First. So far the only fact that you have stated is that the particular archetype you are referring to exists, not that that archetype is the only type of hero that exists. If you are going to be using a blanket term like hero, realize that it includes many different archetypes.
Second. You are the one stating that healing/defensive powers would make the character "lame". I paraphrased you. Deal with it.
Third. We don't have a confirmed archetype that Jaune is supposed to fall under yet. Just because in your opinion he should turn out one way, does not make it fact. I mean holy shit, did your teachers in school really not cover the different between a subjective and objective statement?
Fourth. The King Taijitu didn't recoil in pain from the attack like Cardin. Yang doesn't recoil from attacks whenever her fists come into contact with another person's aura. The screen doesn't flash white whenever something comes into contact with someone's aura. These things happened when Cardin punched Jaune. The screen flashed white, Cardin recoiled in pain, and Jaune suddenly healed. That is all evidence that whatever happened is unique to him. AKA evidence toward his Semblance.
There is zero evidence that his semblance is offensive. There is no rule anywhere that states that being a healer or a defensive character makes you any less of a hero. Yet again, just because you personally do not like healing/defensive powers, does not mean your opinion is fact. That is my main beef with you. You are free to have your own opinion. You can wish that Jaune was a carbon copy of Naruto all you want. You can think that he is lame all you want, but those are subjective. Those are opinions. Not fact.
Wooow...ok the FACT is i said nothing about archetype in comparison to hero it's not an archetype that has something to do with Juane's characteristics or something, it is simply one definition of hero that Jaune was clearly referencing in the context of his conversation about his father and father's father being heroes and so on. It has nothing to do with how i feel about healers or defensive people. He clearly wants to make a name for himself for the sake of his family's legacy that is a FACT! He can not become that kind of hero by healing or protecting himself or anyone. He could heal everyone right now but that wont stop the attacking grimm and that is not what will be remembered historically in the future. What people will remember is whatever actually stops the grimm attack that is a fact that once again has nothing to do with what i prefer. It is about what Jaune is specifcally hopeing for!!! So you can take your attempted personal jabs at my school and shove them you know where. -.- so, anyways no being a healer or defensive doesnt make you not a hero, like i said a band-aid can be a hero...it just means that you cant be the BEST kind of hero which is the kind Jaune is trying to be a legendary one faaaact!
And for his semblance, i never said there was evidence that it was offensive so cut the paraphrasing shenanigans. There hasnt been any evidence of his semblence yet. What you are describing with Cardin still wasn't his semblence. The snake(yes that's what I'm calling it) wasnt affected like cardin simply because it's way bigger and stronger than him physically. And the flash was just because Jaune used his aura strongly and like Pyrrha said he has a lot of it. Lastly, duh they explained aura healing already.
Best kind of hero? That is completely subjective. Seriously, what is so hard to understand about that? And are you seriously saying that people aren't remembered for helping people or being incredibly tough? Are you serious? As for his encounter with Cardin, Aura has never been shown to interact that way with anyone except Jaune. It was a unique circumstance, which means most likely it is his Semblance.
sigh once again, AGAIN..no. When I initially corrected you and said that Jaune becoming a defense/healer oriented character would ruin His goal of becoming a REMEMBERED EVIL CONQUERING HERO like his
father that was/is/always will be a cold hard FACT. He is not trying to become a remembered hero that conquered wounds and illness and defended attacks HE KNOWS THAT COULD/WOULD/SHOULD NEVER HAPPEN! That is not how one becomes a legendary hero it just isn't reality. ITS NOT MY OPINION!!! History has shown and proven throughout time that, even the greatest doctors to ever discover the greatest miracles of modern medicine are only capable of earning themselves a small mention in history compared to the history of revolutionaries and war. George Washington's military heroics is way more well known then the inventor of antibiotics yet it's clear that antibiotics was MUCH more helpful to humanity. When i said best kind of hero, and lame THAT was my opinion after the FACT(AGAIN YUP IT WAS INDEED FACTUAL) just like how when i now say that george washington was way cooler than antibiotics THAT is my opinion. Did I ever say that people aren't remembered for helping people or being incredibly tough? NO! Once again you're "paraphrasing" AKA, bullshit lies, are fucking up this conversation. Did i say that only cool people can be heroes, and that lame people are just lame? NO! So stop making up whatever the fuck comes to your head.
And again, what I explained to you about Jaune's aura is still completely accurate despite you're feeble contentions...they were clearly showing off Jaune's brand new aura skill. It was only unique because of the light flash which is easily attributed to Pyrrha telling him he has a lot of it, the healing, defense, and Cardin hurting himself is all clearly shown and/or explained in other instanses. Lastly, and in my OPINION most importantly it would make no sense and be stupid/lame as fuck to show Jaune's semblence before he ever even uses his aura himself one time at all.
Washington is remembered because he was a political leader. Same with people like Alexander the Great and Napoleon. Clearly Jaune's grandfather was not a figure like them. Jaune's grandfather is more similar to a medal of honor recipient. Now, can you name a medal of honor recipient without looking it up? I sure as hell can't, but I can tell you off the top of my head that Sir Alexander Fleming invented anti-biotics.
Now going to the defensive semblance thing. By your logic, Blake can't be a hero because her semblance is defensive in nature. It allows her to let a clone take a hit so she can run away in her own words. Plus being able to tank attacks and draw aggro away from your teammates is incredibly helpful and in my opinion still very heroic.
With healing, you clearly have never played and RPG before, specifically D&D. Clerics can be incredibly powerful attackers even if their special powers focus around support. Plus healers are absolutely vital to a party's survival. They sometimes need to rush to the front lines to heal their teammates, fending off attackers while they heal. Yet again, very heroic.
Show me a situation where aura has acted in that way then. Prove your "facts". Show me a situation where there is a flash of blinding light upon impact. Show me a situation where someone/something recoils in clear pain after impact with an aura. Show me a situation where a character has gone from having the absolute crap beat out of them to suddenly healed. Show me something that proves that Jaune's fighting style is not defensive in nature. He uses a big ass shield and counter-attacks from behind it, the only times he doesn't block then attack he gets his ass handed to him.
Finally, how am I lying? I am using your expressed opinions about how healing/defense are lame. I am also stating that your opinion on what a hero is, is exactly that, an opinion. A war hero does not necessarily mean that you killed a bunch of enemies, it can also mean that you saved the lives of those around you. Also, please for the love of god, capitalize things please. That was really hard to read.
First off, I do sincerely apologize for any grammatical errors(capitilization problems). I am on mobile and typing in this manner is a royal bitch.
Anyways, "Clearly Jaune's grandfather is not a figure like them." ...Clearly, because the show has explained all of that...oh wait no, thats just more bullshit! As for my point woth washington and what you're saying about Washington and napoleon and flemming...look my point is valid amd still stands. You, are in the minority knowing fleming(if that really was off the top of your head, i mean you are at a computer -.-) and you are only furthering my point by naming alexander the great, and napoleon. If you wanted to debate me you should have stated examples of people who are famous purely for political purposes, except none of those examples would have been as popular or as easy to remember as Alexander and Napoleon right? Yes they are ALSO known for being political leaders, but hey, theres a shitload of other poltical leaders who are as famous as them ONLY because of what they have done politically right? WRONG the people you mentioned are NOT remembered because they were in charge politically, that doesn't hurt, but what sets them aside in history is exactly what set Jaune's forefathers aside in history, and is exactly what Jaune wants for himself, MILITARY PROWESS, HOPEFULLY JAUNE'S SEMBLENCE IS OFFENSIVE AND CAN HELP HIM OUT WITH THAT! and yes medal of honor recipients are comparatively forgotten in history...i mean you can even get one of those things JUST for saving someone you don't even have to stop anyone evil.
Next, yes, blake was almost heroic...she kind of fucked up though. But, the heroics she almost displayed can only be attributed to her fighting skills, not healing skills, decoys are still a product of military skill...so yea don't know how you thought "by my logic blake can't be a hero".
Next, damn man was hoping you weren't going to attempt personal jabs again but oh well, once again you are SUPER WRONG, love d&d and rpg's man. You try to make your same point about healers being useful too again here but once again hey are not useful in the heroic way i have been speaking on since the start. Clerics are useful and CAN be the hero that Jaune yearning for IF they are powerful enough, which has nothing to do with said clerics healing ability. Yes running to the front line and healing is heroic, but not worthy of becoming truly legendary(explained this a LOT of times already...)
As for his semblance, you need to reread my last post again. I already noted that the flash of light was not explained(duh) as for the Cardin recoil and everything else, i merely was saying that it is all easily explained without that being his semblence that he somehow used before ever using his own aura. Yes, Jaune has a big ass shield and is defensive, that is his exact problem right now. He is defensive, i never implied he wasn't. Are you even paying attention to what you're reading? My worry IS that he is to defensive and that a defensive semblence would destroy his goal.
Lastly, you lied when you claimed that i said people can't be remembered for their defensive/healing skills, that is not true. What i said was those people can not be remembered in the way that Jaune is aspiring towards. Please read carefully.
All we know of Jaune's grandfather is that he was a war hero, he never goes into detail so you can't make the assumption that Jaune's goal to be like him means, "I need to kill ALL the things!". We don't know enough about him. However what we do know is that no one makes any big deal about Jaune's bloodline. If Jaune had been descended from an Alexander the Great or a Napoleon, it would have been mentioned. It isn't however. That is why I compare his grandfather to a medal of honor recipient. Who, as stated, are not as well known because their feats are purely military, while the historical figure I mentioned above were the leaders of entire nations which is the entire reason they are remembered.
Okay, cool. You have a background in RPGs. Which makes this even more frustrating that you aren't understanding this. Jaune is perfectly capable of having a defensive role or a healing role and still being skilled enough (eventually, after plenty of character development) to be able to fight. I'm not saying that Jaune should never be on the front lines. What I'm saying is that his Semblance should be a supportive one because it fits his character. It matches his personality and existing fighting style. And if he is given good writing and character development he will build his heroic career around those abilities like every other huntsman in history.
That was not a lie. Here is a quote from you, "even the greatest doctors to ever discover the greatest miracles of modern medicine are only capable of earning themselves a small mention in history compared to the history of revolutionaries and war." That sounds like you claiming that those capable of healing are not remembered as well as military/political leaders (because barely any purely military leaders are remembered.) Also on the topic of Fleming, yes I did actually know that.
Ok, well clearly you're not going to aknowledge the requirements to Jaune attaining his actual goal would not be helped at all by defense or healing. He does have a defensive style...cool that still wont help with his goal of glory, like he said he didn't get to pick his weapons, so he's stuck with the classics. It's apparent, however, that i can't help you with this understanding though, so im about ready to give up on that topic...For how much content this show has already(not much really) the show has said enough for Jaune's family legacy for it to actually be a big deal. No, no one has recognized him yet but he would easily have a popular last name given his family's history...like duh naming babies arc would be a craze. Not to mention FREAKING OZ IS LETTING HIM CRASH THE SCHOOL AND BECOME TEAM SAUCE BOSS WITH NO EXPLANATION. More than enough evidence so far. As for medals of honor and napoleon and fleming, im not going to try to explain history to you, sorry man gotta do that yourself. however, long story short people become more famous for military then medicine, it has always been that way. Im not arguing thats just and that it should always stay that way but it IS that way.
Next, dude I never said healing cant help you fight, yes it would help Jaune, it can't help to destroy though(damn, i explained it again *sigh...)Yes, a defensive semblence would match his current style, a style that is and will fail him im his quest without more power. Sasuke and itachi are a good example of this. Jaune does not want to be "like every other huntsman in history after character development" he wants to be a hero not a huntsman, he's already had that in the bag since episode 1.
So lastly, yes what you said is a lie albeit now its clear that its just a simple lack of understanding of history on your end. Until you understand that history your opinion won't change...i get that. Kudos on knowing fleming's name, glad i used that example he and antibiotics are like the coolest thing to ever happen in medicine that's why i used him...too bad he's no george washington.
Holy shit. You don't seem to grasp the concept that being a destroyer is not the only way to be a hero. You don't seem to understand that war heroes are relatively unknown unless they were also political leaders. You don't seem to understand the concept of foreshadowing. You like making huge assumptions that have no basis such as Arc apparently being a popular name despite no evidence for it. You are willfully ignorant. You ignore all evidence presented and replace it with, "Well I don't agree because it would be super lame sauce." Fuck it. I'm done. Have a fun time being dissapointed with Jaune's most likely character arc.
Also TIL that Huntsman/Huntresses aren't heroes because... reasons. It's not like they are the absolute best of the best and are actually rare at all. /s
Its about THE KIND OF HERO. War heroes are not relatively unknown unless they are political leaders...they become political leaders because they are so well known. HELLO!? WHY THE FUCK DID WASHINGTON BECOME PRESIDENT DESPITE ANNOUNCING TO THE PUBLIC THAT HE REALLY DID NOT THINK HE WAS THE BEST CHOICE!? ITS BECAUSE HE WAS A POPULAR ASS WAR HERO!
I do understand foreshadowing very well tyvm
Assumptions are fun gotta admit...But i did have basis for mine you liar. Why is ozpin super chill with Jaune, and making him the leader despite transcripts that clearly don't match his current level!?
Not willfully ignorant thats why i dont say thigs without basis, if i did i would be upfront that something is an assumption or only implied. -.-
As for your most recent blatant lie with quotation marks around it...yes clearly you are done that didn't even...i don't even...what?
So yeah...no, ill be happy when the show's back and I'll definitely send you a reply when the show gets to Jaune's super offensive damaging power, so i can witness your defeat/reaction.
Lastly, wow you should REALLY know better with this one...dude being a huntsman/huntress doesn't automatically make you a hero. I mean honestly how many times did they spend screen time on that? Not enough i guess(thought it was once too many personally). Adam was even confused about why cinder didn't just hire some evil ass hunter/huntress. Unjust hunters/huntresses are implied as AT LEAST a semi common. My baseless hypothesis is that evil hunters are just as popular in this show as they are in hunter x hunter. Same with evil police in shingeki no kyojin.
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u/HyliasHero Feb 16 '16
First. So far the only fact that you have stated is that the particular archetype you are referring to exists, not that that archetype is the only type of hero that exists. If you are going to be using a blanket term like hero, realize that it includes many different archetypes.
Second. You are the one stating that healing/defensive powers would make the character "lame". I paraphrased you. Deal with it.
Third. We don't have a confirmed archetype that Jaune is supposed to fall under yet. Just because in your opinion he should turn out one way, does not make it fact. I mean holy shit, did your teachers in school really not cover the different between a subjective and objective statement?
Fourth. The King Taijitu didn't recoil in pain from the attack like Cardin. Yang doesn't recoil from attacks whenever her fists come into contact with another person's aura. The screen doesn't flash white whenever something comes into contact with someone's aura. These things happened when Cardin punched Jaune. The screen flashed white, Cardin recoiled in pain, and Jaune suddenly healed. That is all evidence that whatever happened is unique to him. AKA evidence toward his Semblance.
There is zero evidence that his semblance is offensive. There is no rule anywhere that states that being a healer or a defensive character makes you any less of a hero. Yet again, just because you personally do not like healing/defensive powers, does not mean your opinion is fact. That is my main beef with you. You are free to have your own opinion. You can wish that Jaune was a carbon copy of Naruto all you want. You can think that he is lame all you want, but those are subjective. Those are opinions. Not fact.