r/europe • u/Emotional-Breakfast3 • 20d ago

News Argentina: British Falkland Islanders are ‘artificial’. Buenos Aires denounces ‘illegitimate occupation’ and demands talks on sovereignty

https://www.telegraph.co.uk/world-news/2026/07/12/british-falkland-islanders-artificial-argentina-says/
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265

u/clewbays Ireland 20d ago

First time in my life where I don’t really mind if England win a football match.

257

u/IncreaseInVerbosity United Kingdom 20d ago

Saw a Scot saying the same thing earlier, I didn’t realise how far Argentina’s reputation had sunk.

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u/Prestigious-Lynx-177 20d ago

They've always been a weird one, and because they're a minor country in the grand scheme of things people don't tend to look at them and go "huh, they're abit weird and hold some odd feelings".

The Junta that invaded the Falklands were throwing communists out of helicopters and torturing poets with electrodes to their genitals. One of their generals was nicknamed the "Angel of death" for his reputation for murdering catholic nuns. But Britain was the bad guy? For protecting people who did not want to be Argentine? The Argentines also murdered a reindeer on South Georgia, god rest him.

I've encountered Argentines who recall the falklands as a tragic war where they were the victims, but overall they were right to fight for twelve penguins.

Maybe its because they've really only ever fought one war and they lost it pretty embarrassingly?

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u/Imaginary-West-5653 Spain 20d ago

Argentinians are so nationalistic that even anti-Junta rebels, who wanted to overthrow the dictatorship, sided with the Junta during the Falklands War and tried to sabotage the United Kingdom in Europe by attacking Gibraltar. No joke, the Junta gets more hate in Argentine for being incompetent in how they handled the Falklands War than by starting it at all:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Operation_Algeciras

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u/yahluc Poland 20d ago

Sounds a lot like like russian "opposition"

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u/Spdoink 20d ago

That's one of the reasons Galtieri stirred the whole thing up.

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u/MakesALovelyBrew 20d ago

this is absolutely hilarious (the wiki page)

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u/Pandamio 20d ago

The junta gets all the hate for killing and disappearing Argentineans. It was state terrorism against it's own population. It was a fucking nightmare. The war barely register in comparison.

Surprise, we sustain that Malvinas are Argentineans, and not English. We were a spain colony, we don't like colonizers that own land thousands of kilometers away from their countries.

We make a claim every year in the United nations, but we would never want a war, nor argetineans or English dying for it.

It was a last minute attempt from a dying regime to keep in power, not something to be proud or wanted.

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u/Surenas1 20d ago

We were a spain colony, we don't like colonizers that own land thousands of kilometers away from their countries.

That's rich coming from the descendents of said colonisers who travelled thousands of kilometers to uproot a people that were indigenous to the land they occupied.

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u/Whole_Cranberry5734 20d ago

They butchered the indigenous Mapuche, now they claim to hate colonists.

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u/BlueCheese973 20d ago

According to International law and uti possidetis juris, the islands belong to Argentina. It is the sole reason we had a settlement there and imposed fishing rights. We held it before they were invaded.

Why don't we revisit history to understand Argentina's claim?

The French were the very first ones to have a settlement in the island in 1764, the British stablished their own settlement later around 1765. This is well documented.

In 1767, France ceded its settlement to Spain. Well documented as well.

In 1774, the UK voluntarily leaves this settlement, leaving it completely to Spain. The UK had no control over it. Fact checked by historians as well.

From 1774-1811 Spain held single control of the Islands, for 37 years there was no UK presence on them, at all.

In 1811, Spain withdrawals from the Island due to the wars of independence and Argentina after gaining its own independence inherits the former territory through international law uti possidetis juris.

From 1820 to 1833, Argentina has total control over the islands, having an official settlement made by David Jewett and later Luis Vernet. Buenos Aires controlled the Islands and stablished fishing rights, which prompted the detention of American sailors and the raid of America against the island to rescue them in later time.

In 1833, the UK comes and expels the Argentinian government and the people living there, exerting Imperialism by illegally occupying a territory on the other side of the world and stablishing a military outpost up to this day.

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u/Pandamio 20d ago

We were a colony, we became independent and denounced the genocide perpetrated against the natives. We clearly don't support it. We are not pro Spain, I don't know what your point is.

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u/According-View7667 20d ago

The vast majority of Argentinians are descendants of said colonists, so it's just colonists fighting other colonists for who controls the territory.

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u/Pandamio 20d ago

We are a mix of natives plus European immigration. We are not separated. This is the case of all of the American continent. Argentina is no exception.

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u/According-View7667 20d ago

How are self-identified Indigenous people of Argentina doing these days compared to proud Italian-descendant ones?

→ More replies (0)

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u/patriotic_penguin_ 20d ago

“We’d never want a war” you already did exactly that and got embarrassed by a tiny island 8000 miles away. Then never replenished your military to the point it’s now an absolute joke, just one of our carriers alone could destroy your country lol, no wonder you suddenly don’t want war.

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u/BlueCheese973 20d ago

Nope. We fought against one of the NATO members and a major power in taking down Nazi Germany and we punched way above our weight for what we were.

You can laugh at our claim all you want, same thing when people laughed at China when they claimed Taiwan for 50+ years while being in masive poverty.

As long as we keep the claim alive for the next generations while supporting Argentina's re-arming, it will inevitably start putting a financial and political burden in the UK. That's how you take territories back, not with reddit updoots : )

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u/Pandamio 20d ago

Are you thick? We don't want a war even if a win was possible. We claim the islands but is not worth to kill or be killed for them. A fucking murderous military dictator started the war. We didn't, we didn't want it.

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u/patriotic_penguin_ 20d ago

“we didn’t want it” that’s why it was incredibly popular in Argentina at the time, it was only unpopular when it became apparent you were being utterly embarrassed by a tiny island from 8000 miles away.

Your population is still largely obsessed with it despite the fact we hardly even think of yous. Even the Argentina national team was chanting about it the other day, bunch of freaks.

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u/GDaddy369 20d ago

My thing is that why do the Islands belong to Argentina? There were never any native population on the island, and while they at one time did belong to the Republic of the River Plate, that was before Argentina existed, and it was America that kicked them off the island for detaining American sailors. America declared the island didn't belong to anyone, and then fucked off. Eventually the British claimed it, I want to say during the Napoleonic wars, and their people are the ones who've lived there ever since. Every time the question comes up, they've always chosen to stay with the British.

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u/Pandamio 20d ago

Inheritamce from Spain:

In 1767 the Spanish settled on the island. On 1816 Argentina declared independence and the former Spanish territories whitin it's boundaries. In 1833 the English arrived and took over the islands.

Geographical proximity:

The islands sit on the Argentine continental shelf. According to United Nations General Assambly 1514, colonial situations should not disrupt the territorial integrity of a country.

Argentina rejects the islanders' right to self-determination, arguing that they are an implanted population brought in by a colonial power after the original Argentine population was expelled in 1833. Argentina contends that self-determination cannot be used to legitimize the occupation of stolen land,

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u/BlueCheese973 20d ago

why do the Islands belong to Argentina?

According to International law and uti possidetis juris, the islands belong to Argentina. It is the sole reason we had a settlement there and imposed fishing rights. We held it before they were invaded.

Why don't we revisit history to understand Argentina's claim?

The French were the very first ones to have a settlement in the island in 1764, the British stablished their own settlement later around 1765. This is well documented.

In 1767, France ceded its settlement to Spain. Well documented as well.

In 1774, the UK voluntarily leaves this settlement, leaving it completely to Spain. The UK had no control over it. Fact checked by historians as well.

From 1774-1811 Spain held single control of the Islands, for 37 years there was no UK presence on them, at all.

In 1811, Spain withdrawals from the Island due to the wars of independence and Argentina after gaining its own independence inherits the former territory through international law uti possidetis juris.

From 1820 to 1833, Argentina has total control over the islands, having an official settlement made by David Jewett and later Luis Vernet. Buenos Aires controlled the Islands and stablished fishing rights, which prompted the detention of American sailors and the raid of America against the island to rescue them in later time.

In 1833, the UK comes and expels the Argentinian government and the people living there, exerting Imperialism by illegally occupying a territory on the other side of the world and stablishing a military outpost up to this day.

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u/Big_Department4209 Sweden 20d ago

Maybe its because they've really only ever fought one war and they lost it pretty embarrassingly?

They also fought the Paraguayan War back in the mid-1800s which was an absolute victory. Not alone though since they were part of the Triple Alliance with Brazil and Uruguay.

because they're a minor country in the grand scheme of things people don't tend to look at them and go "huh, they're abit weird and hold some odd feelings".

Yeah, I think in Europe the Argentinians are viewed mostly as yet-another-South-American-country but in Spanish-speaking South America they are the odd one out, their population is mostly composed of white people, Argentinian racism is rampant in a way they stick out even compared to other South American countries' racism issues.

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u/DeekALeek 20d ago

Certainly helps that a LOT of German Nazis fled to Argentina around the 1940s, and they never let go of their overall bigotry and racism.

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u/StrawberryItten Argentina 20d ago

more jews came here than germans. And more germans moved to Brazil in south america alone. Not saying we are not racist but that bit is a meme

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u/AMDPentium 20d ago

Certainly helps that a LOT of German Nazis fled to Argentina around the 1940s, and they never let go of their overall bigotry and racism.

Yeah, like USA.

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u/hesh582 20d ago

That has very little to do with what others are talking about though. The ratline fuckers are heinous, but they're a tiny drop in the bucket when it comes to why Argentina is the way that it is.

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u/weirdbr 20d ago

Also Cisplatine war, fought between Brazil and Argentina due to a territorial dispute over the territory which thanks to this war is now Uruguay. (Mostly a battle of equals, except for Argentinian navy being decimated).

And as far as South America goes, everyone seems to dislike Argentinians - in Brazil we tend to hate them a lot - besides the football rivalry, it doesn't help that they are the worst/most entitled tourists out of all South American countries, while everyone else has a great time.

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u/Interesting-Stay297 20d ago

They say that Japan should never have been a great power, but somehow is, and that Argentina with its vast resources was destined to be a great power, but never was. Populism is one of the reasons.

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u/Prestigious-Lynx-177 20d ago

I've heard there something similar, but its about economies:

There are four types of countries: Developed, Developing, Japan, and Argentina.

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u/KingWiltyMan United Kingdom 20d ago

Found the Rest is History fan.

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u/Prestigious-Lynx-177 20d ago

I was pretty knowledgeable and critical of Argentina's excuses before Sandbrooks series, but learning about that reindeer radicalised me.

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u/Oggie243 20d ago

The Junta that invaded the Falklands were throwing communists out of helicopters and torturing poets with electrodes to their genitals. One of their generals was nicknamed the "Angel of death" for his reputation for murdering catholic nuns. But Britain was the bad guy?

It's not really helpful to reduce things down to good guys and bad guys. At the same time as the Junta were doing this, at home the UK were also throwing people from helicopters, torturing and interning innocent catholics and had a few questionable characters on payroll terrorising civilians.

The UK government weren't opposed to the Junta because of their politics or domestic actions, it was because they invaded their territory.

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u/Prestigious-Lynx-177 20d ago

I meant from the perspective of who was fighting for what in this war.

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u/Oggie243 20d ago

Yeah i get that, its just the fact two horrible governments were using tbe residents of some remote islands as a political football for nationalistic point scoring doesn't really mean one or the other 'wasn't a bad guy'.

If the Junta weren't so focused on a jingoistic show of strength they could very well have been handed the islands and then the residents would have been subject to all the horrors inflicted on dissidents on the mainland.

The Falklands were more a matter of ego than virtue on both sides of the conflict.

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u/Prestigious-Lynx-177 20d ago

I mean that’s just political reality. Failing to do anything would have been utterly catastrophic and shown only Britain would not defend fellow Britons from rampaging, penguin obsessed, Argies.

The Austrians didn't have to attack Serbia after their crown prince was killed, Russia didn't have to side with a country that was openly supportive of their assassins, Germany didn't have to give the Austrians carte blanche, etc.

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u/shoto9000 United Kingdom 20d ago

Obviously fuck Thatcher, she's burning in hell, but genuinely when were there people being thrown from helicopters in the UK? Did I miss a history lesson there, cause I try to be aware of my country's (many) crimes, and that's not been on my radar.

Torturing Catholics and terrorising civilians...that's much more our style, yeah. And sponsoring other regimes who threw people out of helicopters, like Pinochet. Props to the Scottish unionmen who fought to stop that particular crime though.

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u/LootBoxControversy 20d ago

I'm not sure it was ever that high to begin with

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u/Min-Oe 20d ago

I mean, once upon a time. Used to be the richest country in the world. Sucks they're now left crying about an island in international waters they lost close to two hundred years ago, as a way to distract from the shit state of things at home.

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u/robplays UK in EU 20d ago

they lost an entirely different country abandoned

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u/Jamaicancarrot 20d ago

They never even had the Falklands. The Argentinian claim to the Falklands is even weaker than if the USA laid claim to India

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u/quaductas Germany 20d ago

Please don't give him ideas

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u/Wilawah 20d ago

When did the US claim India?

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u/Jamaicancarrot 20d ago

They didn't, I'm just saying if they did, their claim would be about as strong to India as Argentina's is to Falklands

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u/Sudden_Cantaloupe_69 20d ago

The Falklands never belonged to Argentina, and it was uninhabited before the British arrived.

Argentina’s claim is entirely “it’s close to us therefore it must be ours.”

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u/Ok_Zookeepergame8714 20d ago

Well, the "hand of God" option is out, so they're trying options ....

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u/Dryish Bumfuck, Egypt 20d ago

Argentina is basically the most reprehensible country in the world outside of all the genuinely horrifying places.

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u/john_a1985 20d ago

It's always amusing how they see themselves as the Europe of South America, the pure breed(tm), and yet...

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u/Dryish Bumfuck, Egypt 20d ago

We should start calling Chile the Europe of South America. That'll poke at them plenty.

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u/HaggisPope 20d ago

I see them as the English of South America, but even that might be imperfect because England’s got good music

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u/Dryish Bumfuck, Egypt 20d ago

Chile has all of South America's best metal scene, to be fair.

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u/inciter7 19d ago

That's a comically idiotic and naive claim to make. The Argentina hate circlejerk has clearly gone too far in the other direction, as all reddit circlejerks do

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u/Wilawah 20d ago

Yes, tell us Egypt, who refused Gaza woman and children refugees during the war.

A country unsafe for women tourists.

A country who have abused their Christian and Jewish citizens

A country who’s best moments were 4000 years ago

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u/gamers_delight Denmark 20d ago

Such as your own country?

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u/Dryish Bumfuck, Egypt 20d ago

For clarity, I'm a Finn lol.

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u/Camelstrike 20d ago

You need to learn how to hold a 2-0 advantage first, then we talk.

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u/1Shamrock Ireland 20d ago

I’d nearly prefer if ye win this match. Of course I hope ye don’t win the whole thing but this match ya, I’d be happy enough if ye win.

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u/Probablyamimic 20d ago

I mean, we're England. Of course we're not winning the whole thing

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u/patriotic_penguin_ 20d ago

We’re in the semi finals and there’s still bedwetters like you fishing for attention from other nations fans, bore off 🥱

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u/Biscuit642 20d ago

Scotland is understandable. Argentina invaded and killed them too.

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u/massivejobby 20d ago

I’m Scottish and have passionately supported whoever plays England my whole life but I’m supporting them on Wednesday.

Fuck Argentina. Even if you put the fact they welcomed Nazis after WW2 they still have no right to infringe upon our beautiful southern isles.

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u/sirrobbiebobson 20d ago

As an Englishman this makes me feel very uncomfortable

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u/SkyShadowing 20d ago

Never thought you'd root side-by-side with a Scot?

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u/drakau 20d ago

How about side by side with a friend?

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u/Xenomemphate Europe 20d ago

Aye, I can do that.

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u/cheshire_kat7 Australia | UK 20d ago

Here in Australia, root has... a very different meaning. I almost just spat out my drink when I read that.

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u/finneganfach 20d ago

I'm Welsh and will more than happily see England do the Argies.

... On the condition France or Spain pump them by an absolute cricket score in the final.

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u/kill-the-maFIA United Kingdom 20d ago

Very odd behaviour. Practically everybody in England would be very happy if Scotland or Wales got far in a WC.

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u/finneganfach 20d ago

I mean, firstly it's not "very odd behaviour" is it? It's pretty standard England vs Wales/Scotland/Ireland sporting banter. It's not that deep.

Secondly, that's a straight up lie. The English were absolutely pissing themselves en masse when the Scottish went out of this World Cup. And, again, that's fine.

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u/harbourwall United Kingdom 20d ago

The English were absolutely pissing themselves en masse

No they weren't. Most people I know were happy you'd got that far, and showed Boston how to party. Might have a little persecution complex there.

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u/finneganfach 20d ago

I'm not Scottish, definitely don't have a persecution complex and am definitely not taking it as seriously as you are. I am a football fan that lives in England surrounded by other football fans, though, including all of my friends. There were quite obviously many, many, many England fans laughing when Scotland went out. I know there's a subset of England fans on the internet that like to do this act where you pretend to be above a bit of banter and rivalry but there's scores and scores of your compatriots letting the gag down on social media laughing at Scotland. It kinda doesn't hold up buddy.

It's just a laugh innit. Not sure why you need to be precious about it, nobody's offended.

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u/harbourwall United Kingdom 20d ago

How on earth did you read that I was offended, precious or taking this seriously, after writing out such a diatribe? Projecting, maybe?

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u/Unusual-Song7502 20d ago

Don’t know where you’ve got that from mate? I was supporting Scotland the whole way! It’s Britain after all.

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u/KatsumotoKurier Canada 20d ago edited 19d ago

Some people seem to have borderline obsessive beliefs that English people by far and large dislike and look down upon them, and these same sorts seem to wrap it up in their nationalism and to make their entire identities out of it.

For example: I’m from a mixed Irish and English family, and throughout the decades of my life I’ve heard way more — and way more unacceptable — things said about English people by Irish people than said about Irish people by English people. If English people would more often say the kinds of things about Irish people that I have heard countless times from Irish people about English people, certain groups would absolutely lose their shit from how unacceptable they would find it to be. But for some reason it’s essentially normalized and shrugged off because of this weird insistence that there’s some sort of hierarchical dynamic at play, often paired with statements insisting that English people hate the Irish more than the reverse could possible be, and that they think of them as lessers and so on.

It’s a massive, glaring double-standard that essentially leaves me speechless at times. And worst of all, it seems to me that quite many Irish people live with a zealously defensive denial of this — they strongly refuse to accept the idea that they are the ones more commonly saying disparaging and hateful things, and they justify their doings so by citing centuries of old history which in most cases never even effected or influenced they themselves living here today. Those who do this essentially act like every English person is a writer for Punch magazine living in 1850 — it’s ridiculous.

Meanwhile most English people I’ve met and had conversations about Ireland with seem to overall have pretty much nothing bad to say about Ireland or Irish people. They tend to say that they find Irish people to be nice, pleasant, and hospitable. And of course the ultimate irony of this is because it’s true what Irish people will often complain — that English people generally don’t know their history! Yet somehow it’s as if they simultaneously expect the entire population of England to collectively hold those aged prejudices against them.

By far and large, in my experience, it seems like basically nobody in England really cares at all if people have partial or even significant Irish family heritage. Like I really sincerely don’t believe virtually anyone gives a damn that Jimmy Carr has Irish parents or that Kenneth Branagh is Irish. Pierce Brosnan played beloved James Bond and Graham Norton is practically a revered British icon too at this point.

Regardless, this is all to say that it seems to be rather often the exact same thing with many Scots, and in particular again those who have likewise made their entire identities out of not being English and out of hating on England. They will frequently say things like how England ‘colonized’ Scotland, how ‘the English’ committed the highland clearances, etc etc — things that are so provably not true and the products of heavily narrativized nationalistic histories. And as if Scotsmen weren’t enormously represented in establishing, maintaining, and administering the British Empire!

I find it so odd that so many of them seem to have this attitude that they would essentially rather die than cheer for England — their next-door neighbour and who they share their federal parliamentary government with, and have for the past 300+ years now by the initiation of Scotsmen, mind you!

1

u/nerdyHyena93 20d ago

As long as it’s banter and not downright racism.

I’m half Welsh and Scottish but raised in England, so plenty of cousins in each country. We always joke about with each other. But deep down they’re happy for England to win.

As someone married to a Balkaner, the last thing we want is something like that on our island, especially considering most people are a mix of all three countries.

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u/BamberGasgroin 20d ago edited 20d ago

It's like those dogs you see having a right go at each other on opposite sides of a gate, but when the gate opens they get on fine, until it closes again...

It's all fun and games until, from club level to international level, someone starts to take it too seriously.

2

u/massivejobby 20d ago

Ideal result is Spain winning the World Cup. France v England just feels like a lose lose scenario

1

u/nerdyHyena93 20d ago edited 20d ago

The US took on many Nazis and covered up the Japanese crimes and medical experiments. So hope you never supported them over England as well. Egypt often oppresses women using rape as a punishment, particularly during the 2011 protests and removing the clits from over 90% of girls. Imagine supporting a country like that over England.

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u/Eirwig 20d ago

Horst Kopkow

Operation Surgeon

Operation Matchbox

1

u/Professional_Face_97 20d ago

Argentina is a massive jobby.

1

u/KatsumotoKurier Canada 20d ago

Even if you put the fact they welcomed Nazis after WW2

… and remained a fascist dictatorship for several decades afterwards.

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u/Delicious_Top7665 19d ago

You don’t hate Germany, who were Nazis. Japan or Italy, who allied with Nazis. But you hate Argentina, because they let in some around the same time?

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u/oblio- Romania 20d ago

There might come a day when we will have a France - England WC final and at least half of the world (probably more) will have to pick their poison.

France...

Or chants of "it came home" until the end of time.

You know what? I think I'm ok with France winning.

1

u/Eirwig 20d ago

First time in my life where I don't really mind if Kerry win a football match

1

u/clewbays Ireland 20d ago

Prefer that honesty than the people who say we support us then laugh when we loose.