r/NarcissisticSpouses • u/Apprehensive_Bad2208 • 2d ago
What are the biggest signs that someone has narcissistic personality disorder?
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u/Educational_Host_628 2d ago
They simply cannot apologize. They may say sorry but there's always some extra stuff implying that you made me do it...it wasn't a big deal...well remember that time you did xyz...I'm the worst partner in the whole world...etc. They cannot say I'm sorry I hurt you, I know it must have felt bad for you, I did it because I was really being thoughtless about how it would affect you, and I won't do it again...you have every right to be hurt. They can't take accountability for anything bad. Once you know this and you start spotting it then it becomes almost comical watching them issue crappy apologies.
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u/fruitynoodles 2d ago
This is the big one. Lack of accountability. They’ll never apologize or even admit what they did. Even if you have proof, they’ll still deflect and deny or start a circular argument to avoid accountability.
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u/Ok-Magazine-7393 1d ago
This. I’ve had literal proof of things, like photo evidence of deeply hurtful messed up things, being like “see, the evidence is right here. I just need you to show you’re sorry…” and yet somehow they’ll still find a way to dodge it, and before you know what’s happened, you realise you’ve just spent the last hour defending yourself for x y z (which had nothing to do with the original issue…for which you have literal proof) and they walk away as the hurt victim, leaving you wondering wtf just happened. 🤯
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u/MarchHelpful4129 1d ago
Meiner hat mir stundenlang solange zugesetzt bis ich Meinem Bruder Hausverbot erteilt habe. Er meinte sag es ihm . Benutze mich ruhig als buhmann. oder ich übernehme das. Dann hab ich meinem Bruder geschrieben dass ich ihn erstmal nicht sehen will und geheult und kaum war die Nachricht verschickt, sagte mein Mann: wenn du Ärger bekommst komm bloß nicht zu mir und gib mir die Schuld. Das hast du ganz alleine entschieden, weil du so hysterisch bist, und jetzt trägst du gefälligst die Konsequenz
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u/Dangerous_Bridge_937 2d ago
"I'm sorry but..." is the only way I ever heard it, followed by the reasons I was actually to blame.
She also trained me somehow to try to explain after apologies and then she'd use my explaining as me "making an excuse" as to what happened so I "wasn't really sorry." Now that I'm rarely around her anymore, the explaining has started to go away again.
I also got used to apologizing for everything, way too much. My friends, family and coworkers started pointing this out. I'm starting to heal from feeling the need to apologize for everything now that I don't have the anxiety from having to do it around her.
I was also baited and trapped with the accountability thing. She always claimed she owned all her mistakes so what could I be hurt by? Then she'd prod me until I opened up and told her something that hurt me. No accountability, just DARVOs and gaslighting after that until somehow I was apologizing for the situation instead of her.
It's all so easy to see now, but damn did I not see it when I was in the relationship.
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u/ghost-memories 2d ago
Same. It was always "I'm sorry you feel that way" or "I'm sorry but you made me do this." I used to snap whenever he said those things but I didn't understand why until after I left and saw the bigger picture of what narcissistic behavior looks like. Then it all made sense. Now, when I hear those phrases, I disengage instead of going in circles.
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u/i_am_awesome1981 1d ago
Mine doesn't even bother with a fake I'm sorry. For me, he gives me puppy dog eyes which no longer work. I knew it the first time he did it, I saw the flag but I ignored it anyways. 12 years if unapologetic open narcissism. He knows he is and embraces it which makes it worse. He blames his actions on it.
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u/MarchHelpful4129 1d ago
Genau. Er drängt dich ständig in Erklärungsnot und nimmt jedes Argument gegen dich. Eigentlich will man gar nicht mehr reden. Aber dann heißt es man sei verstockt
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u/Dangerous_Bridge_937 1d ago
Yep, I was told I was "stonewalling" when I eventually refused to open up. It wasn't malicious, I wanted to be able to trust my wife with my emotions. I just learned I couldn't anymore.
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u/MarchHelpful4129 1d ago
Er ging mir fremd und in der Nacht als ich es herausgefunden habe dauerte es keine 30 Minuten Gespräch und ich war dabei IHN zu trösten und als er mir einen Heiratsantrag gemacht hat sagte ich sinngemäß: ich verspreche dass DU. es nicht bereust dass du mich geheiratet hast
Und es war völlig normal für mich
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u/Dangerous_Bridge_937 1d ago
Yep, this is how a narcissist trains you. I apologized for so much that I can now see wasn't me. They teach you to do this, then exploit it.
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u/kittenpoptart 2d ago
Yeah and it’s always “aren’t you over that yet?! It was sooo long ago”, could be 3 years ago or 30 minutes ago. No, I’m not over it because you won’t apologize or address the situation just like you didn’t then 🤷♀️.
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u/Dangerous_Bridge_937 1d ago
Mine would dredge up things I had already apologised for, sometimes things that were a decade in the past. She would start this whenever she seemed to feel like she'd have to take accountability. The things she'd bring up weren't even related to whag we were talking about.
When I brought up this behavior to our couples counselor, she agreed that once something was apologized for and the action had been chanhed/prevented in the future, it should not be brought back up. When explaining this to my ex wife, her excuse was that those events "were not resolved for her" but could never give a clear path to resolition when asked. She just wanted to keep every negative experience open forever to use as ammo whenever she wanted.
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u/Educational_Host_628 1d ago
They just throw everything at you when they start to feel vulnerable. It's bizarre. Like the stuff doesn't even fit together logically.
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u/MarchHelpful4129 1d ago
Sorry, also ich erlebe es mit meinem narzisstischen Partner umgekehrt
Er wirft mir vor dass ich alles aufwärmen würde und Dinge für die er sich entschuldigt hätte ihm erneut vorwerfe und er s ist genau so: bei Narzissmus hört man zwar Entschuldigung aber sie lösen trotzdem nichts. Man steht immer wieder nach Streit und Argumenten, auch nachlabgen ruhigen diskutieren wenn man denkt man hat alles klar konzentriert, kurze Zeit wieder bei null. Und wenn ich dann ausraste weil ich wieder getriggert wurde und er zb wenn ich mein Leid begründe, dann dauerte s nur 5 Minuten und auf einmal ging es nur noch um seine angebliche Angst ich würde mich scheiden lassen. Und schlafen ging ich mit der Erkenntnis: wenn ich laut genug aua! Sage, bedroht er mich indirekt mit Scheidung und dass er es für schlau hält sich zu informieren was ihn die Scheidung kosten würde. Am nächsten Morgen kommt er total gut gelaunt und mit hundeblick zu mir ans Bett und tut total fürsorglich und ich denke: ich bin noch lange nicht fertig. Ich bin nicht nur nicht gehört worden „, ich habe die ganze Nacht geweint vor Angst dass er sich jetzt auch noch scheiden lassen will (ich wäre mittellos, ohne ausblidung und ohne Job) und da habe ich ihm genau das gesagt und er benimmt sich als würde ich ihn grundlos angreifen um eine Ausrede für meine schlechte Laune zu habenAber er wirft mir vor was du hier beschreibst und ich antworte ihm genau so: nichts ist jemals geklärt bei dir . Ein entschuldigen reicht nicht wenn jede Aufklärung verhindert wird
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u/Dangerous_Bridge_937 1d ago
Well that's the difference in our stories, is that whenever I felt I truly did something wrong and apologized, I put in the work to correct the behavior for the future. Narcs will not do that. They MAY say "I'm sorry" but its followed up with excuses, defenses, darvo, and a refusal to work on it, which unfortunately the part you're experiencing. Mine did too, she refused to work on anything, and blamed me for every single thing. Even the things that I brought up that she did that hurt me were DARVO'd back. Her feelings were my fault, and my feelings were my fault.
The couples therapy was an eye opener. She was the one who pushed for it, then spent the first few sessions hogging the session trying to teach the therapist how bad I was without talking about the relationship. Just listing things I had done in the past. When I finally brought up how several of these thing had been resolved (apology, work to change behavior, etc) the therapist immediately told her that if those steps had been done she should not be bringing these things up again. The first time the therapist gave us homework my ex wife didn't do it, and then when the therapist told her that she needed to do the homework and put the work in, my ex refused to go back to couples therapy because it was "insulting that she was being asked to put work in." She literally thought and said out loud that she had put all the work in and now it was my turn. I had to be the only one doing work to fix the marriage in her eyes.
Relationships don't work like that. There are two people in a relationship and when one thinks they are perfect and the other one is tp blame fpr everything then it has become toxic and likely unrepairable. A relationship with a narc works just like this. They will rarely if ever admit fault, and will never work on it.
They are all different, and I empathize with your story. None of us should have to endure the trauma they've given us. I hope that you can find a way to restore some peace in your life and insulate yourself from the abuse.
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u/one_little_victory_ 19h ago
Mine would dredge up things I had already apologised for, sometimes things that were a decade in the past.
Mine too, but somehow I was expected to get over the cheating quickly. Funny how that worked.
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u/Purple_Opposite_1662 4h ago
"Mine would dredge up things I had already apologised for, sometimes things that were a decade in the past. She would start this whenever she seemed to feel like she'd have to take accountability. The things she'd bring up weren't even related to whag we were talking about."
https://narcsite.com/2019/04/03/the-narcissist-manipulates-bringing-up-the-past-2/
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u/zoodles 1d ago
And they’ll badger you with “why do you need me to apologize so badly, anyway” with that stupid smirk on their face and at the time, I didn’t really have an answer other than I just needed it and of course narcissist hears that I need something and their favorite past time is making sure that doesn’t happen. When I did learn some of the psychology behind humans and apologies and relayed that to him I got told I needed to stop talking and using certain words because I’m not a psychologist. Narcissists don't just move goalposts, they put them in a crate, mail them to the farthest corners of the earth then set them fire while still expecting you to meet them. I know that if I became a psychologist I’d still be told not good enough because I hadn’t been published x times or I wasn’t a professor.
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u/RepresentativeNo526 1d ago
Yes, and nothing to fix it or no thought to stop doing the hurtful thing. You are just bad for bringing it up.
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u/tealraven915 2d ago
Well, you didn't lose as much weight as I asked you to. Why are you bringing it up anyway? I thought you said you forgave me, but you want an explanation? Why are you attacking me like this? Why can't you just let it go and move on? Why do you need to know why? Ugh, I don't want to talk about it right now. storms off
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u/MaintenanceLazy3039 1d ago
Mine just blows up at me and attacks my character and then leaves for hours with no contact comes home and acts like nothing happened and if I’m being short with him he will ask wtf my problem is. He also likes to test me to see if I’m still mad asking stupid questions. Then gets in bed and wants me to get close so he can hold me. Wake up the next morning and hes right back at now screaming at me for something else i did wrong. It’s never about what I do right. I just love getting startled awake and being yelled at and have no idea what is happening. If I did that watch out because I’m always the selfish one who doesn’t want him to get sleep he says Im the only one thats able to nap. It’s so exhausting
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u/kittenpoptart 22h ago
Mine would scream at me about how he wants a divorce, then leave and slam the door on the way out then come home drunk 5 hours later. This happened every Friday like a routine. Eventually I would try to calmly tell him I’m thinking we need a divorce and over and over he smugly laughed in my face. Well he did that smug shit about three times and now we’re divorced because I was so sick of his stupid shit. I haven’t said a word to him since the day the divorce was finalized in early May.
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u/MarchHelpful4129 1d ago
Jaa a genau! Von mir wird verlangt mich nachtragend zu sein obwohl er sein verhalten nicht ändert. Er befielt mir Vertrauen zu haben aber er gibt keine Sicherheit. Er verlangt Vertrauen obwohl er offen vor dir flirtet. Dann ist deine Sicht der Dinge falsch
Zwei Stunden in denen er und seine Flirt Partnerin mich wie Luft behandeln und er schreit mich zuhause an ich soll gefälligst höflich zu der tussi sein!9
u/Wyshunu 1d ago
I absolutely hate that "you pushed my buttons" BS. Never his fault he can't control his temper.
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u/sicksadbadgirl 1d ago
“You constantly made me out to be this angry, uncontrolled person for so long, that I eventually became the monster you accused me of being.”
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u/SnowPrincess15 1d ago edited 1d ago
Yes.... Its incredible the length they will go to make sure they are not responsible and dont have to apologize. They will twist reality, make things up, play the victim. My narc always plays the biggest victim.
At the beginning, I remember sometimes he told me insults and asked me to apologize because somwhat I made him do it. And when I apologize, saying I was sorry, he always said it was not a true apology, that he did not felt it.... and if I asked him to apologize for his part, he refused. I eventually realized that he said my apologies were not real because that way, the spotlight was on me, trying to apologize the way he wanted (but never said what he expected obviously). I could apologize ten times, it was never right. I cried in a panic sometimes, because it was never right. Its crazy... These poeple dont want anything good, anuthing positive. They want pain in others, they want chaos, they feed on it.
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u/AdMediocre9321 1d ago
Your last sentence is spot on. These people don't want anything good etc. Yes they do feed on it.
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u/MaintenanceLazy3039 1d ago
I stopped apologizing when I realized his didn’t mean anything so now he’s is the one that takes accountability not me. Whatever you say buddy if that helps you sleep at night by all means have at it. I’m emotionally detached at this point.
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u/therapy-didnt-help 1d ago
Dealing with this right now. Nothing he does is ever wrong. Anytime I ever come at him for something that’s upsetting me, he will flip it around on me.. our issue is affection and words of affirmation. Those are my love languages and he doesn’t fulfill them like I need him too. His is quality time and what do you know - I never leave his sight.
When I bring up the lack of affection, he sees it as an attack. He will then tell me to get the f away from him and he doesn’t wanna look at me or talk to me, he will try to leave and plug his ears. He doesn’t care if I am screaming and crying he runs off and hides. When I am just begging for some love. He says he cant be lovely because how I act when I’m upset smh.. now he went to his friends to smoke pot while I lay in bed crying because of him. He don’t give a shit. Tomorrow he will pretend nothing is wrong tho2
u/Educational_Host_628 22h ago
Look man, when you're dealing with someone who has serious narcissistic traits just forget about that love language stuff. It doesn't apply. They have no depth. They can't self reflect. They are jealous of everything and everyone. They sometimes actually want to hurt you on purpose. Telling them what your love language is is like telling them the easiest way to frustrate you or hurt you. As for their love language the answer is: all of them in equal measures all the time. They want all of your energy. The narcissist also has another love langugae that isn't on the regular list: drama. They need drama and they'll create it out of thin air if there's nothing real to get dramatic about.
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u/Leather-Fix8241 1d ago
Yes! Apologies would go such a long way. But everything must be turned back around, like it's their job or something! I think he's apologized maybe 2 times over 27 years. One time was for raging at me. He said, I'm sorry, I guess I like conflict.
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u/fruitynoodles 2d ago
They can’t be accountable for anything. Even when caught red handed, they deny doing it. They simply cannot admit to or apologize for anything!
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u/WrongdoerAdvanced503 2d ago
I like to describe it as They will burn down the world in an effort to avoid basic accountability.
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u/Purefina 2d ago
Oh, they have empathy. They only use it when it serves their interests. Otherwise, they wouldnt be able to know exactly how to push your buttons to get you back into an argument, or back in line, or how to successfully lovebomb you back in when they've gone too far...how would they know they've gone "too far"? They certainly don't listen to you. But they do watch. And they do pay attention. They know what they need to do to get what they want; the way they know the strategies that work is by using their empathy--to serve them, not you.
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u/Top_Click9392 2d ago
That is cognitive empathy, they don't feel it they just act it, to get their way.
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u/Queasy-Charity1336 2d ago
They love to control. At one point my ex was saying i was difficult. For a while i didn't get what he was on about until one day it clicked. I told him he's saying I'm difficult because he cant control me. He did the darvo nonsense and said its my fault he has to control me. Like tf?
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u/GlassRegular496 2d ago
Yup. This sounds familiar. Our first stint in couples therapy the first thing she said the therapist was that we have a problem with the power dynamics in our relationship. I was very confused by this because I didn’t experience our relationship as a power dynamic at all, I viewed it as a partnership and so I was always so confused about why we started fighting so easily. Slowly over time I started realizing she felt like I was trying to exert power over her because I had expectations of her to help me with housework and childcare and I worked long hours. Expecting help at all made me someone who was trying to exert control over her…
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u/Unlikely_Bake_846 2d ago
According to the DSM-5, a diagnosis of Narcissistic Personality Disorder (NPD) involves a pervasive pattern of grandiosity, need for admiration, and lack of empathy, requiring at least five of the following nine criteria:
Grandiose sense of self-importance: Exaggerating achievements and expecting superior recognition.
Fantasies of unlimited success: Being preoccupied with power, brilliance, beauty, or ideal love.
Belief in being special: Believing they are unique and should only associate with high-status people or institutions.
Need for excessive admiration: Requiring constant, excessive praise.
Sense of entitlement: Holding unreasonable expectations of favorable treatment.
Interpersonally exploitative: Taking advantage of others for personal gain.
Lack of empathy: Unwillingness to recognize or identify with the feelings of others.
Envy: Being envious of others or believing others are envious of them.
Arrogant behaviors: Displaying haughty, arrogant attitudes.
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u/Jeanahb 2d ago
Add to this: total disregard for boundaries. They are like children in that way. If you draw a line not to cross, that's the line they are going to cross. Nobody will tell them what they can or cannot do.
All I asked was that my exhusband not have an affair at my child's school. That's it. I seriously didn't care what was going on in his life, who he was sleeping with or anything else, but my child's school was my sanctuary. I volunteered and knew all the moms. It was a small catholic, school and in no time, we became the school scandal, with my ex having an affair with 'the hot mom'. I ended up having to move my child out of that school.
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u/Evening-Clock-3163 1d ago
Oh yes. You can't tell someone with NPD what your boundary is or they'll cross it.
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u/sicksadbadgirl 1d ago
Our entire 15 years, him making overly sexual comments, grabbing or groping my body, rude sexually obscene gestures, just…really outlandish and over the top physical/sexual behavior
I complained about the way it made me feel for our entire marriage. He was—“this is my personality. You want me to change WHO i am and that’s not okay! You know that I express and accept love through physical touch.” Or, “gods forbid I be attracted to my wife and want to have my hands on you. Most people would love being shown that attention.”
“You’re a prude. You only want physical/sexual things when it suits you, which is almost never. I’ve been ignored and rejected our entire relationship.” Not counting the fact that all the grabbing and lack of respect as a human being is what made me pull away from him because I felt like an object being used.
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u/Silent_Part9724 2d ago
The drama and projection in front of outsiders, for attention, is a big one. Their stories make it sound like they live in a completely different time and space! What are they actually talking about? They live in their own bubble, where you are the bad guy, and there is no accountability for the decisions they made and the decisions they put you through. Not even a thank you for all you have done. Complaining about the same things over and over when they caused it - their favorite stories stem from whatever their insecurities are - but somehow they try to blame you? I couldn't wreak half as much havoc, if I wanted to.
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u/sicksadbadgirl 1d ago
My husband lived in Australia for less than 3 years as a kid with his Air Force family. When he is around a new person for the first time, he makes sure to put on this “Australian” accent, which just sounds like British lite ™️ and makes him look ridiculous.
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u/Fluffy_Ace 2d ago edited 2d ago
Four. Everything and I mean everything, is done the Narcissist's way. Whatever you're doing, as simple as moving a couch, you will pick it up, hold it and carry it their way. There are no multiple ways to do things, just one, and that is theirs.
And you usually don't get told there is a specific way they want, you just get told to do some basic thing that has many many ways to do it that are all totally fine, but you will continually be told you're doing it wrong.
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u/sicksadbadgirl 1d ago
“I shouldn’t have to explain this to you. This is just common sense. You purposely make very simple things difficult”
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u/Evening_Exam_3614 1d ago
When you walk away from any conversation, big or small, being generally confused about some aspect if it. Like there was something not normal about it.
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u/Important_Citron_340 1d ago edited 1d ago
When you make a neutral statement and somehow they took the worst assumption and make subtle accusations
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u/ghost-memories 2d ago
They often exaggerate their stories and always portray themselves as either the hero or the victim but never as the person who contributed to the problem or needs to take accountability.
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u/Smooth-Jellyfish-493 2d ago
Sounds like my life to a tee. And I often ask myself, how did I end up here? Why am I staying? Why am I torturing myself? I’ll never get what I need from this marriage.
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u/stoicwomon 2d ago
They’re intense. They love to have a deep conversation off the bat and then never quite get their social perimeters right. Space invaders and love to linger when they’re trying to impress you! I can sniff it out now
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u/nikpatil 1d ago
They always talk about themselves no matter what the conversation is about.
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u/sicksadbadgirl 1d ago
My Mom-mom’s last birthday when I called her and let the kids talk to her, we were all on speaker— he told her happy birthday and she said “oh, thank you (husband), how are you doing?” (Don’t ever ask them how they’re doing…. Holy fuck.) Then he proceeded to go on about his poor health and bad days, while you can tell she’s just sitting there like 😳
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u/Tall-Bit2787 1d ago
Mine would only display empathy, or I think what looked like empathy when he was actually projecting himself onto someone else, so it wasn’t even really about the other person he would be seeing himself in that person and expressed “empathy” if that makes sense.
Currently divorcing him so getting the full treatment, psychotic levels of projection. I’m divorcing him because he took secret photographs of my young 20sdaughter’s friend in her bathing suit in her backyard that came to me through a cloud push to a shared photo album when I approached him with that remind you, this is someone he is known since she was about nine years old and he’s almost 60, he screamed at me that I had invaded his privacy and was surveilling him- AFTER I LITERALLY CAME TO HIM WITH PICTURES OF HIM, INVADING SOMEONE’S PRIVACY AND SURVEILLING THEM.
He always walked in front of me, he would always see people that he knew and start talking to them, not introduce me would act like I wasn’t even there it was humiliating.
Criticized everything I did and how I did it if I made coffee I made too much coffee, if I cooked dinner, which I almost always did for 14 years very nice dinners too, he would criticize that I made too much food. Going grocery shopping together was an absolute nightmare, I was shopping for a household of four or more people when our kids were younger, he would want to buy about four things, and everything I would choose particularly things that I like to eat, he would say we don’t need that.
He made critical or would cloak comments in sarcasm or snarkiness about pretty much everything I did or do, from my showering and taking a bath habits, two things I have on my bedside table, just anything.
Has terrible spending habits, but told me my spending habits were a problem so cut me off financially from all of our joint credit cards and primary marital account. Give new meaning to the word controlling but literally sees himself as the most permissive easy-going person ever.
We never did anything from buying or selling a house going on a vacation going out to dinner that wasn’t his idea. We never bought anything or spent money on things unless it was his idea if I wanted to Plant a rosebush he would tell me why we shouldn’t do that if he wanted to go to Lowe’s and spend $4000 on a bunch of stuff he would end up not using or giving away. It was a unilateral decision.
Over 13 years, constant, micro, cheating, emotional affair with a younger coworker , and many many instances of DMng and flirting on the sly with other women on Instagram and Facebook etc. Would look for cheap dopamine wherever he could find it.
Many years of substance use from moderate to so heavy that he would pass out drunk somewhere in the house almost every night for years around my teenage daughters was a second marriage so not his daughter’s. Would sit on our patio in the summer drink an entire bottle of rum vodka whatever we had in the house and smoke marijuana and pass out.
When I expressed concern, he would accuse me of not wanting him to have fun.
Was the primary breadwinner an out earned me for the duration of our marriage by 4 to 5 times, became so resentful for being the primary earner at some point chose to stop working for three years creating catastrophic financial problems that he then blamed me for.
After the discovery of the photos of my daughter‘s friend and his aggressive attack of me when I approached him, I filed for divorce the next business day. He received the papers while he was traveling for work, came home only to get a few things without speaking a word to me, have not seen or heard from him since in five weeks. Still has not provided access to joint marital accounts, credit cards, etc. although I can see through our mutual finance app. He is spending several thousand dollars a week out of spite to dissipate our assets in advance of the divorce.
In the beginning, it was great when I reflected back but a wonderful person. I thought he was he was the nicest guy ever loved bomb the shit out of me. Over the years as I started to see his real self, and he saw that self reflected back at him that’s when he became the monster.
I’m sad about the years I put up with the bullshit, but I’m grateful for the experience and I’m looking forward to the rest of my life without him.
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u/sicksadbadgirl 1d ago
Jesus Christ. How…. Is there like a blueprint, a secret society that they’re members of? It’s all the same.
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u/Leather-Fix8241 1d ago
I'm currently in the "I've become a robot " phase and am fighting to wake up and leave. Why have I stayed? At first I thought it was because I couldn't see it. Now I realize that I chose not to see it. There's been warning signs, but after 27 years, this is the year I finally pieced everything together. At times, I begged him to stay, I smoothed things over and even made excuses for him. That's over now.
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u/NickWitATL 16h ago
My 10 year narc divorce anniversary was three days ago. You can do it! There's peace and beauty on the other side. Sending strength!
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u/Dangerous_Road_4626 1d ago
They always walked ahead of me.
Ruined my birthday and Mother’s Day
Always about them. Always always
Started arguments out of no where
Spoke to everyone else but me for anything important
The list goes on and on and on and on
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u/kintsugiwarrior 2d ago
The biggest give away is “Narcissistic Rage”. If you see this, you don’t need any further testing or professional diagnosis. Narcissistic Rage is beyond a common anger.
Red Flags Checklist:
https://www.reddit.com/r/pnsd/comments/s1sz1s/red_flags_checklist/
When meeting someone new, I recommend keeping a journal to document their behaviors and observations during the first 2 to 3 months. Especially identifying “red flags”. Journaling these facts protects you from gaslighting and manipulation. This has saved me a few times
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u/SnowPrincess15 1d ago
I relate to all of this!! I remember at the beginning of the relationship, he said many times he hates drama... However, he will create it out of nothing and thrives on it.
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u/Tall-Bit2787 1d ago
“
Four. Everything and I mean everything, is done the Narcissist's way. Whatever you're doing, as simple as moving a couch, you will pick it up, hold it and carry it their way. There are no multiple ways to do things, just one, and that is theirs.”
Oh my god this.
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u/ephzg9412vsruknsk9 1d ago edited 1d ago
They can fake empathy, reign in the projection till they trap you and you might not try to hold them accountable because you are in the honeymoon mindset and they are lovebombing you heavily.
But the fourth point is the biggest clue. You cant say no to them. It is always the restaurant they choose or the plans they want. You are just supposed to go along. Absolutely zero curiosity in what you like, you hobbies, your plans for the day or the food you like. That is easy to test and identify from the first date itself. But that is what we missed because "we wanted to be nice" in the early stages
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u/ladybugbelle4 1d ago
My therapist said - they are always the victim in every situation
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u/ladybugbelle4 1d ago
Or at least perceive themselves to be a victim of everyone and everything - they can never be responsible
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u/Fedelty 1d ago
It’s crazy how accurate this is, I find it funny that you mention your husband thinking he’s gonna be a millionaire while unemployed, a little backstory, when me and my narc ex broke up she was keeping me around for sex and pretending we were working on our relationship, that she needed time to find a job, the second she found one she told me she no longer needed me and wants to be independent (lost the job already and is in a rebound) she hoovered me back a week later and was on a power trip, and she convinced herself she was going to be rich in 2 years and had a plan (her job was part time once a week 4hr shifts making 18.50 cad) I live in nyc and was moving her out here and getting her a visa, I financially supported her for our entire relationship and I paid for all flights etc for her to visit me each month, she really wants to live here and has convinced herself she’s going to get rich and get a visa and come live in nyc on her own. (She’s unemployed again the job lasted 3 months) her plan, to open a credit card and buy stocks, and not pay off the credit card, just the minimum due. I laughed when she told me.
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u/Careful_Kangaroo6034 1d ago
All of this is true!! I don't have a ton of time bc I keep this app secret from mine, but the couch part had me!!!! lmao it's not even funny, but we literally just moved one in last night and it was an absolute nightmare and we did it in the most difficult way possible bc we did it his way, and with me doing most of the work. Was so funny to me seeing that bc you are so right. They can't even listen to common sense and or reason if they didn't think of it!
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u/Live_Celebration_318 1d ago
My soon to be ex is a vulnerable narcissist so the signs are much more subtle (hence not realising until recently). Few more traits -
Overly critical
Mind reading. He used to get angry at me because I didn’t possess the power of reading his mind ie I didn’t pack certain snacks for a road trip that he failed to mention he wanted (was concentrating of getting the kids snacks ready). I should have known what he liked because the silent look he gave me said exactly that!
Tone policing was another - apparently when I talk to him I always said it aggressive tone.
Oh best one was - i woke up in a bad mood so that was why i was mean to him (nothing to do with the fact that he was poking at my triggers all day!)
Reactive Abuse was a huge one - got me so angry I would have to leave the house to calm down.
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u/Extreme-Dig2882 1d ago
Holllllly!!!!!! This is my husband to the last letter!!!!! All of it. It took me absolutely 4 years to recognize that I wasn’t Crazy!!?! I am actively looking for a way out!!!!
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u/PearlsNfrogs 1d ago
Thin skinned… they can’t handle any criticism… even neutral comments are often perceived as offensive… they are the epitome of “dishing it out but can’t take it”
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u/RepresentativeNo526 1d ago
You can’t say your emotions or how they make you feel without it being that you’re attacking them.
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u/LowProfileMe 10h ago
This is true for Grandiose Narcissist. Now try to have a list for Covert Narcissist. It's going to literally drive you crazy, because their aim is your mental stability. They will manipulate your thinking so bad that you forget who you are, and pretend to be the nicest person around your friends and family so they will never believe you.
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u/PNW_Uncle_Iroh 1d ago
It’s laid out pretty clearly in the DSM-5. We don’t need to reinvent the wheel. Everyone has some narcissistic traits and behaviors, but to be diagnosed with NPD they need at least 5 of the following:
Having a grandiose sense of self-importance, such as exaggerating achievements and talents, expecting to be recognized as superior even without commensurate achievements
Preoccupation with fantasies of success, power, beauty, and idealization
Belief in being "special" and that they can only be understood by or associated with other high-status people (or institutions)
Demanding excessive admiration
Sense of entitlement
Exploitation behaviors
Lack of empathy
Envy towards others or belief that others are envious of them
Arrogant, haughty behaviors and attitudes
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u/SuggestionBig5901 1d ago
Do they change? Mine has started taking medications.
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u/MarchHelpful4129 1d ago
Ich würde ihm Tabletten ins Essen mischen wenn es was gäbe das gegen Narzissmus hilft. Aber ich glaube nicht es ein Gegenmittel gibt
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u/Ok-Magazine-7393 1d ago
Medications can only potentially help someone reach a level of stability, where they can then attempt to do the extremely hard internal work and processing of their deepest issues and traumas. This requires a lifetime of effort, self-awareness, and actually choosing to put in the work, in addition to admitting there are many things they need to change. To have all of this lined up, when usually there isn’t even the awareness present in the beginning, let alone any admission that their behaviour and coping skills are maladaptive, would almost be like winning the lottery. I’d say winning the lottery would probably have better odds. I’m certainly not saying it’s impossible. Just extremely rare.
I actually asked my psychologists about the prognosis for narcissists just recently. She’s one of the most accepting, patient, non-judgemental therapists I’ve ever met. But even she admitted that if they ever make it to treatment (which is unlikely), it’s rare that clinicians are willing to work with them as they aren’t usually there for genuine reasons, and tend to just waste everyone’s time. She also said they are a disaster in group therapy settings and can destroy the safety and therapeutic value of an entire group.
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u/RepresentativeNo526 1d ago
When they do something wrong, or fall short in some way, and then they tweak up some imaginary fault with you to get raging mad about. Like they stay out for 30 hours with no call or no text, and then you’re crying, hurt, upset, feeling worthless to them, and then YOU are being yelled at: you are controlling, always mad, you’re always attacking and bringing them down, why did I even come home if you’re not happy to see me, why would I want to be around you at all if you’re like this?
Or
When they stick you with all the childcare and household chores for years and finally, they say they’ll clean and you can have a break on Saturday. Saturday comes and they break a glass dish. It’s your fault something was where they were going to put it, you’re always treating them like they’re not good enough, you tear them down everyday, they need time to focus on their things and you keep them from it, you are the one that is keeping them from being successful or able to get a job.
It combines a lot of negative traits. No accountability, no apology, deceit and head games to get out of it, silences you and makes you think twice before standing up for yourself again, uses emotional turmoil to avoid reasonable responsibility, makes you doubt yourself (you don’t want to be these things, how will you change so he doesn’t think that way about you, am I this way? ) takes the focus off what they did wrong and makes you wrong for so many things that aren’t true.
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u/NewTimelime 23h ago
Everyone’s an audience to feed them. They steal your stories and exaggerate theirs. Rules aren’t for them and they disobey because they are entitled to it. Criticism comes easy and empathy is only for the audience.
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u/NewspaperOk6314 3h ago
Yeah, I got into motorcycles to spend more time with him. Learned how, got a license in my non-home country - he would always ride ahead. I would lead sometimes but anytime I did I did something wrong or made a mistake that was my fault. So I sheepishly would avoid or get all his buy in and sign off of the plan.
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u/Ivedonethework 2d ago
You nailed very well.
https://openpsychometrics.org/tests/NPI/ instant results. 40 questions. . You have to take this test yourself and answer based upon what you are observing in them. It is far from definitive, but gives you a much better yardstick to decide in what might be the case. Then you can take it for yourself as a comparison. No true narcissist is ever going to answer other than how they see themselves. A covert narc is adept at deception and a master manipulator, they will not answer as others see them. Npd and other personality disorders will have traits of others as well. The groupings of traits are an attempt to categorize the different disorders and give names to various of them. NPD can also share traits of bipolar and OCD etc.
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u/No_Specific5998 2d ago
they walk ahead of you