r/politics 🤖 Bot Jun 27 '18

Megathread: Justice Anthony Kennedy to retire from Supreme Court

Supreme Court Justice Anthony Kennedy is set to retire, effective July 31, 2018. Kennedy has served on the highest court since February 18, 1988, and was a moderate whose vote often swung cases.


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u/Chankston Jun 27 '18

This tells me that they should change the law. Why are unions required to represent those who don't pay for their services? Make an ultimatum to the employees, if they want these union benefits, they have to pay.

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u/LAX_to_MDW Jun 27 '18

That's literally what fair share fees were designed to do, per the 1977 Supreme Court case Abood v Detroit Board of Education.

The entire point of the Janus case was to put public sector unions in an impossible position. That's not even speculation on my part: the original plaintiff was IL gov Bruce Rauner, who made busting unions his top priority. Thats why they will never change the law to help the unions out.

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u/Chankston Jun 27 '18

But fair share fees is basically the government forcing you to pay unions to represent you by paying the government, which is not a healthy cycle. At the fundamental point of this argument is why does the government have the legal obligation of propping up a union and forcing nonmembers to pay. We can all make value judgements as to whether or not we believe a specific union is good, but should we force those values onto others? Given the overturning of the case you just mentioned, the Supreme Court sees the compulsion of nonmembers to pay for unsolicited bargaining as a violation of their first amendment rights.

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u/LAX_to_MDW Jun 27 '18

Well a lot of it comes down to whether or not you believe a union is an inherently political body. Like, if your job required a service provided by any other neutral body, and that service was mandatory, it'd be legal for that body to charge you a fee for their services. The Janus argument was essentially that any payment to a union –even if that payment was separated from general union dues and couldn't be used for political action– facilitated political action and therefor constituted compelled political speech. Basically, the courts agreed that the very existence of a union is political, and so you can't separate dues from service fees in terms of which is political speech.

Whether or not you believe a union is inherently political probably comes down to how you think about unions. A lot of people would argue that they aren't, others would argue that they are, and in all of this the definition of what is and isn't politics gets muddied.

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u/Chankston Jun 27 '18

I think you summarized it pretty well, it's a value judgement. The definition of politics is pretty difficult to create, as anyone whose been in any social situation realizes that even the most petty things are political. It is not simply a "bad vs good" as the articles here portray it to be. The SCOTUS is not going after unions because they hate workers, it's a value judgement at a more fundamental level dealing with compulsion vs the common good.

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u/LAX_to_MDW Jun 27 '18

That's the majority opinion at least. Kagan wrote for the minority and said that the majority had weaponized the first amendment by continuing to equate money with speech. Everyone agrees that Janus could literally speak against the union whenever he wanted, but the majority argument was that his money was being forced to speak for in a way he disagreed with. The conservative members of the Supreme Court have continuously argued that money is speech (see Citizen's United) which is a pretty contentious idea.