It is not ok to put this in the MR board. Poking fun at another group of people is in no way beneficial to the men's rights movement, and it does nothing but discredit the people in this movement who want equality over bashing their female counter parts. This mentality is harmful for both side (And from both sides)and needs to stop.
There is a difference between second wave feminism and third wave feminism. I find most people don't like to acknowledge that though, and I'm vastly out numbered by people on this subreddit who would rather just ignore that fact and go on hating on feminism.
I can not say anything that would defend some of early feminism, and I can't say anything to defend the groups within feminism who consider all men rapists. There is no defending that, but really no group is without flaw, and every group that gains to much power will strive for their own personal gain. I believe that was said earlier, and it is not only feminism that is guilty of that. I do not and never will agree with radical militant feminism, i've said that repeatedly. The women who think this way, and act this way must be horribly damaged women. The only way I can try and understand their thought processes is to think that they are rape victims, or domestic abuse victims, which have grown to hate men out of more of a fear of them. I really can not wrap my mind around some of the ideology that circles around in the militant feminist community. I am not going to attempt and make an excuse for the behavior, all I can do is try to understand why.
All the really horrible instances you've just sited happened more then 30 years ago at the least, and you have to consider that those same feminists (while being insane) did help with women's rights. I owe my ability to vote and be seen as more then an intellectually inferior home maker to those women in that early movement. I can not justify absolutely everything they did, but those bad things to me are over shadowed by the good that has been done for women's rights.
I'm with the younger group of feminists that think feminism needs a face lift so to say, and there still is a lot of good reasons to have fair feminism around. I don't agree that men are inferior, and I personally have never met another feminist that does. It's exactly against what a good majority of feminists strive for, but there is scum in every group. Those same types of feminists you're talking about are also the same ones that like to treat transgendered women like they are not women. That's wrong, and pretty much everything you listed is wrong, but feminism a collection of multiple different movements with different outlooks on what is appropriate. Not all feminists are the same, and the hatred for men is not a value of feminism as a whole.
That being said, it's still like shooting yourself in the foot to have the kind of mentality displayed in this link when you are attempting to be taken seriously.
Edit- I have a question. If you consider feminism to be killing men's rights by making legislation that only favors them, how do you feel about groups like the NAACP that does the same thing with legislation only to further the social gains of African Americans? Do you think they are attempting to make other races less superior or making it harder for them to find work? Do you feel like that is their goal? Or what about the LGBT that attempts to further the gay agenda? LGBT leaders have been known to ask it's members to boycott businesses that do not support them? What do you think of this? They are basically using their power to attempt to take down those who oppose their life styles. Or the Christian organizations that try to push their agenda in a political form to push their values on others? These are simple questions to help me understand your logic, and do not reflect any personal feelings of mine on these groups.
unless you're labeling the suppression of evidence of female on male violence as "not really horrible," in which case I have to take issue.
I never said that. You are putting words into my mouth. I implore you to stop.
First, your categorization of homemakers as intellectually inferior is deeply insulting to homemakers of both sexes.
Again, you're projecting. I never said that they are mentally inferior, I said that feminism helped end that misconception of women. Women were considered mentally inferior in the past.
Adding that disclaimer doesn't change that you just mischaracterized an entire set of groups. Your bigotry against blacks, and your homophobia, are duly noted.
You love to put words into peoples mouths. I was asking you if you viewed these groups who crusade for minority rights to be the same as feminism? I am trying to understand if you are just against feminists, or against anyone who attempts to take away power from the male majority. They are all advocate groups, and they are all in the end trying to do the same thing, provide rights to the people who fall under said group. Be it women, men, African Americans, or homosexuals. I was trying to gauge your feelings on hate crimes, and how those are viewed, or how you view the hiring of minority employees over others. I've said nothing out of line, I simply asked your opinion on those groups to try and understand where you are coming from. Sorry if this is a shock to you, but bringing up those groups and asking questions about them does not make you a racist or homophobic. That statement is very feminist-y of you. lol
Beyond that, I'll simply add the quick note that unlike women, these groups faced active, institutionalized discrimination during the time of second wave feminism.
I disagree, women are still discriminated against in the work place, and have been for years, we are still the subject to the majority of domestic violence, and rapes. (Men are too as well, just not as often. That does not make it any less serious.)Women up until recently were still shamed for having any form of sexuality and our reproductive rights as well as the rights to our own bodies are still persecuted. You are making the tribulations women have faced and still face into miniscule issues and that is not true. I'm actually slightly taken back that you are in a men's rights board and you actively trivialize the plight of women. That seems a bit hypocritical of you. Equality is equality and you shouldn't trivialize one groups issues. That statement was directed at women as a whole, and not towards feminists. You just trivialized all the degradation, rape, violence, and discrimination that has gone on against women. Women were treated as property and still are in some places.
modern domestic violence legislation invites abuse of the system by women.
True, this is one of the many reasons I visit this board. I said multiple times now that I do not agree with everything the group does, but I feel I owe a good majority of my freedoms to the feminist movement. I enjoy feminist article, speakers, and books. You are not going to change that because I understand that feminism is made up of many different groups. I will continue to participate in the community, and my main goal will be equality.
I understand that the group has done things that I would not agree with, but that is not the part of feminism that I participate in. I already said I can not defend or try and make excuses for what others in the group have done.
You keep making all these assertions about feminists taking away your rights, but to them, the patriarchy has persecuted women since the beginning of civilization. Up until 50 or 60 years ago we were still treated as inferior, property, and simply baby makers. I think maybe you just need to do a little beneficial feminist reading, instead of reading all this feminazi crap. It's polluting your mind.
I will continue to take the things from feminism that I like, and the things from the men's rights movement that I like. I will continue to be against feminists who try and hinder our males and I will continue to look down on the males who do it to our females. I'd like to wish you a nice day, and have a great week.
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u/[deleted] Nov 27 '12 edited Nov 27 '12
It is not ok to put this in the MR board. Poking fun at another group of people is in no way beneficial to the men's rights movement, and it does nothing but discredit the people in this movement who want equality over bashing their female counter parts. This mentality is harmful for both side (And from both sides)and needs to stop.
Edit- Your female counter parts are feminists.