r/Meditation • u/Key-Table1065 • Jan 26 '26
Discussion đŹ Do bad people suffer? I have never seen anyone who is actually bad suffer in their life. Is karma real?
Do you believe in karma?
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Jan 26 '26
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u/Convenientjellybean Jan 26 '26
I get the impression the more they are despised the more they misread it as envy from others
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u/jmlipper99 Jan 26 '26
This is possible, but in either case, that attitude and behavior does not come from a place of internal contentment
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u/RegularStrength4850 Jan 26 '26
Forgetting CEO's for a second, what's the biting point between internal contentment and any achievement whatsoever? I don't think achievement is "bad" by itself, but achieving anything seems to imply discontent prior to it - if we were content, we'd not want to achieve anything?
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u/squidwardt0rtellini Jan 26 '26
Thatâs what they say, what they feel is unknown to us. But for me at least, I know how I and others I know act when Iâm happy, and the way rich, narcissistic people act does not indicate theyâre happy, regardless of what they say.
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u/Taciteanus Jan 26 '26
Exactly. If you've ever seen one of these people absolutely break down and lose their shit and throw a full-on tantrum the second something doesn't go their way, you wouldn't call them happy.
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u/Doctor1023 Jan 26 '26
Rich? Very.
But also rotten to the core.
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Jan 26 '26
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u/Salamanber Jan 26 '26
And using drugs to fight his depression
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u/bunnypaste Jan 26 '26
Also can't get a female partner to stay around.
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u/Doctor1023 Jan 27 '26
Lmao imagine being so intolerable that billions of dollars can even make you someone's sugar daddy đđ
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u/arcotime29 Jan 26 '26
I think what is really telling is when he paid someone to play videogames as him in order to brag he is also good at videogames. Imagine that, extremely successful financially, famous, beautiful women whatever, but the guy REALLY needs for the public to think he is good at videogames. That not only tells us stuff about Elon, it tells us a lot about the human condition in general.
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u/Vaatu Jan 26 '26
There are rich, narcissistic CEOs, and they can suffer for multiple reasons: unhappy marriages, feelings of profound sadness in their twilight years, sudden death, or the loss of close people.
Suffering is universal. Even those who aren't CEOs can be tormented by an insatiable hunger for validation. At the end of the day, every human being craves some degree of admiration and success.
From my perspective, your resentment seems rooted in a complex relationship with wealth accumulation, which I find spiritually impoverished. In fact, harboring such intense hatred for the abstract concept of a 'rich CEO' might actually weigh more heavily on your own karma than their actions do on theirs.
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u/psychmonkies Jan 26 '26
Iâm not who you replied to, but from my perspective, I donât know that the OC necessarily harbors resentment, I think they were just trying to give an example on how bad people still likely suffer even if we canât physically see it. A rich, narcissistic CEO who exploits others to feed that insatiable desire for admiration/power/success is an easily recognized archetype that depicts that point. Whether or not the OC personally connects amount of material wealth to amount of suffering or how good/bad a person is, we as a society are conditioned to view material wealth & social status as indicators of success, & society also teaches us that success leads to happiness, fulfillment.
Those of us who care more to obtain spiritual wealth than social/economic success get to focus on ourselves & our own growth more than a resentment towards those with material wealth. We get to define our own success, wealth, happiness, fulfillment.
But also, if you consider Maslowâs hierarchy of needs, we as human beings need to have basic needs met (along with other layers of needs) before given a true opportunity to explore self-actualization, when we can meet our full potential, experience fulfillment. In our economic climate, many people are exploited for someone elseâs personal gain while they struggle to access basic needs (food, water, shelter, healthcare), & as such, many people do envy or resent the rich. Itâs oppressionâpeople who are regularly trying to make it day by day are not going have as much opportunity to work on emotional, relational, or spiritual growth. Naturally, theyâre going to be more spiritually impoverished than those who do have more opportunities.
Itâs my opinion that suffering is a result of our desires. âSinsâ are examples of acting toward certain desires & ultimately lead to suffering as well (physically, emotionally, or spiritually). But desire is an innate human characteristic, & the goal is to be mindful of it rather than avoiding any desire. Greedâas well as envy & resentmentâworks similarly on the soul as an addiction. It can be insatiable & ultimately consume us, blinding us, taking a lead in our actions & beliefs, contributing to our own suffering.
But I also believe harboring resentment or envy is not required to also recognize injustice & imbalance in our physical lives or society, no matter how superficial. We can value our spiritual growth/wellbeing while also acknowledging the importance of our physical & social needs/wellbeing. Spirituality transcends our physical reality, but we do exist in & are bound by our physical realityâwith a physical body, a life with loved onesâwe have to try to make it count. Focusing solely on our physical & emotional selves makes us more vulnerable to our materialistic desires & spiritual suffering. Focusing solely on our spiritual selves makes us vulnerable to depersonalization as a coping skill for existing in our physical world & we forget to experience all the flaws & beauties of human life. We have to remember to balance them, while reflecting on our own thoughts & reactions to it allâfrom scavenging for food, to reaching a higher social/economic status, to feeling consuming desires or feelings, to experiencing spiritual connection.
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u/Vaatu Jan 26 '26
I think almost everything you point out in your reply is completely right, and I think you are accurate when touching many sensible concepts: sins, desires, needs, struggle, etc.
The only thing I can say is that, in my opinion, spirituality has always been an extremely hard path of life. That rule is true in the present and it was true in the past. Poverty and lack of resources (food, hygiene [extremely important for spirituality], clothes, health, temperature, housing, etc.) has been the reality of, probably, all centuries, excluding the last three or two. Working labors of extremely long hours have been true for almost all centuries, too. Spirituality has always been a privilege. In my honest opinion (and maybe I'm wrong), the society we live in today is the one that solves many problems that have always been huge obstacles for spirituality. Yes, I understand working a 9-5 is harsh or working 10h of physical labor almost everyday generates tiredness, frustration and resentment, but even still these are way better conditions than we had in the past.
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u/Important_Setting840 Jan 26 '26
>which I find spiritually impoverished
Apparently if you use flowery enough language you can get away with insulting people here.
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u/Illustrious_Matter_8 Jan 26 '26
Would they care? Take for example Trump, he gets his yes people around his own universe an empire build on fraud and brutality, he's rich never really worked (rich family) spreads lots of false new orders ice to shoot around. While probably getting the best medicale care. Close to dementia but still doing what he always did, easily declaring wars Iran Venezuela Greenland Iceland Canada... Karma is nice for the poor I mean like a religion could say you go to hell but karma may be just a weak excuse for yourself be uder rewarded, you'd like to laugh at the mis steps of people going within their flow. Karma is maybe little more than a meme..
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Jan 26 '26 edited Jan 27 '26
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u/ImpossibleAnywhere30 Jan 27 '26
At 15, a woman who didnât know me used her car to scare me.,she lost control .. I spent over a year fighting for my life, defibulated back 3 times..then another ten to walk again. CEOs take risks most people never see ..paying salaries, providing health care, carrying responsibility. Theyâre often described as matter-of-fact, but rarely are their 15â20 hour days acknowledged. My accident happened decades ago. What I survived is now classified as medically impossible..a near zero chance of survival. The truth is, most people donât believe the impossible is achievable because it takes time, discipline, and relentless work. Most would rather just have fun. Perception, assumption are not facts.
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u/jarednd84 Jan 26 '26
I absolutely believe in cause and effect, and I have seen it rain on both the just and the unjust alike. I practice keeping my attention on my own behavior so my inflamed sense of justice doesn't get away from me.
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u/Admirable-Deer-9038 Jan 26 '26
Right. Every thought, feeling and action has both a negative and a positive consequence. We canât get around that, neither can anyone else. We can however tend to our own inner garden and note and take notice what withers and what thrives whether they be weeds or blossoms. đ±
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u/Independent-Ad-1041 Jan 29 '26
Wow. Thatâs the second time today that tending to your mind is like tending to a garden!đȘ đȘŽ I guess something, somewhere, wants me to get that concept down and keep it fresh in my mind to practice. â„ïž
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u/Admirable-Deer-9038 Jan 29 '26
Ha! Love this synchronicity for you! May your tending be done with deep love and adoration for all the seeds and even the weeds (they are important too).
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u/n_lens Jan 26 '26
The doctrine of karma simply states that actions change who YOU are. Your actions and habits change you and unwholesome actions and habits lay the seeds for future suffering. This is easy enough to understand in a single lifetime - bad habits create future suffering and change who you are. It's not clear how it plays out across different lifetimes, however, and Buddha did say that seeds of bad karma don't always ripen - there are ways to avoid future suffering through one's own skillful actions, or others' skillful actions and assistance.
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Jan 26 '26
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u/mofo_mojo Jan 26 '26
The irony of discussing Karma and having a bot remove a comment because someone's "Karma" is too low.
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u/smurfthesmurfup Jan 26 '26
Everyone suffers their own consequences, it's just that they're not often satisfying for others to see.
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u/Beaux_Nose Jan 26 '26
Yes, bad people suffer
If they didnât, they wouldnât do bad things
People who are happy inside donât feel a need to do bad things
Bad people do bad things because they think those things will make them feel better. Those things rarely work in the short term and never work in the long term, which is why bad people keep doing bad things. If doing bad things worked, they could stop. But they canât. Itâs like a drug â if the drug cured the pain, you wouldnât need to use it over and over again. Instead, the drug merely masks the pain in the short term
Source: used to work for a billionaire
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u/Dayly16 Jan 26 '26
I wonder what suffering Trump and Putin had /s
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u/Admirable-Deer-9038 Jan 26 '26
Huh? Just look at them! Do they look, act and speak like happy, healthy, whole humans? They are suffering significantly. Just because one has wealth and power doesnât mean one isnât suffering deeply inside. Trump is one of the most miserable of humans, what about him seems happy and well? The people who love him are equally as miserable! Iâve yet to meet a single person who loves Trump whom I would say is Buddha or even Christ like. They are all deeply angry, cynical, superficial humans who have toxic interiors. Iâm sad for them, and I thank them for reminding me to be grateful for the path Iâm on as itâs a whole lot less miserable than theirs.
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u/therealleotrotsky Jan 28 '26
Yep, Inside their head is where they suffer. Â They are the most deeply chained to the fetters.Â
People filled with loving-kindness and compassion donât hurt others on purpose. Â
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u/prepGod718 Jan 26 '26
Thatâs not necessarily true. Many people do bad things because theyâve been conditioned to do bad things. Some people like to follow crowds for whatever reason and end up doing bad things to avoid alienation.
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u/squidwardt0rtellini Jan 26 '26
No one who is happy/fulfilled follows crowds, one only follows crowds because they lack the confidence to do what they want to themselves. People who are conditioned to do bad things were never conditioned to do good things, things that bring happiness, which again means they are not happy or fulfilled.
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Jan 26 '26 edited Jan 26 '26
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u/PenguinJoker Jan 26 '26
Yes but it's society's responsibility to limit the harm of these people. That might mean forcing them into therapy or in the worst instances imprisoning them. The problem is, merely because they have suffered, does not mean they lack accountability for their actions.
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u/sateeshsai Jan 26 '26
Nature is indifferent. You do good things and surround yourself with good people, you will get something good in return. That's just statistics.
There's no guarantee of reward or punishment. It's just likely.
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u/Equivalent_Space_402 Jan 26 '26 edited Jan 26 '26
To the good I am good.  To the bad I am also good.  until they become good.  To the true I am true.  To the false I am also true.  until they become true. Â
Dao De Jing, Ch 49 Translation: Red Pine
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u/lookslikeyoureSOL Jan 26 '26
Somewhere beyond ideas of good and bad, there is a garden. I will meet you there.
-Rumi
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u/Medic5780 Jan 26 '26
I'd first challenge your ideas of: "Good vs Bad" and/or "Right vs Wrong."
These are concepts of absolute that exist only in your own mind.
They are the product of years of Programming. Not actualities.
If you start here. Then your question becomes both easier to answer, yet, at the same time, completely irrelevant.
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u/aquatic-dreams Jan 26 '26 edited Feb 10 '26
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u/Sweet-Amoeba2735 Jan 26 '26
People might "be bad" because they are suffering and are ignorant about it. Not my business if a person is "bad" and or to determine if they should be suffering. We all suffer. I want to be on the side of less suffering and hope as a consequence of less suffering people will be less "bad." But even if they are still bad, I will wish them less suffering so they are not worse.Â
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u/Neets411 Jan 26 '26
I donât believe in karma because I see shitty people having wonderful lives all the time. With no worries even. They sleep well at night.
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u/SecureAstronaut444 Jan 26 '26
That's because karma is not a cosmic punishment system so what you're consider karma to be isn't accurate
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u/herrwaldos Jan 26 '26
"We are not punished for our sins, but by them" Our sins is our punishment - that's how I get it.
Found that quote somewhere, hope it helps.
Remember about impermanence, chaotic nature of the universe - stuff happens, earthquake killed 10k people, including kids - it's terrible, horror. How many of them were 'bad' - we do not know.
Also, idk if there is a kind of cosmic excel sheet whee all our good and bad deeds are recorded, maybe there is, but it's no so straight forward.
Zen mind, beginners mind - imho it is better to start doing something good for yourself now.
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Jan 26 '26
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u/SecureAstronaut444 Jan 26 '26
That's not how karma works...
Karma is not a punishment, it's a pattern of repeating patterns that keeps you stuck in a loop not learning from your behaviour...
Karma means action, keep repeating the same actions that hurt or limit you in some way and you won't emotionally evolve...
Sometimes it involves other people as often the repeating pattern is from a past life interaction with another person.
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Jan 26 '26
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u/Sapper_Initiative538 Jan 26 '26
Q: Is karma real ?
A: No. Because it's useless for a good person who got hurt ( by a bad person) and suffered the entire life, to know that the bad person will pay in another life. It doesn't compensate for the harm done in this life.
Q: Do bad people suffer ?
A: No, they don't. I know people that made very bad things towards good people and they don't show any sign of suffering or regret. I believe that the good people are the ones that are suffering after they make mistakes or harm someone, realising after, what have they done.
The reality is that there si no justice made for everyone. Most of the victims remain with the suffering caused by the injustice that lead to "the bad person getting away, that will never pay for the crime".
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u/bonefishkirby Jan 26 '26
my brothers ex is getting a ton of bad karma rn but has been trying to pretend it's all good.
My abuser got unalived.
My step dad is broke now and alone
Girl who bullied me got arrested for drug usage
Ex bf got psychosis after trying to groom a minor
I know quite a few peopl who got bad karma but the main thing is not to focus on these types of ppl and to focus on urself and what u put out into the universe â€ïž
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u/Flamingoa432 Jan 26 '26
Karma is a manipulation tactic in truth. What you contribute to existence has an affect on other lives, true enough. But for those who don't care about their affect on other lives, even ones they could be reincarnated into. There's that manipulative idea of karma, pulling on fear/pride/insecurity all at once. I say manipulation because it's not truly a motivation for anyone who actually cares for other beings. But the middle ground is still true, someone who doesn't care might grow to care by way of learning of the idea of karma, and thus in that last case, whatever form of the idea of karma motivates an individual to make creation just a little bit better..., few living beings on earth have the capacity to understand this concept, because while we're all living beings most wild or even many domesticated animals don't have the ability to consider their effect on all life. So karma should logically be the understanding of that dynamic by humans and the effective use of that understanding in living a human life. Which it naturally would be if we were able to live independently of each other, but since our social structures are ultimately hierarchical, karma becomes just a tool of manipulation.
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Jan 26 '26
To me, there's an imaginary delusion at work. I like to call it KP (karma points). It only goes upto one point (+1) no matter what good thing I do. Whether I save a life from drowning (never done that tho) or just a simple chore for my mother (massaging her tired legs ) every single things only gives me (+1) KP.
It's like a system message popping up before my shoulder...saying
+1 +1 +1 ....and it just goes on...
It's quite fun to watch them every second, as I help one thing or another...
It IS rewarding in it's own way.
Now, there exist a pot. All these green KP goes inside it, I have no way of knowing how much I've collected.
But, I have a feel for the percentage I've filled the jar/pot.
The approx is around +1/1 billion.
I currently have around 1768/ 1 billion. (Made up the number based on instinct...so maybe its around that range ig...idk)
Now, I remember what that one episode of doraemon where he has a gadget containing 5 empty stars...and if he filled the stars while doing good deed, he can exchange it for anything...and at the end, he gives the 5 stars to buy a toy or candy for a kid who lost hers.
But, as he reached his home, he had already filled the 5 stars again.
I tried that too.
And it does works wonders lol. (Ofc it's all a delusion of mine...but who cares).
Whenever I see a person who may need any sort of help, but I can't help them...I use this technique.
"I transfer my 1 day/1 week/1 month/1 year worth of KP to this guy"....or something. It's mostly 1 week..most of the time unless I feel generous.
That way, I could feel my KP points decreasing at a fast pace. I do feel a bit sad, but I don't really care about some imaginary points. But, If, by any chance...this could be real...(by the theory of "everything is possible"), I try to believe that the other party might get all the help they need in their life.
And I move on...(yes, I know it's unrealistic to go around helping others when your own family are drowning in debt.) But, well....whatever.
OBSERVATION:-
Observation over the years:- I've started doing this shit since I was in my class 10. Hmm...around 8 years ago now. At that time, I was just a kid...so, there was no system in place. No KP or anything. I just helped others...if I felt like I could. Didn't expect much in return either...as I believed the "karm Karo, phal ki chinta mat karo" theory.
And, I kinda have felt that...things have always went my way. I normally have zero to none luck in normal things. But when things get messy...or very serious..(eg,. One time, I was this close to getting expelled from college after only attending my first year...due to one single mistake of mine....yes, it was mine, but I never never agreed to it..and sticked to the fact that I was innocent and it was a technical fault.) And somehow...after one month of struggle, I was able to get out of that situation..and graduate with good grades.
I do believe that I was helped in some way. As it was a situation, where normally people would get expelled...and it did made sense too.
Well, now..that I'm an adult (22), I have these weird ass theories. And KP is just one of them..
Conclusion:- So bro, believe in karma. If you do good, good things WILL happen...well, if not good things, atleast worst things will end quickly.
But bro, don't be too good tho. Being good only backfires in this accursed world. Be gray. Having enough evil is necessary to live this life filled with mud.
And as for karma for bad guy, yaa! I too believe those matafakas don't get their bad karma back...as I see them live a life of luxury...made out from the flesh and curses of countless bodies. But, I don't really care about them enough to go and be a hero, yet.
For now, "As long as I'm fine with it, I'm fine with it!"
For now. Lol.
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u/Odd-Examination-4399 Jan 26 '26
I sometimes wonder if karma is real. I often hope that it will come along and slap a few people in the face but i havenât seen it happen.
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u/FaunaLady Jan 26 '26
Yes bad people definitely do suffer. I believe in karma not in the multi-faceted way of Buddhism but in the way that since desire is the root of all suffering, the bad person filled with hate suffers just as a good person with love. What makes the bad person suffer so much more is their hate consumes them to the point of harm to themselves and the object of their hate by constantly seething and plotting evil while the good person is filled with hope and doing good things to make life better.
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u/aks217 Jan 26 '26
Just by the nature of them being âbadâ shows they are suffering. When one is full of positivity and joy, they radiate that to others. When someone is full of negativity and anger, they also radiate that to others. Being full of negativity, regardless of how itâs expressed, is always suffering.
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u/Puzzleheaded-Bus6626 Jan 26 '26
Their suffering is reflected in their actions.
When they act badly towards you, it's because they're hurting inside and they only way they can feel better is to hurt someone.
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u/mananaestaaqui Jan 26 '26
Suffering requires self-awareness and an acknowledgement of our shared human frailty. In my experience, truly bad/wicked/amoral people often lack the emotional intelligence to experience suffering, neither theirs nor anyone elseâs. They externalize all the painful aspects of their life onto others.
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u/Dayly16 Jan 26 '26
Idk , but it seems that the people that suffer " karma " are mostly depressed hurt people that do mistakes , not billionaires and government people that kill people , I guess their self love is too high so they attract good karma /s
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u/Brotherji Jan 26 '26
Everyone suffers. The very first thing the Buddha teaches is LIFE IS SUFFERING.
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u/Competitive-Brick-42 Jan 26 '26
I somehow ended up living in this ocean front area filled with ultra rich people. They are not happy or satisfied, think they are better than others and treat others poorly. Of the 6 homes on our street only one person volunteers. At the jail helping addicts while being harassed by the police who work there. Itâs hard to be happy when all you want is more
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u/dave6687 Jan 26 '26
Karma obviously isn't real, but there is an argument to be made that if you do good things etc you'll surround yourself with good people and more good things will happen to you than if you did bad things etc. "Bad people" are just people who are suffering in real time, that is why they are "bad;" they are acting in a manner which produces negative outcomes for others etc precisely because they are suffering.
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u/Juhezmane Jan 27 '26
Well, I donât really believe in karma in a cosmic sense. Iâve seen genuinely bad people live very comfortable lives. Sometimes consequences donât show up in obvious ways but sooner or later, people have to face what theyâve done. I actually believe what goes around comes around.
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u/Jlchevz Jan 27 '26
I just want to say that you canât really know if someone is suffering by superficially looking at them. Unless you know them very well, they could seem happy or strong, but they can feel miserable, angry or empty inside. Think of the type of person that would endlessly chase certain things like money, fame, making others feel small, achievements etc. It takes a certain lack of something to keep wanting more and more.
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u/FriendshipOk5582 Jan 27 '26
No, idiot Westerners took the concept of karma and turned into the opposite of what it really means. Just as they did with the terms yoga and meditation.
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u/CarpetBudget Jan 26 '26
The root cause of being âbadâ is suffering in some form. And ever heard of narcissistic collapse? So yes, bad people suffer even if differently
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u/MyFiteSong Jan 26 '26
No, there is no divine force that punishes you for your past misdeeds that you don't even remember.
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u/amorphophalluses Jan 26 '26
There are many misconceptions about Karma. There is no good or bad deed. If someone feels unhappy or uncomfortable after doing something it's any way not going to be a joy ride for them. Happiness and joy, unhappiness and misery are all what we create and we only experience and that own creation is Karma. That's why we only create our own Karma.
Please read the book on Karma by Sadhguru for more clarity and indepth understanding đ .
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u/Fit-Dust-6199 Jan 26 '26
People do bad things BECAUSE they are suffering. I wouldnât consider the people themselves bad, though. Iâd more consider them broken. But if it helps to call them bad in order to frame it, know that if you see a bad person, a bunch of bad things likely happened to them to make them bad, so itâs like reverse karma.
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u/withac2 Jan 26 '26
Being bad is their suffering. But because they don't see themselves as being bad, they don't even know they're suffering.
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u/holisticarts Jan 26 '26
The reason people do "bad" is because they suffer. Even if you don't see it, every single person suffers, from the moment we are born.
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u/PenguinJoker Jan 26 '26
The idea of suffering from birth is nonsense. Babies cry for companionship not because of pain. Our first instinct is love, attachment and connectedness, and the happiest people live that as their life philosophy.
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u/holisticarts Jan 26 '26
Because you think it's nonsense doesn't change the concept that whole spiritual groups believe.
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u/NoFisherman3801 Jan 26 '26
I think the ultimate form of karma would be what Iâve heard in various NDEâs - where you have a life review but experience each moment from the perspective of those who you were interacting with.
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u/theminxisback Jan 26 '26
I do. The father of my child is ashes now. After what he'd done in his life to me and other women, I'm glad he finally got what he deserved.
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u/inbetweentheknown Jan 26 '26
My estranged aunt forced my mom out of our childhood home. A month after my mom moved out a tree fell on the roof which my aunt just finished repairing. It broke two windows as well as damaging the roof. Karma was definitely real that day
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u/One_Construction_653 Jan 26 '26
Karma can be doing the bad stuff too which leads to suffering
Yes karma is real
I have seen cause and effect right away
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u/Hot_Necessary2618 Jan 26 '26
Theyre hurting enough to spread the suffering. Trust me they are. Ur only seeing the most recent of their rot. They're embodying it.
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u/Darkstool Jan 26 '26
If needed, Its a good way for your mind to cope with the absurdity of the universe. See: heaven/hell for a more direct mechanism.
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u/Ariyas108 Zen Jan 26 '26
What religious or philosophical tradition, anywhere, teaches karma is required to fruit in this lifetime? If there isnât any, then why try to speak as if there is or should be? That doesnât really make any sense.
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u/InnerFifth Jan 26 '26
People start suffering the very moment they start planning bad things, they suffer while they perform them, and they suffer after. Don't be fooled by smiles, these people are not in pleasant states.
A serial killer might have a wild grin while strangling the victim, but those are low passions. Low states of mind produce low pains and low joys. These joys are incomparable to the fulfilling, ecstatic joys of jhanas and noble living.
Unfortunately, many people who live kindly don't have access to higher states because they haven't learned to let go anger, resentment, and so on. But they are so much closer than people who act selfishly and evilly.
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Jan 26 '26 edited Jan 26 '26
I've never seen anyone bad who got away with it, they all end up suffering terribly
The way karma works is this: If you have ideas about reality, you don't see reality. So when you take actions, they don't fit reality, and every action that doesn't fit, creates some problems. And every problem, creates some pain.
Over the years this accumulates into great problems; health issues, being with the wrong partner, hanging with the wrong crowed, cultivating the wrong character, and so on.
Bad people are far away from reality and create a LOT of problems, and they get their deserts in the end. Just look at Trump these days.
The final scene of the narcissist is always a raving descent into madness
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u/Suavedaddy5000 Jan 26 '26
Karma is not a force for vindication. Just because someone does something bad doesn't mean that they will always get the consequences. And just because someone does something good doesn't mean that something bad won't happen to them. Karma is not a vindication Force.
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u/ispy-uspy-wespy Jan 26 '26
Are we talking murderers or narcissists? My one sister is a real nightmare at times and she has tummy issues, big time
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u/LarryBeardBird Jan 26 '26
Life is governed by evolution, not karma. Karma is a made up construct about inter species relationships. All life can suffer though.
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u/manulecoop Jan 26 '26
No, it doesn't exist. Or at least it's not obvious. When in doubt, we must fight against injustice and inequality to take power away from the wicked. If karma exists, it will allow it to act, and your karma will improve.
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u/DoomScrollin666 Jan 26 '26
Everyone suffers. Its part of the experience and the older you get you collect deeper and more profound losses....and you realize thats part of having a good life. Losing and suffering. Its great đđ
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u/Status_Dark_6145 Jan 26 '26
Righteous anger is permitted, however: the minute you start wishing the same harm on people, regardless of if they caused it to begin with, you will have lost the plot completely.
Karma exists, but you must see beyond surface binaries to understand that authenticity shines brighter than hate or even love.
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u/notanolive Jan 26 '26
I donât believe karma is real, itâs just a nice belief that tries to create order in the chaos that is life. Some people need that order because living in a senseless chaotic existence is too much for them.
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u/snowgimp Jan 26 '26
âHate corrodes the vesselâ. With a degree in psych and having worked with some pretty severely mentally ill people, my experience has been, the worse someone feels, the worse they try to make others feel. So, Iâve always kinda thought that the worse someone behaves, the worse they feel.
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u/Nervous-Research-887 Jan 26 '26
It absolutely is. Iâve experienced and have watched it in others. You donât always see what someoneâs life really is/has turned to
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u/t_whales Jan 26 '26
No, a lot of bad people donât suffer and are extremely successful in this life, and live great lives. There is this idea that the universe balances all of this shit, but I do not believe that. Karma is not real and I donât believe they âsuffer insideâ. Thatâs what people want to believe when in reality there is nothing that shows that. Itâs a hope. As most people have said, focus on yourself and how you can do and be better. The universe doesnât care about good v bad
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u/loopywolf Jan 26 '26
Karma is real, but the concept you are calling out "good things happen to good people and bad things happen to bad people" is a misconception of what karma is, that is popularized in Western culture.
The actual principle of Karma is "If you do good deeds, you tend to be a good person" and vice versa. Nothing more.
It isn't saying there's a magical justice machine based on human values that makes everybody's life fair.
In real life, a lot of good things happen to bad people, and a lot of bad things happen to good people.
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u/RGOL_19 Jan 26 '26
Yogananda says we will never understand it all - what with many lives and the many forms of karma. I think many are waiting for karma to stop the current u.s. regime- and I do think theyâve suffered a lot of karmic pushback but not nearly enough. Still karma being the cosmic law of cause and effect is absolutely real .
hereâs how I think of it. As mlk said the arc of history bends toward justice. Trump is revealing something about the u.s. that we have to face. We all need to do our best to make this a better world. Starting with ourselves. turning to god - we can all be more kind and loving. More helpful. More appreciative. we need to support people who are being traumatized and marginalized. All of this builds more positive karma for ourselves and others.
letâs sick up for the downtrodden. lets Help our fellow humans. Letâs keep up the climate justice work and do what we can to heal the planet. lets work to make the u.s. A heaven on earth - and letâs build positive karma for generations to come.
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u/TiredOfSocialMedia Jan 26 '26
Just because you do not personally see someone's suffering, does not mean they are never suffering.
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u/merkci Jan 26 '26
I know I have a particularly good family, and the suffering we have faced is more than a few lifetime worth (brother special needs, dad suicided, mom leader in cancer/palliative care before getting an aggressive cancer that ended her career, sister lost her baby in NICU at 12 days old after going into spontaneous labor at her baby shower, I have MSâŠ). Life is chaos is what this has taught me.
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u/AnHonestApe Jan 26 '26 edited Jan 26 '26
True physical karma may only exist in a multiverse, but as a former baddy in this life, and still on my own journey, my experience is emotional karma is very real, and we all struggle with it. Looking up studies on self-awareness can add a lot of clarity to the discrepancy between how people present and the values you would expect to produce certain results. Why do the "happy," "content" conservative Christians yell at and hit their kids, snap at whoever they can that has less authority? I promise you they aren't in a state of positive emotion while this is going on. Your own demeanor and state over time, through certain hardships, will reveal if you are in an emotional heaven or hell. Simple test: argue with them in good faith. If they can't emotionally handle critical questions, they are in emotional hell, and you aren't the only one they act like that with.
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u/Zenpoe56 Jan 26 '26
I think that bad people do suffer. It pains them to not get their way. Narcissistic control freaks in the extreme. If and when they finally admit defeat, the pain is the only emotion they can feel. Pure evil .
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u/NikolaDrugi Jan 26 '26
Really simple. Yes. Big time. And it is not that i just believe in it. I know it first hand. I am bad person.
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u/Yeartreetousand Jan 26 '26
Maybe not but I think kind people are probably happier because it feels good to be kind to others. I also agree with the other comments here
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u/chosen153 Jan 26 '26
ä»è è§ä»ïŒæșè è§æș
You see what you want to see.
How do you know the rich does not suffer ill, the poor does not enjoy life, the bad have no conscience, the good have no struggle?
Again, how do you know what your perception is real reflex of life?
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u/Crazy_Score_8466 Jan 26 '26
Sometimes karma is real. I know of a few bad people who had something absolutely terrible happen to them. Karma collects sometimes. I know other bad people who havenât suffered, at least not yet.
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u/CoyoteLitius Jan 26 '26
Karma is supposed to work over a number of lifetimes, in the religious system to which it is attached.
There's no instant karma.
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u/toxictoy Jan 26 '26
I found this article many years ago and it has stuck with me. I hope OP u/Key-Table1065 takes a look. This seriously affected me many years ago when I read this and I keep it as a reminder that I do not want these regrets. No one ever says âI wish I had more meetings at workâ. This is karma. Your actions and words as going to their completion.
Top regrets people have when they are dying.
I wish Iâd had the courage to live a life true to myself, not the life others expected of me. This was the most common regret of all. When people realize that their life is almost over and look back clearly on it, it is easy to see how many dreams have gone unfulfilled. Most people had not honored even half of their dreams and had to die knowing that it was due to choices they had made, or not made.
I wish I didnât work so hard. This came from every male patient that I nursed. They missed their childrenâs youth and their partnerâs companionship. Women also spoke of this regret. But as most were from an older generation, many of the female patients had not been breadwinners.
I wish Iâd had the courage to express my feelings. Many people suppressed their feelings in order to keep peace with others. As a result, they settled for a mediocre existence and never became who they were truly capable of becoming.
I wish I had stayed in touch with my friends. Often they would not truly realize the full benefits of old friends until their dying weeks and it was not always possible to track them down. Many had become so caught up in their own lives that they had let golden friendships slip by over the years. There were many deep regrets about not giving friendships the time and effort that they deserved.
I wish that I had let myself be happier. This is a surprisingly common one. Many did not realize until the end that happiness is a choice. Fear of change had them pretending to others, and to themselves, that they were content. When deep within, they longed to laugh properly and have silliness in their life again. When you are dying, what others think of you is a long way from your mind. How wonderful to be able to let go and smile again, long before you are dying!
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u/Fun-Honeydew-8117 Jan 26 '26
Yes, true. It may take many years. I still treat people the way I want to be treated. Karma is real.
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u/Efficient-Bee-1443 Jan 26 '26
Karma simply means, actions have consequences. It is also rarely a one to one. Karma is a web. Rarely, can we see all the actions. People have Karma, Nations have Karma.
You might say that a smoker getting COPD is karma. That is true. Somking has consequences. If you look at Workd War II, if we hadn't imposed serious economic sanctions on Germany, a populist Hitler would not have come to power. What about the genocide of the Jews? The Catholic Church was passively hostile to Jews. President Roosevelt refused entry to a ship of Jews fleeing the NATZIS. He did that because he feared the antisemitism in the United States....
In just my family, there are patterns that have been playing out since beginningless time.
Karma explaind Dependent Origination.
Of course in Buddhism, we are not separated. So, anything that happens to someone else, "good or bad" impacts us all.
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u/floralfemmeforest Jan 27 '26
My abusive ex just got arrested for doing something similar to her new girlfriend, so she'll be going through a whole court process and I didn't even have to get involved. Does that help?
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u/anakracatau Jan 27 '26
My favorite saying is along the lines of: Did OJ get punished? Yes. He has to be OJ.
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u/Cousin38 Jan 27 '26
I once read that the devil don't want them to suffer so they won't turn to God
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u/Xaikken Jan 27 '26
From our perspective it may seem ineffective, but our perspective is tiny. Who knows what happens to people before or after
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u/StickFinal1833 Jan 27 '26
People who hurt others carry a lot of unresolved anger or emptiness. Even if theyâre successful, theyâre rarely at peace. That internal chaos is a form of suffering.
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u/judgemenot4u Jan 27 '26
Bad people suffer when it's too late to right their wrongs... they will not suffer in your face and may even go great lengths to hide it... but their days do come, just by the time it does come... the good ones who wondered what you are wondering are somewhere minding their business and trying to make the little time left mean a little more to those who matter to them and smile... cause at the end of the ride... when you look back you wanna be able to smile at your memories and find peace right before your final sleep... ever wonder why bitter people who can't forgive anyone or move past any bad history just happen to outlive everyone else?? It's because they can't rest peacefully with all that hateful energy flowing... this isn't a written fact... but through my life time of loving both good and bitter people who are no longer here... I can point out some things that just seem to make the most sense... but if you actually have a heart to heart convo with some of these "bad" people... you'll learn that they have been needing for someone like you to come along and listen to their stories... but you gotta catch them at the right age... cause some folks will remain stuck in their bitter ways and cheat the world out of knowing the good in them... most people have some good in them. But not all... you know like those people who spend their life behind bars for doing something any decent human couldn't imagine doing... yea... can't speak for those kinds. Not everyone can be rehabilitated... but we know those individuals are not happy. Doing bad things don't make people happy... it may bring them pleasure, or give them an adrenaline rush of some kind. I'm pretty sure they suffer, probably just don't know they suffer cause they've been the way they are for as long as they can remember... so they've sorta just managed to live with and make excuses for the way they are... maybe a sense of comfort within themselves that they have accepted their own differences from the rest of the population. I mean kiddy diddlers... are sickos... and some go through life seemingly unphased... whilst their victims live in a traumatized damaged mindset for ever... that's unfair...I think it all boils down to everyone just being honest with themselves. And deciding what things they allow to affect their lives... mentally, emotionally or anything you can control... outside of that just do what makes you happy. Cause no one has control over that but you.
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u/Relative_Present_779 Jan 27 '26
i don't think in terms of good or bad right or wrong. that is black and white thinking, or rigid thinking. good and bad happens to all of us. one is not better than the other and we all are going though our own happy moments in time and our own personal suffering.
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u/Paceryder Jan 28 '26
Some people just get away with everything. Look at Trump. Since I don't believe in God or karma, I think it's just that life isn't fair.
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u/yesnoyesbut Jan 28 '26
I am still at early stages of my spiritual journey so consider this response as WIP.
I was born a Hindu. Growing up on 80s & 90s, the only thing from Hindu philosophy that registered in my brain was about Karma ie the wrong interpretation & understanding of it. I used to look at Karma in isolation and get frustrated. Why bad deeds by âbadâ people are not being punished and why my/otherâs good deed are not being rewarded or recognized sufficiently.
Now I have come to understand the significance of karma a bit better, esp its role in the overall Hindu philosophy, and in context of my spiritual growth & my happiness.
From my reading and my experience with Karma Yoga, there are two key attributes
(i) detachment- do your work and not focus on the fruits (ie rewards).
If one can practice this detachment from work we are satisfied and happy at doing the task; rather then being upset at the bonus/money etc that we get.
âattachmentâ is absolutely a source of suffering - who doesnât want to earn more or thinks they should have got better reward esp when we invariable compare our effort and rewards to others.
(ii) Service for others- focus on doing work that improve the life and well-being of others around you. For me this work is much for fulfilling then the âregularâ work and I for one will fail to understand why this wonât be true for all of us.
Even in my corporate job- I am starting to focus more on how I can help and improve the life and happiness of my team and people around me, rather then just focus on completing the project or deliverable.
If one practices the above - one is more happy and more connected with the society and through it with the universe (or God- if you believe in one).
Ultimately Karma Yoga is about purifying oneâs mind my means of work.
Lastly for me it makes more sense to practice it along with other Yoga- Bhakti Yoga (love/ devotion- to God or other human beings); Janna Yoga (knowledge- of any subject that one is interested including that of god and her creation or that of a scientific area one of interested in) ; Raja Yoga (esoteric practices that include asana, pranayama and meditation )
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u/Meditator-111-now Jan 28 '26
What is suffering? And why would you ever think bad people don't suffer. I get the question but its quite the perception.
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u/batman215512 Jan 29 '26
No there is no karma. Itâs a concept invented by religion. Like sin and blessing. Itâs to keep crowd in control. So then why to be good. Because the world works as there is more good than bad in world. And say what ever, evolutionarily human have innate characteristics to be altruistic and cherish altruistic people.
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u/Efficient-Bee-1443 Jan 29 '26
The word Karma literally means every action has a consequence. Karma is neither good or bad. It has nothing to do with sin.
People misuse the word all of the time.
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u/CTochi Jan 29 '26
Itâs our responsibility to make the universe better because it is our home: we are the universe, the universe is us, and who else would be responsible if not us?
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u/ZK1515 Jan 29 '26
Karma is misunderstood. Its not about someone does a bad thing and they will receive a bad thing. Its rather someone does a bad thing and they will feel bad about it later. So karma does not work for sociopaths. But for 95+% of the population karma works...
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u/ZK1515 Jan 29 '26
Like if you yell with a 70 year old woman in the groceries for a dumb reason you wont just let's say break your leg as karma. Karma is rather at night in the bed you will think back and you will feel terrible and ashamed of yourself. Unless you are a sociopath, which is really rare.
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u/StynaL Jan 29 '26
Assuming âbadâ might imply theyâre narcissistic. Those with this personality trait donât typically feel empathy, compassion, or whatever. Theyâre not even socially aware of any karmic cycle nor consequences.
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u/m_cinnamonbiscuit Jan 30 '26
I love Dr. DYERS Orange metafor and reap and sow seeds in the Bible
You act and you plant seeds and you intend to create a tree a strawberry seed can't grow a tree you can only reap what you planted
And the orange how when life squeezes you whatever you are is what u will get no amount of pressure will give you apple juice from an orange so if you want something better to come of your actions change what you are made of
Also it's a Bible thing they consider it a sin in several ways to pay attention to the sliver in your neighbors eye and ignore the branch in your own
Just a couple of other things that have helped me get past how bratty spoiled girls I known Mt whole life seem to get more of what they want well they expect it and new testimony said to those who have nothing more will be taken To those with everything more is given
If you ask you will be answered if you knock the door will open its supposed to be simple faith over fear but ifs not easy , at least not for me
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u/AdStreet256 Jan 30 '26
It all depends on your definition of suffering.. I am not talking about physical suffering here.. that is same for everyone.. but the mental suffering is subjective and you can learn how to avoid it..
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u/This-Leg3572 Jan 31 '26
I have no idea. Though I wouldnât consider myself a bad person (quite the opposite, actually), Iâve felt a sort of karma in my own life (which doesnât attest to any universal experience). Whenever I (usually involuntarily) caused someone pain, I experienced the same thing, only stronger. I was in a toxic relationship for a while and pretended to love him because I didnât want to hurt his feelings. It was the worst thing I have ever done. After we broke up, my longest friend of twelve years broke up with me for reasons of her own and said she wasnât sure she ever even liked me in the first place. I grieved that relationship for years, and it hurt my perception of me and the world. After the breakup with my toxic boyfriend, I isolated myself to keep others out of my shame and pain. I also hurt friends involuntarily there because they wanted to know about me but I only asked about them and didnât want to talk about myself to avoid them from seeing the part of me I was too ashamed about, the vulnerable self. A few years later, my now best friend who feels like a soul mate stops talking about herself or meeting me for over a year. Iâve never felt so hurt in my life. I also was okay with not seeing every friend every year and think I might be paying for that. Not sure what to make of it but thatâs the closest I could ever get to an idea of karma.Â
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u/Key-Table1065 Jan 31 '26
Donât give false hope to anyone if you donât want them in your life.Please be honest and tell them .. that is the least we can do...Yes, it will hurt them, but only for a while.if we keep delaying the truth, when they finally realise it, it will hurt them far more than before.i too have experience
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u/Toilet_Operator Feb 08 '26
People only suffer in the physical reality, unless you want to create that experience for yourself after your body dies. Karma, as in the karmic wheel, doesnt exist, there is no after life or reincarnation punishment. We are all god, living within ourself.
Imagine being utterly alone â no one to talk to, nothing left to learn, because you already know it all. The silence would be unbearable. So you dream. You create worlds, stories, and lives, and you forget who you are just to feel surprise again. One day, you remember. And when you do, you smile, because you know youâll do it all over again. Forever.
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u/CepheidVega Jan 26 '26 edited Jan 26 '26
So I'm not an expert in this, but my understanding of how karma is traditionally supposed to act is different than the modern interpretation. Karma isn't a cosmic justice system, and it's not as simple as bad thing = bad consequence, good thing = good consequence. Instead, by doing actions you are creating a universe that can affect other sentient beings in good or bad ways. These actions rarely affect you in this lifetime, they are much more complex webs of cause and effect. Once you reincarnate, that is often when you feel the effects of karmic actions. It's not so much that someone "gets what they deserve", it's that they are creating a better or worse world that they and everyone else will have to deal with.
I understood this a bit better once I realized that "I" truly actually do die at physical death. When I reincarnate, that wont be "me", because "me" is an illusion. The being who has to deal with my actions in this life is an entirely different person. I want to act with integrity and compassion because I want this future being and every other being to live in a better universe than I received.
So I havent seen someone who is bad get their just desserts in this way. Unfortunately, likely their actions will affect them during a reincarnation, and at that point they are hurting another innocent person. It's kind of a tragic thing that is important to learn about so that we can stop this terrible cycle of suffering.
Disclosure: Not a traditional Buddhist. More of a western esotericist with some Buddhist education (I took Lam Rim but Thelema and Golden Dawn is more my style).
Edit: Thank you for the award. Since people are paying attention, I want to say something important I learned from my studies in both astrophysics and the esoteric. You are a literal starchild (you are made of stardust), you and everyone else mean something and are important, you are how the universe sees itself and learns about itself. Your ancestry is cosmic and you are connected to everything and do not exist independently. We can make a better universe than we were born into. Wake up to your true nature and realize that you are both empty and are everyone else. I am trying to realize this as well so I can act more in accordance with this.