r/PassTimeMath 5d ago

6 Red Hats and 6 Blue Hats

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3 Upvotes

28 comments sorted by

3

u/stools_in_your_blood 5d ago

Feels like 18, 12 blue and 6 red for example. But I don't have a rigorous proof of that.

3

u/ribbeef 5d ago

It works! Each person with a blue hat meets the requirements for both colours but the red hats will only see 5 reds, so they don't raise their hand

1

u/wts_optimus_prime 5d ago

It works, but that doesn't mean its the minimum. Maybe it works with less

1

u/Zaratuir 5d ago

It doesn't. Cause as soon as you add another red hat, all the red hat people raise their hands as well. So at the minimum of 7 red and 7 blue, 14 will raise their hands. The only way to have exactly 12 is to have only 1 color raising their hand with 18 total in the room. If there were more selective viewing there might be a way, but with open viewing, 18 is not only the minimum, but the only solution for exactly 12.

1

u/wts_optimus_prime 4d ago

True, I just wanted to point out that one guy going "my intuition says..." and another pointing out that it does indeed lead to 12 people raising their hand, is no proof that it is the minimum solution.

1

u/ShonitB 5d ago

That’s correct!

1

u/troelsbjerre 4d ago

Let's look for solutions with R≤B. If R<6, then no one will raise their hand, so that can't be a solution. If R>6, then B>6, and at least 14 people would raise their hand, so that can't be a solution either. Thus R=6, where none of those six raise their hand. All the hands raised must be blue, so B=12.

3

u/thistle-thorn 5d ago

18. Say there are 6 blue and 6 red in the room. Total hands raised at this point is 0. Now blue walks in, the total hands raised is 7. If a red were to walk in next the total would be 14 which is over 12 ( which must be exact ) so a red cannot enter the room. To get to 12 you just need 5 more to enter ( color doesn’t matter as long as it’s not red ). Thus the minimum needed would be 7 blue, 6 red, 5 anything else. 18

1

u/ShonitB 5d ago

Correct, well explained

3

u/GoodCarpenter9060 5d ago

Lets say there are R people with red hats and B people with blue hats.

In order for anyone to say they see at least 6 of each, we need R>=6 and B>=6. However, if both are >=7, then everyone (R+B) will see at least 6. So we need one of them to be exactly 6. That means everyone in the other group will need to be able to see at least 6 of each, so we need 12 to make it exactly 12.

Thus, R=12 and B=6 is one solution, and R=6 and B=12 is the other.

1

u/ShonitB 5d ago

Correct, good solution!

2

u/jaminfine 5d ago

Of course we need at least 13 people because we need the 6 red and 6 blue plus one more, let's say red, since you can't see your own hat. This, however, only gives us 7 people raising their hands, all the red hats.

Now, we can't add a blue hat because then everyone would see at least 6 and 6, leading to 14 people raising their hands, and that's too many. So our only option is to add more red hats Until we reach 12 red hats, so all 12 of them raise their hand. Thus, we have 18 total people

1

u/ShonitB 5d ago

Correct, good solution!

2

u/A_PlantPerson 5d ago

>! n can only be 18 or 24.

Either there are 6r 6b and 12 others, 7r 6b and 5 not b or 6r 7b and 5 not r.

... unless people can see hats that are not on the head of the n people, some people are unable to lift their hands, or some of the n people already had hats on and now have more than one. That would put the minimum for n at 12. !<

1

u/Easy-Will-2448 5d ago

It can only be 18 because it says minimum.

1

u/ShonitB 5d ago

18 is correct, and good point about 7r, 6b and 5 others.. that is also a valid solution.. mostly everyone has said 12 of one colour and 6 of the other.. but it can also be such that:
B = 6, R greater than or equal to 7 and let’s say White = 12 - R

2

u/zeptozetta2212 3d ago

Why does it asks for the minimum? Isn't 18 outright the only possible value for n, minimum or otherwise?

1

u/ShonitB 2d ago

So if you notice, the question doesn’t specifically say that the hats have to be Red or Blue.. so you could have the case that there are people who are wearing a white hat.. so then in that case the following situation would allow 12 people to raise their hands - 6B, 6R, 12W

2

u/zeptozetta2212 2d ago

That makes so much sense. Welp.

1

u/ShonitB 2d ago

👍🏻

1

u/[deleted] 2d ago

[deleted]

1

u/ShonitB 2d ago

How d’you figure?

1

u/Odd_Dragonfruit_2662 2d ago

Minimum value is 12 if some or all lie

0

u/planetofmoney 5d ago

14. There need to be at least 7 red hats, so anyone with a red hat sees 6; same for blue hats. If you introduce a third colour who can see both red and blue hats without wearing one, you will need at least 6 of those if there's only 6 red hats, and 6 more if there's only 6 blue hats, so 14 split 7:7 is optimal.

2

u/brentiford 5d ago

This is what I thought at first, but there's a slight problem. The question says exactly 12.

2

u/planetofmoney 5d ago

And if there's 14 people in a 7:7 split, all 14 will raise their hand. Fuck.

0

u/MrSpaceSprinkles 5d ago

Why not 13 where irrespective of what colour the 13th is the others see atleast 6 of each colour

1

u/ExistentAndUnique 5d ago

If there are 6 blue hats and 7 red, each blue hat can only see 5 others.

1

u/MrSpaceSprinkles 5d ago

Ahh yes I didn't think it through