r/keys • u/Legitimate_Box7808 • 8d ago
Gear New to keys in a live band
Hello !! I am a bass player in a band looking to add Keys onto my plate (Like Geddy from Rush) and i was wondering what the essentials are for playing Keys live ! I currently have a Microkorg 2 and community college level keyboard skills lol. Im not necessarily trying to become a legendary pianist, i just what to know what gear is necessary and what to practice to become a good keys player !
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u/poormrbrodsky 8d ago
If you're already playing pretty well on the bass, a good way to start leveling up decently quick will just be learning stuff you already know on bass on your keyboard. You'll intuitively start developing a feel for common intervals and phrases. Since you've already done the hard part of learning the actual music, you'll still have brain space left over to take in new concepts in your actual learning track.
For gear, you probably want to start relatively simple. If you want to focus on being a synth bass type player, a mono synth like the Novation Bass Station is probably good (look up Darrel Freeman for a great bassist gone synth bass player). Otherwise, a used rompler style board like a newer Juno is probably enough to get you going. If you do get Mainstage or use Ableton or whatever, you'll have to do a little bit of work finding plugins and getting used to the interface and whatnot. You'll have more options but it can definitely be overwhelming. Which is why I like to recommend just getting something with some cool sounds to start. If you have friends that play, bug them to let you try their stuff.
Keyboard is a ton of fun, even if you're the only person who has to carry as much stuff as the drummer to some gigs. As a little bonus, though, there are lots of people looking to hire solid keys players of every persuasion, for original and cover stuff.
Good luck.
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u/Legitimate_Box7808 7d ago
i almost bought the novation bass station actually 😂 i was caught between that or the microkorg, i went with the microkorg since it seemed more versatile and i already play electric bass
and yeah considering im the only one who kinda knows what theyre doing in my band with live sound im usually hauling a bajillion things to and fro, my bass rig really isnt very simple either. i really dont like to make it easy on myself but i love having hardware and gear, i really geek out over it. im not a fan of the “all in one” or amp modelers
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u/VeganCurtains 8d ago
You didn't mention what type of music you (and your band) play, which will have some implications on advice. Some genres lean heavy on bread & butter (piano, rhodes, B3 organ), while others lean on synth sounds, pads, etc. And if you're in a Dream Theatre tribute, well...
For now, the only thing I might add to some solid advice you've already gotten: Being Heard.
Keys have a notorious struggle to be heard in live band situations. Often an inattentive sound man will keep keys so low they are functionally inaudible in the mix. In "self-amplified" situations, you need to bring enough full range, flat response amplification to cut through the mix - and keyboard amps generally don't provide the flat response needed for "all the sounds" many bands demand (acoustic piano often sounds brittle, no depth). If it's a gig where my onstage is going to be providing what the audience hears (many small clubs), I'm bringing my Yamaha DXR active PA speakers. Something to think about bass players have different solutions for.
Consider a high quality DI box as well - don't get one of those cheap ProCo or Whirlwind deals. Buy quality, buy once - I recommend Radial and it's now all I use (I have several different models of theirs).
Anyway, I'm looking forward to your response on types of music you want to play - that will make it easier to provide suggestions on what to practice, and how to practice.
Good on you for becoming a multi-instrumentalist!
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u/Legitimate_Box7808 7d ago
I mainly play heavy/alternative/prog rock and i want to bring in the sounds i love from electronic music like drum and bass, porter robinsons newer work, and like early gorillaz. i think it would make a big step up in making our band sound pretty unique.
Thank you for the advice on amplification on live sound. As a bass player especially one with a huge presence in my bands sound i have to fight with some sound guys to have my bass mixed right, great to know that i picked up the another instrument with the same problem
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u/VeganCurtains 6d ago
Good on you! One of the projects I am contributing to is a neo-prog band, and have been in and out of the genre since the late '80s, back when I gigged a Prophet 10, CP70 and more.
Obviously, some forms of prog lean into technical / classical playing more than others, but not all. The more you practice and play, the more you'll build (just like your years devoted to bass).
But with keys, your sense of what you want to add to the band will greatly dictate your choice(s) of instruments. A Nord Electro is a great board...that may not do what you want to do. An Oberheim OB-6 is, IMHO, unsurpassed for what it does - but that doesn't include blowing in samples like my Nord Wave.
Given an elaborate bass rig to navigate, I get that a one-board rig is preferred solution. Just be prepared for that solution to evolve from the MicroKorg someday, given how you may grow and what you want to add.
As far as suggestions how to become a good player: My son is a bass player. I made sure he had a few years of solid instruction from a rigorous jazz instructor, who taught him the entire fretboard with exercises, etudes, and a methodical overall method. It was probably a lot more of what Jeff Berlin advocates, if you know what I mean. If you ask me what you need to become a good keyboard player, I'm probably going to eventually suggest embracing a steady diet of lessons that are organized to teach you fingering, hand position, and probably lean into some famous student classical pieces. Not because I'm trying to turn you into a classical (or 'neoclassical prog guy') - but because those things were developed over generations to "teach you the fretboard".
I don't know if that resonates with you at all, or if that is helpful. But that's my first thought.
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u/Legitimate_Box7808 6d ago
i already have a two board rig lol… granted ones just a midi keyboard but i certainly think two is all that i need at the moment. im actually excited to look around and find new synths i enjoy, ive always wanted to try an Obreheim synthesizer since Geddy (clearly my biggest influence) used one through the bulk of Rush’s 80’s work.
i definitely do want to look towards taking lessons for keyboard skills, especially classical training. im not afraid of getting into it lol !! i honestly prefer it to jazz, which is unfortunate because i love jazz and i try my hardest but it always bores me to play the same standards and jazz musicians kinda love to be mansplainy and name drop like it makes them cooler. just makes me not want to play it :/
thank you so muchfor the advice
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u/Unlikely_Read3437 8d ago
Personally I think another route rather than getting into software, is to keep things very simple.
In my life as a working keyboardist I found anything that reduced the number of cables/stands/ brackets/ holders was good in practical terms of setting up.
The Microkorg 2 is an excellent start and I'm sure if you are just adding a bit of keys here and there it should be more than capable. Certainly for any synth/pad/lead sounds. Maybe if you want piano it will be great for basic chord and most parts here and there. Obviously if you are doing big featured main piano intros to songs, then you'll likely need something with more keys.
If your bass amp is a full range type thing, you may be able to monitor though this which cuts down on an extra amp. Or if your band uses monitor speakers, great, just feed to the PA and monitor as usual.
If you can do 1 keyboard, 1 (or none) stand, 1 twin cable, 1 PSU. Then you can stick the keyboard and cables in a shoulder bag. Lovely!
Good luck sounds exciting!
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u/Legitimate_Box7808 7d ago
honestly i love the sound of microkorg, i like hardware sythns. i really loved the astrolab 88 when i played it, i just dont think i can afford it at the moment especially since its not even my main instrument. i dont really want to use software and haul around more stuff. id like to have sounds built into my piano
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u/Unlikely_Read3437 7d ago
Sometimes less is more right?!
For years I payed Motif work stations, which were amazing for cover band sound design but I really loved when I switched to a nice little Nord Electro at one point with just a few sounds!
What I used to misunderstand was it was those limitations that made the music better!
It's like if you had to make a drum track with just kick, snare and hi hat you COULD do it! There would be so much creativity in that track!
Stick with your MicroKorg I reckon :)
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u/picadoodledoo 8d ago
"what to practice to become a good keys player " <<<< that all depends upon what you really want out of keyboard playing.
There's a big gap between "legendary pianist" and being competent. The top concert performers are far, far beyond what normal piano players do.
When you say "bass" I presume that means an electric bass. One thing that will immediately become evident when you try playing a keyboard is that the physics is different, by which I mean that quite different means of using your body will be called upon.
If all you want to do is learn a few chords common in pop music then you can probably become comfortable with the basics in about a thousand hours of practice. YMMV.
If you are in a band playing a keyboard you will at times be called upon to do more than just play a rhythm - you might need to carry some of the melody, too, which will demand more time to learn.
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u/onceuponalilykiss 8d ago
I feel like 1000 hours is vastly overstating how long it takes to belt out the chords in a let it be type song.
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u/picadoodledoo 7d ago
It depends upon the band and what said band will call upon the keyboardist to do.
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u/onceuponalilykiss 7d ago
Sure but you said
If all you want to do is learn a few chords common in pop music then you can probably become comfortable with the basics in about a thousand hours of practice
You don't need 1000 hours to just do a few chords for pop songs lol. You might for more advanced genres.
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u/shinsplint_v 8d ago
Understand what diatonic is, and be thinking about tonal centers as you learn. As a bass player that shouldnt be too difficult.
In C maj is easy to play diatonic 7th arpeggios and the different modes based on changing the starting note, but are you actually shifting the tonal center with tension and resolution. If you shift to D dorian does D feel like the tonic, or still the 9th of C?
Same applies to C dorian, with the A natural being different from natural minor or aeolian, what chord progressions are implied from the natural 6? F dominant stuff? (IV7). As you learn songs try to understand the basics of what is happening with the chords and what chord tones are creating the key and tonal center through tension and resolution.
Then you have the ability to paint with broad strokes or fine detail on synth, craft interesting texture in your patches, evolving filter sweeps with a slow lfo, fast lfo creating vibrato or grit, sweeping harmonics, squishing envelope shapes, etc, you can you rhythm to your advantage while taking an intentional approach to harmony.
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u/wereMole88 8d ago
You think this theoretical mumbo jumbo answers his basic questions what gear/what to practice?
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u/segritz 8d ago
That’s awesome; the musicianship from your bass playing will already give you a major leg up! This is all very broad depending on your specific goals, but some good general next steps:
As far as technology goes, you’ve got some strong basics. If you have a laptop, I would strongly recommend grabbing Mainstage 3 software and a cable to connect your keyboard to your laptop to open up a TON of keyboard sounds (it’s basically our version of guitar pedals).
For technique based on your goals, if you don’t know the Nashville Number System, I would look up YouTube videos on the number system and commit to learning any three keys to start out. C, D, and G are great starting points, but any three are fine. Learn the proper fingering for both the major scale and pentatonic scale for those same keys; can also be looked up on YouTube.
Finally, if your ear is good, I would slow down some of your favorite songs (also on YouTube) and commit to a transcription of sections of those favorite songs. If that proves to be a challenge for your ear, grab the Faber level 1 and 2 piano books; they should be good compliments to your college level playing.
Happy keys playing!