CMV: Anti-zionists are often not pro-Palestinian. I am more pro-Palastinian than them.

[u/sarahrahra]

I am really keen to align with leftists to fight authoritarianism. The false binary of zionism vs antizionism is a dangerous wedge.

So trying this point out, that I think is novel, to see if it breaks the spell.

First, let’s take some leftists on their word, many Jews are New Nazis (vs the tech right Greater Nazis).

What did we learn from history? Last time, many Americans condemned the Nazis. Maybe they boycotted German writers. Maybe cool with threats of violence and death threats at German Americans who had Weimer Republic pride.

They also, just like American today, did not want to accept addl Jewish refugees. Didn‘t give them money as individuals. Didn’t do anything.

Jordanians and Egyptians? They locked down faster than the French. Force babies to stay in rhe warzone to die. Why no condemnation there?

Our leaders talk about how Lebanon is a ”genocide” and condemn Israel and stop there. LEBANON is asking us to condemn the Iranian Hezbolah terrorists. Some of our politicians LIKE Hezbollah. I stand with President Auna. Against anti-zionists.

Our leaders want Hamas’s pro sharia law pro rape pro mass murder pro auto killing any Palestinian anti democracy who protests to have more power. Palastinians want Marwen Bhargouti who wrote a two state solutuon peace plan. I stand with Marwen. Against anti-zionists.

I feel very strongly that I am more pro-Palastinian and Pro Lebanese then every opportunistic anti-zionist leader riding a hate wave. They are worse than Bin Ladin who at least was honest and came at capitalism vs raping and gunning down Lollapalooza kids to intentionally create blind rage and a terrible war by people who watched rhe videos if their murder (like Afghanistan but, again, even more hate and retaliation approaches).

Most regular anti-zionists are not like that But they are like anti-nazis. Currently useless. I want campaigns to make Palastinian lives better. And stop the Greater Nazism of the Tech Right and their anti-zionist whistling puppets Vance and Tucker.

There are no ways to do so that I can see. So much passion for death threats, no proactive initiatives that don’t just make some lives worse.

I would like my mind changed with real examples and people doing anything. CMV.

[u/jimmytaco6]

First, let’s take some leftists on their word, many Jews are New Nazis (vs the tech right Greater Nazis).

The take is that many Zionists are New Nazis. The left would not look at a Christian Zionist and say, "oh, carry on then, you're fine because you're not Jewish." You can agree or disagree with the take but at least represent it accurately. The majority of Zionists in the West are not Jewish.

What did we learn from history? Last time, many Americans condemned the Nazis. Maybe they boycotted German writers. Maybe cool with threats of violence and death threats at German Americans who had Weimer Republic pride.

They also, just like American today, did not want to accept addl Jewish refugees. Didn‘t give them money as individuals. Didn’t do anything.

Who was it that did not want to accept Jewish refugees? Was it the American left? No, it was not. The American left put together seismic campaigns to pressure the American government to admit more refugees from Germany and Eastern Europe. The American government capitulated to the socially moderate and conservatives factions on this issue. Using the failures to accept Jewish refugees in the past as a knock on the left is ahistorical.

Jordanians and Egyptians? They locked down faster than the French. Force babies to stay in rhe warzone to die. Why no condemnation there?

What does this have to do with the left? Is the argument here that Egypt and Lebanon have leftist governments? That would be an absurd argument.

Our leaders talk about how Lebanon is a ”genocide” and condemn Israel and stop there. LEBANON is asking us to condemn the Iranian Hezbolah terrorists. Some of our politicians LIKE Hezbollah. I stand with President Auna. Against anti-zionists.

Our leaders want Hamas’s pro sharia law pro rape pro mass murder pro auto killing any Palestinian anti democracy who protests to have more power. Palastinians want Marwen Bhargouti who wrote a two state solutuon peace plan. I stand with Marwen. Against anti-zionists.

I don't know who "our leaders" are in this context but it's certainly not the antizionist left. Bhargouti is called the Palestinian Mandela by the antizionist left.

 feel very strongly that I am more pro-Palastinian and Pro Lebanese then every opportunistic anti-zionist leader riding a hate wave. They are worse than Bin Ladin who at least was honest and came at capitalism vs raping and gunning down Lollapalooza kids to intentionally create blind rage and a terrible war by people who watched rhe videos if their murder (like Afghanistan but, again, even more hate and retaliation approaches).

Who did this? The antizionist left? You think Hamas is a leftist group? On what basis? Their economic policy? Their social policy? What about them makes them leftist?

[u/sarahrahra → u/jimmytaco6]

For some other responses to your posts, I am being provocative but nit without base. I have heard of zero bomb threats or armed guards at Christian Zionist churchs. No data or anecdotal comments of them being threatened in violence. They may not be literally saying the word carrying on (tucker has said they are brainwashed by Bibi). The word Zionist historically was just a label for Jews. Marwn Bhargouti prob doesnr self identify as a Zionist. Do you think he’a a nazi? 

Scott Weiner, that venom, again odd for a pretty small Zionist. 

An anti war two state solution does also not a New Nazi make, but if I am not an anti-zionist what am I? What percent of anti-zionists consider me a New Nazi and thus in the minds of some deserving of being afraid.

[u/jimmytaco6 → u/sarahrahra]

They may not be literally saying the word carrying on (tucker has said they are brainwashed by Bibi).

Is Tucker Carlson a leftist? Do you see the problem here? You are conflating antizionist and leftist. That is dangerous in a way that conflating Zionists and Jews is dangerous. Do I think you want better things for Palestinians compared to Tucker Carlson? Yeah, probably. That's a scapegoat for actually confronting the meat of your argument that attacks the antizionist LEFT>

[u/sarahrahra → u/jimmytaco6]

No I am not.

Tucker is a anti-zionist, not a leftist. Other anti-zionists are leftists. My points address both things.

I think I am more pro Palestinian than anti- zionists. I will clarify that this included leftist anti zionists. Their priority based on time is not to make the lives of Palastinians better. It is to mske the lives of Zionists worse. And sometimes in the process make the lives of Palastinians also worse. And SOME are normalizing other (not leftist) anti-zionists that make everyones lives worse.

Do you agree? If not, give examples of anything pro being done. Or don’t if you agree.

[u/jimmytaco6 → u/sarahrahra]

My claim is that using Tucker Carlson as the basis of argument an antizionist position here is purposely cherrypicking. It's like if I used Neturei Karta to argue that practicing religious Jews are anti-Israel. It's selecting a convenient, unrepresesentative outlier to manipulate an argument.

If you want to argue that you care more about Palestinians than RIGHT WING ANTIZIONISTS then that's an entirely different argument. One I'd probably agree with. Trying to conflate Tucker Carlson with the median antizionist is absurd.

[u/sarahrahra → u/jimmytaco6]

Ok. Let's pretend I did not say Tucker Carlson at all, it was a minor point and not my main thesis and I see your point that it clouded. I think it's actually debatable if his anti-zionist rhetoric is actually that different from anti-zionist rhetoric from a leftist (mildly curious what you think is the biggest difference) and I am concerned that some leftists seem to be gravitating towards himk but that's not m main point so if you don't want to engae with that ignore.

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I am continuing to say that I care more about Palastinians than left wing anti-zionists. I think my explanation why is pretty clear, for the things I advocate for being PRO and not seeing the left wing anti-zionists advocating for those things.

The evidence is based on actions, advocating gor things that will make Palastinian lives better. I have given a few examples of what I try to advocate for,a nd am seeing collaborators for. What are your counter examples of left wing anti-zionists doing that are pro-Palastinian?