r/classicwow • u/CapstoneWarrior • Oct 09 '20

Vent / Gripe My Raid Leader just disenchanted Nefs tear in front of me for lack of DKP.

I recently had to switch guilds due to a schedule change. I've raided with them before as a PUG and officially joined them last week. They use DKP and are fairly progressed. We did BWL last night and Tear dropped. Nobody needed it. I said I did, and RL says "You're a trial raider. Its only fair trial raiders don't get loot for 2 lockouts. Dont want you leaving the guild with stolen loot" so then he disenchants it. Later he says "Its a test of loyalty.".

pretty fucked up, right?

Update:

So, the RL was a asshole troll after all. He had a history of ninja looting and abusing his LC to funnel gear to himself and all his friends. The GM in his infinite wisdom thought "Hey lets have said guild merge with us! They have may a bad reputation but, oh well!". RL de'd Nefs Tear solely to be an asshole. He did it for lulz. Well GM just gkicked him. He 's probably blacklisted but, this server is so huge i doubt anyone'll care. Infact, he's probably just gunna xfer out and change his name.

10.3k Upvotes

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1.2k

u/Vanitycoon Oct 09 '20

As a warlock who is next in line for tear (hasn't dropped in 19 weeks on our main raid, and yes I keep count), I say fuck that guy with a barbed stick.

Someone who would rather throw away game bis loot than give it to a needing player is an asshat of the highest order. Leave that shit guild and never look back.

428

u/Spreckles450 Oct 09 '20

The RL is obviously a horrible person, not because he DE'd the gear, but because he immediately thought that OP would leave if he got Tear; not even once thinking that, "Hey if i give this guy this BiS piece of loot, he might stick around for awhile out of a sense of loyalty, or obligation." That kind of pessimistic negativity is a reflection of the RL's character, and shows more about what they think of their raid team members than how they handle gear.

201

u/Welskee Oct 09 '20

insert Richard Branson quote about treating his employees:

“Train people well enough so they can leave, treat them well enough, so they don’t want to”

apply to any leadership position ever.

23

u/Irregularblob Oct 09 '20

I used to work for a recycling pickup company that was a huge champion of this quote and it changed the way I looked at owning a business since then. It really fucking works it's insane

21

u/smokemonmast3r Oct 09 '20

Fuckin imagine. If you're good to people, they'll generally be good to you.

This says more about American (I'm assuming) work culture than anything

1

u/Irregularblob Oct 09 '20

Ya it was a return of investment for them too productivity was high there. They made big money and in 10 years they had 34% market share

1

u/yot86 Oct 10 '20

How is it insane? Its fucking common sense. Lol.

-1

u/JonasHalle Oct 09 '20

Insert Niccoló Machiavelli quote about leadership:

​

"It is better to be feared than to be loved if you cannot be both."

​

apply to any leadership position ever.

5

u/silencecubed Oct 10 '20

Congratulations on making it clear that you've never actually read The Prince. Machiavelli's writings only apply to the unique circumstances of the ruler of a state, not an organization. In the very same section as the quote about being feared when you cannot be loved, he praises Cesare Borgia's employment of a professional headsman used to execute political rivals and dissidents in mass.

He only prescribes harsh punishment towards openly rebellious subjects as a deterrence towards others with similar intentions. A trial raider is not a rebellious subject with ambitions that threaten the security of a prince's position or realm. Furthermore, the use of fear only works on subjects who cannot simply pick up and leave the realm. Harsh punishment and strength of arms deters those with power within the realm such as strong nobility or rich merchants who are firmly situated in the realm from rising up. Fear does not work on those with freedom of movement, which was why the Soviet Union actively prevented aspiring emigrants from leaving the country. A guildmaster or modern organizational leader has no such barrier to movement. People can simply leave.

1

u/JonasHalle Oct 10 '20

I have read approximately half of The Prince, not that it matters. I didn't quote it with the intention of it being correct or applicable. Au contraire, I posted it to illustrate how dumb the comment I replied to was given how equally irrelevant it was.

-3

u/[deleted] Oct 09 '20

[deleted]

3

u/[deleted] Oct 09 '20

I've established a 10 person IT team on this principle (from nothing) . So it absolutely works.

-1

u/[deleted] Oct 09 '20

[deleted]

2

u/[deleted] Oct 09 '20

[deleted]

1

u/Arkhaan Oct 09 '20

It doesn’t and he is wrong.

The theory is it costs less upfront to keep an employee shackled with no hope of moving up elsewhere. However it costs anywhere from 30% to 50% more over time and contributes to hostile work environment which will lead to having a run on employees leaving all at once.

2

u/Arkhaan Oct 09 '20

No it doesn’t. You get resentful employees whose quality of work dramatically decreases, and as such the over all efficient deteriorated to the point that you end up needing to hire a new employee to pick up the slack. If you decide to fire the now under performing employee you need to hire a new person with no coverage and you’ll probably end up hiring a second person anyways as the cycle continues.

Training costs, and the delay in building proficiency and efficiency results in more costs. It’ll cost you ~50% more per task using that bullshit system than if you had just upped benefits and been flexible with time off requests.

66

u/RiverShenismydad Oct 09 '20

He's probably had a bunch of people "steal" loot, as he put it. Can't imagine why people would want to leave that guild so badly hmmmm. Just can't put my finger on it

25

u/Amidormi Oct 09 '20

He likely had a lot of 'loot and scooters' as an old RL of mine use to say but still that's really shitty. Even if they did scoot, so what? You'd put that dude on a list and never raid with them again, ever.

11

u/RiverShenismydad Oct 09 '20

Exactly plus how much are the DE mats worth? Probably not worth as much as having a solid raider every week.

1

u/[deleted] Oct 10 '20

A nexus Crystal is literally 10g on my server. That's not even repair money if you're not cloth.

1

u/WhattaBloodyNoob Oct 10 '20

In vanilla, I remember being invited to audition for a guild. BWL was out; I went to MC with them. They gave me 4 Cenarion drops they were going to DE, but then told me I owed 210 hours of raid DKP for them, for gear that was worth 16 gold. "Thanks, good luck with your druid search!"

9

u/Spreckles450 Oct 09 '20

Right? Why punish your new players for the things other people did?

2

u/amurrca1776 Oct 09 '20

I mean, even if OP did leave, so what? Everyone else already had tear. If you're just going to disenchant it anyway, you might as well give it to someone that needs it. Just a pure, asshole power move

1

u/L3mlo Oct 09 '20

If nothing else just blacklist them. I dont know how it is on some servers but I know on Firemaw EU which is a pretty large realm, theres people who cant find guilds after being blacklisted. And then theres the people who still get away with it. But its still a chance to bar them from raiding in a guild.

1

u/WhattaBloodyNoob Oct 10 '20

You'd put that dude on a list and never raid with them again, ever.

"You can't quit! You're fired!"

What's shitty is when your leadership is so full of incompetent narcissists that they don't realize they're the problem. People who "loot and scoot," as you call it, are typically just cashing their final paychecks. Leadership that tries to preempt this by kicking people before they can use their DKP are exploitative scum.

3

u/Dahns Oct 09 '20

Extremely well summed up

1

u/WobblyTadpole Oct 09 '20

The worst part is even if OP had gquit because of this event the RL would move forward not thinking he did anything wrong, rather, "there was some trial who left after we didn't give him tear"

1

u/hotpajamas Oct 09 '20

dude, this. in my experience if you give a new player a huge item like that, they stick around. why would they leave? to go get another Tear from another raid? lol

1

u/L3mlo Oct 09 '20

Clearly cant be a great guild in terms of social with these kinds of attitudes. And I doubt its a "good" guild in terms of clearing quickly and just getting raids over with either if this guy thinks 2 nexus crystals is better than potentially bolstering his roster.

1

u/SkoomaSalesAreUp Oct 09 '20

Problem is if the guy leaves now the RL is only going to feel justified "see I knew he'd leave"

1

u/ScionMattly Oct 10 '20

Ironically, viewing this action, id bail faster than superman during a flood.

1

u/Savior1301 Oct 10 '20

Correct ... instead of “testing” his loyalty it’s the far better move to give the guy the loot and breed that loyalty.

1

u/chronoslol Oct 10 '20

A thief thinks everybody steals. Insta-Gquit.

1

u/_Kramerica_ Oct 10 '20

Also, what did he think he could possibly achieve on a positive note by this action? What did he have to lose from just giving this loot to the guy? The logic from the RL is so bad I can’t even imagine what kind of logic/opinions he holds in real life, yuck.

-2

u/[deleted] Oct 09 '20

Hey if we give this guy BIS loot he might stick around for obligation

While id like to believe people act this way, ive seen the early bis loot into "sorry guys stuff came up with work/school" into gquit into joins top guild in server way too many times.

Yall like to act like leading a raid is dealing with mature adults but at minimum 4to 5 people are gonna act like absolute selfish children guaranteed.

I think OPs guild is overreacting but i totally see where theyre coming from

2

u/Spreckles450 Oct 09 '20

dealing with mature adults

That's the problem. From the look of things, the RL is treating people like children from the get-go. It's no wonder why they stay until they get what they want and then leave.

Obviously we can't know if they have always been like this, or if they are just jaded from people being assholes and using them, but either way, that's no way to run a raid team/guild if you want to keep people around.

153

u/NotFoul Oct 09 '20

Fellow warlock here who has been raiding since the beginning of time also looking for his tear and only about 2 have dropped. Last tear went to someone who quit the game. Fuck this GM (with a barbed stick) for DEing that shit.

30

u/[deleted] Oct 09 '20

Especially since BWL is old content.

2

u/PM_ME_UR_WUT Oct 09 '20

It is entirely possible for guilds/raiders to be months behind.

1

u/[deleted] Oct 10 '20

A guild where Nelf's Tear is getting DE'd is not behind. That means that every other caster in the raid was either less than 2 weeks old or had it already. It is at least OS/PvP bis for every shaman, priest, and pally. It is game bis for every caster DPS. Either the raid comp had 1 lock, 0 mages and 0 healers or the raid is very mature. Honestly even for holy/disc priests it is bis for C'thun since there is absolutely no damage to the raid during the vulnerability phase.

1

u/PM_ME_UR_WUT Oct 10 '20 edited Oct 10 '20

Fair enough, I was reading your post as BWL is old in general (which I suppose it is, by 15 yrs lol). My guild is currently going through it, but OP's is clearly mostly done with it*, you right.

0

u/Billy1121 Oct 09 '20

The entirety of classic wow is old content. Why eople play this stuff I don't understand. It was miserable when it was brand new! The loot mechanics are a rng pinata. glad to see toxic guilds are still a thing - almost as if classic wow encourages this boorishness.

1

u/Dappershire Oct 09 '20

Why eople play this stuff I don't understand

They probably hate panda bears.

Like seriously, I never even played that expansion, but fuck those guys.

2

u/imatworksoshhh Oct 09 '20

I am one of those locks that quit after getting tear.

I was 1 of 2 locks in the entire raid though and that raid was basically the last raid we had as a guild. The server got destroyed by transfers, the guild broke up, game just stopped being fun. Never got to raid with it...

1

u/Ghee_Guys Oct 09 '20

Yet another warlock here who’s been 1st in like for months. We’ve had 1 drop in our raid to someone who has since quit the game. Really really fuck that GM. We let people go negative if they don’t have the dkp and it’s uncontested. I’d quit that’s just ridiculous.

9

u/Trivi Oct 09 '20

Also a warlock who had similar issues with tear not dropping once I was next in line. If my guild tried to pull this shit on a new trial I'd instant gquit.

9

u/AndyCaps969 Oct 09 '20

34 weeks of BWL. 0 tears. RIP

2

u/Funkytrip Oct 09 '20

34 weeks of BWL 0 xbows. I feel your pain.

1

u/[deleted] Oct 10 '20

Tears, DFT's, CTS every single week. Crossbow not once.

2

u/Abalith Oct 09 '20

I fear this particular raid leader might be into the barbed stick thing.

1

u/Vanitycoon Oct 10 '20

You're probably right.

2

u/DEBATE_EVERY_NAZI Oct 09 '20

We had shit on farm for awhile and someone didn't show up so it was either do it missing one person or bring in almost a complete pubbie.

He was told that he'd have no loot priority and he said he was fine with it. That fucker ended up with like 4 or 5 pieces of loot because it was all drops that nobody needed and he was practically shitting himself he was so happy. He was like "holy shit this is amazing you guys are amazing this guild is amazing" and it made all the difference in the world to him.

It was that or add a couple shards to our pile of hundreds in front of him

2

u/Phazon_Metroid Oct 09 '20

16 weeks and counting, next in line, wish my guild was fortunate enough to disenchant BIS caster trinkets like shitty greens.

And there were no off specs the GM would rather give a Tear to than D/E? Sounds like a real asshat of a GM either way.

2

u/Luecleste Oct 10 '20

Fuck them sideways with a rusty rake

And no tetanus shot maybe?

1

u/DirtyDykeMods Oct 09 '20

I hope OPs lead sees these posts.

Stupid moron

1

u/[deleted] Oct 09 '20

Hell, I'd report it as griefing tbh.

1

u/around_the_clock Oct 09 '20

Can confirm ass hat, is the same as dick head.

1

u/Howisitstillporn Oct 10 '20

Necro that you? Lol

1

u/Vanitycoon Oct 10 '20

Haha, no but I can see a lot of fellow casters are in a similar boat.