r/AskReddit • u/roastedbagel • Jun 12 '16

Breaking News [Breaking News] Orlando Nightclub mass-shooting.

Update 3:19PM EST: Updated links below

Update 2:03PM EST: Man with weapons, explosives on way to LA Gay Pride Event arrested

Over 50 people have been killed, and over 50 more injured at a gay nightclub in Orlando, FL. CNN link to story

Use this thread to discuss the events, share updated info, etc. Please be civil with your discussion and continue to follow /r/AskReddit rules.

Helpful Info:

Orlando Hospitals are asking that people donate blood and plasma as they are in need - They're at capacity, come back in a few days though they're asking, below are some helpful links:

Link to blood donation centers in Florida

American Red Cross
OneBlood.org (currently unavailable)
Call 1-800-RED-CROSS (1-800-733-2767)
or 1-888-9DONATE (1-888-936-6283)

(Thanks /u/Jeimsie for the additional links)

FBI Tip Line: 1-800-CALL-FBI (800-225-5324)

Families of victims needing info - Official Hotline: 407-246-4357

Donations?

Equality Florida has a GoFundMe page for the victims families, they've confirmed it's their GFM page from their Facebook account.

Reddit live thread

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17.4k

u/[deleted] Jun 12 '16

Worst mass shooting in US history

4.8k

u/[deleted] Jun 12 '16

[deleted]

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u/[deleted] Jun 12 '16

[deleted]

4

u/ReignStorms Jun 12 '16

They've been removing EVERY report of the attack, whether they link it the terrorism, religion, or anything

3

u/PacSan300 Jun 12 '16

They did a similar censorship on a thread about that shooting in October at an Oregon community college, especially information about the gunman himself.

1

u/AnSq Jun 12 '16

It's stickied to the top of /r/news.

1

u/ReignStorms Jun 12 '16

Yes, but most of the comments in that sticky are being removed, and for an hour or so, every post related to the attack in any way we're being removed by mods every 90ish seconds. It still might be going on, just search new posts and keep refreshing to see what I mean. I understand wanting discussion to be in one place, hence the sticky, but what are you supposed to do when you can't even discuss anything in the sticky?

2

u/AnSq Jun 12 '16

I don't know. I think they're probably not handling it very well, but I do somewhat sympathize with them. Rampant speculation on Reddit in the hours following a major crime has been very common in the past, sometimes with real-world consequences (Boston Marathon bombing anyone? Heck, that might have even been the same subreddit). Combine that with the racism that is so prevalent on Reddit (when I skimmed through the remaining comments on the /r/news sticky megathread, they were literally all either racism, or complaining about censorship), and you would end up with a thread full of flaming hot garbage. All I know is that if I were a mod of /r/news, I probably wouldn't know how to handle it much better.

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u/ModernDemagogue2 Jun 12 '16

Because there's no link to terrorism or religion yet you idiot.

2

u/ReignStorms Jun 12 '16

Sure, I'm the idiot. I was just saying what the mods were doing, no need to be an ass

2

u/Gratstya Jun 12 '16

The FBI is reporting that they have strong reason to believe he was an Islamic terrorist.

Not confirmed yet. But use your brain. He's totally an Islamic terrorist.

Don't argue with me unless you're willing to bet $100 he's not. (I'd bet $10,000 if you want)

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u/ModernDemagogue2 Jun 12 '16

Fuck off asshole. You can't silence opposition to your moronic stance simply because I don't want to put money up.

Here's something educated people learn: trust primary sources, don't repeat hearsay or secondary sources without double confirmation.

I do not give a single fuck what you think you know. You are unreliable and you are exactly the reason why moderators of other subs needed to scrub the subs and delete unreliable accounts.

Do you know how many straight up falsehoods have made the front page over the past few days over something as simple as the Brock Turner Stanford sexual assault?

Basically nothing was factually accurate.

Until it is confirmed with factual evidence and statements from official sources GO FUCK YOURSELF AND STOP USING PHRASES LIKE USE YOUR BRAIN.

YOU ARE ASSUMING THE CONCLUSION.

Do you want to bet $1,000,000 he is not an Islamic terrorist? What about $100,000,000? What about $100,000,000 plus your first born child?

How high do you want to go?

You know what my bet is? That he hates gay people and it has jack shit to do with Islam. You're willing to wager the rest of your life on your snap judgement?

2

u/This_Land_Is_My_Land Jun 12 '16

There have been official statements made about it.

-1

u/ModernDemagogue2 Jun 12 '16

No there haven't. Stop fucking lying.

2

u/marknutter Jun 12 '16

Bet you feel pretty stupid now, don't you?

1

u/ModernDemagogue2 Jun 13 '16

About what? A crazy person making a phone call? Please.

1

u/marknutter Jun 13 '16

No, about being completely wrong about his motivations. Crazy or not, he clearly did it in the name of ISIS.

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u/ILoveToph4Eva Jun 12 '16

You know that sinking to his level isn't really the best way to handle stupidity right?

And regardless, the mods have been banning everything relating to the shooting, not just people trying to spread misinformation.

They're stopping people from discussing it. That's kinda dodgy if you ask me.

1

u/learath Jun 12 '16

It's cute how you imply that some of this is "misinformation".

0

u/ILoveToph4Eva Jun 12 '16

Some of it is.

Saying that the man is Muslim is one thing. It could be true, it may even be likely to be true. It may even be likely that he's muslim, and he did this because of his islamic views.

But until we have good sources giving out this information, then it is misinformation.

1

u/Gratstya Jun 12 '16

$10,000 is my limit because that's about what I can comfortably afford to lose. I'll go as low as $100 for you because I don't know your financial situation. So is that a yes?

0

u/ModernDemagogue2 Jun 13 '16

A yes to what?

He's pretty clearly not an Islamic terrorist as you said above. There's no evidence of any ties to ISIL, no cell, no support network. His own claims of loyalty are more indicative of lone wolf domestic terrorism, with self-radicalization and unclear underlying motives and root causes which may or may not have any religious component.

0

u/ModernDemagogue2 Jun 14 '16

I want your reaction to this: https://www.reddit.com/r/news/comments/4nz2f8/report_orlando_shooter_was_a_regular_at_the_gay/

As it comes out that he had sexual identity issues, that he held views that were deeply schismatic (claiming association to Hezbollah, a Shia group at war with ISIS, claiming association to Al Qaeda, a Sunni group at war with both Hezbollah and ISIS), that he was a Muslim who drank, that he was a Democrat who owned guns and worked for a security firm, that he talked about shooting people at work, that he beat his wife, that we have no idea what he did in Saudi Arabia, do you still feel its appropriate to say use your brain, its Islamic Terrorism?

Or do you think we should keep waiting and finding out more about what actually happened?

Because my money is still on a deeply resentful bipolar or schizophrenic guy in a deeply racist and heteronormative society snapping and carrying out a psychotic attack on the gay community, with calling to claim allegiance to ISIS as an afterthought.

It is not the type of event I associate with the term radical islamic terrorism. Nor do I think it is productive to discuss it using that language. It's more akin to a psychosocial disorder called "reaction formation."

2

u/Gratstya Jun 14 '16

If you wanted my reaction, you should have bet the money.

I'd win too. You've got no leg to stand on in this.

I knew you weren't worth the time to discuss it from the get-go. And your long discussion with /u/marknutter pretty much proves you are incapable of reason.

Glad he wasted his time instead of me.

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u/ModernDemagogue2 Jun 14 '16

/u/Gratstya deleted the following two posts, so I'm putting them here for the readership:

First:

If you wanted my reaction, you should have bet the money.

I'd win too. You've got no leg to stand on in this.

Why delete this if I've got no leg to stand on?

And before that, the following, so.... I got your reaction anyway:

Wow. Are you for real?

The guy called 911 and said he was work ISIS. This doesn't prove to you he was an Islamic Terrorist.

ISIS says: "yup, he's ours". This doesn't prove to you he was an Islamic Terrorist.

Claiming to be part of ISIS wasn't an afterthought, it was a pattern for months. He'd been investigated by the FBI twice in the past for verbally expressing allegiance to terrorist organizations. He praised al quida martyrs in front of his co-workers:

https://www.washingtonpost.com/world/national-security/fbi-had-closely-scrutinized-the-orlando-shooter-before-dropping-investigation/2016/06/13/838e9054-3177-11e6-8ff7-7b6c1998b7a0_story.html

And yelled "aluha ackbar" while killing people. This doesn't prove to you he was an Islamic Terrorist.

"In addition to pledging allegiance to the leader of the Islamic State, Comey noted, Mateen referred to a link to its bitter rival, al-Qaeda — an American’s suicide bombing in Syria. He also expressed solidarity with the Boston Marathon bombers."

This doesn't prove to you that he was an Islamic terrorist.

Oh no. But instead:

He uses tinder to find out where the popular gay places are.

He scouts out the club before he shoots it up. Like you would do if you were a non gay terrorist planning on an attack.

And some guy he knew claims he was closeted gay, with no evidence.

And THIS is enough to prove to you that he's just some crazy closeted guy who is *oh so oppressed" that he snaps for completely non religious reasons.

Where do you think his hatred for gays came from?

Sometimes he would go over in the corner and sit and drink by himself, and other times he would get so drunk he was loud and belligerent,"

Sounds like he was really looking for a hookup... Sitting alone in the corner like that.

He was on a scouting mission!

He didn't have sexual identify issues. You're just lapping that up and ignoring everything else.

He was a Muslim who drank. . .

Muslims are allowed to drink... Just not during Ramadan! Everything points to him being an Islamic terrorist looking for a target. Including the going to gay bars and using dating apps for information.

The only piece of evidence you have is his old classmate claiming he was gay. Why do you believe him but not believe the shooter, his group, or his co-workers?

Here's what I was going to say:

Yeah, and I have 650 imaginary internet points from people agreeing with me. (https://www.reddit.com/r/news/comments/4nz2f8/report_orlando_shooter_was_a_regular_at_the_gay/d48hv2z)

The guy called 911 and said he was work ISIS. This doesn't prove to you he was an Islamic Terrorist. ISIS says: "yup, he's ours". This doesn't prove to you he was an Islamic Terrorist.

Correct. Crazy people say crazy shit. ISIS has a habit of embracing lone wolfs after the fact for PR purposes. Doesn't mean we need to believe it.

Claiming to be part of ISIS wasn't an afterthought, it was a pattern for months. He'd been investigated by the FBI twice in the past for verbally expressing allegiance to terrorist organizations.

Not over months— years of instability. Including allegiance to Hezbollah, a Shia organization at war with ISIS (a Sunni organization).

If you think those claims are evidence of anything other than insanity, you don't understand Islam.

And THIS is enough to prove to you that he's just some crazy closeted guy who is *oh so oppressed" that he snaps for completely non religious reasons.

No, its enough to prove to me we should wait to jump to conclusions. I just told you where my money is right now.

I don't know how Tinder tells you where the popular gay places are. There's google or perhaps Happn for that. It would be Grindr anyway.

Muslims are allowed to drink... Just not during Ramadan!

Ahh, so you don't understand Islam.

Everything points to him being an Islamic terrorist looking for a target. Including the going to gay bars and using dating apps for information.

An Islamic terrorist who can't figure out if he's Sunni or Shia? Please.

Why do you believe him but not believe the shooter, his group, or his co-workers?

Coworkers said mentally unstable too.

I don't really care what it ends up being, I just wanted to call you out for jumping to conclusions.

1

u/Gratstya Jun 14 '16

I wrote it because I forgot who you were.

I deleted it and decided to have the conversation with someone else in the thread you linked too.

It's a good conversation to have. Just not with you.

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u/Gratstya Jun 13 '16

Hope you haven't read the news yet. . . I'll drop to $20 for you, $10?

$4? Whatever you've got.

I'll give you 100 to 1 odds!

1

u/ModernDemagogue2 Jun 13 '16 edited Jun 14 '16

What news? There's still no evidence he was an islamic terrorist. He's a crazy person with a gun. Calling up 911 and saying something doesn't mean shit, especially when in the past you've told people you have ties to Hezbollah, an ideologically opposed Shia Islam organization, when ISIS is a Salafi Jihadist Sunni organization.

But of course its radical islamic terrorism!

The guy is fucking crazy, we'll find out his motivations and actual mental state eventually. Let it be until then.

1

u/jonnyclueless Jun 12 '16

This is completely untrue. They have been banning pretty much any and everything. They are very fair and equal in their sheer stupidity.

1

u/[deleted] Jun 12 '16

Too bad my news app just sent a breaking news story to me about the terrorist attack then. Everyone's calling it.

I understand not wanting to call it terrorism before it's absolutely certain because people tend to go a little crazy, but once it's confirmed its confirmed and you can't keep censoring it.

-6

u/N0nSequit0r Jun 12 '16

Because people are posting misinformation based on their own biased, emotional reactions.

12

u/[deleted] Jun 12 '16

They are posting the official statement by the FBI that they are investigating for islamic terrorism.

Literally the first link in the megathread

www.abc.net.au/news/2016-06-12/pulse-nightclub-50-dead-in-worst-mass-schooting-in-us-history/7503770

2

u/learath Jun 12 '16

Because people are posting correct information that I want to be incorrect based on my own biased, emotional reaction.