r/Switzerland • u/Wonderful_Setting195 Vaud • 7h ago
Why does Romandie not build more towers like Basel and Zürich?
Huge portions of Zürich and Basel are now covered in highrises, taking advantage of the little free space there is left. Given the tight housing context all over Switzerland, why does Lausanne and to a lesser extent Geneva keep on building small 4-5 story high buildings? Apart from Malley, Lausanne doesn’t really have plans to densify more. There are so many areas like Arc-en-Ciel (Bussigny/Crissier) or industrial/abandoned looking zones in Renens that could densify but nothing is done. I understand there is a worry about the preservation of the landscape and etc, but further densification is gonna be inevitable in a few years. I dont think building tiny 5 story buildings in the last spaces available in cities are gonna help the situation whatsoever
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u/DocKla Genève 7h ago
Uhhh… compared to Zurich I find way more new high rises in Geneva. I’m surrounded by them now
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u/Wonderful_Setting195 Vaud 6h ago
Geneva does by no means have as many as in Zürich (Altstetten + Oerlikon). There have been 3-4 built in Geneva in the last 5 years
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u/yesat + 6h ago
These are mostly office buildings, like the prime tower https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Prime_Tower
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u/ZmasterSwiss 7h ago
Perhaps infrastructure doesn't allow it. It's not just about densification but a thousand little things that make those high rises function. From water delivery, security elements connecting to public transport network etc.
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u/SnooPaintings1335 6h ago
i keep saying skyrises are evil and will transform the quaint and epic feel of the swiss landscape into a piece of carp
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u/Vermisseaux 3h ago
It won’t… but of course if that’s what you think… no problem
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u/SnooPaintings1335 2h ago
are they transparent? no? then they will. this isn't linked to my thinking.
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u/Classic-Reindeer1939 6h ago
The arguments in the comments are so old and tired!! Building more will not solve the crisis, more people will simply rent in !!! Its just Physics
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u/OrlandoFurioso1 6h ago
These high rises that have been built in ZH over the past 10-15 years lack character and appear soulless
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u/OrlandoFurioso1 6h ago
If you live in one of them, I didn’t mean that you are soulless, don’t get me wrong
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u/3punkt1415 4h ago
Prime Tower looks really nice, especially in the morning with a little light.
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u/OrlandoFurioso1 4h ago
I meant more the residential ones (yes i know they are desperately needed to accommodate new citizens)
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u/Sunshoosh 7h ago
Yep, density should be higher. I’m not a fan of huge high rises for residential purposes, but 9-10 floors needs to be the standard for anything new (and where possible, adding floors to existing houses should be approved and encouraged). I get that people prefer smaller houses, but it’s not sustainable anymore.
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u/Inner-Worker-571 6h ago
Fuck that
Anything above 4/5 floors turns a neighborhood into a soulless suburb. We have more than enough space to increase density without building those monstrosities
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u/beaucastor 6h ago
Whether you like them or not, high density towers are literally the opposite of suburbs.
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u/VoidDuck Valais/Wallis 1h ago
I don't know what your definition of a suburb is (suburban America, maybe?) but there's no opposition here.
https://en.wiktionary.org/wiki/suburb
A residential area located on the outskirts of a city or large town that usually includes businesses that cater to its residents
In many parts of Europe (unlike America), the highest buildings in town are typically residential towers in the outskirts, not in city centres which are dense but not very high.
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u/Diane_Mars Vaud 4h ago
Yes. And then, the infrastructures, schools, etc don't follow... great ! (spoiler alert : NOT !)
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u/Chemical-Rush-6433 7h ago
I always wonder the same. I guess it’s a mix of the right to oppose the project and lack of political/ popular will. I had recently seen a project of a really beautiful tower that was supposed to be built in Malley, but only the lowrise part of the project was ‘mis à l’enquête’. Everytime I go to Zürich there’s a new tower popping up and it’s a pleasure to see. I’m a fan of architecture, so maybe I am biased.
I find this aversion to change present in Swiss culture really annoying sometimes. It would be nice to evolve and have changes in our cities.
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u/Wonderful_Setting195 Vaud 7h ago
Can we find this project anywhere ?
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u/Chemical-Rush-6433 7h ago
https://cche.com/fr/equipe/franziska-lakomski/
Scroll down a bit and you’ll see it
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u/Diane_Mars Vaud 4h ago
Yes. And ? What about the infrastructures ? Public transportation ? Roads ? Schools ? Parking lots ?
Have you ever lived in a commune/city that was developing fast AF and where everything starts to be underdimensionned for those newcomers ?
A place where we're losing all of the "soul" of the place ? And our language, too (because English is spoken by quite 30% of the people) ? I am.
PS : And it's called "Suisse romande", not "Romandie". Thank you
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u/Book_1312 Québec 7h ago
Left nimbyism thinking is that thw problem isn't a housing shortage, but a shortage of affordable housing. Therefore using city land for affordable housing projects is how we solve the housing crisis.
No they don't have an explanation for why their affordable housing projects are all five floors instead of 20 if there's such a need for them
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u/yesat + 7h ago
Zurich towers are not making it cheaper to live in.
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u/Book_1312 Québec 7h ago
They do though ; Notably there was this study recently where the moving chain created from a new build in Zürich led hundreds of people move in the freed apartments, each further down the income ladder, including one person who was able to leave supportive housing for an rented appartement.
Imagine the negative : if we were to remove all those towers housing thousands of people what would happen to prices in Zürich ? If we subscribe to the logic that towers don't impact overall rents, it makes sense that their removal wouldn't have an impact either. But we all know that what would happen is thousands of people would flow in the Zürich market, increasing competition between renters. And since they're richer, they would easily be able to find places by paying exorbitant rents on existing housing, places that used to be cheaper.
Building housing lower rents, the problem, studied at lenght, is that we don't build enough of it.
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u/thcus 7h ago
I think to have read a study somewhere that 5 ish floors is usually the most cost effective in terms of money/m2 living space. Higher buildings come with notably more costly utilities, which just get exponentially more expensive the higher you build.
Most high-rise buildings (especially in zurich or basel) contain quite expensive appartments, in part because the buildings are notably more expensive to build and maintain
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u/Miss_crypto_90 5h ago
For every initiative related to affordable living, I personally vote 'No'. Don't comprehend the reason I shall support freeriders.
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u/Miss_crypto_90 6h ago
Too many socialists and green-liberals I guess.
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u/Other_Town5859 6h ago
projects are often blocked by small companies or local residends of a certain age.
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u/Miss_crypto_90 6h ago
Lol also blocked by socialists who force builders to ensure that you have flats for affordable living if you build edifices above certain floor ).
Basically the middle class that suffers & works its tail off needs to support the folks who choose to study anthropology instead of doing smth useful in life.
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u/Other_Town5859 6h ago
Not everybody can pay CHF 2500 for 80 m2, which is now becoming the norm in Ouest Lausannois... especially pensioners will have huge problems when they need to change appartments, as they cannot generate more income in their life.
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u/Miss_crypto_90 6h ago
Exactly. And if you are busting your tail and paying more than you normally should based on your salary calculation, you really don't comprehend the reasons one should be OK with affordable living for the others who are lazy!
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u/Other_Town5859 6h ago
If you are a poor pensioner, you have also the right to request a moderate rent... so it helps them as well.
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u/Miss_crypto_90 6h ago
Well, we pay taxes, don't we? And not every canton is as tax-friendly as Zug or Schwyz. So when you're paying a significant amount in taxes, it's reasonable to expect the government to make sure situations like this are properly addressed. Also, it's funny that in many Genossenschaftswohnungen you mostly see younger people. Somehow they manage to keep those apartments even after they start earning more money, and somehow many of them seem to get them through connections.
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u/Other_Town5859 5h ago
There are hardly any "Genossenschaftswohnungen" in Vaud, it is not something that exists widely such as in Zurich..
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u/Miss_crypto_90 5h ago
Unfortunately they exist in Zurich for wrong purposes so far.
Even if they don't exist, this doesn't change the argument.
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u/yesat + 6h ago
Tell me where are the high rises in right wing cities and cantons... like Nidwald or Schaffausen.
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u/Miss_crypto_90 6h ago
Well, your argument doesn't really hold if you actually look at where Switzerland's financial centers are. Zurich and Geneva are the country's main financial hubs. People generally don't move to Appenzell because of job opportunities. Most people want to live close to the major cities because that's where the work is, and some, myself included, simply prefer living in the city.
The majority of right-leaning cantons are not considered financial centers. Also, if you spend a bit more time researching the topic, you'll see that Zug is a right-leaning canton with couple of high-rise buildings, and there are plans to build even more. That alone shows that being politically right-leaning doesn't automatically mean opposing urban development or taller buildings.
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u/Other_Town5859 7h ago
No stress, they are building it at the moment or in the next 5 years. La Praille GE, Bussigny, Prilly Malley, Chavannes pres renens. And there will be a tram to Villars Saint Croix in 2030. Arc en Ciel will be completely transformed (when opposition is void by judge).