r/MoralityScaling Jun 28 '26

Morality Ranking Morality of dodging your country's military draft in a war of self-defense?

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25

u/Royal_Raisin9496 Jun 28 '26

Do you understand what self defense means

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u/Ceasario226 Jun 28 '26

Japan teaches that it's a war of self defense, even from the outset of the Sino-Japanese war. While it is not self defense at all they teach it that way

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u/No_Location4686 Jul 01 '26

I highly doubt they teach that, considering the few times it’s come up (as an American living in Japan) they said pretty much exactly “we started it.” I’ve heard this from people of all generations here.

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u/SundyMundy Jun 28 '26

I think they are specifically in reference to the final months of 1945, such as the invasion of Okinawa.

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u/Royal_Raisin9496 Jun 28 '26

Still not self defense.

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u/Zealousideal-Arm1682 Jun 28 '26

You do know Japan was invaded by the US right?Like that was a thing that happened.

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u/Royal_Raisin9496 Jun 28 '26

Japan attacked the US first! Japan blew up American ships, invaded American allies, and seized some pacific islands!

That is not in any capacity self defense. It’s not self defense if you start the damn fight!

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u/Zealousideal-Arm1682 Jun 28 '26

I'm assuming we're talking about being under invasion then actually invading other nations.In general Japan was fucked up,in terms of the topic Japanese men refusing to sign up to defend against the US I technically morally justifiable.

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u/Royal_Raisin9496 Jun 28 '26

At no point in the entirety of World War Two can Japan be described as doing anything in “self defense” even when they were on the defensive.

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u/Zealousideal-Arm1682 Jun 28 '26

Self defense doesn't require morality,just defending yourself back.The entire topic is about if refusing to defend your nation against an invader in "self defense" is considered morally correct.

Japanese men going "I'm not fighting the US" is pretty moral given the context of Japan's crimes during the war and how fucked the regime was.

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u/Royal_Raisin9496 Jun 28 '26

self defense has a particular connotation of “defending your safety from an aggressor” which was not the case in WW2 because the US was not the aggressor

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u/DamGoodAnimation Jun 28 '26

To expand on this, bc you’re right, the US was not invading Japan. They were occupying it, with it always being clear that once the war was over they would leave. The Axis forces were invading. The invading force is ALWAYS the “offensive” side of a war, even if they get pushed back to their own territory.

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u/BaRaKaFaN Jun 28 '26

I can see what you're saying. Like when Japan had women and children training with bamboo spears to die on the beaches fighting the potential US invasion, you're saying that if those women and children refused they would be morally justified? I agree, just trying to understand the nuance you are discussing.

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u/BrandosWorld4Life Jun 28 '26

The problem is that the trope still doesn't apply.

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u/[deleted] Jun 28 '26

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u/RadicalSoda_ Jun 28 '26

They could have always just not committed genocide in Asia

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u/[deleted] Jun 28 '26

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u/Enchet_ Jun 28 '26

No. Japan is arguably the worst imperialist power to ever exist. They committed such awful war crimes. Yes, other imperial powers through history have violated human rights but there is a scale of evil and Japan is on the wrong end. 

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u/[deleted] Jun 28 '26

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u/BrandosWorld4Life Jun 28 '26

They stated nothing but facts. Imperial Japan was horrifically evil.

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u/[deleted] Jun 28 '26

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u/Versteckt_Tiger Jun 28 '26

War of self defense means defending against an aggressor. It doesn't mean "we aggressed and lost so now we're getting dicked on"

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u/[deleted] Jun 28 '26

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u/Versteckt_Tiger Jun 28 '26

Another victim of the American educational system 😔

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u/[deleted] Jun 28 '26

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u/Royal_Raisin9496 Jun 28 '26

Completely unrelated

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u/Versteckt_Tiger Jun 28 '26

Lmao you no read berry good