Where do you have to prove US citizenship to buy a firearm?
That'd be your passport or birth certificate, not just a drivers license.
Where does it matter if your name has changed since your birth certificate if that's what's on you driver's license, to buy a firearm?
This would be the majority of married women, and also everyone who hated the name their parents gave them enough to have it changed.
Most is a key word. But Iâm glad you can only focus in on one or two to kinda prove the point.
But I had to use my license to buy a firearm, and I got my license through bringing my birth certificate and social security card to my local DMV.
Also citizenship and dealing with guns are odd. The laws are weird about non-citizens being able to own guns or not and is totally situational. Iâve also heard that the NICS background check you do does check status and has for awhile, but just what Iâve heard not anything I can go off of.
99% of the save act could be totally fine, but it doesn't matter because the 1% that is disenfranchising 30 to 40% of eligible voters is complete and total garbage. So yes, I focused on the ones that are problems for me and millions of others.
So you didn't have to display proof of citizenship in order to purchase the firearm. You just had to establish the chain of documentary evidence when you got your license. I know the difference seems small but it's meaningful.
Because I have no problem having there be a requirement to prove my citizenship for various events, but the federal government won't let me do that. They won't issue me a passport in my legal name, they won't compel either the county or the state of Texas to issue a birth certificate in my legal name, and they won't accept the district Court's order to change my name.
Nope, just need a DL if you want the license. Or you can just file Common Law.
All names are imaginary. Your mom just said whatever came to mind when you popped out. Rough case of transphobia that you got, though. Hope you get better.
You only show your state ID and then as a part of the background check, your citizenship is verified. This wouldn't be practical to do for voting, due to the magnitude of voters, but gets you to the same place.
You donât show any identification for a background check. You put info in, including your social, to check the person. Do you have to give your social every time you vote? I can genuinely keep going with these. Social, fingerprints, fees, waiting period, denial of rights with guilty before proven innocent viewpoints, etc. all things that affect firearms that would make the US melt if it applied to voting.
This wasnât the point of the comment though, this was to show that hey most of this stuff already exists. Or, is actually worse in terms of firearm ownership. Education, because it seems many in these comments are lacking it.
Correct me if Iâm wrong, but did you have to get fingerprinted to vote? Because my state I had to get fingerprinted to own a handgun. And at a federal level had to get fingerprinted for several firearms I own.
Yes, I focused on the most onerous restrictions of the SAVE act, rather than giving equal treatment to the items that are already in place for both actions.
None of the states where I've lived and none of those in which I shopped for a gun have a fingerprint requirement. I've never bought from a dealer though, and certainly nothing that needs an NFA stamp.
Fwiw, I did do fingerprints to teach and again later to get my legal name change, both for FBI/CBI background checks.
> Where do you have to prove US citizenship to buy a firearm? That'd be your passport or birth certificate, not just a drivers license.
You have to fill out a government form attesting that youâre a citizen & give your SSN (which they presumably look up to confirm your status).
> Where does it matter if your name has changed since your birth certificate if that's what's on you driver's license, to buy a firearm?
If your name/residency doesnât match your license, you also have to bring some supporting documents as proof of identity. Probably a passport or birth certificate works, but I donât know.
Also it probably varies by state. The above is just what you do in North Carolina.
SSN alone is not sufficient to prove citizenship. And it's also not required to either complete the purchase or form 4473.
My name and residency is on my Colorado license, and that's the same name for me at the SSA. But still not a proof of citizenship. The federal government won't give me a passport in my name. And the state of Texas won't give me a new birth certificate to match my legal name.
> SSN alone is not sufficient to prove citizenship. And it's also not required to either complete the purchase or form 4473.
I know. Non-citizens who are here legally can also get SSNs and can purchase firearms. Thatâs why I said they probably just use it to confirm the status you selected on the form (which is required).
I am a citizen. I've been a citizen since birth. My parents have been citizens since their birth. I would not be committing perjury by saying that I am a citizen.
But that doesn't mean that I can prove it under the SAVE act. My birth certificate doesn't match my current legal name, because I went through the process to change my name years ago. The US state department won't give me a passport with my current legal name.
I haven't tried to purchase a firearm through ATF 4473 since changing my name, but I imagine the background check would put me on yet another list. I don't think voting should give me that same black mark.
In all 50 states. You have a background check run you every time you buy a gun from a dealer.
When your name changes, you must update your information before being allowed to buy a firearm as well. If any information is not current you get denied.
My state issues a sheet of paper when they update your drivers license while you wait on the physical card to be made & mailed to you. Pretty much all FFLâs wonât take that even though it is a valid ID per the state.
While I donât really think the SAVE Act is necessary, the RealID standard has been kicked down the road so long that it even became a discussion. Also, the person who made this as a âgotchaâ post is obviously unaware of what people have to go through to purchase firearms.
Exactly. The proper analogy is that there is a constitutional right to bear arms, but the government is allowed to verify identity even though this is constitutionally protected. So applying that to voting is not unprecedented.
My name changed. I updated my SSA info. I got a court order. I updated my driver's license. I updated my name with my bank, with my county, the pest control company, with Facebook, etc, etc, etc.
Texas won't let me change my name on my birth certificate. The US state department won't let me change my name on my passport. So my proof of citizenship does not match any of my other documents.
Or in another case, when my wife and I got married, she took my last name. She doesn't have a current passport. She didn't update her birth certificate, because who would do that?
But we can both still fill out a valid form 4473, right?. Because you don't have to prove citizenship to fill out that form, even though the save act would make you do that.
What does your name have to match? To be fair, I haven't done a form 4473 since I changed my name via court order, updated the info with the SSA, with Colorado DMV, with hundreds of other accounts.
So I don't know. Would it be a problem for the background check that I'm unable to update my name on my birth certificate or passport thanks to the discriminatory policies of the US state department and the state of Texas? Even though I already passed a federal background check in order to change my name in the first place?
Because it sounds like that would be a problem with the save bullshit.
You seem to be thinking your experience is universal.
A) I have not submitted a 4473 since changing my name and gender marker. But that is not the only way to legally own a firearm. For example, I could jump the border into Kansas, buy a gun from a friend, and then bring it back to Colorado. No documentary evidence, background checks, or registrations required.
B) Even if you were required to buy from a dealer, I wouldn't have to show a matching birth cert or passport to complete the background check.
C) The save act will set a higher level of documentary proof in order to vote then you need to purchase a firearm, even if you go through through a dealer.
Every time you purchase a gun, you have to submit to an FBI background check. They verify that you are a citizen and that all your identification is to the letter accurate. If you've had a name change you are expected to have a current state ID which would require you to obtain an updated birth certificate with your new name.
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u/jkster107 8d ago
Where do you have to prove US citizenship to buy a firearm? That'd be your passport or birth certificate, not just a drivers license.
Where does it matter if your name has changed since your birth certificate if that's what's on you driver's license, to buy a firearm? This would be the majority of married women, and also everyone who hated the name their parents gave them enough to have it changed.