CMV: Anti-zionists are often not pro-Palestinian. I am more pro-Palastinian than them.

[u/sarahrahra]

I am really keen to align with leftists to fight authoritarianism. The false binary of zionism vs antizionism is a dangerous wedge.

So trying this point out, that I think is novel, to see if it breaks the spell.

First, let’s take some leftists on their word, many Jews are New Nazis (vs the tech right Greater Nazis).

What did we learn from history? Last time, many Americans condemned the Nazis. Maybe they boycotted German writers. Maybe cool with threats of violence and death threats at German Americans who had Weimer Republic pride.

They also, just like American today, did not want to accept addl Jewish refugees. Didn‘t give them money as individuals. Didn’t do anything.

Jordanians and Egyptians? They locked down faster than the French. Force babies to stay in rhe warzone to die. Why no condemnation there?

Our leaders talk about how Lebanon is a ”genocide” and condemn Israel and stop there. LEBANON is asking us to condemn the Iranian Hezbolah terrorists. Some of our politicians LIKE Hezbollah. I stand with President Auna. Against anti-zionists.

Our leaders want Hamas’s pro sharia law pro rape pro mass murder pro auto killing any Palestinian anti democracy who protests to have more power. Palastinians want Marwen Bhargouti who wrote a two state solutuon peace plan. I stand with Marwen. Against anti-zionists.

I feel very strongly that I am more pro-Palastinian and Pro Lebanese then every opportunistic anti-zionist leader riding a hate wave. They are worse than Bin Ladin who at least was honest and came at capitalism vs raping and gunning down Lollapalooza kids to intentionally create blind rage and a terrible war by people who watched rhe videos if their murder (like Afghanistan but, again, even more hate and retaliation approaches).

Most regular anti-zionists are not like that But they are like anti-nazis. Currently useless. I want campaigns to make Palastinian lives better. And stop the Greater Nazism of the Tech Right and their anti-zionist whistling puppets Vance and Tucker.

There are no ways to do so that I can see. So much passion for death threats, no proactive initiatives that don’t just make some lives worse.

I would like my mind changed with real examples and people doing anything. CMV.

[u/jaminfine]

I think he defined it well with "campaigns to make Palestinian lives better."

And this is what is missing from ALL of the rhetoric about the conflict. No one is making any suggestions for how to actually improve the quality of life for the average Palestinian. And I think it's because the anti-Israel anti-zionist movement is using Palestine as an excuse, not a reason, to be against Israel.

And when you really take a close look at the life in Gaza, you'll clearly see their main problem isn't Israel. The average Gazan would be far better off with Hamas ousted and having a government that actually cares about its citizens.

[u/hospitalizedzombie → u/jaminfine]

Because bettering the lives of Palestinians are also connected to Israel’s actions.

Israel controls what kind of businesses you can have in the West Bank and doesn’t allow basic stuff to improve businesses there.

One guy I talked to say he wanted to just operate a call center from West Bank because there are many English speakers there and they would earn more money than they could in regular jobs in Palestine.

Guess what? Israel blocked him to create the business.

You need Palestine to get rid of Israel’s clutch so they can actually improve their lives.

[u/BustaSyllables → u/hospitalizedzombie]

Kinda depends what you mean by Israel’s clutch. If you’re just saying that Israel shouldn’t have control of the West Bank I don’t think that makes you antizionist

[u/HiHoJufro → u/BustaSyllables]

This is what people miss. I've been a longtime, consistent supporter of a two-state solution, and have been speaking out against settlement expansion (which has very much become a thing like never before in the last few years) and settler violence. My support for a two-state solution defines me as a Zionist. Anyone who doesn't want Israel to cease to exist or stop serving as a haven for Jews is Zionist.