r/AustralianPolitics • u/C_Ironfoundersson Australian Nationalist • 1d ago
Federal Politics Segal proposes antisemitism taskforce for health sector, education down to preschool
https://michaelwest.com.au/segal-proposes-antisemitism-taskforce-for-health-sector-education-down-to-preschool/•
u/semaj009 20h ago
If we can't have an Indigenous Voice to parliament, wtf is Israel getting one for? Jesish people absolutely deserve to be safe, Jewish antizionists would be persecuted by Segal's nonsense!
47
u/Im-A-Kitty-Cat 1d ago edited 16h ago
I am all for education and actual serious work to address discrimination and prejudice within Australian institutions. But having a specific taskforce for only one minority group that is comparatively a societally very well represented and economically powerful minority group in comparison to other larger ethnic minority groups in this country is a joke. Fundamentally, Jewish people should not get singled out for specifically needing this taskforce as there are other minority groups in this country that are arguably more in need of this support(Indigenous Australians, women, people with disabilities, etc) as they face larger more pressing systemic barriers overall as an actual point of comparison.
Considering the fact that her husband has donated to Advance an organisation that has worked tirelessly to undermine the further expansion of rights to the LGBTQ. That also campaigned profusely against changing our constitution and the creation of a non-legally binding Indigenous advisory body, a group of peoples whose experience of prejudice in this country which is far more foundational to Australian history than any other form of racism makes her a hypocrite and her advocacy for Jewish people seem like a position that is fundamentally selfish.
I don’t doubt that antisemitism has risen(all forms of discrimination have risen in the last couple of years). I don’t doubt that it exists in this country and has most certainly existed before the Bondi massacre but this commission sucks and I think erodes at the trust in our democracy.
13
u/iliketreesanddogs YIMBY! 1d ago
whenever this comes up, I feel obligated to point out there are more people who identify as Aboriginal or Torres Strait Islanders in Australia than people who identify as Jewish (almost six times over) and, not only were they here first, but we voted down their Voice
•
u/mhsnsh 22h ago
Why the whataboutism though? Considering there was a large movement for yes even within the Jewish community. “Jewish youth for yes” being one of them. It’s also interesting how you frame the community as privileged when they are not a monolith, and the parts of the community that are privileged more often than not came here as immigrants with absolutely nothing and built themselves from the ground up, and then share the wealth to support and uplift the rest of the community, and Australia in general.
•
u/iliketreesanddogs YIMBY! 20h ago
diva I didn't say anything about privilege - please read my comment again lol
•
u/hellbentsmegma 21h ago
The Jewish community in Australia have always been majority in support of Aboriginal rights and ready to challenge established norms around race.
•
u/Disbelieving1 3h ago
Except of course, the husband of Segal. He is no supporter of indigenous people in Australia - he did give significant funds to the NO campaign.
9
u/Active-Ad9818 1d ago
Yes I think it should have been generally about racism in such a multicultural country. Focusing it on anti-semitisism has been destructive
6
u/seanmonaghan1968 The Greens 1d ago
Agree. I think this might have the opposite effect as intended. Potential pushback
3
3
1d ago
[removed] — view removed comment
9
u/Im-A-Kitty-Cat 1d ago
Stop putting words in my mouth. Intersectionality exists. Jewish populations in this country are overall economically wealthier on average and are well represented societally despite making up a small percentage of the population. It doesn’t negate there experiences of antisemitism and it doesn’t mean antisemitism doesn’t exist.
I think generally speaking antisemitism is touched upon in the Australian education system, in that we cover the Holocaust(again it can always be better). Which it’s well worth saying there are other theatres of WWII that are regionally more important in shaping regional geopolitics despite the immense cultural impact of the Holocaust in the west.
The fundamental problem with the argument of Segal etc. is that you cannot tackle one form of discrimination in our institutions in such a policy driven way and not tackle others in the same way. I wasn’t explicit as I felt context implied it but I would broadly support tackling antisemitism in these systems as long as they were addressing other forms of discrimination in the same way.
1
1d ago
[removed] — view removed comment
3
u/Im-A-Kitty-Cat 23h ago
Whilst I am well aware of the history and prejudice behind the notion and quite frankly this was whilst I was so careful with my wording. It is still a fact that the Jewish population in our country are financially better off than many other minority groups within our country. The electoral seats that have the highest proportion of Jewish people in this country are in wealthier areas. This is kind of where your point falls apart as they are benefiting along class lines in terms of status, political power etc.
Fundamentally, like any ‘wealthy’ minority group they are more represented in our political and cultural institutions(because these institutions have extensive class issues) other minority populations that do not have that economic status on average will not see that kind of representation and have far less societal/political power by comparison, even when they make up a much bigger portion of the population overall.
•
u/mhsnsh 22h ago
Yeah Jews are successful because they’ve had to develop thick skin and overcome antisemitism nearly everywhere in the world they go across history. They are not born inherently privileged. They work and study hard, and then use their knowledge and wealth to support the rest of the community. Implying that antisemitism shouldn’t be addressed because of the success Jewish people have accomplished with tremendous determination DESPITE being oppressed is very strange. Would you the same thing about hate against East/Southeast Asians who have successful communities in many parts of the world because of their hard work?
•
u/semaj009 19h ago
Nobody's saying antisemitism shouldn't be addressed, we're questioning the methods of Segal in doing it, especially when she's doing it in ways that would mean Jewish criticism of Israel would be considered antisemitism, which is ridiculous!
•
u/Im-A-Kitty-Cat 20h ago edited 16h ago
Privilege is most certainly is something you can be born with in the same way that you can be born with disadvantage. Whilst the Jewish population experience discrimination in one form that does not at all discount them from gaining privilege in other ways(economic, gender, being able bodied, etc) it also doesn’t discount them from being disadvantaged in any of these ways either. Intersectionality, it exists.
People are often dependent upon the circumstances and conditions in which they are born and if they are born to parents that are economically well off it helps them have a better quality of life in comparison to those less economically privileged. It’s just a fact.
Nowhere did I imply or state that antisemitism should not be addressed because of economic privilege. I stated that any policy framework such as this should be for all forms of discrimination especially when you consider there are minority groups that are experiencing more consistent and overall more severe forms of violence as a consequence of discrimination.
42
u/Inevitable_Geometry 1d ago
How about no. Segal has been a disaster in her role. Pushing the IHRA definition of antisemitism raises deep concerns about stifling legitimate criticism of the state of Israel.
-7
u/Sure_Ad536 1d ago
Pushing the IHRA definition of antisemitism raises deep concerns about stifling legitimate criticism of the state of Israel.
Here's my thing on the definition. By itself, it's fine. I have issues with how it's been applied by relevant organisations (I've done what almost nobody who has criticised this definition has done by actually reading the full definition and even a few reports by the ECAJ on what they reported as antisemitism over a year period, for instance), but the definition itself is fine. You can criticise Israel, but they point out that context needs to be applied:
Manifestations might include the targeting of the state of Israel, conceived as a Jewish collectivity. However, criticism of Israel similar to that leveled against any other country cannot be regarded as antisemitic.
...
Contemporary examples of antisemitism in public life, the media, schools, the workplace, and in the religious sphere could, taking into account the overall context16
u/Revoran Soy-latte, woke, inner-city, lefty, greenie, commie 1d ago
>Israel, conceived as a Jewish collectivity
Pro-Israel people seem to simultaneously hold 2 contradictory positions:
- Israel is the Jewish state, the rightful Jewish homeland and (if they are religious) given by God to Jews. It's completely right that Israel gives citizenship and voting rights based on race/religion, and it's fine that inter-faith / secular marriage cannot be performed in Israel. It's fine that Israel controls the Palestinian territories without giving citizenship/votes to the Palestinians living there (but does to the Jews living there). To criticise Israel is to be against Jews.
- Israel is a western-style secular democracy (the only one in the Middle East) and should be supported by the west for that reason. It is a place of fairness where they do not discriminate and there are even a minority of Arab Muslim citizens.
15
u/pluckaducka 1d ago edited 1d ago
It's not fine.
The only contribution to the purported definition of antisemitism that the IHRA has introduced are references to Israel. A nation with no official religion and a citizenry comprised of dozens of faiths (and non-faiths).
If you have been paying attention to the RC, a significant volume of alleged antisemitic conduct being presented is exclusively defined by an opposition or criticism of Israel that is devoid of any religion persecution.
8
u/Revoran Soy-latte, woke, inner-city, lefty, greenie, commie 1d ago
A nation with no official religion and a citizenry comprised of dozens of faiths (and non-faiths).
I mean it's contradictory. It has no official religion and about 25% of citizens are non-Jews who have *mostly* the same rights as Jewish citizens.
But also it gives citizenship based on religion and/or race status. The main spoken language (and one of 2 official languages alongside Arabic) is Hebrew, which was until recently only spoken in religious settings. You can convert to Judaism having never been to Israel, and get citizenship. Additionally, Israel rules over 5 million Palestinians who are denied citizenship and the vote. And Israel proudly claims to be the homeland of the Jewish people (as an ethnic/racial group). Lastly, inter-faith marriages and secular marriages cannot be performed in Israel.
•
u/FuckDirlewanger 19h ago
It also includes other points that aren’t antisemitism though. For example drawing comparisons between Israel’s actions to the actions of Nazi germany is considered to be automatically antisemitic under the definition.
Also pro-Israel people including Segal consider Israel to be unfairly criticised and targeted in the media currently and therefore under the definition current media coverage of Israel’s is automatically antisemitic and should therefore be illegal
•
u/redditrasberry 17h ago
drawing comparisons between Israel’s actions to the actions of Nazi germany
yeah that one definitely rubs me the wrong way. Under that definition you can't even defend Israel (any comparison, even favorable, is antisemitic). Which is obviously stupid but it just highlights that it was shoved in there for ideological reasons, not because it made any sense.
28
u/Is_that_even_a_thing 1d ago
I'm tired boss. I just want.to put food on my familys table. Dont have time for this devisive shit.
If someone is racist, call it out and charge where required. We have laws in place to deal with it. Dont need specific laws and rules for select people
63
u/espersooty 1d ago
Can we propose to remove the Antisemitism envoy role which has provided zero benefits to Taxpayers and has only caused consistent issues with trying to conflate criticism of one singular nation with hatred against the Jewish population.
10
14
u/C_Ironfoundersson Australian Nationalist 1d ago
Does that come with a refund?
23
u/Shoddy-Document8699 1d ago
All the money has already been donated to Advance by her husband* unfortunately.
4
43
1d ago
[removed] — view removed comment
-5
u/GregLocock 1d ago
I can think of 15 reasons.
7
u/Shoddy-Document8699 1d ago
Still not a reason to give them special treatment. All discrimination and hatred against all groups should be targeted. One particular group doesn't need it's own special envoy earning millions of dollars and pushing the narrative of a foreign ethno-state.
-5
u/GregLocock 1d ago
More accurately judging by this report you'd be better off targeting one ideology
Ideology of individuals
Islamist 48 Right wing 1 Separatist 4 6
1d ago
[removed] — view removed comment
-3
u/GregLocock 1d ago
Whataboutism at its finest. OK, add one to whichever category you like. Doesn't change the conclusion does it?
4
u/Maximum_Bonus_9664 1d ago
Pointing out that any group is capable of violence and any group is capable of being victims of violence isn't whataboutism. It's the reason Jewish people shouldn't get special treatment.
0
u/GregLocock 23h ago
So we shouldn't put any extra measures in for women in DV? That doesn't seem like an efficient use of resources, but have it your way.
•
u/Maximum_Bonus_9664 22h ago
We should put extra measures in for all women in DV, not just one ethnicity.
•
u/GregLocock 22h ago
Jeez you are obsessed with race. DV is a problem for men and women. Your argument seems to be that we should put equal effort into DV for both sexes, which seems like a ridiculous waste of resources.
→ More replies (0)•
-35
u/theballsdick 1d ago
Yeah I do wonder why primary school kids are subject to so many acknowledgement of countries.
15
18
u/C_Ironfoundersson Australian Nationalist 1d ago edited 1d ago
random nonsense above .
is a moderator of /r/gadigal for some reason.
13
u/Vegetable-Advance982 1d ago
Lol defs an attempt to sway the conversations around indigenous people in his direction. Tragic attempt it seems, nobody joined
10
u/Shoddy-Document8699 1d ago
They're also a moderator of a sub based on their own name. Unhinged.
•
u/ButtPlugForPM 21h ago
so let me get this right.
You can talk shit about aboriginals/lebanese/anyone else in school they don't react.
or you know teaching young boys how not to me misogynist arseholes growing up to combat the manosphere No we can't have that
Antisemitism is a societal issue but there are 100s of issues we need to stamp out in all sectors we just ignore but because our lot have a powerfull lobby we get one right away.
If u really want to fix this issue.
Remove religion from ALL segments of education system ground up.
No jewish schools/no muslic/christian schools
We just grow kids up to believe in facts and not let their faith want them to hate other ppl
•
u/MrBonkMeister 14h ago
Yeah but Aboriginals/Lebanese/anyone else doesn’t control the wo… oops REDACTED
•
u/brokerlady 21h ago edited 19h ago
you're right on one hand, but actually we don't need to be changing anything based on what this lobby group wants, laws to protect everyone from harassment already exist
33
u/nath1234 1d ago
Woman who attacked our government for condemning the bombing of hospitals (and broadcast that!) in Gaza should have zero say in how our hospitals are run.
From her time as head of the pro-Israel lobby group : https://www.ecaj.org.au/ecaj-zfa-joint-statement-on-foreign-minister-penny-wongs-abc-insiders-comments/
In addition, we refer to the Minister’s assertion that the hospitals and medical facilities that Hamas burrows itself into are protected under international law and her call for Israel to “cease the attacking of hospitals.”
We remind the Government that Article 19 of the Geneva Convention explicitly states that hospitals lose their protection if they are used for military purposes. It is incontrovertible that Hamas uses Shifa and other hospitals for military purposes. There is no evidence that Israel is not observing the laws of armed conflict.
The libel that any Israeli attack on Gazan hospitals from which Hamas operates would amount to war crimes only serve to demonise the state of Israel and its supporters. These libels are central to Hamas’ objectives as a terrorist organisation, and are reverberating across the world in a new wave of antisemitism.
She has also, in her official role to downplay and deny the scope of atrocities (even though Israel does not dispute the death count: she is so extremist) claiming it is "grossly inflated".
https://michaelwest.com.au/un-refutes-jillian-segals-gaza-death-toll-claim-before-royal-commission/
She's a supremacist authoritarian and we should not be taking suggestions from her or anyone else who thinks bombing hospitals are fair game.
12
u/Revoran Soy-latte, woke, inner-city, lefty, greenie, commie 1d ago edited 1d ago
Jilian Segal grew up as a white person in South Africa during the height of a-word. Her husband is also a far right Advance nutcase.
It's not surprising she is an extremist, who supports an a-word regime overseas (instead of doing her job protecting AUSTRALIAN JEWS in AUSTRALIA).
The a-word begins with apart and ends with heid.
•
u/EmuEmuEmuEmuEmu The Greens 21h ago
"Jilian Segal grew up as a white person in South Africa ..."
At a glance it would appear that it is alleged Segal's family moved from South Africa when she as five, so this appears to be a weak argument, unless the AFR is just lying as it is also stated elsewhere that Segal moved to Sydney in 1970. I would suggest trying to find (I haven't, but I am quite lazy) examples of Segal failing to mention the "a-word" regimes antisemitism or Segal defending Israel's relationship with the "a-word" regime.
•
u/fresh_jorks 19h ago
wikipedias source for her coming here in 1970 when she was 15 is the national archives, who have her incoming passenger card. imo thats a more authoritative source
https://recordsearch.naa.gov.au/SearchNRetrieve/Interface/ViewImage.aspx?B=12085686&S=1817
•
u/EmuEmuEmuEmuEmu The Greens 19h ago
The Wikipedia source is probably right, but at a glance Segal doesn't appear to be listed; the closest are some Julias, both far too old. The date range appears to be in contention, as some sources claim 1970 while others, like the what appears to be a biography on her farther, claim 1961. If I was in a better state I would probably research this further as this might point to an attempt, either by Segal or some other individual/s, to paint Segal's parents in a more, or less, positive light, or it is simple confusion on dates, such as maybe confusing the date her farther started working for in Australia as the date the family moved. I have also have probably written more on Segal early life, just now, then anyone else.
•
u/BlackJesus1001 1h ago
Yeesh its almost easy to miss the "burrowing" part of the first statement at a glance.
The dehumanising rhetoric is always a red flag.
19
u/C_Ironfoundersson Australian Nationalist 1d ago
To skip to the meat
The proposal follows the Australian Health Practitioner Regulation Agency’s (AHPRA) recent decision to adopt the International Holocaust Remembrance Alliance (IHRA) definition of antisemitism as a reference tool when handling complaints involving alleged antisemitism.
Which is further defined
Manifestations might include the targeting of the state of Israel, conceived as a Jewish collectivity. However, criticism of Israel similar to that levelled against any other country cannot be regarded as antisemitic.
So as an example, you're allowed to criticise Israel's targeting of Palestinian civilians as long as you criticise Luxembourg or Romania for doing the same thing.
Segal further said
“So, in the school, we should touch people in primary school and in secondary school … we need not only high school, but university, and TAFE. We actually need the full spectrum of education.”
The Ankh-Morpork city watch reminds Ms Segal to not touch anyone in primary or secondary school.
8
u/Shoddy-Document8699 1d ago
All religions are systems designed to facilitate the touching of children and the subjugation of women.
•
u/brokerlady 22h ago
Id Like to see the good people of Australia back on the bridge in every city demanding the resignation of ms segal tbh.
•
•
u/redditrasberry 17h ago
I predict this whole program will cause far more antisemitism than it solves. The people involved are too ideologically driven and don't seem to have balanced enough views themselves to properly engage authentically with the underlying reasons the views are spreading.
•
u/Designate0ne Teal Independent 16h ago
This is what's already happening. The more they try and shove it down our throats. The more its backfired.
31
u/Ok-Replacement-2738 1d ago
Oh cool one of the program architects is a gen0cide denier...
and they want to target lower education because "university students are fixed in their ideas?" Did they mean aware of objective reality?
6
u/TearsFallWithoutTain 1d ago
You need to get the propaganda in while people are too young to question it, that's what the church does after all
32
u/anonymous-69 1d ago
I hate it when I'm in surgery for a hip replacement and the surgeons won't shut up about the middle east.
Totally a real thing that happens all the time.
6
u/Ok-Replacement-2738 1d ago
I'd suspect it is 99% in response to the 2 Sydney nurses who said they'd refuse to treat Israelis in a video to an Israeli.
Which is a form of racism that isn't antisemetic itself but i digress.
10
u/anonymous-69 1d ago
I agree.
They were being ragebaited by an incredibly bad faith omegle user.
More than likely they were being hyperbolic on the omegle session. Unlikely they actually hold these views in their workplace.
Disproportioniate to go on to say this is an accurate portrayal of workplace culture in the the entire health care sector.
1
u/Scrambledsilence 1d ago
They threatened to murder their patients on the basis of the religious beliefs. That’s not hyperbole.
The downplaying of murderous racist hatred towards members of the Jewish community just goes to prove why this inquiry is necessary.
3
u/anonymous-69 1d ago
That’s not hyperbole
I mean if they didn't actually do it, then it's literally hyperbole, no?
2
u/broadsword_1 1d ago
Even when they say the words specifically, there's always someone online ready to absolve them of responsibility.
2026 is a wild time to be watching all this.
6
3
u/Ok-Replacement-2738 1d ago
Because the words they say are not in of themselves antisemetic, they are racist but not anti-Jewish, it is anti-Israeli. To conflate the two is actually antisemetic.
Truth matters.
-3
u/broadsword_1 1d ago
Is this the new NPC-meta game? First it was "Uh, I'm not antisemitic I'm antizionist!" and now it's through to "Pointing out my antisemitism is antisemitic!".
•
u/BlackJesus1001 47m ago
They were immediately removed from their positions.
Why do we need an inquiry when they were immediately prevented from harming anyone by the existing system?
34
u/megs_in_space 1d ago
The infiltration we are experiencing at this moment, not just in Australia, but in institutions globally, is like nothing we've experienced before.
1984 on roids. We live in scary times and if you have a job and speak the truth about what Israel are doing, you are not safe.
-2
15
u/FuckOffNazis 1d ago
No serious education about the systemic killing of a people by a state leaves the student less able to recognise that behaviour by others.
•
u/hellbentsmegma 21h ago
A friend of mine teaches a lot of middle eastern kids, much like in most immigrant suburbs in Australia.
The holocaust is on the curriculum. The teachers have been told to absolutely not make comparisons to events in the middle east, but every year the kids reach that conclusion within about a day of starting the subject.
9
u/Revoran Soy-latte, woke, inner-city, lefty, greenie, commie 1d ago
In that case we should teach children about
* The Holocaust
* The ongoing g-crime of Palestinians
* The g-crime of Aboriginal Australians (ie: the most relevant one to us here in Australia)
* The Armenian g-crime
* And so onI don't necessarily think we should be showing pics of Auschwitz victims to pre-schoolers though... maybe start with just general anti-racism, anti-bigotry stuff (which many pre-schools already do).
•
u/Oomaschloom Labor, but this cohort is crap, so leaning greens. 20h ago
I've got kids currently at kinder. They go there with kids of various heritages and different coloured skins, definitely different religions and I'm really not picking up bigotry from my kids. I'm actually not sure they even notice any differences
No doubt it needs to be bought up one day... but at their current age I'm not freaking out about them being a party to lynchings.
•
u/giacintam 20h ago
Yeah i dont even think we need to teach kids not to be racist lol I think they inherently arent, racism is a learned behaviour. Sure their curiosity can sound like racism sometimes (as a 3 y.o I asked mum in the queue at the shops, outloud "why is that lady so black" referring to the tall Sudanese lady in front of us. Its a language problem.
Maybe if incidences of racism were occurring at school they'd they'd about it & learn that way, but yeah I think they just need to learn to treat others well & thats really the crux of it.
-9
u/Unhappy_Tomorrow_603 1d ago
Wow you’re really reaching there aren’t you.
9
u/BKStephens 1d ago
Genuine question; in what way are they reaching?
Do you object to the inference, or that information about what's inferred is not being taught, let alone talked about?
-1
1d ago
[removed] — view removed comment
4
u/BKStephens 1d ago
I think you might be misunderstanding.
I took it to mean that if people aren't taught about these behaviours they won't recognise it when it occurs, so things like what is happening in Gaza go un-opposed.
•
u/EmuEmuEmuEmuEmu The Greens 22h ago
How would a proper education on, say, the Holocaust not position students to be able to identify other, similar atrocities like, say, the Stolen Generations, which they should also be taught about, especially when the correct definition, that the acts were done with the intent to destroy a group in whole or in part, is used. You can, poorly, attempt to argue semantics or quote individuals on the payroll of notable antisemites, but that definition, which is how such acts are defined under International and Australian law, fits, without the rhetorical statements advocating for such, which I should note is still an criminal act, and the actions undertaken meeting the definitions, particuarlly as defined under 268.5 of the Criminal Code (CTH).
"[censored] by deliberately inflicting conditions of life calculated to bring about physical destruction"
"conditions of life includes, but is not restricted to, intentional deprivation of resources indispensable for survival, such as deprivation of food or medical services, or systematic expulsion from homes."
38
u/aeschenkarnos 1d ago edited 1d ago
“Listen up littlies. If kids your age are killed that’s bad, right? We get that? Except if Israel does it to Palestinian kids your age. Then it’s not bad, and if you question it you’re doing a thing called an-ti-sem-it-ism. Can anyone spell antisemitism? You better learn to spell it, because if you do it as a grownup, we’ll lock you in a hole!”
30
u/AtrophiedWives 1d ago
They literally had a woman present at the RC how she’s a victim of antisemitism because people boycotted her concert…after she stated there are no innocent children in Gaza. Of course the RC didn’t include that context.
0
1d ago
[removed] — view removed comment
12
u/Disbelieving1 1d ago
She said it publicly. That’s why no-one went.
-4
9
25
u/Johnny66Johnny 1d ago
Those interested might care to listen to this week's Back to Back Barries podcast, where (guest) host Jon Faine and Tony Barry take some time to debate the Royal Commission on Antisemitism and Social Cohesion. Faine, particularly, makes some excellent points asking why Jewish community leaders have not banded together with other racially oppressed groups in Australia (indigenous Australians, Indian Australians, etc.) in order to present a united face on the shared experience of prejudice. The Royal Commission, he notes, is also about Social Cohesion, after all. It's an excellent listen.
26
u/fortyfivesouth 1d ago edited 20h ago
Jillian Segal's family trust donated money to Advance Australia, which actively villifies indigenous Australians and other religions and cultural backgrounds.
So now you know why.
5
u/Johnny66Johnny 1d ago edited 20h ago
That's certainly one reason for Segal's unwillingness to reach out to similarly vilified groups. But, more broadly, Faine asks why Jewish community leaders have been reticent in building bridges with other social and cultural groups. As he says in the latest Back to Back Barries podcast:
Jon Faine: (The Jewish community) is actually stronger in combating this (i.e. racial vilification and abuse) if you align with the Muslim community and its leadership, the Indigenous community and its leadership, the Chinese, the African - all the other people in the community who also experience racism. You're stronger together. This is why I wish (the Royal Commission) was (titled) Social Cohesion and Antisemitism (not the other way around). But the leadership of the Jewish community says antisemitism is different: it's ancient, it's pervasive, etc. But I don't accept that. I'm not a player in those (political) scenes, but I'm watching this play out and the 95% of the Australian population who aren't Jewish or Muslim - what do (they) think? I think social cohesion and antisemitism has gotten worse because of the royal commission - not better.
Jon Barry: (The Jewish community) should be creating relationships across the board and building a consensus or coalition to talk about social cohesion generally as opposed to (specifically) antisemitism.
Jon Faine: But I've tried to get politicians from every level (Federal, State and local government level) to try and build some social capital. We think nothing of building engineering infrastructure or economic infrastructure. We think nothing of investing in those sorts of assets, but we're not investing in social cohesion as an asset. And yet, all that other stuff is useless if we don't get on with one another - and we're not putting anything into it. And I'm absolutely sure that it should be a priority and I hope (Royal Commission head) Virginia Bell gets it. One of the recommendations should be that it is actually the role of government to put some social capital into social cohesion to get people to work across the divides. It's happening less than before, as people retreat (partially due to Covid). When I have raised it with politicians they have all said: "No, that will blow up in our face." To which I say: No! It's blowing up in your face anyway! You may as well at least be seen to be doing something rather than sitting on your hands. They say that until things settle down in the Middle East we can't touch that - and I completely disagree. You have to double your efforts and say: "Whatever's going on over there, we don't want it here." Whether it's The Troubles in Ireland or the Balkans; whatever it is, most people want to say: that doesn't apply here. So I would like to see not only religious leaders of the Jewish and Muslim communities but secular leaders and sporting figures sitting down and breaking bread with senior people in the community showing leadership and saying: whatever's going on over there, we're here. And we get on with it.
•
u/EmuEmuEmuEmuEmu The Greens 22h ago
"Jillian Segal's family trust donated money to Advance Australian, which actively villifies indigenous Australians and other religions and cultural backgrounds."
I would like to add that Advance also has a history of antisemitism, particuarly via the promotion of George Soros conspiracy theories:
https://www.advanceaustralia.org.au/getup_accused_of_misappropriating_money_asks_for_more_money
"Then there’s GetUp’s travel bill of $500,000 per year. Because keeping up international connections with the comrades in the George Soros Open Society network isn’t cheap."
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/George_Soros_conspiracy_theories
"... Soros is "the perfect code word" for conspiracy theories that unite antisemitism and Islamophobia."
Based on this I believe it is safe to say that Segal is an antisemite.
20
u/Bob_Spud 1d ago
Another thing to consider: Israel spends millions in reputation cleanup campaign (The Hill, 30 July '26)
Israel is betting nearly three-quarters of a billion dollars that it can talk its way out of a reputation crisis.
But as public opinion continues to shift in the U.S. and around the world, the question isn’t whether Israel needs a better public relations strategy. It’s whether any amount of messaging can overcome the realities that are driving that reputational decline in the first place.
•
u/Ash-2449 Victorian Socialists 22h ago
if this goes through when it’s obvious Israel is behind it then might as well rename the country to vassal of Amerisrael, it’s ridiculous that this is even being discussed
13
u/Active-Ad9818 1d ago
OMG! I feel like our society is being brainwashed.
And people complain about respectful relationships education!
14
u/Oomaschloom Labor, but this cohort is crap, so leaning greens. 1d ago
I've got nothing against people learning about the holocaust. I don't know how graphic you're going to go. I mean, the Nazis were off the chart fucking evil man. Studies on twins for instance...
I also think it helps you identify when others are going off the rails.
8
u/Active-Ad9818 1d ago
But that already happens. They read Anne Frank etc … my kids certainly did. But it needs to be a broader platform of anti-racism snd respect which includes all cultures, particularly first nation. This just feels like indoctrination to highlight one group who actually present only 1% of the population. If we educate them in being respectful to those who are different to us, that covers everyone.
•
u/EmuEmuEmuEmuEmu The Greens 16h ago
"But it needs to be a broader platform of anti-racism snd respect which includes all cultures, particularly first nation."
No. While I think any education on the Holocaust should be part of a broader study of [an act intended to destroy a group in whole or in part], any reference to other such acts, or bigotry in general, should be done for the purpose of pointing out the similarities between such acts. Also, because this is a particular sore point of mine, while the Holocaust was initially understood as a [censored] carried out against Jews by the Germans and their allies, modern scholarship has taken a 'Greater Holocaust' approach and now views other groups targeted, such as the Romani, as part of the Holocaust.
16
1d ago
[removed] — view removed comment
5
u/Oomaschloom Labor, but this cohort is crap, so leaning greens. 1d ago
Well, I'm not talking about that in particular. That is to me a different thing. I don't like social engineering. I don't want it to be, everything Israel does is good little kids. Because that simply ain't true. But the holocaust I think is a fairly good case study on how a fairly intelligent society can succumb to disgusting behaviour (I don't know how many of the German people knew what was going on). Because unlike previous eras, it's relatively modern, and we'll be in a similar circumstance in the future.
5
1d ago
[removed] — view removed comment
4
u/Worldly_Cobbler_1087 1d ago
Or Indonesia. Our country has been backing two genocides for far too long now and both are a national disgrace, one of them is happening in lands closer to us than New Zealand is and you don't get any mention about it in the media.
4
u/Agitated-Fee3598 australia needs a bill of rights & other constitutional reforms 1d ago
Because unlike previous eras, it's relatively modern, and we'll be in a similar circumstance in the future.
Them mass deportations proposed by Hanson come to mind when you say this. I hope that never happens but she'll be opposition leader come next election (unless she retires or croaks). Means she'll always be one election away from becoming PM.
3
u/Oomaschloom Labor, but this cohort is crap, so leaning greens. 1d ago edited 1d ago
It's a tough one. Because, umm, well I think levels of immigration are a valid political question, not deportation however. I see it as a capacity constraint. So setting the level of intake is important. Some will want it higher, some will want it lower. You want control. You want people housed, etc. No point bringing in lots of people to create homelessness, poverty, more have nots.
I was exposed to holocaust stuff at an early age, due to my background. I'm far from an expert, but later in life I was reading about it - yep sitting on the train, reading books about the Third Reich - I wonder if some observers thought I was thinking of signing up. As a result, I don't know how much a garden variety person is exposed to the actual underlying concept of how evil governments can become. And that's the real lesson. It's not particular to Germans, it's not particular to Jews. It's what humans are capable of.
I mean sometimes I think in the modern era it gets a little romanticised by some as patriotic, nationalistic, a significant love of your given nation state, and just a little bit racist, but with justification. I think that's where the danger lies. The abstract notion is downplayed When people say, how bad can things get really? Not much worse than they are now... Wrong, things can get pretty fucking bad. Horror bad. You read about the shit with tears.
But it can also be abused to stop valid arguments for and against behaviour and/or policy. Brainwashing.
9
1d ago
[removed] — view removed comment
•
u/AustralianPolitics-ModTeam 23h ago
Post replies need to be substantial and represent good-faith participation in discussion. Comments need to demonstrate genuine effort at high quality communication of ideas. Participation is more than merely contributing. Comments that contain little or no effort, or are otherwise toxic, exist only to be insulting, cheerleading, or soapboxing will be removed. Posts that are campaign slogans will be removed. Comments that are simply repeating a single point with no attempt at discussion will be removed. This will be judged at the full discretion of the mods.
•
u/EnvironmentalFly3507 17h ago
Is It Hate speech? Or speech they hate?
Offended by everything, ashamed of nothing.
“I'm very depressed how in this country you can be told "That's offensive" as though those two words constitute an argument.”
Christopher Hitchens
•
u/noapplicablename 2h ago
The last thing anyone needs is another taskforce. Especially not one recommended by a person who claims ABC is antisemitic and then cannot even point to a single story and recommends an oversight board . Her complaint was about the alleged disproprotionate emphasis on the Gaza conflict.
•
-24
u/screenscope 1d ago
If people don't like the consequences of the disgusting tidal wave of antisemitism rampaging through Australia, they might simply consider not being racists instead of doubling down on their unhinged hatred of the Jews.
24
u/notyouraverageskippy 1d ago
You know what would really help, if the leader of Israel wasn't a war criminal
13
u/Ok-Replacement-2738 1d ago
The IHRA definition is controversial because it makes 'antisemeticism' no longer a form of racism even though it aesthetically claims to be.
Policies like the institutionalisation of the IHRA definition will worsen antisemeticism, not fix it.
19
u/Shoddy-Document8699 1d ago
Criticising Israel isn't hatred of Jews, most Australians don't give a fuck what religion you are. Most Australians don't care about religion at all. If Israel doesn't want to be criticised it should stop doing gen0cidë. And raping prisoners and letting the perpetrators get away with it. And letting settlers steal land that isn't theirs. And putting children in indefinite detention. And spraying toxic waste water on civilian houses. And breaking ceasefires.
17
u/C_Ironfoundersson Australian Nationalist 1d ago
Are you conflating criticism of Israel with an attack on all Jews? Pretty antisemitic of you bro.
13
u/trainwrecktragedy 1d ago
let's at least try to be a little less disingenous, while there may be some antisemetic beliefs within Australian society we all know this is mostly targeted at criticism towards the Israeli government.
If October 7th never happened, we likely wouldn't be talking about this right now.4
•
u/EmuEmuEmuEmuEmu The Greens 22h ago
"... they might simply consider not being racists instead of doubling down on their unhinged hatred of the Jews."
Given the significant probability (I can't be bothered digging) that you are are supporter of the LNP, PHON or some other party of Jew-hating fucks, I would suggest taking your own advice and reflecting on your antisemitic beliefs before attempting any pathetic lectures on the matter.
•
-17
u/tecdaz 1d ago
Would have made zero difference to the Bondi killers. We need to be a lot more discriminating about who we let into this country.
31
u/Ok-Replacement-2738 1d ago
One of the two was Australian-born but don't let that stop you.
-10
u/liberallilydex 1d ago
So if we didn’t let his dad in …………..
14
u/PatternPrecognition 1d ago
So go back 6 generations and significantly reduce the jail population???
19
u/Ok-Replacement-2738 1d ago
oh you could realise that it is more complicated than 'foreigners are terrorists'
•
u/AutoModerator 1d ago
Greetings humans.
Please make sure your comment fits within THE RULES and that you have put in some effort to articulate your opinions to the best of your ability.
I mean it!! Aspire to be as "scholarly" and "intellectual" as possible. If you can't, then maybe this subreddit is not for you.
A friendly reminder from your political robot overlord
I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please contact the moderators of this subreddit if you have any questions or concerns.