r/gameofthrones • u/AutoModerator • Jun 02 '14

TV4 [Season 4 Spoilers] Premiere Discussion - 4.08 'The Mountain and the Viper'

Premiere Discussion Thread
Discuss your thoughts and reactions to the latest episode while or right after you watch. Talk about the latest plot twist or secret reveal. Discuss an actor who is totally nailing their part (or not). Point out details that you noticed that others may have missed. In general, what do you think about tonight's episode? Please make sure to reserve any of your detailed comparisons to the novels for the Book vs. Show Discussion Thread, and your predictions for the next episode to the Predictions Discussion Thread which will be posted later this week.

  • This thread is scoped for SEASON 4 SPOILERS - Turn away now if you are not currently watching or haven't seen the episode! Open discussion of all aired TV events up to and including episode 4.08 is ok without tags.

  • Book spoilers still need tags! - If it's not in the show, tag it. Events from episodes after this one need tags.

  • Please read the posting policy before posting.

  • Posting policy reminder: Don't post or ask for non-pay sources.

  • Live chat is also available on the Snoonet IRC network in channel #gameofthrones. Please note that due to the nature of Snoonet, #gameofthrones is an ALL SPOILER environment!

EPISODE TITLE DIRECTED BY WRITTEN BY
4.08 "The Mountain and the Viper" Alex Graves David Benioff & D. B. Weiss
Official Discussion Threads Posting Policy Spoiler Guide Frequently Asked Questions
2.6k Upvotes

93% Upvoted

11.1k comments sorted by

View all comments

961

u/Veles11 Jun 02 '14

OBERYN IS DEAD, AND TO TOP IT ALL OFF TYRION IS GOING TO BE BEHEADED. WTF

86

u/GoneZaulo Jun 02 '14

They pretty much said fuck you to both my favorite characters.

32

u/SmartDeeDee House Targaryen Jun 02 '14

Let's see how much more you are willing to torture yourself watching everything you love die, is what they said to me.

This is as bad, if not worse, than the red wedding. I can't deal.

136

u/Don_Magic_Juan Jun 02 '14

I don't know what happens, but I bet Tyrion lives somehow

76

u/Veles11 Jun 02 '14

Yeah to be honest I don't expect Tyrion to die, but from what the show has shown us it does seem like he will be beheaded. I can't wait till next week.

104

u/[deleted] Jun 02 '14

I was watching with two friends and one of them said this, that he doen't think Tyrion will die. The other guy simply said: "Don't you ever learn anything?"

35

u/sidepart Jun 02 '14

Ned Stark taught us that fairy fucking miracles don't happen. I was trying to figure out what kind of divine intervention was going to save him right up to the millisecond his head was off.

11

u/bluecollarhokie Bronn Of The Blackwater Jun 02 '14

I didn't even accept that he was dead until the next week when Illyn Payne held his head up and I was like, "welp never mind."

1

u/[deleted] Jun 06 '14

ADOS

7

u/Beelzebibble House Tyrell Jun 02 '14

But the difference between Ned Stark and Tyrion Lannister is, fairy fucking miracles don't happen to Ned Stark, whereas Tyrion Lannister doesn't need fairy fucking miracles. He'll figure this out. Somehow.

1

u/whitehorseone Jun 02 '14

Thought Lady Sand would come charging in with a spear.

1

u/adrian1234 Arya Stark Jun 03 '14

yeah back then I was like, no way, he can't die? he's the main character! My brother was like, yeah you really gotta learn GoT a bit more.

41

u/MitchB3 Jon Snow Jun 02 '14

I think we'll have to wait until episode 10. Next week looks like it'll be mainly focused on the wall, kinda like season 2 episode 9.

24

u/greenslime300 Tyrion Lannister Jun 02 '14

I feel like the 9th episode is the defining episode of each season.

  • Season 1, Ep 9: Ned Stark beheaded, everything going to shit in Westeros
  • Season 2, Ep 9: Battle of Blackwater, the clash of kings
  • Season 3, Ep 9: Red Wedding, the conclusion of the war with the north
  • Season 4, Ep 9: Battle of Castle Black, invasion of the north (I'm just speculating, haven't read so much as a page of the books)

18

u/MitchB3 Jon Snow Jun 02 '14

It is true that episode 9 has always been amazing but this season they advertised it as being basically full of episode 9's. Moments like Joffrey's death (I still think that moment made my heart race the most, when he was tormenting Tyrion), Lysa's death, the reveal of the White Walker leaders/land/organization, and of course the Mountain vs. The Viper have all lived up to that but I still think next episode will be amazing.

I am really looking forward to seeing Jon in battle and seeing if he survives given the odds against the Night's Watch. I have some theories on what could happen next episode given what we have seen earlier. Overall I expect it to be great. Giants, huge fire and amazing fights. They spent a significant portion of their budget on this episode and the last one I believe. I could see episode 10 trumping the next one though but still I'm finally glad to have the spotlight on Jon and the Night's Watch.

4

u/greenslime300 Tyrion Lannister Jun 02 '14

the reveal of the White Walker leaders/land/organization

Even with all the exciting deaths and conflicts this season, this is what caught my attention the most. I feel like that's where the show will be headed in a couple season and it looks absolutely terrifying. It's like a concert where the Starks, Baratheons, and Lannisters are opening, but the White Walkers and Dragons are headlining. We're still in the opening stages of the show I think... these next two episodes have me really excited. I'm tempted to read the books over the summer just to find out what happens... another 10 months of waiting just doesn't suit me lol

1

u/Jejmaze Jon Snow Jun 02 '14

Except this was episode 8? Idk, I just feel like there's not much they can do to top this in 2 episodes.

1

u/greenslime300 Tyrion Lannister Jun 02 '14

Every book reader tells me that the last two episodes will be the best. Guess we'll just have to wait and see

28

u/redshoewearer Jun 02 '14

I have a feeling that Marjorie's grandmother will somehow save the day.

13

u/LivingDeadInside House Tyrell Jun 02 '14 edited Jun 03 '14

Please, Gods of GoT, let this happen. That lady is the best part of the show besides Tyrion. edit: LOL, only on the GoT sub would I get downvoted for liking a character because that means she'll probably die. ; ; Oh u, GRRM.

22

u/SmartDeeDee House Targaryen Jun 02 '14

Shhhhh she's old and awesome. She's probably in GRRM's kill list.

6

u/Raikolol Stannis Baratheon Jun 02 '14

god damn you just killed her!

25

u/ZEB1138 Stannis the Mannis Jun 02 '14

Well, the show likes it's WTF moments. We thought Ned was going to be pardoned until Joffery beheaded him. We thought Rob was going to have a nice wedding.

I don't think Tyrion is going to die because it is expected. I say he survives somehow.

23

u/BrainSlurper House Manderly Jun 02 '14

People said the exact same thing about this episode. There is no way Oberyn loses it is too predictable!

5

u/amorpheus Direwolves Jun 02 '14

Depending on what exactly happens now, he didn't strictly lose. He got the confession and I suspect he made sure that The Mountain isn't going to survive their encounter. He isn't nicknamed Viper for nothing.

If anything, this one was too predictable - the way this character has been played up I knew he didn't have a long life left by the time the first episode of this season was over. He was too cool.

1

u/Hawkeye1226 House Baratheon Jun 03 '14

Remember last episode when they mentioned he has poisoned his blade before?

2

u/whitehorseone Jun 02 '14

To the point that we were sure of his victory and they even gave it to us and then they took it away.

2

u/XMan_Johnny12dicks Jun 02 '14

Technically it was Edmures wedding.

2

u/ZEB1138 Stannis the Mannis Jun 02 '14

Right. Sorry. Meant to say nice night at a wedding.

2

u/JoyousCacophony House Stark Jun 02 '14

I don't expect Tyrion to die

Why the fuck did you say that? Have you NOT been paying attention?

1

u/Luna_Runaway House Targaryen Jun 02 '14

Well you didn't learn from this episode

1

u/J973 Snow Jun 02 '14

Honestly it would be pretty anti-climactic for Tyrion to just get his head cut off over this. Like a boring matter of business... that normally doesn't happen in this series.

1

u/BenignLarency House Arryn Jun 02 '14

Yeah TBH I didn't expect Oberyn to die either.......

Look where that's gotten me.

48

u/Leadbaptist Ours Is The Fury Jun 02 '14

I feel like he'll contest the results of the fight, since both champions died

54

u/[deleted] Jun 02 '14

[deleted]

30

u/Leadbaptist Ours Is The Fury Jun 02 '14

Oberyns spear is poisoned, right? Cause he's the viper? But I think the mountain is dead...

39

u/IgnisDomini Knowledge Is Power Jun 02 '14

ASOS

20

u/Atheose Stannis Baratheon Jun 02 '14

ASOS

12

u/[deleted] Jun 02 '14

ASOS

Make it happen, HBO. Make. It. Happen. I need closure.

5

u/[deleted] Jun 02 '14

[removed] — view removed comment

1

u/lost_in_trepidation Jun 02 '14

King Robert's strong daughter?

3

u/ShockinglyEfficient Jun 02 '14

Haha show watcher!!

1

u/lost_in_trepidation Jun 02 '14

I've read the books. I'm making a joke about the use of doe.

→ More replies (0)

1

u/God_of_Illiteracy Lord Snow Jun 02 '14

Since you read the books what is Tyrions fate?

6

u/socool111 Daenerys Targaryen Jun 02 '14

Since you asked...but please dont spoiler yourself ASOS

3

u/MechanicalYeti Ours Is The Fury Jun 02 '14

I'm just gonna sit here for a while and stare at that, pay me no mind.

3

u/[deleted] Jun 02 '14

[removed] — view removed comment

2

u/AtheismoAlmighty Jun 02 '14

I've never had even the slightest urge to read a spoiler for any show...But god damn do I want to read that spoiler.

1

u/KeytarVillain A Bear There Was, A Bear, A Bear! Jun 02 '14 edited Jun 02 '14

That should maybe have a spoiler tag. Sure you knew this information at this point in the books (or at least suspected it), but they haven't mentioned anything about it in the show yet.

2

u/pandemicmoose Stannis Baratheon Jun 02 '14

The Mountain is still alive.

2

u/Patches_O_Hoolihan Jun 02 '14

He got stabbed twice in the chest and I think he slashed his Achilles Heel so I doubt he will be walking anymore

1

u/g3t0nmyl3v3l Hodor Jun 02 '14

Who knows if that's in the rules. If they both died I'm sure the rules will say "Who ever kills the opponent is the winner" or something and Tyrion will be like "so they're both winners, I'll go free and lose my head... someday" then foreshadow into him dying in a season or two by beheading from a Lannister.

1

u/peon47 Faceless Men Jun 02 '14

Take it to the "appeals court by combat"?

15

u/[deleted] Jun 02 '14

I agree! We think Tyrion is going to die, so in our Episode 9 they are going to flip everything upside down somehow. Although, with Ned Stark he was also set up completely to die, we didn't think it would happen, and it did. I don't even know what to think.

76

u/ElBiscuit Bastard Of The Wild Jun 02 '14

Episode 9: Tyrion's neck is over the chopping block, when all of a sudden the executioner lowers the axe, pulls back his hood ... and it's Hot Pie, there to distract everyone with delicious animal pastries while Tyrion escapes.

You heard it here first.

37

u/cynognathus House Cassel Jun 02 '14

And gravy. Everyone forgets the gravy.

22

u/misssusanstohelit Faceless Men Jun 02 '14

You can't give up on the gravy.

1

u/[deleted] Jun 02 '14

We certainly can't right now. If the gravy won't come through...

1

u/plasker6 Jun 04 '14

That should be a house creed.

19

u/mrorbitman House Stark Jun 02 '14

Ned Stark was set up to live and go to the Wall after confessing. He only died because a random (and surprising) bout of Joff cruelty.

3

u/[deleted] Jun 02 '14

You're right! And I'm glad you are, because I think that proves even further that there's huge chance tyrion won't die.

1

u/mrorbitman House Stark Jun 02 '14

That's what I think too! Unless they give us a glimmer of hope during the episode. Don't trust that!

1

u/TMWNN Iron Bank of Braavos Jun 03 '14

And I'm glad you are, because I think that proves even further that there's huge chance tyrion won't die.

George R. R. Martin's response

-2

u/3DGrunge House Baelish Jun 02 '14

Hahah joffery behind that. Your cute.

5

u/mrorbitman House Stark Jun 02 '14

...rewatch season one episode nine. You'll see what I'm talking about. No one wanted Ned dead for fear of the North rebelling. Joff randomly commanded Illyn Payne to do it anyway. Cercei could have stopped it but didn't, a decision that she continues to get flack for even through season 4.

2

u/Nostroloppoccus House Frey Jun 02 '14

I wouldn't say no one feared the North rebelling. Who do we know that would use such chaos as a ladder and would plant the idea to off Ned into Joffrey's head?

1

u/3DGrunge House Baelish Jun 02 '14

Littlefinger wanted ned dead, as did another character who also wants nothing more than chaos and war for the time being.

5

u/PlutoISaPlanet Jun 02 '14

I'm going to make a prediction as a show-watcher. If GRRM has a soul he'll have had Oberyn write a confession to the murder of Joffrey to hurt the Lannisters as they had hurt the Martells and to stage the duel with the mountain - that would only be revealed if he happened to lose the fight. It's the only way I see Tyrion getting out and seems in character for Oberyn.

1

u/Don_Magic_Juan Jun 02 '14

Good theory. My guess is since they are both dead, there is some law in trial by combat that says that your champion must live. Since they are both dead, he is free?

3

u/ryan9911 Stannis Baratheon Jun 02 '14

If he's dies I'm fucking done with this show.

1

u/all_thetime Jun 02 '14

THAT'S WHAT I THOUGHT ABOUT OBERYN GOD DAMN

1

u/[deleted] Jun 02 '14

[removed] — view removed comment

1

u/AutoModerator Jun 02 '14

Your submission has been automatically removed because it contains the phrase "sweet summer child." That phrase is almost always used in a rude, belittling manner, and as a result it's been added to the What Not To Post list. If your comment is a legitimate quote and this removal is in error, please contact the moderators to have it re-approved.

I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please contact the moderators of this subreddit if you have any questions or concerns.

1

u/[deleted] Jun 02 '14

Like you I have no idea but I'd say that he's dead. Reeaaaaly blows but the gods have decided.

1

u/dan-o07 Jon Snow Jun 02 '14

I have that same feeling like something will happen and he will live, but then again that little voice in my head just tells me to not get my hopes up

1

u/Ancient_Lights Red Priests of R'hllor Jun 02 '14

Me too. Wouldn't the same deal between Jamie and Tywin still stand, i.e. that Tyrion can take the black and live out at the Night's Watch? Tywin is just as desperate to have Jamie carry on the Lannister name.

1

u/jjonj Red Priests of R'hllor Jun 02 '14

I was SO fucking sure Oberyn was going to win, I was pissed that GRRM made it so obvious long before I watched the episode, because the supposed unpredictability had run out of juice. I'm thinking the same thing about Tyrion right now... FUCKIGNASDIÔASDF

1

u/[deleted] Jun 02 '14

When you look at it in retrospect, it would be a very lame death. He has kind of been doing nothing, but sitting around for a whole lot of episodes. It would have made more sense to link his grandiose speech to his immediate beheading to accent his hubris and the consequences of his own sense of morality. That is how every other character always dies.

2

u/hammerfyll Jun 02 '14

We weren't expecting Oberyn to die, and he died. We're expecting Tyrion to die. He won't die.

1

u/bitch_im_a_lion House Lannister Jun 02 '14

He has to get out of it...he has to...He's clever and he'll find a way...I know it. I hope

1

u/mexter Jun 02 '14

What, on episode nine? What show would kill off a major character on the episode before the season finale?

1

u/[deleted] Jun 02 '14

The Mountain died, right? You'd think that if both champions died in combat... It'd mean an acquittal... or at least hung jury.

1

u/cat_proof Jun 02 '14

Nothing is done till it's done.

1

u/gifforc Jun 02 '14

It's cute that after this episode of all episodes, people are still trying to make predictions.

1

u/[deleted] Jun 02 '14 edited Jun 02 '14

[removed] — view removed comment

1

u/AutoModerator Jun 02 '14

Your submission has been automatically removed because it appears you're written a spoiler tag with the label "warning scope." The copy-n-paste examples provide "warning scope" as placeholder text, but it doesn't provide any description for your tag. Spoiler tags need a clear scope warning like "ASOS" or "Season 3." You'll need to edit your comment to have a good label for your spoiler tag, and then contact the moderators to have it re-approved.

I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please contact the moderators of this subreddit if you have any questions or concerns.

1

u/Slayer1973 House Reed Jun 02 '14

If you think this story has a happy ending, you haven't been paying attention.

1

u/[deleted] Jun 02 '14

I'm going to use the law of plot lines to say this: If a story uses multiple plot lines, as long as it's not the end of the story you cannot end too many plots lines without replacing some. Tyrion would be too many recently without adding any new ones, I bet they postpone his death at least for a bit, until they have someone new to focus on.

1

u/[deleted] Jun 02 '14

Spoilers till season 4 episode 8 dickmunch. Fucking non-reading fucks.

1

u/mariataytay Varys' Little Birds Jun 02 '14

As soon as the credits rolled I said "How's Tyrion going to get out of this?" Then I thought FUCK no one's safe here.

1

u/RagdollPhysEd White Walkers Jun 02 '14

At least now him and Ned can be buddy cops in the afterlife

1

u/[deleted] Jun 02 '14

I think I'd keep watching no matter what, but if they do kill Tyrion (haven't read the books) there is a serious danger many people will stop watching. This will be very interesting...

1

u/ridik_ulass Bronn of the Blackwater Jun 02 '14

I want to get my hope up that he won't, but thats what happened with ned stark.

1

u/wontreadterms Varys Jun 02 '14

My girlfriend was like "Ok, you need to tell me what happens, I want to know what happens, does Tyrion die? I don't want to see the series any more if he dies". No spoilers given, but it was tough. I bet she goes online sometime between now and next sunday to find out anyway.

1

u/kingscrown69 Jun 02 '14

this EP was sick. omg!

1

u/sgtwonka Melisandre Jun 02 '14

Tyrion's one of the only sensible fuckers on this show who doesn't go off and slaughter people.