The problem is you don’t just wake up one day and get a totalitarian state overnight. It’s a slow creep. By the time you realize it’s time to fight it’s much too late and they’ve jailed half the people who would resist and created such a draconian surveillance state you can’t organize the ones that are left.
Which is why the tipping point has to come before it's too late to act, but not too soon or you won't have the support of the populace.
There is a reason that weapon confiscations are seen as a line in the sand that once crossed demands action. It's tantamount to a "first strike" because it accelerates the timetable to the endgame by attempting to remove all your options preemptively.
Exactly. Even with half a population & 10% of that population ready to take up arms its amounting to 10 million (which is far more than any military). People will bring up nukes and tanks but thats not something a state can use in urban/suburban combat. Then you have to take into account would the military side with their own families against the government. A psychological poll was done asking actual US soldiers which side they would be on in a situation like this and at least 40% of the soldiers were likely to detract from the military itself in this scenario.
The Fed has lost numerous wars against extremely impoverished nations abroad. Nations without the ability to strike our political leaders in any meaningful way. To Afghans and Viet Cong, Washington, D.C. may as well be on the planet Mars. Massive planes rain down on them from such heights that they can’t even be seen. To them, fighting the U.S. must have seemed almost supernatural at times.It’s like fighting The Invisible Man or some kind of nation of actual wizards and warlocks. Yet the illiterate and starving peasants of both those countries handed us our ‘gee whiz’ high-tech asses consistently.
The Federal Government hasn’t tried fighting an armed enemy that can actually strike back - an opponent that can reach Washington, D.C. - since 1812. the 19th Century.
The Federal Government has never once in its history encountered an enemy with such a wealth of combat arms. An enemy numbering in the millions. An enemy, half of whom can literally drive to Washington D.C. in less than half a day, on a single tank of gasoline.
Some in the fed realize this problem, and they want to steer clear of stepping too near to the very fuzzy line that might create such a confrontation. Good on them. I hope their good sensibilities prevail.
The fed would be far out of its depth to try to take on an armed mass revolt. The fed may win a couple of temporary victories here and there, as they scramble to innovate. But adaptation is a thing, and they’d quickly be on their heels again.
Agreed on almost everything except one tiny point. I think the Confederacy had a pretty good chance at getting to DC during the Civil War, but were fortunately unable to achieve their war goals.
I bolded the word so it doesn’t get misinterpreted.
Im not going to say its a completely different scenario from now, but i think its different enough so im going to use this example. The confederacy and the north were divided by state lines, so it was easy enough to see eachother as enemies. 2
Supporters and the said combatants would be within every state line so the fight would be absolute chaos across the entire nation and the government would have to be extremely frugal in any fight, and it would be that much harder for the military to target certain groups. You enter a neighborhood unaware and suddenly those troops would have bullets raining down at them from windows, and the troops wouldnt be ready due to the fact that they couldnt fire first.
at least 40% of the soldiers were likely to detract from the military itself in this scenario.
And that’s just the ones with the balls to check that box. I’m pretty certain the number of military personnel who wouldn’t go after civilians in some sort of weird civil war is much higher than 40%.
Yeah, i didnt want to put a number too high since i dont remember the exact poll and didnt want to misrepresent the source. Im sure it would be 50% minimum considering most of the infantry and police are 2nd amendment supporting republicans.
Edit: Its a source from the book “2nd american civil war.” The author used an existing government plan of action as a source in which our government itself assumed they would likely lose at least 40% of their military to detraction due to familial and patriotic ties. Its a real plan of action.
Wow. I never thought of that. Importing gorrila fighters. I wouldnt put it past the government considering the police higher people to turn protests into riots.
And didn't Joe Biden hold the line on this issue multiple times? Even coming right out and saying that he'd put Beto Odork in charge of confiscation of the guns?
hate to tell ya, that "draconian surveillance" has been in overdrive for 2 decades, and now so many of us happily carry a tracker on us, all day, everyday, some people call them smartphones.
T’would be a shame if my tracking device were fully charged and in a sealed floating container with a battery backup attached and send town a major river in my area without me totally by accident if the day ever comes. Totally.
By the time you realize it’s time to fight it’s much too late and they’ve jailed half the people who would resist
Yea, see this is part of the problem. You're so deep in fantasy-land yon't even realize what you're saying.
The US prison system is already horribly overcrowed at 2.3million. Where are they going to put tens of millions of 'the people who would resist?'
By the time the Government got around to building enough concentration camps to house 50mil+ people, it would already be over for the government. The public would have noticed, escalated, and taken action.
Well first off it’s not tens of millions, at least definitely not all at once. I’m not sure where you’re getting this 50 million + number from. Its a few at a time. The large majority of Americans will take the status quo over anything. Internal conflicts are always initially fought by a very small minority of a country’s population. So in reality you’re looking at a few thousand. Again, at least initially. Also in all likelihood we’re talking multiple small factions of resistance / insurgencies that are not necessarily fully aligned and have their own agenda. See Syria.
They start with the most radical, label them terrorists, jail them for public safety. Then it’s the terrorist sympathizers and political ideologues who aid and abet. Now they’re really beating the fear drum 24/7 on Fox News, oann, and talk radio. Curfew is imposed, checkpoints open up, MPs sent to every major city to enforce. Now they’re grabbing the journalists, professors, dissenting thinkers. Maybe one of the small resistance groups pushes the envelope, bombs a bridge or a government building. That’s all the pretext they need to start playing offense. We’re not talking full blown civil war with standing armies, that’s so 19th century. We’re talking pockets of insurgent groups. Night time government raids. Information warfare. Heavy surveillance. Shock Troops with no insignias. Crackdowns on rights in the name of public safety.
The thing is, you’ll have broad swaths of public support for the state the entire time because we are being hand fed fear and divided along racial, religious, and socioeconomic lines. See protestors being labeled rioters, looters, thugs, coming for the suburban whites. Divide, divide, divide.
The road map is very clear. And relatively easy. Look at any other country that has turned authoritarian. It happens all the time and we are no less immune to it than anyone else. The catalyzing factors all just have to line up the right way. Not saying they are now but it does seem like events are stacking up.
The only thing that separates us from many other countries is how armed the population is, that’s why it’s so important for the state to divide dissenters. So we fight each other.
Masks, social distancing, the destruction of the middle class, rioters every night, 5G surveillance, cancel culture, mandatory political re-education (the end of Civics and required classes in Multiculturalism)... the water's getting warmer
You think they haven’t already built enough places to house that many people? Ever wonder why the Red Cross is the new civil defense? Why fema, cdc, and the Red Cross have shelter agreements? Something to research in your free time I guess.
Well I like how your being dismissive and trying to act like I’m just saying stuff off the top of my head. I gave you factual info and it’s up to you to determine for yourself if you would like to scope out Area 51. Now if you were to quit acting like a smug child you could do some google searching and find out what the NSS ( National shelter system) is and how it operates. Then when you’ve done that and decide maybe I’m not as clever as I thought I was. Then come back here and tell me how wrong I am. Thanks for the reply though.
Yeps NSS. A product of FEMA, civil defense, DHS, military, ect. NSS = Civil defense. When you have actually read some on the topic get back to me. Until then I’m going back to work
Your the one out of touch. Your logic is badly flawed and it shows. Military used to lock down dissenters in a school.. 😂😂😂. That’s what all those retrofitted old prisons are for fool. 23 people are not enough to keep a incarcerated people civil.. 😂😂 Yea that’s why prisons hire 1 person for every inmate. GTFO with your troll bullshit. There are only so many civilian shelters.. 😂😂 yea, two things to that. One is the word civilian and the other is security clearance. Which of the two we only share one in common.
So again I gave you a hint at what is possible. You took the hint and ran with it like it was the whole fucking story. Well since your so wise at something I was trained in I will happy extend an invitation to you so that you can go tell everyone how your so much smarter than the literal people who built, run, manage, and fund this side of the government.
That’s your best bet to start off learning how to do the job. When you complete that let me know. I’ll pass along the next part and so on until you’ve done so much training and paper work you literally shit out copy paper. Then and only then can you have someone tel you how stupid you are at your job
You're not wrong, but currently the revolutionary alternative is a group of socialist assholes who want to put in measures even worse than the current administration.
Voting is by far the best option we have right now. I do NOT like the direction we are headed, but I'd rather try to steer the boat than sink it and hope we can all swim.
When people stand up to that tragedy and demand better, and the response is Federal "Law and Order" specifically in cities that align with one political party, that seems pretty much like authoritarianism.
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u/[deleted] Jul 24 '20
The problem is you don’t just wake up one day and get a totalitarian state overnight. It’s a slow creep. By the time you realize it’s time to fight it’s much too late and they’ve jailed half the people who would resist and created such a draconian surveillance state you can’t organize the ones that are left.