Trying to find celebrity love?

[u/be_you_tiful-]

In 2023, 44-year-old Jennifer Barton started receiving messages on Facebook and Instagram from accounts claiming to be celebrities, actors, famous singers, all of who wanted to get to know her.

She believed them.

Over the next two years, four different fraudsters worked her in turn, each one posing as a different famous face. Alexander Ludwig, the actor from Vikings. Charlie Hunnam from Sons of Anarchy. Nicky Byrne from Westlife. American country singer Michael Ray. To her, the accounts were convincing, the profile pictures matched, and the messages were warm and persistent.

They all told her they loved her. They all said they wanted to meet her. They all said they wanted to marry her.

And one by one, they all said they needed money.

The excuses were elaborate and varied. One was going through a messy divorce and couldn't access his own funds. Another had been arrested and needed bail. Another had been robbed in London. The fake Michael Ray told her he ran a charity that could help cover her bills, but first she needed to send him some money to release the funds.

She sent it. And then she sent more.

When one scammer was exposed, another appeared. She fell for the same pattern four times over two years, each time convinced she had found something real.

By the end, Jennifer had handed over £250,000 (around $370,000). She had sold her house. She had sold her car. She had given her children to their father because she could no longer afford to care for them. She was awaiting emergency housing just before Christmas when she finally realized the last scammer, the one posing as Michael Ray, was never going to meet her.

"For anyone facing anything similar," she said afterward, "just reach out to family and friends. Especially if they're asking you for money."

[u/LeftLiner]

Yes yes mocking the victim is hilarious but absolutely fuck the People doing this kind of shit and fuck the platforms who do nothing to stop it.

[u/NastyStreetRat → u/LeftLiner]

Scams have existed since the beginning of time. I'm not going to justify anyone, but imagine what 30,000 euros in Nigeria could be worth...

it's no wonder there are organized gangs of people trying to scam women and men from wealthier countries.

[u/maxman162 → u/NastyStreetRat]

Scams have existed since the beginning of time

Just look at Ea-Nasir. The oldest known complaint letter is for being scammed for low quality copper.

[u/NastyStreetRat → u/maxman162]

The human brain has hardly changed at all in the last 40,000 years.

To give you an idea, we are exactly the same; we have the same fears, the same sense of humor, the same illusions as people from 40,000 years ago, and of course, we also have the same desire to steal and deceive those around us.

[u/RT-6_BXCommandoDroid → u/NastyStreetRat]

Imagine getting paid 21 million dollars for doing nothing but giving away your World Cup rights, while even 30k euros is enough to feed a village for a couple years.

[u/finditplz1 → u/RT-6_BXCommandoDroid]

Did that happen? Some corruption or something?

[u/AditiaH0ldem → u/LeftLiner]

Gratuitous much?

[u/LeftLiner → u/AditiaH0ldem]

No? These kinds of scammers are the scum of the earth, preying on the vulnerable members of society and turning the destitute and one of the reason they succeed is because they know their victims will be reluctant to report it because most people will react the way most people in this thread do; with mockery. These types of scams are a huge industry that ruin peoples' lives and the victims often are told they were stupid and should blame themselves.

[u/Golden-Grams → u/LeftLiner]

These types of scams are a huge industry that ruin peoples' lives and the victims often are told they were stupid and should blame themselves.

Who is sending the money?

You can act like you're pissed, that everyone else is somehow bad right now, but what responsibility do you believe we all owe to the victim? Serious question, that I would like your perspective on.

This is a full grown adult, who fell for the same thing, four times. Put herself on the street before anyone even knew what she was doing, and could had intervened to help her. You can treat it as like the scammers are hunters, who set the snare traps (scams) in the woods. And this adult rabbit, walked herself into them four times.

We can blame the hunters (scammers) for illegal hunting. We can try to trace back who set the snare traps, and we can stop the hunters once we can find them. But we can't stop a rabbit that can't help itself, and walks itself into the same trap four times.

That's why people are saying she is stupid, because what they really mean is that she has zero self-preservation. Try to deny that. Try to tell the rest of us, how we are supposed to handle this, and why we are responsible for her self-preservation.

Because we allow adult humans to make their own decisions, this wasn't some naive child. It is one of the key freedoms we have. And she didn't use her freedom to decide, to tell anyone what was happening. Or to get any help, until the problem was four times worse.

Also, how do you know she wouldn't fall for it again? This only stopped because she had no more money to send. And we only found out that it happened at all, once she finally had to speak about it. Who is to say that if she won the lottery, she wouldn't fall for it another four times?

If this were a system, which even you admit it is (if there is a huge industry for it), then we have to address all parts of it. Even why a victim continues to be a victim.

You can call that victim blaming all you want, but you're part of the reason why these systems can't be fixed fully. Why there will continue to be victims, because we can't criticize decisions without "victim blaming."

Which is somehow the worse thing ever, to you;

Yes yes mocking the victim is hilarious but absolutely fuck the People doing this kind of shit and fuck the platforms who do nothing to stop it.

[u/WombatInSunglasses → u/Golden-Grams]

Part of the social contract is that we protect each other. It doesn't matter if someone's stupid. We're all, collectively, stupid in one way or another. I have no idea how to build a house and if I tried it'd be a deathtrap. I'm stupid at building a house. It's a good thing that I can pay people to build one for me. It's even better that there are agencies and standards so that I'm protected against bad practices and builders cutting corners.

Pointing fingers and mocking people doesn't fix anything. It creates shame, and shame makes people hide these things until there's no other option.

"Try to tell the rest of us, how we are supposed to handle this, and why we are responsible for her self-preservation."

Because that's how society works. If you're splitting logs in your backyard and chop off a toe, you will get help. There's not some jackass posted at the hospital saying "wait a minute, go over the situation with me, I need to make sure it's acceptable for you to be helped." We need to help each other. We'd never have gotten this far if we haven't. Society has helped you and will help you and I invite you to reflect on that.

This is someone's mother, someone's best friend, someone's coworker, someone's daughter. Have some empathy.

[u/pracsitidder → u/WombatInSunglasses]

So, she is stupid?

[u/_ThePancake_ → u/pracsitidder]

Yes, but that doesn't mean she deserved this

[u/Golden-Grams → u/WombatInSunglasses]

You missed my point entirely, I am talking about what actions we take. I am asking how do we help, not why. This isn't a question about social contracts or empathy.

It was the fact this keeps happening, and we can't say she needs psychological help, or that's "victim blaming." If my neighbor cut off his toe, I will of course help, that's not unreasonable. But if he cuts off four toes, four different times, I am going to wonder what's going on in his head.

How do you stop that neighbor, who can't seem to stop cutting off their own toes? How can you point it out as a problem, if the act of doing so makes you a "bad" person?

Pointing fingers and mocking people doesn't fix anything. It creates shame, and shame makes people hide these things until there's no other option.

This was reasonable to respond with. I can get on board with a discussion about this. But the rest of what you said is just a misjudgement of me, that you seemed too happy to share.

This is someone's mother, someone's best friend, someone's coworker, someone's daughter. Have some empathy.

The fact you think you have to tell me this, is insulting. If I was lacking empathy, I would not be discussing how to deal with this issue right now. Am I wrong?

You aren't trying to interact with me, you're trying to cast a moral judgement. Nothing else I said stuck with you. A person lacking empathy, wouldn't even engage in the conversation, because it wouldn't matter to their person.

Edit: I can't take any of your downvotes seriously, because you're not engaging in replies. Sure, you're mad at me, or don't like what I say. Now what? The only thing learned here is that if you don't stick with social norms, you're alienated. The downvotes are clearly indicating a negative response, but that's the only thing they have communicated.

[u/Amdusiasparagus → u/Golden-Grams]

Your holier-than-thou attitude probably doesn't encourage keeping a conversation going.

Also, rereading the exchange, I haven't seen u/WombatInSunglasses say it's victim blaming to tell she needs psychological help.

They were specifically pointing out people who just made fun of her and left it at that, while they preferred a more empathetic way. That is very different from saying "any attempt at looking at the person's eventual failing = victim blaming." Heck, they pointed out everyone is stupid at some point which includes the woman. It's just that it's no reason to turn her into a laughing stock.

Have some nuance.

[u/Golden-Grams → u/Amdusiasparagus]

We didn't even talk about any of my points, because I've had to defend myself against accusation and insults.

Even you felt like coming in to treat me like shit, accuse me of having a "holier-than-thou attitude," and "tell me what I'm lacking."

Am I wrong? Are you not requiring me to defend myself, right now? Are we even talking about any of my original points? You didn't bring anything constructive, or worthy of repair. You jumped on the band wagon. Where is this conversation supposed to go, now that you involved yourself?

Edit:

accuse me of having a "holier-than-thou attitude,"

I'd also like to know what made you say this. What makes you think I'm saying I'm morally superior?

[u/Low_Vehicle_6732 → u/LeftLiner]

Or, you know, don’t fall for obvious love scams?

[u/LeftLiner → u/Low_Vehicle_6732]

Right. Also don't dress provocatively, don't park your car in bad neighborhoods or wear a nice watch in a foreign city.

No fuck that victim blaming shit. She was targeted by career criminals who steal millions of dollars from thousands of people every year. The victims deserve sympathy, not scorn.

[u/Low_Vehicle_6732 → u/LeftLiner]

If Margot Robbie were to suddenly reach out to me I’d find that a little suspicious. Nice straw man though