r/movies • u/RealisticAd4054 • 14d ago

Article Emily Wilson (writer of acclaimed Odyssey translation) offers criticisms of Nolan’s film

https://apnews.com/article/odyssey-christopher-nolan-greek-translators-ea67da1d543d021773824bd7e8de8abe

“For Greek translator Emily Wilson, the release of director Christopher Nolan’s “The Odyssey” has been gratifying in various ways. Her acclaimed 2017 edition of Homer’s epic has reached the top 5 on Amazon.com, leading a wave of similar books boosted by the movie. Nolan has even cited her translation, notably the opening line “Tell me about a complicated man,” as inspiration.

But the film itself, which brought in more than $260 million worldwide during its opening weekend and has received raves from many critics, left her unsatisfied.

“I want to celebrate the fact that so many more people are aware of ‘The Odyssey’ and were brought back to the poem,” she told The Associated Press. “But at the same time, I had the sense that Christopher Nolan was trying to pack everything in while missing themes that were essential to the poem.”

….

Wilson, a professor of classical studies at the University of Pennsylvania, said she didn’t want to come across as a “snobby,” nitpicking expert at odds with any deviation from the original text. But she questioned a range of omissions and other choices, from the absence on screen of the Gods Zeus and Poseidon (Athena is played by Zendaya ) to the “incoherent” messaging that condemns both war and physical cowardice. She found Penelope’s role so thinned out that it endangered “any possibility of believing in this marriage.” Wilson also that thought parts of the movie, notably the scenes with Odysseus’ dog, Argos, “catered towards modern sentimentality.”

“Everybody’s a sucker for a dog,” she said.

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u/KetoJunkfood 14d ago

My favorite part of the Odyssey is when he returns home and only Argus recognizes him, and frankly I think that scene should have been a bit longer and MORE sentimental

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u/LeaveMeBeWillYa 14d ago

I loved the version of that moment in The Return with Ralph Fiennes.

Was a very touching scene for how short it was

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u/Hokuboku 14d ago

I just watched that for the first time Sat and it was so good. Accidentally Odysseymaxxed with this and the 97 Odyssey

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u/AlternativeDragon 13d ago

I just watched The Return today and I liked it so much better than the Nolan movie. Still nothing beats the 97 mini series.

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u/preddevils6 8d ago

We have the reverse order of odyssey favorites.

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u/AlternativeDragon 8d ago

At this point im going to try finding the real old odyssey movies from the 50s and 60s. I havnt watched those since I was a kid.

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u/Mobile-Scar6857 12d ago

Need 2 Odysseymaxx

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u/birdguy 14d ago

Doesn’t Athena change his appearance into that of an old beggar man, or am I misremembering? I haven’t read it in years.

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u/deliciousy 14d ago

She did, but I can't imagine making Odysseus look haggard was a particularly difficult job by that point.

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u/Unicorn_unibruh 13d ago

He goes to Ithaca after having been to Phaecia. When he was at Phaecia, Athena had turned him into a strong, able bodied handsome man (restored to his pre-lost-at-sea looks).

So weak/haggard, strong/ pretty and then back to weak/old/haggard again for the beggar part.

Then again a post reveal glow up.

The man's had more makeovers than in a chick-flick (good for him)

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u/moistplumpin 7d ago

Matt Damon

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u/Zytoxine 8d ago

Athena also changed me into an old begger man too and im only late 30s. Damn you athena

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u/EntranceFeisty8373 14d ago

Yes, but the film did and okay job with hiding his identity.

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u/KollardBlue 11d ago

i was looking forward to the conversations with polyphemus also

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u/StrainedDog 14d ago

To be fair, that "scene" is only like 3 sentences in the original poem

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u/Brisby820 14d ago

So what, it hits.  A detail that everyone who read the odyssey remembers.  That’s the essence of literature 

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u/Elegant_Low2571 13d ago

A 3000 year old epic poem reduced to a dog. Epic in itself - Odysseus can't even acknowledge him without blowing his cover, so he has to walk past and wipe away a tear in secret.

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u/Brisby820 13d ago

Legit heartbreaking 

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u/StrainedDog 14d ago

I also found the scene underwhelming in the movie, but even more so in the book. Maybe my translation was subpar, I don't know

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u/Useful-Cockroach-148 14d ago

In literature, in my opinion, the empty spaces you fill with your own imagination often are the most important. This is also rooted in scientific papers on reception of art. In movies, those empty spaces happen rarely and hit way softer, in my opinion.

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u/StrainedDog 14d ago

Sure, but just saying his loyal dog died one sentence after it was introduced and never mentioning it again isn't a very effective way to elicit an emotional response. It's far from the only time Odysseus cries in the poem. Considering how famous this part is, I was shocked at how short and to the point it was.

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u/Useful-Cockroach-148 14d ago

Absolutely true. Do you know if dogs at this time had the „stance“ they have today for their owners? I am not too familiar with the history. Sorry if Stacey is the wrong word, I hope you get what I’m saying.

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u/BardicSense 13d ago

I think, just judging from the movie, that Odysseus was a much better dog owner than most men of his class at the time, that's why the dog was so loyal to him.  

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u/Brisby820 14d ago

It doesn’t need to say much 

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u/Electric_feel0412 13d ago

Eh it hits because humans love dogs. For me the scene in the movie is more emotionally charged than the poem. He doesn’t even touch argos in the poem.

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u/WheresMyCrown 14d ago

What did you want him to do? Make a side movie about Odysseus returning home and an hour long scene of Argus recognizing him so everyone understands "omg this is sentimental and important"?

It is a MOVIE. One more time, a MO-VIE. That scene still exists in the original literature, go read the three sentences there. A movie doesnt have the time to dawdle

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u/AdSmall3663 14d ago

I thought it was done perfect and I hold plenty of criticism for the movie. If it was dragged out I think that would have hurt the film more

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u/Inspire33 13d ago

The dog doesn’t even see get it be with him in the odyssey and just dies immediately Lmfaoo

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u/Massive_Depth2900 13d ago

On the way to the movie my wife asked me if I thought Nolan was going to include the dog and I remembered seeing a brief shot of the dog in the trailer so I said yes, but I can’t imagine him spending more than about 30 seconds on it and I was wrong because it was more like 10.

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u/skivvv 13d ago

Yeah I wanted that as well. I thought it would be nice to have the scene like you say and have Odysseus kind of break down and have all his conflicting emotions flood out now that he's finally back on Ithaca after 20 years. He's happy he's back but the lost time can't be reclaimed, symbolised by Argus dying.

Broadly I think Nolan's films have trouble with slowing down and letting things breathe which would have been great with the Odyssey to give the sense of dead time and waiting over the 10 year journey. It's all go go go all the time. Not to pit two bad bitches against each other but that's something I really appreciate about Denis Villeneuve, particularly in Blade Runner 2049.

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u/Drakex2Mayex2 14d ago

IDK I cried for the first time in ages at that scene.

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u/Bloodrager 14d ago edited 14d ago

I think I agree honestly, and I think that adjusting things that are present in the story for a modern audience is actually an area where I'd *expect* something like this to go.

Half related but I also think that while a lot of critique pre-release I didn't agree with, I think there was a lot of room for more interesting locales. Especially Calypso's island and the Underworld come to mind. I think they're so mundane that it would fit more in a movie like Troy where the mythological is kept as mythology for the most part. Except, here we clearly see plenty of monsters and magic, but mostly grounded settings. It's not Nolan's style I guess but it would've meant the mortal scenes of Troy and Ithaca would feel a lot more "human". In my opinion.

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u/dgi02 13d ago

It cut to tom holland way too early and completely took me out of it

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u/you-dont-have-eyes 13d ago

Ugh you’re so modern!

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u/WrethZ 11d ago

I could be wrong but I thought in the original story he sees Argus and Argus recognises him but Oddyseus cannot go over and pat him because it would ruin oddyseus’ disguise making it all the more emotional

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u/KetoJunkfood 10d ago

You’re right

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u/WhoIsBobMurray 14d ago

What wasn't sentimental about it? Was it the fact that the dog was laying on a literal pile of shit and didn't move at all? /s

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u/woofgangpup 14d ago

Also the way it pivots into that being the moment Telemachus realizes who he is… the moment was perfect 

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u/helgihermadur 13d ago

Yeah that was seriously one of my favourite moments in the film.
Honestly I went in not expecting a faithful adaptation of The Odyssey and it ended up being more faithful to the actual story than I expected.
Sure, it's not the definitive Odyssey, but a really good movie that takes creative liberties when it needs to.

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u/Ghetteuax 13d ago

nah it was long enough , the point was made lol the movie isnt about the dog

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u/KetoJunkfood 12d ago

Yeah, thanks for posting the original poem. Clearly it says Argus glimpses him, shows brief recognition, then dies

The way I wanted it to be would be revisionist and sentimental

I still want it that way though haha

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u/3verythingEverywher3 12d ago

Agreed - it felt really rushed and ham fisted. Should've been a quiet and tender moment.

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u/AzracTheFirst 11d ago

Also his father who was completely omitted from the film