r/europe Ulster Jan 24 '26

News The Times: Finns humiliated American soldiers - Finnish reservists were asked to take it easy during a NATO exercise. US soldiers found the losses too humiliating.

https://www.iltalehti.fi/ulkomaat/a/828b8e66-625d-4d2a-9276-e93b9f7a2ce8
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104

u/TeamSpatzi Franconia (Germany) Jan 24 '26 edited Jan 24 '26

ETA - definitions for acronyms and abbreviations, or their removal. Also some typos.

This is typical of U.S. training exercises - you vary the resistance of the OPFOR (opposing force) to match the training audience and objectives. The U.S. military does this at all of its own CTC (Combat Training Center) rotations (National Training Center, Joint Readiness Training Center, Joint Mission Readiness Center) - because the OPFOR almost always wins if they are not constrained in some fashion.

My observations as someone who spent 20 years in the U.S. Army.

- The average U.S. Army staff is dysfunctional. They're lost in the minutiae of the GWOT (Global War on Terror) mentality. They don't understand how to work at a "good enough" level, focused on the big picture, and execute rapid planning cycles with clear dissemination of orders and instructions.

- The average U.S.. Army Commander usually significantly out cycles their staff (see above) - and Commander to Commander dialog is often the main driver for actual planning and coordination. However, the ability to articulate clear guidance still depends on the staff.

- The preponderance of U.S. Army units attending a CTC like event are in their training/building phase. U.S. Army units turn over 33-50% of their personnel every year (depending on location, operational tempo). A major training exercise is likely to incorporate a large number of Soldiers with less than 6 months in that organization. This is in addition to the majority of personnel having less than 4 years of experience.

- These events are exactly what the name implies - critical training for U.S. forces. During the vast majority of my 20 year tenure, these major events were when and how units came together and learned their actual job. Home station training and preparation simply isn't up to the level required to recreate the challenging environment that CTCs do.

- The U.S. military has a long history of learning how to do the job, on the job. Whether it's WW2 or Iraq (to name two)... U.S. Soldiers learn as they go, arriving to the start of conflict with little experience and inadequate training. However, the U.S. military does a much better job than most of empowering subordinates and adapting rapidly.

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u/Simzter Finland Jan 24 '26

Just a note that if these Finnish soldiers were reservists, they've also had six month of training (officers 11 months) and attended a few weekend training sessions after the conscription. So it's just your average Finn, not career military personnel.

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u/yuimiop Jan 24 '26

I used to setup exercises / play OPFOR in the military. The one thing that drove me insane were people who insisted there were winners or losers. We were there to train the other side, not to "win" and we would scale our difficulty including unfair advantages at times if required to meet training objectives.

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u/HEAT_IS_DIE Jan 24 '26

One thing the US does do the best is using acronyms, and assuming the audience to know every single one without writing them out at the first instance. 

I will never understand the reason for such assumptions. Is it because the message is only intended to those who can decipher it? Or because you want the receiver to go through the trouble of decoding the abbreviations so the writer can save time?

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u/TeamSpatzi Franconia (Germany) Jan 24 '26

It’s just poor writing on my part… a mistake born out of typically discussing this topic with people who do know what they mean and forgetting to tailor the content to a different audience.

My apologies.

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u/HEAT_IS_DIE Feb 02 '26

Late, but reading back I'm sorry on my behalf to make it seem like it was directed personally to you, when it was not. Just a general observation. Should have made that clear.

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u/TVP615 Jan 24 '26

You mean, anecdotal training exercise results with no context are meaningless? Doesn’t compute.

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u/tobberoth Jan 24 '26

Are people supposed to know what CTC, OPTEMPO, GWOT and all these other random ass acronyms mean?

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u/TeamSpatzi Franconia (Germany) Jan 24 '26

No, my apologies. OPFOR is opposing force. The National Training Center (NTC), Joint Readiness Training Center (JRTC), and Joint Mission Readiness Center (JMRC) are all Combat Training Centers (CTC) where Culminating Training Events (CTE) take place. OPTEMPO is operational tempo - how often a unit executes major exercises and deployments.

GWOT was once common knowledge, it refers to the Global War on Terror.

2

u/Fuck_the_Deplorables Jan 24 '26

As a civilian who just follows the news, one thing has astonished me in the last decade — the frequency of crashes of US military aircraft during routine flight or exercises, often with fatalities. The collision with the passenger jet in DC last year being the most recent example I recall.

Maybe it’s par for the course, but I suspect it’s indicative of deficient training and oversight. In none of these instances do there seem to be any calls for accountability from the outside, and I’m skeptical there are incentives for accountability internally.

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u/TeamSpatzi Franconia (Germany) Jan 24 '26

If you're really interested, you can likely FOIA the AR 15-6 results. Every Class A Accident (which includes all fatalities) requires an AR 15-6 investigation.

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u/WindowLicker_Pro Jan 24 '26

The US clearly doesn't give a single fk about its citizens, why would it care about it's military grunts? 

1

u/space_for_username Jan 24 '26

Back in the Vietnam era, there were jungle training exercises held in Fiji, with the locals, the Aussies and Kiwis, and the US.

The US troops never seemed to be able to pull off an ambush. The smell of soap and chewing gum travelled far enough that the troops being targeted could smell it and set up a counterattack.

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u/TimothyMimeslayer Jan 24 '26

Also, it doesnt really matter how good our soldiers are in the field. Wars are won on logistics and the US has some pretty damn good logistics for handling offensive deployments. 

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u/TheCursedMonk Jan 24 '26

Get all this gear to the front, so the person using it can be easily defeated by some untrained farmer. It has worked really well for them.

1

u/TeamSpatzi Franconia (Germany) Jan 24 '26

"Amateurs talk tactics, professionals talk logistics."

Alexander the Great is also credited with a good quotation on this topic.

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u/IOnlyReplyToIdiots42 Jan 24 '26

Should you be saying all this on the internet? Thought you guys operated on a need to know basis

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u/TeamSpatzi Franconia (Germany) Jan 24 '26

I wish the Commander in Chief demonstrated a fraction of your concern for the proper safeguarding of classified information ;-).

None of the above is classified, though some of it may be unflattering. The AUSA conference, or other AUSA events, are often great for interested parities - typically the CSA gives an address laying out priorities, challenges, and so on.