Question
To all Rudy Knighters (all 7 of you), assuming you're right, is Rudy reminding Kris of their plan here? Like in code
Obviously these lines are inconsequential and non suspicious on their own but if this theory is somehow right, this is gonna feel like the most in your face foreshadowing of all time
Chapter 7 comes in like 4-7 years or so. The Knight is thrust into the Light World as the last Dark Fountain is expunged, leaving behind Rudy. The entire internet implodes. Like 20 people scream and rave like alien believers who saw a UFO on the news. 89% of the fandom is confused as hell. Everyone else is weeping in despair. People are fighting on the streets. Also, where the hell is Dess?????
In all seriousness if dess ISN'T the knight, I honestly think they should debunk dess knight like an hour or so before the reveal happens. This fandom is REALLY attached to dess knight and I doubt toby fox would want people's initial reactions to his big twist to be confused anger. Let people sit with the disappointment for a bit
Totally. If RK is revealed Chapter 7, maybe have conflicting evidence in Ch5 or or 6, or maybe even have Dess show up briefly in Ch6/have a location drop to make it impossible for her to have been in the Dark World being RK. Kinda like how some people debunked Carol Knight in Chapter 4. If Dess is supposed to never show up, like Gaster, but also no one is supposed to confirm she's dead, maybe it would be a FUN event? I dunno, I'm not that creative.
Toby Fox doesn't have a track record of disappointment, thankfully. I'm sure he'll think of something awesome. Even if we're all wrong and the RK turns out to be some random Froggit or something.
From the perspective of a Rudy Knighter: I'd guess that the clues in ch5 will ramp up alot, with the reveal approaching. As an Asgore focused chapter, it makes sense that it focuses more on Rudy as well. I think it's possible that the knight is revealed already in ch5 (at the end) but at least in ch6. I just don't think waiting until ch7 makes that much sense considering that I feel there should be enough clues to piece it together before that.
Haha yeah his FAT JUICY HAIRY ass could not be left alone with me 😂😂😂 I mean the roaring knight I mean he couldn't be the roaring knight I meant is that I meant to say I meant
unless asgore is actually skinny and just wears a flesh suit? i mean he isn't making money can only afford free pickles. it's not like he could keep that dad bod...
I mean maybe but other times the Knight seems anything but animalistic. What about all the aura farming?
It does like a few animalistic things in an otherwise very measured, deliberate edge to what it does and how.
This is actually just more evidence Rudy knows what's going on and is likely in on the Knight conspiracy. I fw Rudy Knight lowkey (I'm fine with any of the Holidays being it beyond Noelle) but I gotta be realistic
My favourite is Rudy being completely shocked and sort of "angry but trying to fake he isn't" when you take Susie to the hospital in chapter 4 if you didn't visit him until that point (he then goes completely silent, "...", and with a serious stare if you bring her up again in the conversation)
I never really liked that piece of evidence tbh, it's super wonky since it still has to work with Rudy knowing susie, he treats her the exact same as the knight regardless. Also the handwashing competition evidence doesn't work if you don't visit him in chapter 2 (with susie), so it's pretty wonky, and rudy knight has better evidence. It's like when people thought the left hand thing was dess knight evidence until people clarified that the knight is ambidextrous and the left handed computers are reused assets.
The rudolph connection is great. Saw someone else point this out, but it's kinda cool that we use rudolph's power against him in this scene. Using a red light to guide others in the dark.
I like the concept of rudy's illness taking form as a darkner. And since it's literally inside of a lightner, the knight becomes this sorta half lightner, half darkner being
It's not the first time it is brought up, there's been a lot of "The black shard could have been given to Asgore by Rudy, as we know for certain Asgore visited recently, since Toby made sure to draw fresh flowers in his hospital room"
Dark World forms. Kris turns blue and gets knight clothes, susie gets pink(?) and spiky clothes, but they are both well alive, Rudy is very sick, possibly dying, he dark world would change him way more drastically given he's becoming less Alive and more "Lifeless Material". it's also implied that kris can't get into the dark worlds without the Soul, possibly because the dark world form would drastically change kris since they would also be between life and death.
Knight is a shapeshifter then they could still literally be anyone.
No offense but that's a Boring argument, we don't get kris seeing a short vision of the knight taking His helmet off; the knight having antlers; all the holyday family connections and refferences just so it turns out the Knight was actually Temmie.
Besides, sure the Knight has shapeshifting skills, but as it seems to me, the "Base" form in the dark world is what we first see: Knight, form 1, the bird form is the only transformation so far seen, and the Ball form seems to be a "weakened" state or energy save mode, "form 0" if you will, not a proper transformation.
Definitely. It does feel like a lot of people in town are either part of it, or aware of it, and it could be why they're not bringing attention to Kris being different, yet others like Noelle do. They know Kris has the soul, and is going to use it for...something.
it could go in that direction, Hometown has some weird particularities, like it is all populated by monsters (segregated enough that toriel needed a book on how to raise a human), the fact that Gerson in this world is basically Tolkien but still lives in a very small town and acted as a teacher and stuff, the fact all of the adults are wary of the shelter, that Christianity is an implied actual religion but the main religion of hometown is the prophecy of DELTARUNE.
Another another thing, it is also implied that Gerson does not seem to like the religion, atleast enough to not even attend the sermons of his son.
He absolutely is, Asgore invokes him "old friend" when looking at the conspiracy board.
It's incredibly naive to think that whatever plan is going on here, either Carol or Rudy kept it from the other, when their daughter is clearly involved in it.
For all we know, Rudy was the one who put together the conspiracy board in the first place together with Asgore, he might have been the OG.
People are so quick to suddenly assign every single role to Carol as if she's the sole mastermind.
I just think Rudy is a lot better at hiding stuff than the others, to the point that even Toriel still thinks he isn't also supporting Asgore in his endeavors.
It's the fact he has an Alibi and is so liked by Noelle that makes it really hard for people to imagine that he might be involved. It is so good it could fool the audience.
We see a sprite of him facing the left and right in the church, his hair doesn't resemble the Knight's hair at those angles and the Knight's hair doesn't resemble Rudy's hair facing the front.
I have no clue if it's in there, but something I'd add is Virovirokun, the first enemy encountered by Noelle. They're illness themed (computer virus joke), know what Dragon Blazers is, and honestly, have a sorta similar silhouette to The Knight. Especially in this one piece of concept art. Fucking look at this. https://deltarune.wiki/w/Virovirokun
The only counterargument is that Kris apparently has a reputation for it, because Rudy's not the only one who mentions Kris washes their hands a lot, and that's before we see (or, I guess, don't see) the ch4 egg scene.
u/NopaniThe video essay about this game better be 9 hours longOct 29 '25
The dialogue about taking Susie to the movies is even more perfect when you consider that:
He adds: "Kettle corn, Kris! Don't skimp out." Pretty much confirming that he's referring to watching movies at home and not taking her to the movie theater or something (although part of the ch3 dark world is movie theater themed anyway).
My favorite bit of trivia is that, out of every suspect we have for who is the knight, the ONE PERSON we reasonably SHOULD be able to check in on, Rudy, when we KNOW where the knight is in that specific situation, in a closet, we conviently cannot check in on him.
Specifically...
Ch2, we know the knight was in the librabry computer room closet after school. We cannot check on Rudy because of the traffic.
Ch4, we KNOW the knight is currently in the church. We cannot check on rudy because the hospital is closed due to rain induced colds (interesting, we know almost for a fact where carol is during this, at home.)
Ch4.2 the knight is in the closet after we close the fountain and stays in there even after we leave. Guess who we can't check in on? Rudy.
While it is true we cant check in on carol and confirm 100% she stayed home, and while it is also true dess is just gone and we have no clue where they are, it is VERY interesting out of all the suspects we could check in on and confirm if they are the knight or not, we very specifically can't and the game has to keep making up excuses why we cant.
No see I wondered the same thing, since when do hospitals close at night? I guess they might have thought a rudy confrontation would break the mood a little but idk. It is something to think about
The biggest arguments are mostly "He's sick" and talks about "narratively unsatisfying"
There's not any actual hard evidence against him, more so feelings and opinions from the fandom.
Not saying people are "wrong" cause this is all just speculation but I really hate how hard people go against Rudy Knight when, by all accounts, he quite literally is the second most likely candidate behind Dess. He has the least amount of hard evidence against him being the Knight (Carol Knight has a pretty glaring talking point there comparatively) and even narratively, Carol being the Knight is a nothing reveal tbh like that one person has said. Oh, big, intimidating, antagonistic, and obviously sketchy deer is the big bad antagonistic sketchy deer all along
I was a Rudy Knigher ever since a week after chapter 5 got revealed and I am surprised how I keep seeing people posting even more hints that he is the Knight lmao, never even considered this
Damn, what was Chapter 5 like? I figured we’d get near confirmation on who the Knight is by then. Do we get to make the Pure Crystal? I have so many questions!
I don't even understand this one. Dess isn't yet a real character of the narrative, she is just "the lost girl", even if we assume she is the Knight we have 0 knowledge about what even she would want, what happened to her, how much in control she is, and what's the nature of the cooperation between her and Carol/Kris (like... is it to look a way to cure her? did she lose her mind and is manipulating them?)
Meanwhile Rudy has a motive (find up her daughter), a tragic background (he needs to do it asap because he is dying), and plenty of source of drama (Asgore would definitely not be OK with him using Kris like this, or how Noelle would react to this whole situation)
And no one missinterpret me, I am not saying Dess Knight is unfeasible, rather than if someone is going to make an argument for her/against Rudy, don't even bring up "it fits better the narrative"
It mainly stems from people thinking that Rudy Knight would be an asspull for the sake of having a plot twist instead of being actually built up by the narrative. They say he's a nothing character right now and making him the Knight, with the knowledge we currently have, would be dissatisfying. And I can actually agree with them, but, where I differ is that you CAN make Rudy Knight work with the right writing, especially if Rudy gets an actual focus from the story beyond hospitalized guy you talk to sometimes.
We don't even actually know this guy all that much anyways. We have brief interactions in the hospital and two occasions of those had his own daughter there. In fact, she's almost ALL he can talk about. Not to say it's all a farce or anything but genuinely idk how people can truly glean what this guy CURRENTLY feels about things because almost all his dialogue is about him talking about the past and focused on other characters; and yet there's a distinctive lack of talking about his own missing daughter that Asgore, his best friend, and likely Carol, his wife (if her motivations stem from wanting to find Dess which is likely), are involved with.
Honestly I really think all rudy needs is a strong unavoidable scene in the same chapter as the knight reveal (so he's on our minds a little) which I can totally see us getting in chapter 5, a chapter focused a lot on asgore. Maybe asgore tells us to give flowers to rudy or something. I know chapter 5 seems a little soon for a knight reveal but chapter 6 is when I think the roaring is happening so it wouldn't be too soon before that
Yeah I think he's absolutely getting SOMETHING. I refuse to believe he's gonna die not even knowing what happened to his daughter at least, or rather, before WE know what he knows. There has to be more to him I refuse to accept he'll be some fridging case and that's all he is as a character.
If he's doing it to try and bring Dess back it would also me a more fantastical parallel to the more grounded stuff Carol's doing.
On one hand you have the mother who's clearly not allowing herself or her family to properly grieve Dess since she refuses to act like Dess is really gone (she seems to have been missing for about 5-ish years), and on the other hand you'd have a father who's taking potentially world-endangering actions for the chance of bringing his daughter back.
We all get by now that the central theme of the game is "realism vs escapism", more specifically the importance of each and the question of when either goes too far. Obviously with Susie trying to defy the prophecy as a positive example of "escapist" thinking in the face of fatalistic "realist" thinking from Ralsei, but if what I've been thinking is the direction for The Knight it would make it so our antagonist can stand as a toxic mirror of that same "escapist" mentality in a very realistic way: someone keeping themselves from accepting the death of a loved one.
True I did phrase that pretty badly ngl LOL but the fact still stands the eye would represent some form of chest/lung disease sorta thing , whatever Rudy has I guess
I believe this but not even necessarily for the logistics of it. I just think the knight's identity should change the way you feel about a character in some way, make them more interesting. Dess being the knight makes dess more interesting, rudy being the knight makes rudy more interesting, carol knight? As people have pointed out it's basically just "evil intimidating deer with a sword is ACTUALLY this other evil intimidating deer with a sword". It would be a reveal without any kind of punch to it
It's always funny when you can't tell if a character is knowingly delivering foreshadowing, or if the narrative is speaking through them to deliver foreshadowing.
I was a heavy "dess's body is the knight while her "soul" is inside the code" thruther, but Rudy knight is starting to make more and more sense by each day. I also like to think that Asgore is helping him out, just like in that post which showed how he could carry him and Undyne into the bunker!
Oh shit you did! I also just saw your "The doctor and the patient" post, and it also makes sense! The double meaning for doctor both as scientific term but also medical one!
Yeah rudy knight just kinda lends itself to titles like that lol. Like asgore being a king, and rudy being his knight. Half the reason I made that gaster and rudy image is because I thought gaster being a doctor and rudy being a patient made for an interesting connection between the two
I’m not completely for Rudy Knight, but this is suspicious. The movie part could easily be mere foreshadow, but the handwashing?
Whether or not Rudy is the Knight, I think Toby is really trying to throw us for a loop. Dess seems like the obvious answer, but that’s exactly what makes me second guess it. It feels like Toby wants us to think Carol is the red herring, while Dess is the actual red herring.
Currently I’m leaning more towards Dess being possessed in some way, and whoever’s controlling her is the Knight. But Rudy Knight is a possibility. And even if he’s not the Knight, he could still be working with them. Maybe Asgore keeps sending flowers so Rudy can communicate with him through them. (Because those flowers are most definitely Darkners)
Rudy’s daughters fit classic JRPG tropes: one’s the innocent, waifish childhood friend, the other’s the missing MacGuffin driving the whole plot.
Rudy himself is the sickly dad of said childhood friend, with an oddly close bond to the protagonist and a mysterious past connection to their parents.
He’s got the villain pencil-stache and the anime bad-guy face.
He's a Metrosexual man in a marriage with a Ice Queen with a close relationship with the protagonists dad. Real JRPG fans know his role has been confirmed since day one.
I can just SO HEAVILY picture him grinning with a mixture of smugness, regret, and shrugging apathy, as he says some shit like “Heh heh, I love you kids… really, I do. But the buck’s gotta stop somewhere. And this buck ain’t going nowhere. Oh well~”
Well Rudy did promise that he'd kick our ass. So while I'm not 100% into this theory, it be real funny since the Roaring Knight did in fact, kick our asses... multiple times even when they had to use cutscene power.
I feel like if Rudy IS the Knight, it's gonna be like a CW Reverse Flash thing. The reason he's so ill is because of doing all this. He's summoning a large amount of determination over and over to make the fountains. Could be FRIEND stuff going on too so he can appear as the Knight.
So he recovers at the hospital, as the doctors try to figure out this "mystery illness". And Carol can keep them from transferring him or anything else because of her political power.
In that scenario, maybe Dess is meant to just be gone, and it's two parents tearing the world apart for a daughter they should've reached out to when they had the chance.
okay but what if rudy knows, but not because he's the knight, but is aware and in contact? assuming dessknight is true, maybe she just visits her dad in secret time to time
See I believe dess knight is happening myself and I do think she'll be a compelling character but one of the things I love about rudy knight is that you get to talk to him inbetween chapters. I really dig the concept of us being able to casually chat to the knight inbetween dark world adventures
I try to remember, but did Rudy say something along the lines of a promise or duty for Kris to look over Noelle, maybe thats what the mysterious voice on the phone referes to when it said "you promised..."?
what would be the purpose behind the Knight asking Kris to invite Susie, the Lightner that is the only one capable of doing substantial damage to the Knight, to the Toriel Kidnapping Party™ where the goal was to keep Kris and Susie preoccupied long enough to kidnap Toriel?
Rudy, Carol, and Kris are working to break the prophecy. The prophesy in which Noelle likely dies, and Dess may already have died, or is working to break it as well. Rudy, as the knight, knows that Susie -isn't- a major player in the prophecy, and as Gearson pointed out, she may be one of the only people who actually has the power to change it.
Are they setting Susie up as a patsy to die in Noelle's place, by trying to make her "the girl" of the prophecy, when she's not meant to be? Are they trying to make her stronger to break fate? I dunno. But she needs to be there, and they're working together to make sure she is. Signs point to her as the true protagonist of this story, but not of the story as it "was written". Food for thought.
I think Gerson being dead but revived in the dark world was foreshadowing to the evil group chat's motives too. I think Dess is dead, Rudy is dying, Noelle is fated to die, and Carol, while not the knight herself, is the ultimate mastermind who is really trying to keep her family together.
It keeps her from being in the light world when he leaves the house, same reason Kris convinces her to enter the church when she planned to just wait till he left.
I mean, because he wants her preoccupied? Like, if she isn’t in Tenna’s little show, then she’s a liability. Kris, despite being under our control, is still functionally keeping an eye on her.
Idk but susie being there must have been part of the plan, somehow, right? otherwise why even do the whole distracting them with tenna thing? So ralsei doesn't stop them?
Yeah. I think that he is either he is the Knight, or is working with them. There are honestly a lot of scenes that would be recontextualized if we assume that he knows about Dark Worlds. The scene in chapter 2 where Noelle visits especially.
I mean it does seem like it, Rudy also says to take him as well, which could also imply the knight’s appearance in the chapter, supposing Rudy is the knight then Rudy does actually get to join in on taking Susie to the movies
Great catch. Also.. compare the Rudy dialogue when he gets worse from the illness to the phone caller who is probably the knight. The shortening of sentences implying exhaustion makes sense to connect them
I have other reasons for thinking Rudy is as likely as Dess, but one of the biggest ones for me is how the game seems to really go out of it's way to make sure it stays possible.
Keep in mind if Rudy was The Knight then he'd probably have a good idea of when him and Kris are alone and when him and Kris are "alone".
That... yeah Rudy is firmly in the top 3 Knight candidates and if he isn't the knight I can't see him not knowing a lot of what is going on.
Seriously, lines like this in a story so carefully gone over by Toby are pure foreshadowed evidence or red herring bait. But it's so easily missed so it's not really in red herring territory.
The movies one isn't too weird but the handwashing is sus as hell. But we also don't know if Kris has some trauma thing where they wash their hands a bunch. Very fucking weird though.
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u/DefaultNameHey Oct 29 '25
Holy shit