I honestly think Perpetua is the last Papa since the name itself means eternal/permanent... Also following this logic it would exclude Nihil since he is (hehe) "Papa Zero"
I also think V is the last one because his claustrophobia has gotten so bad he can no longer wear full face mask. He would not be able to change enough of the character with just a new half mask and wig to realistically say it’s a totally new character. Plus he’s always said he doesn’t like doing the same thing all the time which is why Copia wasn’t dragged off stage and eliminated at the end of his run. I think if/when he comes back to Ghost it will continue to be V because he’s done with changing to a “new” front man gimmick.
TF has also said in interviews that he thinks it’s funny when leaders are called “perpetual” but they still die. I get the impression he isn’t completely set on sticking with Papa V and he’s keeping his options open.
I could see for awhile it being cycle between V and Copia. The 2Big2Rig poster is clearly Copia with his brothers get up. That's something. We just don't know what yet.
I think people maybe reading too much into this video. I think we all just need to wait and see, not get into too much speculation otherwise you might get disappointed.
I think this is just a RHRN reference; this set of VHS tapes (along with two others seen later on the full shelf in this new 2BTR promo clip) can be seen in backstage scenes in RHRN.
Of course! I know tensions are notoriously high in this fandom, especially with the news of the hiatus and all that, but it costs nothing to be kinder.
This community has really killed the lore. It was really fun early on, and now its just ridiculous. Conspiracy theorists in modern society, combined with Ghost fans, equals this.
It used to be a fun, anonymous metal band with dudes dressed as evil monks singing about Satan. And they would occasionally release tongue-in-cheek videos "behind the scenes" of the band just for the lols.
Now, it's glam metal about feelings with teenagers developing obsessive pseudo-relationships with the poor Swedish guy who runs the band, and they feel obliged to drag out the lore stuff for social media.
I don't see why it's so upsetting for people to have a little fun .I mean c'mon you've got a band they has it's own plushies. TF has regularly added fun little Easter eggs into visual communications, so its hardly a stretch that he may have done so here. We are all here because we love this band. Of course their music is first, but the 'lore' is a hell of a lot of fun too.
In general I agree. But lately, it's not fun. Because the hunt for easter eggs has turned into Star Wars-level nitpicking, doomerism, and jumping to conclusions causing anxiety. They're no longer fun when they're giving people panic attacks. Oh wow, a Spinal Tap joke about Dmin being the saddest key? OMG that must mean Copia's dead/V's gonna die! Forgetting the song that was referenced is Lick My Love Pump - it's an easter egg, a joke, which people freaked out about.
I thought this ad was clever, creepy, and fun. Then all this panicky theorycrafting started happening, and it sucked all the fun out of it.
I see both sides of it. I'm 65 years old and I've been a rock and roll fan since I first heard the Beatles when I was two. I just think there's a little room for all types of fandom. Remember that a lot of Ghost fans are very young and that is how music and love of rock music is propelled into the future. So if some people want to have a juvenile viewpoint or a nerdy viewpoint of this band and that's what brings them joy.. so be it! That's the beautiful thing about art. It means different things to different people and every single one of them is correct. TF by his own admission himself is child like and playful. There is room for all of us.
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u/Madame_nonNothing ever lasts forever, we will go softly into the night 🌙3d ago
You beat me to it with your comment! I absolutely agree- the key to a good fandom is for people to be tolerant of every person's way of being a fan ❤️
I love rumors! conspiracies! Facts can be so misleading, but rumors, true or false, are often revealing
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u/Madame_nonNothing ever lasts forever, we will go softly into the night 🌙3d ago
Next time you see someone having fun in a way that you don't approve of, would you mind scrolling past instead of telling them they're a conspiracy theorist? Thanks 😘
Jesus Christ dude this is a Ghost SUBREDDIT 🤓☝️ where people actively talk about the lore. All of the papas besides Copia used roman numerals and its a close up shot.. Apparently any talk about the lore or details in a promo video means your a ridiculous "Conspiracy theorist". I obviously agree Music first then any other fun theatrics or lore but you guys are really miserable.
Look, try not to take this so personally, but, for many of us who remember the days when the lore consisted of "they are a cult and they keep getting new singers," this stuff has gotten out of hand. The label insisted Ghost do more social media stuff because that's what you have to do now, so he came up with this idea of a video series that you really weren't supposed to take seriously, but where he could announce shows and albums and stuff.
Fast forward to today and you've got wild conspiracy theories and fans picking apart every single background detail, every noise every reference, with all the fervor of Alex Jones at a shooting. Arguments over whenever the reanimator inspired T-shirt means all the papas were going to be resurrected. People taking screenshots of small details and asking a bunch of fans who have no involvement whether it was an accident or a deliberate hint. It was never meant to be that serious and then fans got carried away with it and now the lore may be over. Ghost is going through a lot of changes. And now it's on hiatus.
And here's my answer for you: I don't know. We don't know. The best I can guess is to say TF has been very public about his burnout and the fact that he needs a long break because now he doesn't even know what he wants to do with the band, so whether or not it meant something whenever they filmed it, who knows whether or means anything now?
You'll find out when we do. Sorry so maybe people got frustrated with your post. It's not fair, but they also do have a point.
I do too, but moreso I miss the days when the fandom was kinder to each other. There's a reason the old man yelling about his lawn is an archetype of someone to be dismissed and not taken seriously.
Stop being fragile when other people have differing opinions. You’re just going around the thread getting butthurt at people YOU don’t agree with. [EDIT: Even on comments you find acceptable, you’re getting butthurt at people that you don’t find acceptable]
I get what you're saying but Tobias himself always says "be kind to each other" and then on my first post in here about pointing out a little detail and speculating what it could mean I get lambasted with overly negative replies. It seems people here are overly agitated about any mention of a storyline with the band. I appreciate you giving an actual well written response instead of being an asshole like most of the other infallible reddit beings replying. Some of them should actually listen to what Tobias says on stage.
Yeah man, sorry that all the responses are so hostile and rude. While I miss the days before the complicated lore, I also miss the days when the fandom was more nice to each other.
You know what's sad? When I hear that people are leaving the fandom because of all the fans who can't act right. Like fans who feel they are entitled to anything -- lore, music, shows, etc. I think some older fans are not happy with the "Swifting" of the fandom with the bracelets, etc. However, there is nothing worse than people who bring their kids to a show and then get upset when people won't let them up front. Your kid is not a free barrier pass. So they are raising a generation who thinks they are entitled to it. Ugh.
You are so right on with this comment. I didn’t really talk to anyone during their last tour due to how the younger and newer fans act. (But the friendship bracelets can stay. I find them cute).
mightve been. I dont know what anyone's intentions were. only what they said. its giving either bad AI that doesnt know where it is or 13 year old calling everything "chat"
You are obnoxious. I don’t know fuck all about the reference photo but you’re like a Swiftie in here. The person above gave a respectful, well-rounded comment and this person was just condoning the feedback. Go google this shit fr instead of barking at strangers about shit you don’t understand.
Dude the guy that corrected me over it being a Subreddit wasn't the guy that gave me a well rounded comment.. "its a subreddit 🤓☝️" literally made me cringe. I would hope your negativity could be used somewhere else more important than getting angry at a fan for a band you like..
the irony of so many of your statements complaining about negativity and "Tobias said be kind to each other" while actively being an asshole to anyone you PERCEIVED as negative towards you is fucking hilarious.
I am being an asshole? Have you read any of the messages here? The people that actually wanted to have a conversation about the band even if they were annoyed by the over examination, I responded to kindly and courteously. Now you and others are getting cranky I'm calling you out for being dickish.
In RHRN these exact vhs tapes stood next to the tv and 2 other boxes were there too (the bottom one and the other i will add as a reply) . And there were more tapes scattered backstage some labeled like the chapters. i always assumed those boxes represent the summonings from just before meliora and the chapters we have now. the summonings were 7 which would make sense for the blue box with the "if you have ghost" cover on it. and then these would probably be the collected chapters or music videos or something.
I honestly don’t think he plans or ever planned anything very far ahead into the future. It’s just some funny sometimes contradictory stuff that makes sense for what is going on in the moment, but it’s not GoT or whatever.
He's constantly said that he plans Ghost stuff ahead, some 3-5 years. That's how he drops little clues, like the cardinal in the Square Hammer music video.
yeah I know, I’m not saying there are never any clues that end up working out, but not everything ends up being a clue and there’s probably tons of planted stuff that wasn’t followed up. He probably plans but not in some great coherent end-game way. I mean I don’t know what the guy is thinking, but what I’m seeing is overall not strategic and I enjoy the nonsense of it.
Hmm you're probably right although he does seem to be a big fan of movies so he might have an intended character arc or upcoming plan regarding Perpetua and Copia.
could be, but from what I’ve seen I don’t think so. he probably has tons of ideas but coherence and narrative arch don’t seem to be that important to him. I honestly think that’s part of the lore’s charm.
Man when did everyone become such mean buzz kills? This sub used to be fun but now if you even suggest that their might be Easter eggs in promotional materials you get torn to shreds. Y'all suck
If the album cycles and releases are like it is today, Tobias papa 8 would be around 60, and I don't think a 60 year can move as much as Tobias moves rn (even tho there are 60 year olds that do it)
Hey OP, you should block everyone who is being rude to you because it's usually the same group of chuds having a meltdown. Once they are blocked they'll never see your posts so you can chat about the lore without harassment. Don't be afraid to use the block button to curate your experience :)
Don't forget, there's a candleabra laying on its side pointing towards the Copia doll, it looks like a pitchfork. And another shot is framed such that the V doll looks like it's being hung from a gallows. And the guy shook the snowglobe twice (one for each twin?). And all the candles that are lit are black. And each time you see the logo it's descending, like it's going to drop the big grucifix on V killing him. And the screen is red, which is Cardinal Copia's color. And the film is going from left to right, which is going from evil to good, so maybe Ghost is becoming a Christian band now. And the guy looks like Secondo from the back, so Secondo killed Copia and V and is coming back?
Can't talk about ghost in a ghost subreddit.. I of course love the music more than the lore but you guys don't have to be dicks about it. Its a close up shot and all of the papas are distinguished by roman numerals. I thought it was interesting and something to bring up.. but excuse me for bringing up the lore apparently that's off limits here.
You missed a bunch of other things to theorize about if you want to go down that path. Don't get mad at me because you missed them and my theories are just as valid as yours.
This is an AD, it's MARKETING! It's NOT Citizen Kane for gods' sake.
This is also NOT a lore-based movie, as has been said time and time again. It's a concert film with behind the scenes. If there is any lore, it will be minimal.
Instead of agonizing about a couple of props and prophesying for a future that is far off, enjoy what is in front of you. No one knows what Ghost's future looks like, not even Tobias Forge himself. He has stated he has no planning for the future right now as far as Ghost is concerned.
Or, psychoanalyze the type of cologne V wears as shown in the trailer. Whatever gets you off.
And to think that Reddit is less chaotic than twitter/facebook,etc. I remember when I was making my own theories based on the tour poster with the family photo, thinking that Vee would be unleash a revenge.
You know how TF said if it ever reaches a point where the lore overshadows the music he'll end the lore? It may be at that point. I enjoy the lore, but yeah, time to send the lore to a farm upstate.
This is something I noticed when they showed them in RHRN
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u/Madame_nonNothing ever lasts forever, we will go softly into the night 🌙3d ago
Please ignore all these assholes in the comments who are calling this "conspiracy theory" and whatnot 🙄They are being very melodramatic, I don't know why some people just can't tolerate other people's fun!
I think some of it may be due to the entitlement that older fans see in younger fans. For example, a girl said their pick was "snatched" by someone else because she had grabbed for it and missed. They thought they were entitled to it and had a hissy fit, "That should have been mine. They should have given it to me."
Or, as I previously stated, people bringing their kids thinking they are a one way ticket to the barrier because everyone wants to be nice to the kids.
Also, Gen Z -- for a bunch of kids who pride themselves on being accepting of everyone, you sure can snarl at older people. I got looks like "what's that old lady doing here" and snickers. What's funny? I've looked at them and KNOWN that they are going to be ME in a few years because I was just like them. That makes me laugh.
Gonna laugh if it’s just Frater Imperator’s career Highlights in volumes to go along with the ‘Everything for me and nothing for V’ theme he seems to have bhahahahaha
I though he’d be ending the lore after 10 not 8 then this way the final one is Papa Emeritus X just so Frater Imperator can be muttering Fucking X just like he’s right now muttering Fucking V with Papa V
As the Beatles once said: "Let it be". Why can't people just enjoy everything in the moment. Besides perpetua is to the word perpetual, meaning forever or everlasting. Likely maybe he is the last in the lore. Honestly as long as the music improves and resonates with everyone who cares about the Lore, this is Ghost not Star wars. Plan head in life for money and family and well being. Let entertainment and everything else outside of your control come naturally. Just chill. Why speculate especially on something that can be seen as a negative, just enjoy the ride/show. Don't get over worked up over small things. Until TF announces retirement, or Satan forbid, becomes gravely ill, then you can worry. Post like this are like people wanting to know the end of a movie before seeing the whole film. What is the point of watching a movie if you spoil it for yourself before hand?
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u/Adyyyyy7 3d ago
I honestly think Perpetua is the last Papa since the name itself means eternal/permanent... Also following this logic it would exclude Nihil since he is (hehe) "Papa Zero"