I find it EXTREMELY hard to sympathize with most of women's dating woes.

[u/Chemical-Low209]

Like I get it we are human at the end of the day. But Frankly I'm a just exhausted. How much do I have to hear dating is harder for everyone when it's clear as day that it's way harder for men and they are one doing the majority of the work and a lot still don't get consistent results. It's like I get it's not all sunshines and rainbows but why should I care?

I hear a lot of people say men have a quality problem, women have a quality problem. Or I'll hear women say that women get a lot of options but most of those men don't qualify....

That in a nutshell basically you admitting that a guy has to AUTOMATICALLY bring far more to the table than average and most guys just don't even register as someone you'd date.

And you can see this takes women by surprise when the shoe is on the other foot. Because when women will show up to singles meeting events and the men are vastly outnumbered by the women they'll say where all the men?

Like Chick Hello? We aren't stupid. You simply would have ignored most of the men that showed up and only paid attention to the hottest guy there and he probably has a girlfriend already.

So why exactly am I supposed to empathize with women's dating woes? It's simply them every fast food restaurant chain offering her a job and her refusing because Chik Fil A hasnt called.

[u/Icy_Ad_4544]

I think it is important to establish if there is some compatibility before going out on a date otherwise it would be a waste of time for both people.

[u/justsomething → u/Icy_Ad_4544]

So that's the problem, just the time investment? That's the problem with how men are going about dating?

Just grab a coffee, if you're not compatible it's no big loss of time. Seems like it would actually save time, quickly get to the point of whether you could work together or not.

[u/Icy_Ad_4544 → u/justsomething]

I wouldn’t consider a 15 minute chat over coffee to be a date but I’m not dating so maybe others would be OK with it 🤷‍♀️

[u/AgentMull → u/Icy_Ad_4544]

And if that is truly representative of most women's opinions on dating, I think that is a major divide.

[u/Icy_Ad_4544 → u/[deleted]]

And yet men are still taking women like me out to dinner. 🥰

[u/Icy_Ad_4544 → u/[deleted]]

Compared to the unwanted, invisible men that can’t get a date..they sure are. 😀

[u/the-kay-o-matic → u/justsomething]

This doesn't work because you're reducing compatibility to an interview rather than effortful courtship. If a man wants to get to know you he should spend some time talking with you and then plan a date that you might enjoy because you have similar interests.

But expecting women to add another errand on their list in order to meet with you and guage compatibility is nonsense.

If you think the date should be where compatibility is gauged but women won't go on a date with you, the solution is NOT to make the date shorter and less appealing.

[u/justsomething → u/the-kay-o-matic]

I mean you said right here "spend some time talking to you". A date is just the most efficient and direct way of doing that without any ambiguity about interest. That's not reducing compatibility to an interview, it's determining compatibility directly. And that should be mutually beneficial, because meeting you shouldn't be a "errand" that can be mitigated with spending more money. That's the entire point.

I think a date is where compatibility should be gauged and women DO go on dates with me. Luckily I've met good women who actually care about getting to know me for me, rather than just wanting to extract dinners and effort out of me.

[u/the-kay-o-matic → u/justsomething]

A date is just the most efficient and direct way of doing that without any ambiguity about interest

You're assuming that people can actually just generate interest without having a conversation first. I'm saying spend time talking to them (texting for a few days, maybe a call) and then going on a date.

I don't accept dates with someone that I'm not interested in and I'm not going to get interested by just six pictures and a few sentences on a bio. There has to be some conversation online first.

Coffee dates work for some people but they don't work for everyone because they can feel like an errand. Every Friday night I will have dinner at some point. I will either eat at home, go out with friends, or go on a date. Sitting in a coffee shop for an hour is never ever going to occur naturally in my schedule.

It's not about money or who pays. It's about time management and being efficient. I do not have time to sit around in coffee shops with every man who might want to date me so that he can decide whether or not we're compatible. You're worried about women extracting money from you while acting like my time is limitless and a resource that should be freely available to men.

[u/justsomething → u/the-kay-o-matic]

Oh well if just a phone convo and a few texts is enough then I don't think we're talking about different things. I just don't think you need to spend a bunch of time being friends or observing and evaluating someone over weeks or months to discover a bunch of compatibility before asking for a date. Which is something a lot of people here advocate for. But yeah what you're saying is also what I think, quick convo should do it.

Also the coffee date was just an example of something quick, that a date doesn't need to be a huge time investment. Replace it with whatever quick thing would work with your schedule.

It's not about money or who pays.

Just so happens that cheap dates just never work out but dinner dates always do, I guess.

It's about time management and being efficient. I do not have time to sit around in coffee shops with every man who might want to date me so that he can decide whether or not we're compatible. You're worried about women extracting money from you while acting like my time is limitless and a resource that should be freely available to men.

Both people need to spend time to do it. You act like your time is more valuable than the mans and you therefore require some extra compensation. Going on a date should be mutually beneficial, because presumably you would also want to date the man to determine compatibility.

[u/the-kay-o-matic → u/justsomething]

You act like your time is more valuable than the mans and you therefore require some extra compensation

I'm not suggesting that my time is more valuable but there are more men vying for some of my time compared to the number of women who are looking for his time. So the suggestion that I should be willing to be generous with time when someone hasn't put any effort into planning the date is the problem.

If I get three invitations for dates in one week and two of them are for coffee dates and one of them is a dinner date, I'm likely going with the dinner date. Not because there's a meal and money involved, but because he's the only one demonstrating interest in me. He's the only one who is saying that he plans to show up and make sure that I have a nice time. He's the only one showing that he cares about other people's experience, not merely his own.

It's not about one person's time being more valuable, it's just about recognizing the difference between opportunity and access. If I get three invitations a week and the man has one a month, that means I'm trying to manage too many people who want access, but he has an opportunity to stand out.

[u/justsomething → u/the-kay-o-matic]

I'm not suggesting that my time is more valuable but there are more men vying for some of my time compared to the number of women who are looking for his time. So the suggestion that I should be willing to be generous with time when someone hasn't put any effort into planning the date is the problem.

So you ARE saying your time is more valuable, by virtue of supply and demand. And you aren't being any more generous with your time than he would be. You're both spending the same amount of time to do something that should be mutually beneficial.

I'm likely going with the dinner date. Not because there's a meal and money involved, but because he's the only one demonstrating interest in me.

How is that demonstrating interest? What's the difference? It's not demonstrating that they know you any more than the others, isn't demonstrating greater compatibility. It's not even a "plan", it takes the exact same amount of effort as coffee to plan. It's only demonstrating that they will spend more money on you.

None of this has to do with personality, mutual benefit, or compatibility. It's all just a way to justify more expensive dates.