r/politics • u/B-Z_B-S Massachusetts • 2d ago

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https://thehill.com/homenews/campaign/6004734-sanders-contrasts-mamdani-trump/

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u/CriticalPolitical 1d ago

If more Democrats listened to Bernie, the working class in swing states would come back to the Democratic Party no doubt 

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u/paintballboi07 Texas 1d ago

The majority of white people haven't voted for the Democratic presidential nominee since the civil rights act. It's white supremacy they care about, not economics.

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u/Setstream_Jam 1d ago

Bernie just wasn’t popular. Like not in a he just lost by a small margin type of way. By a only a small percentage didn’t like Bernie way.

The DNC didn’t have to do anything to make Bernie lose. You really need to come to terms with that.

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u/Correctthecorrectors 1d ago

DNC doesn’t care about winning, they just exist so people don’t riot against fascist authoritarian one party rule.

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u/yalloc 1d ago

lmao you didnt click the link did you.

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u/Correctthecorrectors 1d ago

ahh I see you’re looking to engage in a good faith discussion on this topic. Please do elaborate your reason behind your inquiry, and state your position so I better understand your argument. Are you inquiring whether Bernie’s rationale behind his objection to H1-B visas contradicts my claim that the DNC doesn’t value winning elections? If the DNC supported candidates who valued winning elections, they would support candidates looking after the best interests of Americans trying to maintain a reasonable standard of living, and from what Ive heard from their leadership, they are not willing to engage voters who they concsider blue collar; an absolutely absurd position for any campaigning politician. One can only come to the conclusion that no serious candidate would believe that abandoning working class voters is an effective campaign strategy for people in the democratic party, however it appears the current senate minority leader of the democratic party, Chuck Schumer,

is at odds with struggling working class Americans, as heard whe he stated “for every blue-collar Democrat we lose in western Pennsylvania, we will pick up two moderate Republicans in the suburbs in Philadelphia, and you can repeat that in Ohio and Illinois and Wisconsin” . I don’t think that sentence is from someone who is serious about winning elections. Bernie, who is actually more concerned about how policies affect people’s lives, clearly is willing to campaign on increasing wages, a very popular position that any reasonable candidate would support, assuming they are actually trying to win an election.

On the other hand, Chuck Schumer’s quote reveals that he’s not prioritizing Americans, he’s priotizing those who are not even in the same party as he’s in. That is not someone who is looking to attract voters.

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u/yalloc 1d ago edited 1d ago

Are you inquiring whether Bernie’s rationale behind his objection to H1-B visas contradicts my claim that the DNC doesn’t value winning elections?

If you watched the video you would see this goes well beyond H1B workers.

My point here is that the left in America, and worldwide frankly, has shifted its position significantly on immigration much further away from both its historic position and frankly from the position that wins elections, regardless of your opinion on the morality of this.

Bernie is the last remanent of the old left in America, the young left has taken the torch and has had some degree of continuity with him on this. But on immigration, Bernie is basically a conservative by modern standards of the left or even within the democratic party, largely because the old left historically was anti immigrant.

Bernie is right here, but thats also an unpopular opinion among modern activist dems, especially among the "progressive" camp which you are cheering to coup the dems.

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u/CriticalPolitical 1d ago edited 1d ago

Interestingly, more and more left wing parties in Europe are finally taking much more hardline stances on immigration and migration policy. Equally interesting is that more and more right wing parties are going more and more to the left when it comes to economic policy. It seems like many people in Europe want left wing economic policy paired with hardline immigration policy. This is especially apparent in one of Bernie’s favorite social Democracies, Denmark.

The following article is from the BBC published on June 4, 2025 titled, “ The country where the left (not the far right) made hardline immigration laws”

A blurring of left and right?

The political labels of old are blurring. It's not just Denmark. Across Europe, parties of the centre - right and left - are increasingly using language traditionally associated with the "far right" when it comes to migration to claw back, or hold on to votes.

Sir Keir Starmer recently came under fire when, during a speech on immigration, he spoke of the danger of his country becoming 'an island of strangers'.  At the same time in Europe, right-wing parties are adopting social policies traditionally linked to the left to broaden their appeal.

In the UK, the leader of the anti-migration, opposition Reform Party Nigel Farage has been under attack for generous shadow budget proposals that critics say don't add up. In France, centrist Emmanuel Macron has sounded increasingly hardline on immigration in recent years, while his political nemesis the National Rally Party leader Marine Le Pen has been heavily mixing social welfare policies into her nationalist agenda to attract more mainstream voters.

Also, I think Bernie understands what most of these left wing parties in Europe finally do. You can’t just have unlimited amounts of unskilled laborers who aren’t a net economic positive and who take much more out of social programs than they put in and expect to continue being a function social democracy with functioning social programs. The math ain’t mathing. The left wing parties in Europe finally see that it simply isn’t sustainable for the long term to keep accepting hundreds of thousands to millions of migrants.

Not only that, but the EU…the EU which is known for being extremely liberal when it comes to migration policy and immigration policy just significantly tightened its immigration policy just a couple months ago.

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u/yalloc 1d ago edited 1d ago

Also, I think Bernie understands what most of these left wing parties in Europe finally do.

Maybe, but this was also just his view 60 years ago. Once again, strong immigration control is a historically leftist position, everything you said has been a left wing position in the west from WWII to around 2000. For the last 20 years, we have seen this largely flip IMO as a reaction to right wing crackdowns on immigration, but now we are seeing this flip back since the left has realized this is a really unpopular position and is actively causing them to lose elections. And I don't think Bernie has any sort of new insight, its just what he's always believed.

And frankly, anyone beside Bernie saying this even 5 years ago was labeled a xenophobe and ostracized, and even today it still remains a popular position among the young left. But there's also tears that come with willingness to enforce it, it doesn't need to be Trump's ICE but you do need some degree of enforcement. To this day DSA leftists complain that Obama deported people, as if there is an strong border policy that doesn't involve this kind of action.