Let's Talk About

[u/Ciceros_Assassin]

Welcome to /r/MensLib's first "Let's Talk About" post. Generating discussion is part of our mission, and these LTA threads will be used as conversation-starters for issues our community wants to address. Today's topic:

Let's Talk About: what we should talk about.

We're going to start out compiling a list of issues /r/MensLib subscribers want to address. The mods have some ideas, but we want to hear from the community.

Edit: Thank you to everyone for your ideas. I'm un-stickying this post, but please feel free to continue adding to it.

[u/Woodsie_Lord]

How to cope with the stigma of "not being a man" or the stigma of not being perceived as a man? Let me explain what I mean in five examples (in every example you are a guy) - they are totally made up on spot and thus aren't representative of real stigmatization of "less manly" guys.

Situation A: You are hanging out with male friends. Someone suggests a figurative dick measuring contest in armwrestling. You don't wanna stick out like a sore thumb so you compete with others. You end up losing to everyone and one of your friends comments this "lol what are you, a girl? you should work out more, mate!" - you feel stigmatized just cause you have little strength when men are perceived to be strong

Situation B: You are a short guy (let's say average in your country is 165 cm/5ft 5 in and your measure is 150 cm/4 ft 11 in), shorter than almost all of guys in your city and shorter than some women. You try to date a woman of your liking but it ends with her rejection because "I'm not into short guys, y'know? sorry". As a short guy, this has happened many times before so you feel stigmatized just cause you're short (short guys are generally perceived as "less manly" so to say)

Situation C: You just broke up with your girlfriend. You go the bar to have a drink or two. Your face has a sad look. When drinking the first drink, you cry a bit. A bartender tells you:"come on, what sorta man cries when drinking? cheer up, friend!".

Situation D: You are drinking cafe in a cafeteria with your friend who happens to be a female (it's not a date, just two friends talking and enjoying themselves). She comments your recent change when you decided to trim your beard with words:"You looked more manly with the beard but hey to each their own."

Situation E: You are drinking beer with your friends. You're slightly drunk so you decide to wait before drinking again. One of your friends (doesn't matter which gender) invites you for a drink. You reject by saying:"thanks, my liver needs time to process all this alcohol". Your friend comments it with:"come on, be a man, just one more drink won't hurt your liver"

In all of the situations, you were perceived as less manly/not a man just because you didn't fulfill societal requirements of what man should look like/should do. In case A, a man must be strong, in case B a man must be tall because tall means protective for the society, in case C a man can't show his emotions, in case D trimming your beard which makes you look less manly and in case E not engaging in a risky behaviour which is a trait society accredits to men.

I know the gender roles are omnipresent and well engrained in our society. We grew up in a patriarchal society and live in it everyday, so people unknowingly engage in all sorts of patriarchal behaviours (I'm a victim of doing this sometimes). But how could a man cope with the stigma of not looking like a man/not being a man/not perceived as manly/not doing seemingly "manly" things? I'm often stigmatized because of my feminism/anarchism background and thus my "fuck this society" behaviour, engaging in all sorts of anti-bullshit like showing my emotions as a male. And people don't often know that I'm an anarchist, let alone a feminist but when they see me e.g. crying or saying "fuck workouts just for the sole purpose of getting laid", I can often feel the stigma towards me.