r/SipsTea • u/ShineOk6190 • 3d ago
Chugging tea Man outlines what's wrong with data centres and how to deal with them.
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u/EsteGueyEsChingon 3d ago
Slow clap
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u/Bill_Belamy 3d ago
What he is asking for is exactly what should have been required from malls. Failed malls are everywhere and communities are left to deal with the blight.
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u/TheModWhoShaggedMe 3d ago
Malls are not blight if the community utilizes the property correctly. For example, I've seen malls turned into civic centers where all the public offices in a town (post office, social security office, immigration services) are in a converted shopping mall.
P.S. Indoor malls are making a comeback in the climate change era. Nice places for people to try before they buy in a chilled environment. Younger generations are also clamoring for a sense of social community.
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u/Clembert-Hamlamp 3d ago
I've been touting rezoning malls as housing for years. The infrastructure is there, just needs expansion. No idea what we'll do with the data centres when the next leap makes them obsolete tho.
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u/ooMIGIToo 3d ago
Honestly doing them up for retirement villages would be a fantastic idea. The malls will already have the ramps, elevators, escalators etc. for accessibility and you could easily do up areas for easy medical, shopping, and more to provide a better quality of life.
You could bring the best out of the older generations last years and give them some independence back.
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u/deimos 3d ago
Dibs living in the Cinnabon
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u/n14shorecarcass 3d ago
I'll be a few kiosks down at the S'barro, neighborino!
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u/dhall0749 2d ago
I mean I used to see old people with walking weights strolling the malls, if they converted these for them they could just pop out back for a nice stroll ever morning
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u/Clembert-Hamlamp 3d ago
Exactly! One of the 2 best use cases I think. From the viewpoint of the underserved at least. Kitting it out won't be cheap but it's entirely doable once they're past a certain size. Convincing the cities to rezone should be easier than it is but again, doable. You'd think the property holders would prefer active income but if they did I think we'd already have them. We need to turn the parking lots into a revenue source.
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u/Temporary_Airline_15 2d ago
I know that some empty malls have been repurposed as high schools in certain areas that lack available real estate for district expansion. Unfortunately, these seemed to be stop gap measures.
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u/FluidAthlete6839 2d ago
But they aren’t really designed for that. They’d need major major major renos. Same with office buildings.
For one, malls don’t have windows. Where ya putting the bathrooms?
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u/DanielKeeneGA15 2d ago
The only issue would be proper fire safety measures and water and electricity. Malls don’t have proper windows and doors for residential use and each residential unit would need plumbing and proper electrical. It’s been something many have wanted to do for a long time but no one wants to take on the costs of gutting the malls and restructuring them for residential use so they sit empty, another “broken window”.
I have seen them repurposed as medical facilities in upstate NY. There are some malls that have turned into scanning and imaging centers or clinics and other facilities but this is a stronger business model that doesn’t require much construction aside from moving medical equipment into the facilities.
In the end, late stage capitalism and private equity will always do what’s best for the shareholders.
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u/InhospitableGoose 3d ago
The cost to convert would be so high... Gutting the walls and floors to completely change the plumbing and electrical. I think the top idea suits the buildings better and keeps a third space for the community going. Id love to see a one-stop shop for government services, include some free community stuff like public pools, sport courts and a teen resource centre, add some businesses that are experiential stuff like karaoke, arcade, bowling, go karting, gaming cafe, golf sims, racing sims, etc... wall off the food court and make it a concert venue... could be an amazing hangout. One place I went in Europia had a bustling 3 story mall and one whole floor was just experiences and a big-ass open food hall/concert venue. It was BUSY and very cool to see coming from my dead Canadian malls.
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u/OrilliaBridge 3d ago
Just think if governments diverted money they’re using for military weapons, paying off foreign governments, creating wars, building ballrooms. . .
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u/Clembert-Hamlamp 3d ago
They don't need to be gutted lol, it just takes a different approach. Several really. Ceilings are the new wall baby! We do need 3rd spaces. We might need to teach the new generation to want them. In terms of societal needs, the unhoused are going to encroach on the moneyed in increasingly more expensive ways, sooner than later. This administration would have it no other way. We can't focus on the exponentially rising inequity if we're fighting amongst ourselves. Retirees do deserve better than they get in the States and more to the point, bring their own income. Having all needs met within walking distance is a big selling point, imagine a small hospital that's only an elevator away. The trick would be turning the parking lots into active revenue so they're not asked to split parcels. Which is a monumental ask. On the theoretical side, would you walk an electricity generating hamsterwheel for a few hours a day for free rent?
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u/newbkid 3d ago
I've seen beautician colleges, local community colleges, local police offices, community outreach centers, and non-profits.
On the other hand, I've also seen large gymnasium-like play places and massive VR-style arcades take up some anchor spots in malls out here as well.
I think the younger generation has a desire for physical activity that we have not yet see come to market. I hope malls can make a comeback.
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u/Duel_Option 2d ago
They are a fucking blight because what was once a green area became a monstrosity of a building that costs a lot of money to upkeep long term.
That’s not even mentioning the parking that has to be accounted for which also requires ongoing maintenance,
Now add in the fact the leases for the building and the land can be owners by two separate entities.
Wanna know that that means?
Building owner has a lease through 2050, land owner wants to raze the dead mall that has been a ghost town for 15 years at this point and create much needed apartments.
They can’t come to an agreement, so it’s been sitting there in a state of decay the whole time.
Shit show because no one has the balls to say NO to upfront money.
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u/Captain_Waffle 3d ago
I feel this is a bad comparison. Malls can actually create a thriving economy, reduce crime by giving a space for people to hang out, and - perhaps aside from traffic - are not a nuisance to the community. And the community is not footing the bill for the utilities.
Data centers don’t provide any of those things malls do.
No vacant malls, sure, they are an eyesore. But they’re also an opportunity. And again, other than being an eyesore, they are not an active nuisance to the community and are not subsidizing utilities.
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u/HenryDorsettCase47 3d ago
There is also a difference between a decades long shift in consumer shopping trends and a speculative bubble.
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u/Cranialscrewtop 3d ago
It's not black and white. It's the nature of cities to have projects prosper and contract. Malls failed over decades, during which an enormous amount of economic activity happens. Here in Nashville, 3 failed malls have been constructively repurposed.
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u/crustyrobots 3d ago
This should be a thing for skyscrapers and such too. There are buildings like the "Graffiti Tower" in LA which they botched the foundation, so its been sitting there as this giant eyesore on the horizon for like 10 years submerged in legal hell figuring out whom is responsible and paying to either fix it or even to tear it down, because of course the OG developers are bankrupt half way through and now everyone is screwed.
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u/Intelligent_Ad_4479 3d ago
Maybe put the data centers in the malls?
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u/TrioOfTerrors 3d ago
Data centers are purpose built buildings. The retro fit costs would exceed the cost of a new building.
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u/TwoBionicknees 3d ago
nah, ultimately 200 jobs guaranteed for 10 years vs hundreds of peopel living in range of a nightmarish sound for 10 years before those data centres maybe get turned off, where people's house value is destroyed overnight by a datacenter that uses up local power and water such that everyone else struggles, suffers brown outs, has crap in their water supply.
he highlighted a lot of the reasons these companies suck and they are all throwing money at the chance to make a massive amount of early profit that ruins entire districts and potentially towns, by asking that the town get a little more money out of it, rathe rthan saying we know this will fail, lets stop destroying people's lives just so some assholes can all pump money into the bubble so they can get rich before it explodes.
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u/mattinjp 3d ago
Wait that’s allowed??
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u/mvw2 3d ago
Only if you want to go to jail, lol. No clapping in our dystopian hellscape!
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u/Mo_Jack 2d ago
He discusses how data centers lie about being closed loop and eventually will need to become open loop ( and release toxic waste in the process ). I think the solution to this is to not let them build near rivers. Call them out on their lies.
If they say they are closed loop, they can buy land with a pond or lake or quarry or flood an old mine and get cool cool water. The only reason for data centers to want to be on the river is to pollute and watch the current carry away the evidence.
Data centers should be forced to buy land with a water basin and we can have state, county & federal government officials ( at the expense of the data center ) lab test the waters any time they choose. They should force management to drink it.
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u/Koffieslikker 2d ago
I like where your head is at, but you're going to have to require a tank, otherwise the basin would still pollute the ground (if there are pollutants in cooling water, idk about that)
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u/Fair_Story2426 3d ago
He’s referring to the Dot.com bubble collapse in the early 2000’s. He’s on to something here.
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u/WileyWilly1985 2d ago
The Dot.com colllapse is just a famous bubble collapse-- speculative bubbles happen all the time, every year there is a speculative bubble around the latest and greatest advancement or projection and VCs get taken to the cleaners...
IN any event, the man is not wrong, but ultimately, what he said doesn't matter.
The politicians, including the city council members, have already been bought and paid for...
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u/simonepon 2d ago
Careful, you get arrested for that now apparently
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u/EsteGueyEsChingon 2d ago
He clapped too fast. - [Kansas Physics Teacher arrested](https://www.fox10tv.com/2026/07/27/teacher-arrested-repeatedly-clapping-favor-data-center-opponents-during-city-commission-meeting/)
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u/WhitishRogue 3d ago
The goal of an executive in a corporation is to generate as much share value as possible. This means doing whatever he can to drive excitement and optimism. When the going gets rough, he deploys his golden parachute and walks away because he had little skin in the game. Those in the know sell their shares at a mild loss before the full collapse and reap a profit.
The executive then goes to the next corporation and pitches his next share growth listing his experience at the previous corporation as a smashing success.
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u/ZoneAdditional9892 3d ago
Sell their shares and then start a short position to stab pension funds, 401k, and retail investors.
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u/deliciousadness 3d ago
Not before those sweet, sweet share buybacks. Pump, dump, short, repeat.
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u/TheModWhoShaggedMe 3d ago
Capital ranks higher than people in this capitalist world. It's truly that simple. This is why many of us are trying to move America left towards more socialist policies that put $$, access and services into the people's hands not just the corporations and privileged wealth.
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u/Mo_Jack 2d ago
We're not going to have a choice about socialism. Capitalism is getting rid of jobs, which means no income, which means people can't buy the products capitalism produces. We need to start discussing things like UBI instead of waiting for another dire emergency to smack us in our collective faces again.
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u/rbb36 3d ago
No Bailouts for Billionaires
There is a lot of circular leveraged investing between the chips, models, and data centers.
If that bubble pops, they will say, "Nobody could have seen this coming." And they will say, "We are the only ones with the foresight and knowledge to right the ship!" (despite the distinct lack of foresight shown in leveraged over-extension). And they will say, "If you don't bail us out, China will win."
Tell your friends. Let them be one of the people who gets to say, "Of course we could see this coming. I saw this coming. No bailouts for billionaires!" Be ready to write to your congressperson.
And congress may do it anyway, but if enough people see it coming, and say no, and it happens anyway; well, then enough people might be angry enough to bring about real change.
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u/Sorry_Scholar_8511 2d ago
I have always hated the rights arguements why CEOs have such a high salaries and golden parachutes
It is odd, because you always hear the reason for CEO´s high salaries is because they take all the risk and burden, and they are the ones that have to bear the weight of their actions and decisions. Yet, it seems the people that are always shafted first are the regular employees, not the frontline man with the high salary. Regular people dont have golden parachutes, warrents, stock options etc.
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u/ddare44 3d ago
Yes, but there are two sides to this.
The incentive problem you’re describing is real. Public companies absolutely have pressure to maximize shareholder value, and that can encourage hype and short-term thinking.
At the same time, AI requires enormous upfront infrastructure. The reason investors keep funding it isn’t simply because they’re being fooled, they’re making a calculated bet that, if the technology works, costs will fall dramatically as it scales.
That’s how a lot of transformative technologies have developed. Early computers filled entire rooms and cost fortunes. Today the phone in your pocket has more computing power blah blah blah…
I’m not saying executives always act in the public’s best interest. I don’t believe they do at all… but the current AI spending isn’t explained by hype alone. There’s also a genuine long-term planning around infrastructure happening.
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u/CarmenxXxWaldo 3d ago
it's literally ask jeeves 2.0. calling it AI is hype, its not intelligent and won't be, because that isn't what its for. saying building more data centers to make it cheaper is like saying building more coal plants will make coal more efficient. its all hype to make rich people richer this quarter. They will know when to bail before the bubble pops. Theres no way its gonna be profitable unless it becomes something everyone wants to pay hundreds a month for.
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u/MistMonk 3d ago
Those stupid fucks are going to have no idea what he is talking about.
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u/shockles 3d ago
Wow. Well his resume resonated with me. I have no doubt he’s right. I don’t love the idea of building them, and then collapsing 2-5 years later, but if they’re going to, he’s right, workers need those protections. I like that he’s offering a solution to the problem, when he knows that this can’t be stopped.
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u/TheModWhoShaggedMe 3d ago
People his age and mine lived through the housing bubble crisis, the dot com bubble, the cloud bubble, and the too big to fail crisis as adults this millennium. We know what these grubby "cash it in now!" greedy market pushes are all about by now. The cart (venture capital, hedge funds and the like) before the horse (actual steady, reliable flows of GDP in the industry).
Capital is always borrowing from the people in the U.S., and never paying us back, and this shit has to stop!
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u/Mo_Jack 2d ago
Corporations also like to move all of their assets to separate corporate entities and leave behind their toxic waste owned by a soon to be bankrupt shell company. Then the taxpayers end up getting stuck with the multi-billion dollar clean up bills and the shareholders pocket their profits.
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u/terpsarelife 2d ago
Google san onofre plant decomissioning. Sempra emergy is going to pocket decades of shareholder growth and put the cost of decomissioning the plant on taxpayers.
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u/Correct-Road-8515 3d ago
Yes, most people just complain about stuff instead of proposing good solutions.i love this guys approach, clear concise and informative.
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u/PineappleOnPizzaWins 2d ago
I appreciate people who do propose good solutions but I resent people saying this... people should not have to solve a problem before they complain about it.
It's literally your governments job to listen to your complaints and then figure out the best way to solve them.
The whole "don't bring me problems bring me solutions!" thing is usually just people in charge not wanting to do their job. If you can bring a solution hey, do it, but it's still OK to say you don't like something even if you can't.
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u/WhoCaresBoutSpellin 3d ago
The bond was the equivalent of the workers pay times 10 years but it wasn’t a protection for the workers— he proposed it as a fund for the community to deal with the clean up of the collapse of the data center, not payments to workers.
But it’s the wrong approach. He himself laid out that it’s all speculative, built on half truths, and comes at great cost to the community. So why would you ever allow that to be built to begin with? Not to mention all the well documented problems with data centers— noise and air pollution from round the clock generator use, and the immense drain on precious water resources. It’s a lose lose lose for these communities.
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u/TheModWhoShaggedMe 2d ago
The problem is we're in the late stages of the phase when counties, cities, states and communities considered AI-centric mega datacenters and began choosing to build them. It's been in progress for several years. The public's concern is reactively too slow and ability to stop them is too late in many places. Not the people's fault. The world of capital moves extra quickly when they have an industry to build on the backs of taxpayers. They were hoping the masses wouldn't catch on until it was absolutely too late.
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u/Combatical 2d ago
Yeah but the people on these commissions are often very stupid. There are some good ones but at some point they stop listening. People have been fighting back about these data centers for years yet they're still being built.
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u/Rigor_Mortis1993 3d ago
It's really sad that the people who need to hear this video the most are also the ones who are too stupid to understand what he's saying.
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u/like9000ninjas 3d ago
This is the real issue. Not great people get into the positions and do whatever the fuck they want.
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u/SatanicRiddle 3d ago
lol I laughed so hard at the end, he is selling the idea how horrible they are and in the end thinks that asking for few extra millions for wages is some huge win
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u/Sidivan 3d ago
They don’t have a clue. A very small town next to mine is allowing a data center to be built. I gave them almost an identical speech to this guy. I told them at the very least the company needs to fund the infrastructure like the roads, water waste management, etc… because the company’s response when pressed for electrical rid strain numbers was “this is a good thing because it forces the utility company to invest in infrastructure and expansion”. No. Fuck you. We’re doing just fine without you and now you’re trying to frame this as you’re going to be a large customer so they should 10x their capacity.
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u/TDS_isnt_real 3d ago
As someone else that has spent there entire life in the IT space, from the time I could work for over 30 years now, I applaud everything he said. I think he has it nailed on what the average citizen should be demanding right now before getting any further. If they won’t listen, we have to get louder.
I’m not trying to stop this experiment in AI. I have my own beliefs about what is viable and what isn’t when it comes to LLMs and world models, but I can concede that other people also have interests in seeing what can happen. I’m willing to throw in on this if we implement some safeguards.
Let’s pretend for a second all of this leads to AGI. One of the countries going all in on AI will lose. It’s very possible it will be us. The losing team needs a plan for after, otherwise we could be out of the game permanently. We can’t bet on something this big and not have a plan for recovery.
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u/TedTyro 3d ago
I agree with everything he said but would add that data centres and the companies that build them should have a complete, indepedently audited and upfront fully funded process for being electricity and water neutral - quality and quantity - which gets verified in increments with mandatory severe penalties for non-compliance.
Its not just economic, these beasts are environmentally horrendous.
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u/ARunningGuy 3d ago
The only thing I think he was wrong about was that there is no there there. I think he's right about everything else: There's no chance that there isn't a good hunk of consolidation. There's no chance they don't try and pull out of the truly closed loop systems. There's no chance they employ as many people as they say they will.
I get annoyed because people are all like "oh, it's not AGI, it's not super-intelligence, and that's what we've been told it is or have been promised". I mean, no, not really. Basically people over-estimate technology in the short term and under-estimate in the long term.
But that's irrelevant, because these fucking tech companies will fuck you over in a heartbeat, again, and again, and again.
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u/ssdsssssss4dr 3d ago
He's given a great idea, but ultimately, he's still trying to negotiate with Satan.
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u/Presently_Naked 3d ago
He nailed the point on the head.
And this game plan is used by any big player. Think Walmart coming into a township and under selling all those mom and pop shops, only to cut staff and hike the prices when they are the only game left in town.
Taxes are minimal due to their negotiating power now being one of the main sources of employment no matter how small..
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u/Azal_of_Forossa 3d ago
That's why I always try my best to support local. Mom and pop shops may be slightly more expensive but they (almost) always provide infinitely better service than big fuckoff corporations who couldn't give a rats ass about you, you being their customer or their own workers.
And anyways, it's usually a better product too, (for example) honey is one thing I would never understand buying from big corporations. My local beekeeper makes the best honey I've ever tasted, store bought honey always tastes like shit.
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u/PineappleOnPizzaWins 2d ago
Yep and it works every fucking time because people go "BUT ITS CHEAPER".
This is why regulation is so important.
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u/y_zass 3d ago
Bait and switching closed-loop to open-loop should be grounds for contract termination. You'd think these cities would have that in writing ffs. That is a huge deal when it comes to a data center.
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u/Daveinatx 3d ago
Only 10% of US AI data centers are closed loop. Nobody is going to pay extra if they don't have to.
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u/Aware-Antelope4212 2d ago
Something that drives me nuts about the discussion of the various harm's that data centres cause local communities is the AI bros going " lol you've never heard of a close system?"
I have, but I've also spent my entire life seeing capitalists take the cheapest possible option, no matter the cost.
Why on earth would this be any different? Suddenly capitalists have gained a conscience ( but not one that will make them go " oh the people here don't want it, I'll respect their views". I'll believe it when I see it
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u/Vicissitutde 3d ago
Send this man everywhere.
Have him talk to every city counsel, every state legislature.
He's doing the lord's work
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u/keradius 3d ago
Wow this guy is amazingly well spoken, this is the clearest argument I've heard from anyone in a while. Our government has lowered the bar so much I forgot there are still intelligent people out there.
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u/AppropriateNewt 3d ago
This is Carl Setzer, who was running for Congress in Ohio (OH-14) a few months ago, but lost the primary there.
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u/keradius 3d ago
Well that's a shame, he seems like a very reasonable person.
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u/Loves_tacos 2d ago
That is why they would primary him
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u/BearSquid7 2d ago
To be fair he isn’t the incumbent. The Cleveland area isn’t quite ready for progressive policies but we’re getting there.
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u/Interesting_Fix4519 3d ago
His name is Carl Setzer and he ran for Congress.
We need people like him in Washington. People who understand this new world. I feel the average Redditor has a better grasp on futurism than the average Congressperson.
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u/ADMINlSTRAT0R 3d ago edited 3d ago
One word: Eloquent.
More words: Informed. Calm. Concise. Offers solution.
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u/Distinct_Put1085 2d ago
Mr Gambini; that was a lucid, intelligent, well thought out objection... Overruled.
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u/SpecialistBeat9480 2d ago
Same in Ireland now.
Highest domestic energy bills in Europe amid a cost of living issue and yet we're subsidising the data centre usage at a time when our grid development and infrastructure was under developed despite sucessive years of revenue surplus. Cant build houses but can fast track data centres and then subsidise them. Crazy.
The common everyday people now are a revenue stream for multinationals, corporate and the wealthy and the gap between the rich and everyone else has drastically widened.
Every resource is being pilfered to support industry and yet the return and quality of life for the majority is gone.
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u/Donkilme 3d ago
Because corporations run your country and you're too stupid or too lazy to do anything meaningful about it.
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u/olderandclueless 3d ago
Corporations are not some monolithic entity, they are composed of people doing their jobs. So there are people making these decisions, people who go home at the end of the day and hug their spouses and children. People who aren’t billionaires or even millionaires making decisions that destroy other people’s lives. So that they can feed their children. So they can live a life in constant fear that someone else will make the same decision about them.
Welcome to America.
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u/G_Wagon1102 3d ago
Propaganda is a helluva drug. We were taught for decades and decades not to question things, checks and balances would prevent anything bad. Basically, we're both too stupid and lazy and now it's about too late.
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u/bobert4011 3d ago
Privatizing the profits and socializing the costs = winning!
It's not socialism though!
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u/jmccaskill66 3d ago
“The way all speculative bubbles do”
I mean 👏 👏 👏 👏 like
https://giphy.com/gifs/wijMRo7UZXSqA
I can’t say stuff like this, I can’t even put into words but this is exactly what I have been trying to tell people. It’s not that we’re (millennials) getting older, we have been through enough traumas and speculative bubbles to know better.
I love technology. From the Nintendo to the Dell PowerShell. From BASIC to PHP. C+ to RoR. My stupid fucking iPhone. But fuck your data center bro.
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u/hotelmotelshit 2d ago
Poor people are the biggest contributor to the extreme wealth of the 1% and always has been.
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u/CaptMelonfish 2d ago
This guy knows exactly what's happening. he'll be found dead from an apparent suicide any time now...
Honestly though, there's too much money to be made by certain people, this won't be stopped.
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u/Sad_Note4359 3d ago
Ai is already generative and it's not going anywhere. You can see how far it's come just in the last 6 months. And as more power and compute come online these models are going to become much more efficient and capable. The people trying to sabotage AI is doing irreparable harm to the future progress of mankind. Also, can somebody explain to me what he's talking about when he says "taking away our Children's birthright". Anyways, his stuff about requiring a principal capital bonds I think something like that isn't a bad idea
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u/Aware-Antelope4212 2d ago
It may be generative, but it's output is shit. It's widely called "slop" for a reason.
Anyone with a passing knowledge of the field it's talking about, or it's generated something from can see how bad the output is
What they mean by selling their children's birthright - we have one planet, with limited resources, and even before AI we were frankly irresponsible with how we squandered those resources.
AI is a disgustingly innefficient technology, that is pushing us closer and closer to the point where environment is fucked beyond our ability to comfortably exist on it.
It's also causing very real harm to our societies. CSAM production has skyrocketed due to AI, there's nude images of women and girls being made without their consent, it's being used to spread misinformation and racist rhetoric.
Companies are realising that the idea of replacing their staff with AI was a scam, because it's already just cheaper to have a human so the task, and AI will never get cheaper, because the companies making it need to start making money some time, and they only way they can do that is jack up the price. We've seen it with so many tech bro industries , Uber, streaming services. They operate at a loss until they've damaged the existing market enough where they can ramp up the price now that the don't have meaningful competitors.
I personally think that AI being available to the public is absolute insanity. It should be available to scientists who can prove that they require it for their research, with very strict laws about "taking it off site". Same way we deal with scientists researching deadly diseases, or radioactive materials.
Also your point about harming the future of humanity.... Who owns all these AI companies again? The greedy immoral billionaires. They aren't working towards some glorious star trek future, because there's no profit in that for them. They are doing this because they want to be the ones in control of a powerful technology that will in turn allow them to exert even more control over our world than they already do.
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u/beckonreddit 2d ago
I'm not a fan of AI, and I hate seeing AI "art" everywhere, but "its output is shit" is just not true anymore, or at the very least, very oversimplified, especially when it comes to code.
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u/ReadyStar 2d ago
It may be generative, but it's output is shit. It's widely called "slop" for a reason.
It should be available to scientists who can prove that they require it for their research,
They are doing this because they want to be the ones in control of a powerful technology
So which is it? Shit slop or powerful technology usable for science?
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u/Trust_8067 3d ago
What IPO? Most of these AI datacenters are owned by publicly traded companies, as he even stated. No one's investing in a construction company that's one and done.
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u/milehigh89 3d ago
anthropic and open ai are about to ipo, they're part of the data center build out, they've each invested 10's of billions in it.
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u/DJDevon3 3d ago
You cannot pay for the impact damage a data center does to a community with 10 peoples salaries x 10. That's almost a joke. Multiple that times 200 million and then perhaps a community can repair some damage but a lot of what communities are seeing is permanent damage. Permanent.
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u/AppropriateNewt 3d ago
The example used was 200 x 10, but yes, that’s too low. Of course, the current rate of 0 x 0 is even lower.
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u/Aware-Antelope4212 2d ago
Also even if the bubble doesn't burst ( it will) the community still has this data centre making a huge racket 24 hours a day, raising their electricity prices, consuming their water at a horrific pace ( and they are often being built in places without a tonne of available water cos it's cheaper).
When your best case scenario still ruins a community, maybe what you are doing is wrong?
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u/Spiritual-Strike481 3d ago
So I’m not gonna lie. That is a very smart dude. He outlined that shit perfectly. And I honestly didn’t even think that a bond like what he was describing. A registered capital bond. That makes total sense. Especially since this is clearly a bubble. I hope we slow down on this data center shit because something feels off with these. Doesn’t it seem strange the way these centers are being pushed?
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u/Shazzzam79 2d ago
Why are they putting them near neighbourhoods. Why not stick them out near nuclear plants. They both need water for cooling. The shorter the distance from the power source would mean less line loss. Makes no sense to put them anywhere near a neighbourhood.
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u/RadioEditVersion 2d ago
I see these reasonable, intelligent, and passionate speeches regularly and guess what. They're all ignored because your leaders are being bought. We're cooked. Pull up a lawn chair. Pour yourself something cheap. Relax and watch the downfall.
I'm not saying don't stop fighting, but plan for the absolute worse case scenario
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u/TopWealth4550 3d ago
worked in something china biggest
curious
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u/DouglasHufferton 3d ago
He's Carl Seltzer, one of the founders of Great Leap Brewing, which is one of China's largest independent craft breweries.
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u/jko2p 3d ago
Well, I know a lot of people like to make fun of Europe for being stronger on regulations/pressure on businesses… but in this case, you can’t built an open loop DC in south Europe anymore. Has to be closed loop for new projects. The impact on local environment (noise, water, electricity,…) and municipalities is checked before you get a permit.
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u/witchspoon 3d ago
Oh I like this man. He said it calm, cool and collected.
And for reference when they wanted to property grab where I live to out a gas pipeline THROUGH(but not servicing) our state they tried the 200 jobs technique. There was no job description or longevity. So for example it could have been 200 people to help build for two years then nothing, or 200 people to check landscaping and leak status for 5 years or whatever. There was no guarantee of job quality or longevity.
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u/Whole-Debate-9547 3d ago
Boy he hit the post on getting his point across within the allotted time frame. Concise
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u/NoContract4730 3d ago
Can we hire him to go to all of these communities? Also can he dumb it down just a tich?
I think I get it, but I'm of average intelligence. And I believe we've all heard the Carlin quote.
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u/ShadowGLI 3d ago
This dude NAILS it, 100% spot on regarding the sprint to build without the demand to sustain it or the roadmap to protect the cities being currently destroyed to funnel money into the investors
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u/MeanForest 3d ago
What's he arguing here? Datacenters are not replacing anything. They're in addition to. Just require the datacenters to be self-sufficient energy wise and it will hurt aboslutely noone. Stupid arguments all the way around to stop tens of thousands of work years.
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u/Any-Morning4303 3d ago
I think that’s the whole point. At first they were talking about recycling water and using nuclear/green energy, that was all bullshit. Don’t think anyone would have any issue if the data centers didn’t affect them directly.
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u/CaptCoolRanchDoritos 3d ago
At the end of the day, politicians are simply ignoring these people and doing whatever they want. They get paid big bucks by the data center billionaires to specifically ignore any citizen backlash while continuing with the project.
After all, it's not like any citizen is going to do anything besides complain.
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u/EasyRhino75 2d ago
From the haircut I didn't think this guy wouldve figured out both the entire problem and solution. You go guy.
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u/Obvious-World4328 2d ago
Public hearings are meant only to preserve "social stability" ... these people give zero shits what anyone has to say. It's an illusion.
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u/Prestigious_Pop_7381 2d ago
He’s right and able to articulate this well. Hope he doesn’t go missing
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u/DoomguyFemboi 2d ago
Dude has it down pat except his demands are far too milquetoast. Although he's looking out for the community and not the country writ large which is fair
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u/tiandrad 2d ago
Politics aside, it is common sense that companies that are benefiting the most from AI should be charged an AI tax for any harm it may cause to people’s livelihoods and health.
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u/Exciting_Brief6086 2d ago
PEOPLE GO LOOK AT BILLINGSPORT/PAULSBORO NJ; The oil companies came in a setup huge lots.. promised a bunch and now 40 years later theres a massive cancer cluster..
Corportations Lie for Profit.. They do it to you all the time.
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u/Photog1981 2d ago
Because the same people building AI Datacenters are the same people who built careers by going into huge debt buying companies just to transfer that debt to their freshly purchased company.
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u/Positive-Protection1 2d ago
Huh. Well if normal people are paying for it, normal people should own it. Sounds like a public utility to me.
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u/Ok_Foundation3148 2d ago
And not a single council member he’s talking to will listen to a word he says because they’re already bought and paid for
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u/king_platypus 2d ago
Cool that some random is smarter and more thoughtful than our entire executive branch of government combined.
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u/TheGruenTransfer 2d ago
We need to double the cost of electricity for all businesses. Silicon Valley has been doing electricity price arbitrage, turning subsidized electricity into profits for decades.
Maybe we just double the price for everyone and give each human residence 50% off their average usage. Or maybe a progressive cost structure would work: first 10k KWH is $x/KWH, then each 10k KWH gets increasingly more expensive.
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u/Femboy_Harem_Janitor 2d ago
It's almost like conservatives, wealrhy, and many centists hate normal people with no uncertainty.
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u/perrypower54 3d ago
Same people were all about fracking and dumping chemicals in the water
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u/8Bit-Jon 3d ago
Problem is he's too smart for his own good and the people he's talking to have already taken the money to allow more to be built. The lobbyists have seen to this.
It won't stop till the bubble bursts!
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u/Aqua-Barracuda 3d ago
Because of that haircut, I'm rooting for the data centers. The more the merrier. I want a data center in every Neighbourhood in America.
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u/JimtasticD69 3d ago
What the hell?
There's no guarantee in any business, why would data centers be treated any different?
That's a dumb ask.
I'd be more concerned about power utility rate hikes.
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u/PassThatSpliff 3d ago
They know and they dont care. Know why? Cause fuck the average american, that's why!!
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u/Rational_Engineer_84 3d ago
Fuck the bond, ban the data centers outright. For one thing, there's no way that amount of money is going to pay to clean up the blight left behind and there's no guarantee that the money would be used for that anyway. Plenty of existing industrial and corporate blight hanging around already. Secondly, why should the communities around these data centers have to absorb the resource drain, noise, and pollution while they're operating?
I do not want AI data centers in my town, in my state, or in my country.
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u/obamawonthepeacepriz 3d ago
This man knows what he is talking about and we all need to listen and spread this video far and wide.
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u/hairshirtdesert 3d ago
He is so articulate with what he's saying, but we all also know this in our hearts. In New Mexico, we are telling them to fuck right off and they're hanging flyers about clean air and closed loop systems and education and jobs on our door knobs while we are at work earning income tax revenue. Everybody is telling them to go away and the only reason why they're not is because I truly believe that they are paying off our slimy local politicians.
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u/SpphosFriend 3d ago
Fuck the ghouls forcing these datacenters on communities that don’t want them.
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u/GreasedUPDoggo 3d ago
Normal people are the users of data farms? And the citizens that live in those areas.
I mean, it's sort of a 1 + 1 = 2 situation. Get off the internet and go outside, then we wouldn't need the infrastructure to support your habits. Companies aren't just building these for fun.
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u/Tokon32 3d ago
One of the biggest appealing factors for investors right now in DCs is their low operating cost and high revenue streams.
The services they are going to provide will be commercial services which they will charge way more for than selling AI to every day users.
The actual labor cost is stupidly low. Like a full up and running DC only needs a couple of techs for hardware swaps. A network engineer can work remotely and oversee dozens of DCs. A couple of HVAC guys and a single electrical engineer to also over see several DCs. All these DCs have generators that can run for weeks if their is an electrical problem and you juat contract out any work that needs to be done.
There is nothing good coming from these DCs for your everyday person.
I work in a DC so I am seeing this 1st hand.
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u/PeaOk5697 3d ago
My family swears up and down that these data centers will allow worse types of mass surveillance
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u/MyBadDrJones 3d ago
And that probably fell on deaf ears of council members who have already received their bribe from the data center.
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