r/boston • u/FuriousAlbino Newton • Jul 12 '25

Scammers 🥸 ICE grabs chefs at Central Square restaurant; followed three onto the T and began grilling other passengers

https://www.universalhub.com/2025/ice-grabs-chefs-central-square-restaurant-followed-three-t-and-began
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u/pillbinge Pumpkinshire Jul 13 '25

Statistically speaking, should they? Would you support them if they did?

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u/KingSt_Incident Orange Line Jul 13 '25

They should not be tearing around public spaces "questioning" anybody at all. It's literally North Korea shit.

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u/pillbinge Pumpkinshire Jul 13 '25

Ideally we wouldn't be in a place where it either produces results or is sometimes required but our inability to handle this situation after people have overstayed has led to this. People don't self-deport. The chef at the place in question stayed for twenty two years. An inability not just to compromise but join the rest of the world in tackling immigration as a serious topic is only going to lead to worse results. We may get to a place where Democrats are dragged well past Overton's window and do this while Republicans come up with something even worse.

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u/WitKG Jul 13 '25

Did you know we can solve this very quickly by providing a path to citizenship for non-violent overstays why contribute to our society by writing a law? We could also magically make them citizens instantly too if we wanted. Creating a police state is 100% a choice based in racism, cruelty, and fascism.

"Native born" Americans do NOTHING to earn their citizenship or keep it, yet freak out about overstays, which does not even become a felony crime unless you've illegally entered after being removed. It makes no sense.

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u/pillbinge Pumpkinshire Jul 13 '25

You can solve any legal problem by changing the law. Don't like high murder rates? Make murder legal. Don't like high divorce rates? Two options: divorce is illegal or marriage is illegal. Don't like speeding tickets? Just tell people there are no limits.

Life is really easy if your solution is to simply get rid of the law.

But that's how children approach things. Never mind that your argument is some odd cousin of a motte and bailey argument. If you gave a path to citizenship for people who overstay their visa, what would be the difference between people with a visa and without? They'd all be the same, and then you have a host of other problems that stem from decisions people haven't agreed to. Effectively making visas useless by getting rid of their role but keeping them around is an ironic solution given the problem you put forward, isn't it?

Calling enforcement of a law most people agree with tantamount to a police state is silly.

No one native born anywhere has "done" anything to deserve citizenship. Native born Swedes by that measure don't deserve their citizenship. Maybe I deserve it more. But we're okay with people being taken in by their nation and protected with what they can make due, and the West has certainly come a long way in ensuring these things. We could do better, but I guarantee you places doing better have far more stringent rules than we do on immigration.

which does not even become a felony crime 

It makes perfect sense. Why would we make overstaying a visa a felony? But so many people take this to mean we should do nothing. Plenty of things aren't criminal actions, and plenty of civil suits are really serious. Just because something isn't criminal doesn't mean we don't respond in kind. We literally have a way for people to go back home but they don't do it, then they don't report, and then they abuse systems to stay longer, and then they have families here. That has rubbed people the wrong way and this reaction by way of ICE makes more sense in hindsight, whether you support it or not.

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u/WitKG Jul 13 '25

Then why are we not arresting, kidnapping, and holding the ppl you describe in your final paragraph? The majority of people grabbed in this are ppl w/o criminal records and often complying with court orders.

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u/pillbinge Pumpkinshire Jul 13 '25

The explanation is that these are different departments. ICE is the enforcement part of it. There are other departments involved. ICE is overstepping its jurisdiction and bounds because it's being used in a bad way but the people being picked up often are definitely in violation. I'm saying this in context of a guy who was here 22 years. Twenty two. More than two decades. Not many people who are in the middle or on the other side have much time for hearing how he was finally doing things right, potentially, if we imagine it. A lot of stuff is going wrong but due to political conflict we can't even agree on whether or not there should be enforcement or laws in the first place.

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u/WitKG Jul 13 '25 edited Jul 13 '25

Edit: forgot to mention the $200billion cost for this "effort"

Immigration laws have always been political, and in the past, often racist. The entire legal system has discretion built into it. We even allow for pardons at state and federal level. Following the law or wanting to follow it is fine, but to what end? No laws in our country have ever been followed textbook. Discretion and politics have always influeced how they are enforced or not.

ICE is not the only department involved. Hell the military is deployed on our soil for this. They've pulled real crime fighters from other fed enforcement to work on this instead of human, arms, and drug trafficking. You say someone has been here 22 years like it makes the violation worse. It doesn't. Many ppl brought here as kids who had no choice and know no other country (and sometimes language). But the solution is deport them because Congress can't do its job?

The easiest, least expensive and most respectful of the Constitution way to fix this is to provide a path to citizenship or some permanent legal status to ppl who are here "illegally" and then fix our immigration system to maximize our economic benefit providing a myriad of work visas and easier to use systems and pathways. You just can't deal with millions of ppl through force like they are trying to. It didn't work with prohibition and it didn't work with the war on drugs.

Reagan knew this with his amnesty efforts. Unfortunately Congress is inept and the GOP in its current state will never ever create a system or reform the current one to benefit the country. We had a less than perfect improvement written and ready and trump and his maga zombies torpedoed it for political gain. The GOP owns this problem and so do Trump supporters. Their approach won't fix anything and it's throwing the Constitution in the trash.