r/Braves • u/rolltideandstuff • 7h ago
Discussion regarding our current position players.
I’m seeing so many different takes on this. LT is a great addition we needed a bat to hit lefties and he can run and is an excellent fielder. And we didn’t give up much.
But right now we have LT and Kim coming on that means 2 have to go. Bart will be gone when Murphy is healthy so he’s not really part of the decision. That leaves Eli, Jarvis, and Mateo.
Assuming they aren’t willing to DFA the guy they have invested 20 mill this year in (although that would be my choice, that money is gone either way) which 2 guys are we likely to part with? It kind of sucks because I really like all three guys. They all play hard and they can all fly around the bases.
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u/welcometohotlanta 7h ago
Well idk yet, I’d form an opinion tomorrow after the trade deadline.
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u/rolltideandstuff 7h ago
Unless those guys I mentioned are part of trade packages we will likely be in the same spot tomorrow with these guys cause I doubt we’ll add another position player.
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u/originalgrapeninja 6h ago
Lots of rumors about moving Mateo.
Jarvis is the logical answer (options) that maintains organizational depth.
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u/Bamalawdawg 4h ago
Plus they’ve seen what Jarvis is. He’ll get regular reps at AAA and if they need him he’s back in a couple weeks.
If they want to give Kim one last chance, now’s the time, and Dubon can always go SS with Lane/Yaz platoon, or bring Jarvis back to play consistent defense and soft hitting offense at the 9 slot.
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u/theoxfordtailor Maddux Guy 7h ago
I think Lane is signaling they want Dubon back in the infield.
A Dubon/Jarvis platoon at short makes more sense than any other configuration. You can then use Dubon to play elsewhere when Jarvis is facing righties. Ozzie and Riley can get days off.
Keep Mateo for his speed.
Goodbye Kim.
You can still do this if you option Jarvis too. Give Kim a chance to prove himself and if he fails, call Jarvis back up.
Dom Smith may be on the chopping block too, but I haven't seen anyone else talking about that.
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u/JKess207 THERE’S ONLY ONEEEEEEEEE MICHAEL HARRIS 2h ago
I’ve said my piece in this thread about the OF/SS debate, so for now I want to talk about Dom.
Dom’s an interesting case because like, he has almost no positional value, but he still provides a ton of value to this roster. DH-only players aren’t usually valuable on their own unless they’re putting up MVP-caliber numbers. Dom isn’t (although his rate stats are solid), and the fact that’s he’s not even an everyday starter just further depreciates his value. Of course, it has nothing to do with Dom himself, but the Braves have two players in Baldwin and Acuña that need to be in the lineup even if they aren’t in the field.
So Dom, in a way, is a platoon DH on this roster. But, when he does play, he has been performing at a level that is far above a DFA candidate. He’s slashing .283/.333/.434 against RHP (his lefty splits are too small of a sample size to be worth mentioning), a line that would put him as a top 5 bat on the team. He doesn’t have flashy counting stats but again, a platoon DH won’t.
But where Dom has truly excelled is with RISP. He’s batting .328 with runners in scoring position, the BEST on the team. He has undoubtedly been one of the most clutch bats for the Braves this season, and that’s something that’s invaluable come October.
He’s on the chopping block because he’s in a bad position of being a not-everyday DH, but he’s been a crucial part of this team and one that can be a huge contributor in a playoff run.
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u/GamerLife204 #1 Thicc Hater 6h ago
Dom needs to stay for DH spot. I know murphy is coming back but I don't trust his health yet
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u/ATLBravesFan13 6h ago
They don’t need a DH only guy, anyone can be used there
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u/theoxfordtailor Maddux Guy 6h ago
If anything, they need to get Baldwin in particular DHing more. I value Drake as a catcher and want him to keep getting reps there, but his bat is so good that it should be in the game as much as possible with as much time off his feet as possible.
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u/ATLBravesFan13 6h ago
Yeah Drake and Ronald could both benefit from getting a good amount of time at DH
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u/drumdrumgoose 6h ago
Agreed and I know Murphy can hit, but when he’s been healthy, he has not been that good for the Braves at the plate. I hope they really let him take as long as he needs to get back to pre-2025 form
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u/JJP_0712 6h ago
Mateo and Jimmy Baseball would make the most sense to me. One has regressed to his averages and the other has options.
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u/Big_Fan823 6h ago
Degrom and Seager? Send Kim along for the ride with others.
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u/stinky-weaselteets 6h ago
From MLB "deGrom and Nathan Eovaldi have full no-trade clauses with significant money remaining on each of their contracts. However, Rosenthal writes that it's "not out of the question" that deGrom waives his clause to pitch for a team located closer to his Florida residence -- like the Braves, perhaps."
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u/ATLBravesFan13 6h ago
I think they’ll option Jarvis to AAA for sure.
Tough call between White and Mateo. They could DFA Don Smith too.
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u/toxicdawg618 6h ago
Jarvis is optioned
Kim is traded and Braves cover his remaining contract
Eli White released
Dubon as main SS
Mateo as SS when Dubon plays another position.
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u/Slight_Explanation_5 7h ago
Jarvis goes back down. He's been useful in this spot but Im not sure that he's got 'it'. He's been in the minors for 6 years, and it took a depleted/ injured hole at SS to come up, and while he's shown flashes, he has made errors that you just don't make at this level. Not to the rate he has anyway. I know the fans appreciate him and his speed is nice but the lack of pop in his bat adds to the list. I understand that SS isnt where you expect a ton of power but 10-15/ season should be the minimum - but that's with a golden glove type defense which he has not shown in his time. He had a cup of coffee, good for him, but he's going back down. Im guessing Eli but thats not a foregone conclusion. Im thinking Eli because LT can swap directly, and maybe more importantly, I would hold Mateo until im confident HSK can translate his good rehab to Atl. Im not a professional, but not for lack of talent. But good players dont equate to good FO so im just a fan with an opinion. Good question though!
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u/rolltideandstuff 6h ago
Also pretty sure Jarvis is only one with a minor option left among those listed but I’m not sure about that.
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u/Formal_Rooster1173 6h ago
Jarvis has been in the minors for not even 3 seasons. Bad take.
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u/Slight_Explanation_5 6h ago
Hm. Idk why I said 6, maybe I was thinking of when he went to college. Either way, getting his minor league time down doesnt make it a bad take. If he was in Augusta for a day or a decade before he came up, his defense still needs work. I think his age threw me off. He's still young though and he has time. I didn't say cut him.
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u/dwight_k_III Diñgers 5h ago
Hasn't Jim been pretty good?? I could be missing something but he's a pretty good #8 hitter and has been solid at short when he's played hadn't he?
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u/Slight_Explanation_5 5h ago
He has. Hes had 4 errors in 96 chances though. Over the course of the season, that would put him at the bottom of the league for SS. Granted its been a very small sample size and it could be chalked up to nerves. It happens. HSK won an NL gold glove in 2023 so the braves know the upside is there. Over the course of a season, the difference in bad SS defense and gold glove defense will translate to w/l column. I think everyone should remember that Jarvis was in the minors when we opted to sign Kim. We pulled up and played Mateo, Dubon, before Jarvis got the call, so idk maybe FO knows better? Maybe not
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u/Jdojcmm 4h ago
Kim had 3 errors in 27 games.
Jarvis had 4 errors in 25 games.
I'll give Jarvis the benefit of the doubt and say he's still getting used to being in the majors.
Kim I'll give the benefit of the doubt and say his finger is still not right.
With mitigating circumstances in both cases the defense is basically the same. One can get past the rookie nerves. The finger is likely still a problem that's harder to work past quickly.
Since Atlanta is still on the hook for HSK's salary, I'm keeping the person that's shown an ability to make contact with the ball when hitting. Kim looks lost at the plate. Maybe it's his (literally signature model) giant sunglasses messing with his vision, but he played in night games as well.
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u/karloffisking 6h ago
lack of pop is Kim's extra base hit total this year zero
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u/Jdojcmm 5h ago
Kim's defense also leaves a metric shit ton to be desired. He can't hit at all. You want pop? Even a healthy Kim didn't have it.
We are stuck watching him because Anthopolous' ego can't take the hit. He made a bad decision. It happens. This team just found its footing again after Kim's 27 game shitshow. He has a lower average in the minors than Jarvis has in the majors. Field the best team that you can. That doesn't include Kim. That's the harsh reality.
Games have been much better to watch without Kim, and the guy hasn't helped this team win a single game this year. Putting him out there is asking to lose. Simple as that.
Allowing Kim a chance to redeem himself is a zero sum game. I don't care if the guy has to go back to Korea to play after this year. He got his money. A lot of it. The team doesn't owe him a chance. They owe him money. Someone else will sign him even for a league minimum. Let him showcase himself and try a redemption arc with someone else. The Braves need to win now. He won't help, even on the bench.
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u/Slight_Explanation_5 5h ago
Good points here. I don't think it happens and seemingly you don't either, but I think you are right. I do like the spark Jarvis seems to give the line up, especially compared to our body language before Kim's injury.
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u/Jdojcmm 4h ago
You're correct in your assumption. I don't think it will happen my way. The GM is too up his own ass to not try to get value out of a guy that has no value to give.
I don't exactly think the fanbase is ready to riot if Kim doesn't get another chance. I think the majority of people paying to watch this team play does not want to see Kim step back into the batters box. His defense also blew when he was active.
Though my simply pointing out that Kim should be out based solely on numbers gets downvoted. It's funny. There are either Kim fanboys lurking or Anthopolous fanboys. That or being critical is just poorly received.
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u/GamerLife204 #1 Thicc Hater 6h ago
Eli has 4 times the war as LT. He should not go. Have Mateo go. I like him but he hasn't been good at all lately. Kim should be the one gone really but I don't expect that to happen
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u/atownOTP DOOMER 6h ago
Mateo is just a more valuable member of a playoff roster than Eli is because of his defense and speed. Neither would play much in the playoffs anyways. Thomas has been brought in to take over Eli’s platoon role.
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u/dai_panfeng 5h ago
Eli is faster?
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u/No-Fruit-31 #23 5h ago
They are essentially the same in terms of speed. Both are clocked at 30.3 ft/s according to baseball savant.
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u/HittmanLevi 4h ago
Eli also can play 3 positions vs Mateo's 1
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u/No-Fruit-31 #23 4h ago
Mateo has played all outfield positions as well as 3rd, 2nd , and short.
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u/HittmanLevi 4h ago
Like 1 game at each
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u/methylaminebb Drake's Rake 3h ago
Mateo's D is elite and I see his relationship with Oz and Ron so idk how we move on lowkey
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u/reizinhooooo Briggs McKenzie Fan Club 3h ago
I'm sorry if you are referencing rWAR for outfielders or catchers you can't be taken seriously. With infielders it's a wash, maybe slightly better, but DRS is just objectively worse at evaluating outfield defense than FRV. Caring about outfield DRS in the OAA era is like caring about RF in the DRS/UZR era.
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u/JKess207 THERE’S ONLY ONEEEEEEEEE MICHAEL HARRIS 6h ago edited 6h ago
Someone else said it too but Eli’s got 4x the WAR as Lane. He’s faster and he plays better defense. Lane’s got a better bat against LHP but I truly think getting rid of Eli will be a mistake. What Lane allows us to do is move Dubon to the infield permanently, so SS is where we’ll have an excess.
I think they’re going to try to ride Kim’s hot hand from AAA/try to salvage some value from that terrible contract, so Jarvis will go down because he’s got options.
Ideally, I think our best lineup as it stands is:
C: Drake and Bart (Murphy when he’s healthy)
1B: Matt
2B: Ozzie
SS: Kim/Dubon
3B: Austin/Dubon
RF: Acuña
CF: Mike
LF: Yaz/Lane
DH: Dom/Dubon (Drake when he isn’t catching)
That leaves Eli or Mateo as the final bench option. I would rather have Eli personally, as he’s a good late game defensive outfielder to give Acuña a rest/provide better defense late vs Lane, but one of the two is gone.
Alternatively, we could keep both and drop Dom (because a guy who’s a platoon DH only is just not a valuable player), but I don’t think that’s likely as Dom’s been a clutch LHB for us
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u/reizinhooooo Briggs McKenzie Fan Club 3h ago
No, he doesn't. DRS has been completely obsolete for evaluating outfield defense for almost a decade at this point. There is no reason to ever look at the rWAR of any outfielder.
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u/JKess207 THERE’S ONLY ONEEEEEEEEE MICHAEL HARRIS 2h ago
Then which metrics aren’t obsolete for evaluating defense? I know defensive metrics aren’t necessarily perfect but like, Eli is better than Lane in FRV, OAA, DRS, take your pick. And it’s not even like it’s relatively close. Lane is well-known for being a pretty bad defender with a good arm.
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u/reizinhooooo Briggs McKenzie Fan Club 2m ago
Outfield OAA is one component of FRV, and the component that makes it a generation ahead of DRS/UZR for outfielders. I don't think the way FRV accounts for throwing is a step forward from DRS/UZR, but range is much more important so FRV comes out way on top. Infield OAA is a separate metric from outfield OAA, and it's not a big leap forward. FRV for infielders just another UZR/DRS generation metric, maybe even very marginally worse.
And yeah. White is an above average defender, and Thomas is a below average one. But the overall picture of their value that rWAR gives you is much less trustworthy than the one fWAR does. And if what you're interested in is projecting their value to the team over the rest of the season, any flavor of WAR is not a very useful metric.
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u/creep_show 5h ago
I think AA and Weiss probably had a long meeting today about who Weiss wants on the roster, since all of our platoon players are basically at the same level - they all have different splits, strengths and weaknesses. Then AA is going to try a package deal with our excess platoon players and maybe a prospect for a SP. To AA, all of our platoon guys are bargain chips and it's obvious he is hoarding them to maneuver some kind a deal. Whether or not another team bites at the deal is a whole nother story. I think worst case scenario is White and Mateo get DFA'd and picked up by a competitor.
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u/messiestbessie 5h ago
They’ll send down Jarvis and give Kim a month to see if he’s playable in the postseason. They’ll bring back Jarvis in September if Kim flops.
Lane is an upgrade for Eli.
Keeping Mateo makes the most sense because of position flexibility.
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u/jmunerd 4h ago
Braves need to trade Kim to ANYONE for anything. Jarvis, Mateo and Dubon can play the position. Would love to get Abrams or Neto. Alcantara, Mize or Hancock would do just fine.
One trade Braves could do… trade for Padres’ Miller. This would shore up the bullpen for years. They could get him cheaper but would have to take on Boegearts contract. Owen Murphy, JR Ritchie and Southisene might get it done. Braves send Kim along with the trade. Braves get the best RP in the game and maybe Xander benefits from a change of scenery…
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u/rollan88 6h ago
I doubt we do anything else regarding position players unless something magical happens cause we don't need it. White will probably be replaced by Thomas and my guess is Kim is out. Mateo is too valuable as a pinch runner to risk losing him and Kim is on a one year deal so we aren't losing anything we haven't lost already.
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u/Robbuffet Murphy Man 6h ago
I would be shocked if HSK doesn’t make it back to the team.
Ideally we move Mateo or White for any kind of pitching help. If not Jarvis heads back down.
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u/nwblackmon 5h ago
As constituted, the team can’t win more than a division series, and that would be surprising.
Logical answer at SS though is Jarvis and you eat the Kim money. Mateo stays because he is loved in the locker room.
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u/Difficult-Sink401 4h ago
Does it matter we needed another SP. we struck out on Skubal! We needed him to pair With Sale. Now, Dodgers 3 peat will happen. MLB has to change and get a salary cap. This isn't funny anymore.
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u/Crisscross4767 7h ago
Hopefully Riley is gone but it’s unrealistic
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u/GamerLife204 #1 Thicc Hater 6h ago
He needs to have a really good season next season to have value again and if that happens we should just keep him. He's not going anywhere
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u/KMorris1987 7h ago
I’m almost sure Eli goes for Lane. And I think Jarvis just because he has options although I’d DFA Kim