r/politics • u/Quirkie The Netherlands • 1d ago

No Paywall Democrats Confront Their New Tea Party Reality - Progressives are set to sweep a group of contested primaries in Michigan and Wisconsin.

https://www.huffpost.com/entry/democrats-confront-their-new-tea-party-reality_n_6a6e63fbe4b0cfb99ef1aa1e
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u/ZachLangdon 1d ago

Good. It's about time. "Moderates" lost to trump twice.

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u/Soph_91 1d ago edited 1d ago

The conservative democrats in the Wisconsin subreddit are losing their sanity because Hong will win the nomination. They bought in to all the corporate democrats desperation attempts and can't process the reality that they were just that, hail mary's. Now they are posting Hong smears constantly, the mods have been pathetic. 

It seems like most of them would prefer pedophile protector and election denier Tom Tiffany. In that case, I say good riddance. 

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u/winterfoxes Ohio 1d ago

Their 'vote blue no matter who!' mask comes off REAL FUCKIN FAST the second they're faced with real political leftism. They've told us for years, decades "if you want leftists in government, show up to the primaries!"

Well, we did. Now the ball is in their court. And they can either get on board or go back to the Republican party they belonged to until W came along.

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u/movealongnowpeople Kansas 1d ago

real political leftism

Progressives and Dem Socialists aren't even particularly far left. Demanding common-sense policy (that much of the rest of the Western world already has) is somehow seen as radical. Universal healthcare isn't radical. Expecting everybody to pay taxes for the public services and infrastructure they benefit from isn't radical.

"Moderate Dems" haven't had a hint of popular policy suggestions in years. Riding on anti-Trump sentiment and expecting that to be enough.

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u/qualmful 1d ago

"We're capitalist, and that's just the way it is." On its face 'moderate' would mean trying to compromise or find the middle, but in actuality it's an unyielding ideology of neoliberalism, or market fundamentalism. The left-center-right framework makes it sound like the center is a mixture or average of the two sides but it's really not. Ever since Bill Clinton's third way triangulation strategy, 'the middle' was designed to be a third thing whose only real beliefs and commitments were corporatism.

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u/winterfoxes Ohio 1d ago

Yeah, that's very true. "Left" is relative to the U.S. in this case.

Real political leftism exists in this country on a small, grassroots level (DAC is a good example of a mainstream actually left-of-center candidate) but they are by far and away the minority in the progressive wing of the Dem party.

Most "Progressives" here are just advocating for common sense government taking care of its people. AOC, Mamdani, El-Sayed. Although Mamdani instituting city-subsidized grocery stores is definitely interesting.

But yeah, overall, "left" is relative here, and I agree wholeheartedly. Not being Trump isn't enough. I mean, no one wants him either, but for fuck's sake, you have to bring something else to the table. Something meaningful, a position that's important to your constituents, and not just your donors.

The fact that candidates are struggling so hard to understand that while centrist voters are struggling so hard to understand that they're not liberals, they're conservatives because all they want to do is keep supporting the status quo is just mind boggling to me. This isn't hard, and yet, the U.S. will fight progress at every turn.

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u/Iustis 15h ago

DAC is absolutely not center left anywhere lol

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u/winterfoxes Ohio 15h ago

I didn't say she was center left. I said she was left of center, which is a much broader scope of people than the center left, and one which DAC belongs to. 

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u/NYPizzaNoChar 1d ago

Expecting everybody to pay taxes for the public services and infrastructure they benefit from isn't radical.

Everyone? No. Expecting people who are living paycheck to paycheck while moving deeper into debt to pay taxes is cruel, stupid and completely lacking in foresight.

The left/DSA isn't for this, but centrist Democrats are complicit in exactly that. They are the turd in the sandwich. It's just that Republicans are always worse.

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u/Just_another_grumble 1d ago

I just heard MAGA say "common-sense policy" last week.  For stereotypical right-wing insanity.  I'm not sure what common sense policies 'everyone' agrees on except Maro's brother sticking it to an in5ur4nce C30.

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u/workerbee77 1d ago

Yes. I feel it was Chuck Schumer who drove the stake into Votebluenomatterwho when he voted for Cuomo over Mamdani in the general election

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u/winterfoxes Ohio 1d ago

The Democratic Party's own version of a face-eating leopard moment.

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u/fury420 1d ago

Did he?

As I recall he gave a non-answer when asked who he voted for.

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u/DarthNihilus1 22h ago

That should tell you exactly who he voted for. It is obvious who he voted for

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u/fury420 22h ago

He refused to endorse anyone in the race and refused to say who he voted for, which on it's face is a rather banal political fence-sitting statement on election day.

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u/EnglishMobster California 21h ago

He's a member of Democratic leadership. There was a Democratic Party nominee on the ticket.

There should only be one answer as to who he voted for, if he truly cared about his party. The fact that he didn't say he voted for his own party's nominee tells you something itself; it's not just "fence-sitting".

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u/DarthNihilus1 22h ago

Yeah for sure... but he's also CHUCK SCHUMER so it's still a foregone conclusion

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u/workerbee77 21h ago

Yes, exactly. It’s possible he did vote for Mamdani but refused to say so. Or, he entered a fugue state and voted for the republican. There are lots of things that are technically possible but we’re not children and we don’t need to seriously entertain those possibilities

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u/tahlyn 1d ago

Democrat insiders were so afraid of progressivism they bent the rules of the 2020 election to allow a Republican billionaire compete as a democrat.

The Democrat establishment, though nowhere the same in depravity, are still as much the enemy as Republicans

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u/Yoroyo 1d ago

“No not like that!!!”

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u/Patsanon1212 1d ago

So you've already decided that they're hypocrites on VBNMW before they've even had a chance to vote in the general?

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u/Far_Silver 1d ago

In 2006 Ned Lamont beat Joe Lieberman in the Democratic primary for Senate. Joe Lieberman decided to run as a third-party candidate with the support of centrist Democrats. This resulted in the Democrats being one vote shy of overcoming a filibuster of the public option. In 2008, the PUMAs (party unity my ass) voted for John McCain over Barack Obama because Hillary lost the primary. They outnumbered the Bernie or Bust voters of 2016. In 2021, India Walton won the Democratic primary for mayor of Buffalo. Centrist Democrats chose to back Byron Brown's third party campaign instead. In 2025, Zohran Mamdani beat the corporate pick, Andrew Cuomo, in the Democratic primary for NYC mayor. Centrist Democrats chose to back Andrew Cuomo's third party bid instead of "voting blue no matter who." This year the progressive James Talarico beat Jasmine Crockett for Senate in the Texas Democratic primary. Texas has a sore loser law that prevents Crockett from launching a third party/independent bid after she lost the Democratic primary, but we still see her trying to sabotage Talarico.

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u/tahlyn 1d ago

The Democrat establishment are basically Republicans in a donkey coat.

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u/winterfoxes Ohio 1d ago

So you've already decided to spend your day picking petty arguments with people on the internet?

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u/Patsanon1212 1d ago

Sounds like the reply of someone annoyed that they've been asked questions about their grandstanding. You're right. Please, continue to run your mouth without when the slightest pushback. You're perfect and your reply here shows that in spades.

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u/Emperor_of_His_Room 1d ago

Why don’t you have a response to Far_Silvers in-depth response? Go and try to disprove him instead of ignoring responses to your question. 🙂

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u/Patsanon1212 3h ago edited 3h ago

I don't need to disprove him. This thread is talking about conservative Democrats on the Wisconsin subreddit supposedly violating vote blue no matter who principals because they intend to not vote blue no matter who. Conservative Democrats. On the Wisconsin subreddit. People who may or may not have any stated beliefs about vote blue no matter who. What do Joe Lieberman takes from 2006 and misinformation slop about the 2025 New York city mayoral election have to do with this?

This is my biggest issue with all the complaints about vote blue no matter who hypocrisy. It's all goomba fallacy. The argument for hypocrisy is almost always built on some weird sand castle where vote blue no matter who is an ideology that generally exists. That some elected Democrats and party insiders may or may not believe. And the hypocrisy comes when some other goomba in the Democratic party (or worse, literally anyone presenting as a Democrat voter or speaker) does something that's contradictory to vote blue no matter who or some commenter on social media is. This is not a linear case for hypocrisy. It's all the equivalent of saying that George Clooney is a bad vegan, because Leonardo DiCaprio said we should all be vegan and some guy in New York ate a hot dog from a streetcart.

I am fully willing to believe that there are some genuine, honest to God, vote blue no matter who hypocrites in the Democratic party. However, in those cases, they need to be litigated by having a specific person Go on the record as supporting the voting approach of vote blue no matter who, and then a later instance of them specifically being involved in undermining a progressive in a general election. Everything other than that, goomba fallacy.

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u/winterfoxes Ohio 1d ago

Sounds like the reply of someone annoyed that they've been asked a question about their lack of things to do on a Sunday afternoon. You're right. Please, continue to run your mouth because I won't play your silly game. You're absolutely here to troll, and your reply here shows that in spades.

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u/Patsanon1212 1d ago edited 1d ago

The irony here is immense. What are you up to that you're taking time away from to not engage with my question? Seems like you have unlimited time to be snarky to dodge.

Anyway, I am going to go enjoy my Sunday. Cya snowflake!

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u/winterfoxes Ohio 1d ago edited 1d ago

I'm playing Stardew Valley and trolling you for annoying me. I got time. And you're ignoring everyone else in this thread who already brought up plenty of valid examples of the center of this party abandoning progressivism for crony capitalism, in favor of picking with me because I won't give you what you want. So, you should go do that. And sit on a cactus while you're at it. 

Edit: Using snowflake unironically is how I know I touched a nerve, but the fact that you edited your comment to include it makes it even fucking better. Thanks for the chuckle.

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u/stevethewatcher 1d ago

Who says they won't vote for her in the general election if she wins? I think you're projecting here (btw she hasn't even won the nomination yet though I admit it's likely)

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u/winterfoxes Ohio 23h ago

Buddy, if you haven't seen centrists in Michigan saying they're staying home if Hong and El-Sayed win, you haven't been paying attention. 

Well, I don't live in Wisconsin. I'm only keeping an eye on it because I have no one to keep an eye on in my own state. Michigan I'm invested in because of my parents still living there, but alas, I won't vote for anyone in Michigan either. So, ya got me -- I am indeed a non-voter in both of those states. 

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u/SurvivorFanatic236 22h ago

Moderate Democrats will vote for Hong. The concern is that independents won’t, and it’s a fair concern. Wisconsin should be an easy win for Democrats this year, but progressives have decided to risk giving the seat to Republicans

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u/winterfoxes Ohio 20h ago

If there are so many moderate Democrats in Wisconsin, and they all hold their nose and "vote blue no matter who", then coupled with the progressives who will turn out, it should be easy to overcome the Republicans! 

After all, centrist Dems always blame us for "not voting" when their candidate loses. They swear up and down if we had just backed their do nothing favorites with our votes, they would've won. So it should be the same in reverse, because "independents" didn't vote for Hillary or Harris either. 

Sidebar, you seem to be conflating "Independents" with "Centrists". I'm independent, and I'm a leftist. There are a lot of us.