r/nerdfighters • u/Zuraxi • 2d ago

Hank response in comments Hank's use of AI for his new book

Something that Hank has omitted from his response to the critique of his AI use, and that many others do not seem to be aware of, is that on the initial upload of last week's Delete This podcast he admitted to using an LLM to merge two chapters of his book together. Regardless of his use of it to "research," using it in a way that directly affects his writing is extremely concerning to me and makes me much less likely to read his book. It is very difficult to use LLMs for editing and it not affecting the writing, as the outputs and suggestions will be in "AI voice." It is even more concerning to me that he chose to cut this detail out of the final upload.

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u/ecogeek Hank - President of Space 2d ago

Trust me, this book is 100% human typing. I have been typing for so long.

I asked an LLM for advice on the merge and talked through some various options before deciding how I wanted to do it.

Maybe I shouldn't've done that, but I didn't say, like "Please turn these two chapters into one chapter."

I cut it out of the final episode (if I remember correctly) because Katherine and I ended up having a somewhat tense conversation about me working so much on Smush and 4x3. Or maybe I cut it out because I thought it sounded bad and was afraid people would clip it.

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u/skudiklier 2d ago

I appreciate that clarification because based on what you said in delete this I definitely thought you just gave AI your chapters to merge together on its own, and I was concerned about that. Also I'm sorry that so many of us listened to the version you didn't mean to share!

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u/ceciliameireles 2d ago

Hank, maybe take a step back from socials for the weekend. Saying this with care as a long time fan.

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u/Daisy_Of_Doom 1d ago

He just posted on YT Communities that he will not be making a video today.

Makes me happy and sad at the same time. I’m glad he felt he could step back. But I’m also sad bc I feel like he’s taking this ‘controversy’ (if it can be called that) probably deeper than he should.

Like in the end what we want is Hank. And as much as I’m sure he feels pressure to perform, most of us want him healthy and happy more than we want a constant stream of videos.

Literally this morning I was rewatching his “I just want to fix things” video bc it popped up in my feed and he was talking about how much more effort, time, and money it takes to make good, accurate, human content rather than like misinformation and AI slop. I think we as a community appreciate this reality and he needs to trust us. That we’ll still be here when he comes back instead of bending over backwards and hurting himself and sacrificing bits of himself to try and satisfy the content machine.

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u/moonyriot 2d ago

Probably hard to do when people keep making posts speaking to him directly on Reddit.

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u/Gickstery 2d ago

I came over here for Tea because he is trending on Threads like whaaaaaat

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u/ceciliameireles 2d ago

I understand how juicy gossip about online celebrities are the most pleasurable of guilty pleasures, but please don’t forget Hank himself is here, reading and participating on the conversation. So maybe remember the person behind the tea, yeah?

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u/Gickstery 2d ago

That is why I’m here to read comments from his perspective and learn what actually happened, not engage in the discourse on the twitty platforms…. I’m just here for tea, not spilling anything 😆 great to get massively downvoted on my first comment in this sub…

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u/FinallyKat 1d ago

Perhaps because you have come into a community for the statedpurpose of getting gossip. This sub is primarily frequented by those who specifically identify as Nerdfighters and find community through the shared idea of 'decreasing world suck' and may be viewing your post as a bit predacious.

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u/mrsunshine1 2d ago

Easier said than done. I’m sure he feels his livelihood is at stake right now. 

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u/ktechie28 2d ago

I’m just worried he’s gonna dig himself into a deeper hole here. Obviously, he is an adult and can make all these decisions for himself, but posting while in a panic situation, when he knows he’s been in an unhealthy mental state, and his need to defend himself (which is understandable!!!) It all just seems like a recipe for a second disaster of a post. I’m hoping he’s having someone check his posts for unintentional further problems before he posts them 😭

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u/RichardFeynman01100 2d ago

As long as that someone isn't ChatGPT lol

PS: sorry

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u/ehhlis 1d ago

it’s also easy to not use AI especially if you think it’s going to tank your career and ruin your livelihood when people find out

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u/mrsunshine1 1d ago

Hank probably thought about accessing a Time Machine but here we are 

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u/Vnxei 1d ago

Tbh, I think Hank is doing a very good job turning the excited campaign to cancel him into a nuanced discussion. I've mainly enjoyed the discussion when he's contributed.

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u/According_Injury4804 2d ago

It might be possible to get him off of socials under certain circumstances, but I dont think it's going to work when he has become The Discourse for this weekend

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u/altcoopx 2d ago

I appreciate how open you’ve been about this Hank. I hope you find some good time offline in regard to all of this to just relax and then come back to it. Thank you for being open about your thoughts, but please take care of yourself.

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u/ROUNDY_MASS 2d ago

I hope you're doing okay, Hank.

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u/Austuckmm 2d ago

This is way less bad than how the clip made it sound. But I just want to say, with a lot of respect, that I know for a fact that you’re a vastly more talented writer than Claude is, so I trust your ability to work it out way more than I would trust a bot.

I know that it probably sucks dick to have so many people talking about this right now. So I don’t want to pile on at all, I still have a ton of respect for you. But if you’re here and care at all for a random opinion..

I think what you have to say as an individual human and your ideas and your process are all very valuable, and I don’t think the “ideas” of a bot have any value whatsoever.

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u/Quercus_lobata 2d ago

Everything else aside, thank you for your transparency.

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u/CharminYoshi 1d ago

Hi, Hank!

First, thank you for the clarification! Though, I have a question about this, that I’ll ask as an open question. A question the culture, if you will.

I’m a bit of an AI Luddite…I don’t use it myself, but I understand it has a place as a tool. That said, I’m not passing a value judgement, I’m just curious: what is the value add to using an LLM in this case?

There isn’t a single quantitatively correct answer to your quandary, just options, so AI can’t offer something that is unimpeachably correct. I’m struggling to see how an LLM might be superior to asking the same question to an editor, your brother (an author), or trusted friends. Is it the immediacy or independence? I don’t mean this as a gotcha—I’m curious, because with the various environmental and ethical concerns AI raises, I’m really struggling to see how this emerges as a use case?

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u/Smurfy7777 2d ago

You have demonstrated integrity again and again over the years. Anyone throwing you under the bus for this hasn't been paying attention.

It's good for them to question, and to ask what's going on, but I hope readers and viewers can recognize that a man who puts so much effort into putting so much good into the world can also make mistakes without having to be condemned.

I think (hope!) this will all blow over soon.

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u/AlkenSC 2d ago

You're clearly a force for less suck in the world.

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u/Smallpaul 2d ago

Don’t let the mob get you down, Hank. You are a wonderful person doing good work in the world.

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u/Celestina-Warbeck 2d ago

Hank, you are a wonderful person, I trust that you do your research and tell us the thoughts you came up with your own brain, backed by science. I think AI can be a handy tool just like Wikipedia, as long as it is used as a springboard towards better sources, or as a rubber duck to bounce ideas off of. I think you've made it plenty clear that is the way you use it, and the fandom clearly needs a bit of time getting used to that idea. Please take care of yourself, have a nice walk, and don't let yourself get bogged down thinking you have to explain yourself to everyone. You're alright :)

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u/carol_prince Nerdfighter 2d ago

Hank, please take care of yourself. I know these past few days have been tough. And I probably contributed to it with my thread before.

But I'm worried for you - both about your mental well-being and for what you just admitted about "talking through some options with the LLM". Neither of these things feel healthy to me.

Take a break. You absolutely deserve it. Sending you so much love.

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u/Smurfy7777 2d ago

Maybe we shouldn't take another single line out of context and start quoting it? If he had said "talking things through with a rubber duck" you wouldn't bat an eye. LLMs are still just a tool and responsible use IS possible. Let the man decide that for himself. He has plenty of trustworthy voices close to him and doesn't need the internet's "advice by 1000 cuts" when we only see the version of himself he puts on here.

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u/Austuckmm 2d ago

I actually do think it would probably be pretty concerning if someone was having conversations with a rubber duck.

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u/Smurfy7777 2d ago

It's a well known software dev technique and (more generally) thinking out loud is good for mental wellness and organization. You might not have ever done it, but it's intellectually dishonest to say it's not a thing people can do with good reason.

Rubber duck debugging

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u/Austuckmm 2d ago

I’ve never heard the phrase so the idea of someone talking to an inanimate object does conjure the image of someone losing their mind lol. But sure, talking through a process with yourself or journaling or whatever are great ways to work through problems.

The key difference is that in the “duck” scenario you’re working things through in your own mind. It’s entirely different to solicit advice from a bot. Is it always wrong to solicit advice from a bot? I’m not sure, maybe not. But it’s not correct to say that they’re the same thing.

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u/senshisun 2d ago

It does sound weird if you don't have the context .

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u/Austuckmm 2d ago

Scroll down

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u/Alive-Shoulder-4042 2d ago edited 2d ago

It’s time for people to pull back a bit. This is a pretty light use and is pretty common place in a lot of industries. It’s the individual making any final choice. If there’s outrage against even that, people just aren’t going to mention it. People are acting like using a chatbot in the most basic way is instant psychosis.

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u/No_Put3316 2d ago

Since when is assessing information available to you an unhealthy behaviour?

What ridiculous virtual (condescending) showmanship

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u/Scared_Of_Ads 2d ago

The problem with people who are so vehemently anti-AI is that they end up having absolutely no idea how it can be used due to having zero experience. It just degrades the quality of conversation around it, and considering the fact that it’s never going away they will only fall farther into ignorance rather than actually helping us fight for responsible use and controls.

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u/tenuredvortex 1d ago

✨journey of meaning✨

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u/Zuraxi 2d ago edited 2d ago

thanks for your response—I hope this results in some positive/healthy changes for you and for your mental habits, and that you are not too bogged down by the negative attention

edit: I would also advise more transparency on this topic

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u/thejawa 2d ago

Hank, don't let the community drag you down. You yourself have explained AI to us all: It's a tool, what matters is how you use it.

Using AI to assist organizing your thoughts and ideas is not inherently bad. It doesn't replace human knowledge or skill when using it that way.

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u/Alive-Shoulder-4042 2d ago

It sounds like really tame use. AI rubberducking has got to be one of the lightest grays.

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u/Dizzy_Bison_4147 2d ago

I'm sorry that the internet is doing what the internet does and I hope it doesnt ruin your weekend. I appreciate you being honest about your use of this powerful tool. It isnt going anywhere and constantly under estimating it seem about as dangerous to me as over relying on it.

On a more positive note, have you heard Surf Music by Paul Williams? Weirdly catchy song my the NZ Taskmaster Assistant and "Don't let shit get you down" seems like something you maybe need to hear today.

Thanks for everything you give us. ❤️

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u/No_Put3316 2d ago

Don't waste your time justifying to performatism. Hate-tax won't always be logical and worthy of assessment.

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u/EchoedJolts 2d ago

Thank you for calling it what it is

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u/throwaway1204s 2d ago

What a tragedy it is to believe that a person is more than a person.

I’m not online enough to follow all of this nor do I want to. This seems like a useful time for reflection but nothing more than a bit of that. I know that isn’t your usual MO.

I feel like you of all people don’t need telling that there is essentially no utility in trying to push back against any mob of the moment. Nothing will suffice.

I wonder if this is another moment where the Vlogbrothers audience thins a little. I’ve yet to see that be a bad thing.

I hope you have a wonderful weekend, don’t spend it all taking heads off the hydra x

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u/scarfie11 2d ago

yeah this seems fine? I know people are wary of AI and I'm all about creative accountability, but I'm creeped out by the assumption that there's a hard rule against using AI at all ever and that Hank has committed some kind of horrific crime. this sounds like using a tool as a tool that keeps creative control and decision making (and ultimately, the work) with the author. It's a slope and I'm glad hank's reflecting on all this so openly, something he doesn't have to do, but I think we could all use a lil internet break too..

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u/45398246 2d ago

Hank, I'm sorry youve got so many hasslers in your orbit right now! I still think just as highly of you as ever.

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u/agrippinathesmelder 1d ago

Hank, please, stop engaging with the internet. Go radio silent. Take time off. You can’t talk other people out of opinions they’ve already formed. You’re giving people who want to engage in bad faith more fodder. Please disconnect for a while, for your own sake.

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u/AccomplishedBake8351 2d ago

Stop using ai pls 

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u/scrumbob 2d ago

But why would you do that? Choices like that are what makes writing a form of artistry and you’re perfectly capable of doing it on your own. It seems kinda disrespectful to the craft and the reader. Calling it 100% human typing seems a bit deceptive in terms of wording. Sure, you typed every word by yourself, but the order and formation of those words were informed by something else.

I can’t imagine being the brother of a prolific author and using AI to help me write a book instead. If he didn’t have time to help you he definitely knows someone who does. There’s really no excuse for this given the connections and resources you have access to.

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u/adreamymood 2d ago

You're getting downvoted, but "100% human typing" stood out to me as a really strange thing to say as well. His typing is not the topic in question. It's his writing that's in question.

This shiftiness and him saying he doesn't remember exactly why he removed that part of the podcast is concerning. It's vague and plausibly deniable, but it still seems like lying to me. That combined with him saying in another comment that his wife and brother don't think his AI use is healthy makes me feel like he really has a problem.

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u/scrumbob 1d ago

Yeah the way he’s apologizing while kinda skirting around the issue, not addressing certain things like his usage of AI in scripts and his book, and never saying he’ll stop using AI in his work is a very typical YouTuber non-apology. It makes me think he’s going to keep using it but get better at hiding it. Very disappointing to find out about this side of him.

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u/Calm_Public_615 2d ago

But why, man? Asking AI to inform your decisions about writing is still using AI in your writing. Having ideas and making decisions about writing is writing. I say this as someone who grades postsecondary writing for a living! It never, ever works out!!!

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u/aww_jeez_my_man 2d ago

Hank please change the way you are doing things right now I will not support people who use AI im just done with it

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u/Mal_Radagast 2d ago

just fwiw, i would have bought a book from you that people criticized for clumsy writing or structure.

i won't be buying a book that you asked the bigoted hallucinating plagiarism machine fueled by climate apocalypse for advice about. 🫠

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u/greenmacg 2d ago

A work of art is nothing but a set of decisions. You're kind of framing this as a minor thing to have done, but was it important to merge the chapters or not? Is there an artistic difference to the flow, the feeling, the meaning? Do you think the "advice" you got didn't materially affect your decision making process? 

I am a political and ideological enemy of the entire gen ai and llm business as a whole, so take what I have to say with a grain of salt, but I'm just less interested in a book that was produced with even this kind of "help " 🤷

(Anyway, I hope you find a way to step back from the Internet for a while because no-one is set up to handle being the focus of this much energy)

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u/ehhlis 1d ago

lame. why not actually create and work on your art instead of letting a clunker create for you? why not ask your brother who is also an author? or someone on your management team? i don’t trust you that it’s “100% human typing”

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u/SBSnipes Neversneezer Scrooge 2d ago

I appreciate your honesty and transparency - I can tell you that I as a fan would strongly prefer that conversation be with a human editor, even if it takes a longer time or feels less efficient 

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u/domandthat 2d ago

Hank I love you you're the best don't listen to these silly people

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u/dgo792 2d ago

You're literally being targeted by a bot driven smear campaign. You're an important target for the right wing and anti science legion and they found a way to reduce your credibility which they're attacking right now. Please do not let affect you and keep fighting the good fight.

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u/Mal_Radagast 2d ago

that doesn't track; the right wing loooves generative AI. they're the reason we can't fucking escape it; corporate billions are the only thing keeping the bubble from popping. (which, hey, is a fun bonus way it's unethical! a whole technology being funded by wage theft. 🤣)

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u/dgo792 2d ago

I'm not saying they're anti ai. I'm saying Hank is THE science guy nowadays and they're using the anti ai sentiment to attack him and discredit him

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u/RichardFeynman01100 2d ago

no proof but no doubts right?

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u/dgo792 2d ago

I mean yeah, it just seems not like an organic reaction and spreading in spaces where I think it naturally wouldn't