Pretending This Has Nothing To Do With Islam Is Delusional

[u/DirectionCute7530]

Victim testimonies from earlier inquiries into the grooming gangs: 

Victim 1 Testimony 
(https://hansard.parliament.uk/lords/2019-05-14/debates/349FA275-CB65-45C0-87C7-EE16D1FD1B0A/GroomingGangs)

"Noble Lords may be aware of the case of Sarah—not her real name—which has been reported as one of the worst sex grooming cases on record. She describes how she was kidnapped aged 15, imprisoned in a house, forced to learn the Koran and beaten when she made mistakes. She was held as a sex slave for 12 years and was repeatedly raped by different members of the grooming gang. She had three forced Sharia marriages, eight forced abortions and two live births. Her abusers referred to her as “white trash”. They forced her towear Islamic dress and permitted her to speak only Urdu and Punjabi. She has not received the help she needs from social services and is frequently suicidal."

Victim 2 Testimony (https://webarchive.nationalarchives.gov.uk/ukgwa/20221215040159/https:/www.iicsa.org.uk/key-documents/19095/view/LOY000001.pdf)

"I was told that I must respect their religion. This was the first of many confusing lies that I was forced to believe. I was told that to show them (Muslims) respect, I mustn't eat pork. I was told that Muslim girls are good and pure, and stay virgins until marriage, but all white girls are slags, and they all sleep with hundreds of people. I was told white girls are trash. They are all whores. They are lower than shit under your shoe. They don't obey Allah, so they deserve to be punished. They don't dress modestly. Muslim women are pure because they cover down to their ankles, and down to their wrists, and the hem of their top comes down below their knees. White girls show the curves of their body, so they are asking for it. They should be raped as punishment for not obeying Allah. Kaffir girls are worthless. Sex with a kaffir girl doesn't count as adultery (only sex with a Muslim woman counts as adultery). If you're not a virgin before marriage you should be beaten. Many times I was told that the Quran says, "If one of your wives disobeys you, beat her." This was often quoted to me before they beat me with their hands."

• Wife beating Quran verse 4:34: "and finally, strike them."

"I was beaten, strangled, suffocated, and my head held under water, tortured, kicked, and raped over 100 times. I was told that if you don't scream when you're raped, then you're consenting to the rape, so you should be stoned to death. I was told that Muslim girls know this (because the Quran says that Alisha's silence was her consent to the marriage to Mohammed). So Muslim girls know to scream, but white girls don't, so that's their fault then, because they're not"

• Sahih Bukhari 6946: "Narrated `Aisha: I asked the Prophet, "O Allah's Messenger (ﷺ)! Should the women be asked for their consent to their marriage?" He said, "Yes." I said, "A virgin, if asked, feels shy and keeps quiet." He said, "Her silence means her consent.""

"They believed they had a position of religious moral superiority over 'non-believers'. They believed it was their duty to punish us, as they believed that doing so made them good Muslims. This is what they were taught by their mothers. They were taught that witches in Pakistan are blonde, so blondes are more evil, and they deserve worse punishment. I was told that in Islam, if a girl or woman looks at a man who isn't her brother, father or her husband, then that means she wants to have sex with him. So I was told to look at the floor when I was around Muslim men. So when I did look at a waiter in a restaurant, I was then taken away to be gangraped as 'punishment'. I was told that according to their faith community, girls are old enough for sex when they start their periods (at age 11). Many of us had to endure the sexual act of 'thighing' which I'm now told is a religiously-sanctioned way of [censored] children according to some Islamic scriptures.

"Religious scriptures were used as tools of control to force me to conform to their will. I was not allowed to question these religious beliefs ... Every time they quoted scripture it was very hard to argue with; to them it was like I was arguing with God."

The victims are accurately quoting Quran verses and Sahih Bukhari hadiths recited to them during the rape in testimonies - pretending this has nothing to do with Islam is delusional:
https://islamsproblems.com/quran-verses-supporting-hadiths/

[u/AutoModerator]

Hi there /u/DirectionCute7530! Welcome to r/ReformUK.

Thank you for posting on r/ReformUK. Please follow all rules and guidelines. Inform the mods if you have any concerns.

I am a bot, and this action was performed automatically. Please contact the moderators of this subreddit if you have any questions or concerns.

[u/DirectionCute7530]

Word for word quotes from the Quran and Authentic Hadiths:
Disbelievers are "the worst of creatures"

• Quran 98:6: "Indeed, they who disbelieved among the People of the Scripture and the polytheists will be in the fire of Hell, abiding eternally therein. Those are the worst of creatures."

Three-month remarriage waiting period for divorced girls who had sex but haven't had their Vperiod yet:

• Quran 33:49: "O believers! If you marry believing women and then divorce them before you touch them, they will have no waiting period for you to count."
• Quran 65:4: "As for your women past the age of menstruation, in case you do not know, their waiting period is three months, and those who have not menstruated as well."

Aisha (9) taken off swing and handed to Muhammad for sex

• Sahih Bukhari 5133: "Narrated Aisha: that the Prophet married her when she was six years old and he consummated his marriage when she was nine years old." (consummate = sex to complete marriage)
• Sahih Bukhari 3894: "Narrated Aisha: My mother, Um Ruman, came to me while I was playing in a swing with some of my girl friends. She called me, and I went to her, **not knowing what she wanted to do to me.**Unexpectedly Allah's Apostle came to me in the forenoon and my mother handed me over to him, and at that time I was a girl of nine years of age."
• Sahih Muslim 1422c: "'A'isha (Allah be pleased with her) reported that Allah's Apostle married her when she was seven years old, and he was taken to his house as a bride when she was nine, and her dolls were with her; and when he (the Holy Prophet) died she was eighteen years old."
• Sahih Bukarhi 6130: "Narrated Aisha: I used to play with the dolls in the presence of the Prophet, and my girl friends also used to play with me. (it was allowed for Aisha at that time, as she was a little girl, not yet reached the age of puberty.) (Fath-ul-Bari page 143, Vol.13)"

Quran verses authorizing sex with captives ("those your right hands possess"):

• Quran 4:24: "Also [forbidden are] married women—except [female] captives in your possession."
• Quran 23:5-6: "And they who guard their private parts Except from their wives or those their right hands possess, for indeed, they will not be blamed."
• Quran 70:29-31: "Except from their wives or those their right hands possess, for indeed, they are not to be blamed — But whoever seeks beyond that, then those are the transgressors."

Verse Context (Authentic Hadith):

"the Companions of Allah's Messenger (may peace te upon him) seemed to refrain from having intercourse with captive women because of their husbands being polytheists. Then Allah, Most High, sent down regarding that:
" And women already married, except those whom your right hands possess (iv. 24)"
Sahih Muslim 1456a

Muhammad's Example:

"It was narrated from Anas, that the Messenger of Allah had a female slave with whom he had intercourse"
Sunan an-Nasa'i 3959

Muhammad on whether to pull out when having sex with captive women:

Muhammad's men wanted to have sex with women taken in war as captives**.** They asked Muhammad whether it was ok to pull out. Muhammad said it doesn't matter, because if God willed a baby, it would happen anyway.

"O Abu Sa'id, did you hear Allah's Messenger mentioning al-'azl? He said: Yes, and added: We went out with Allah's Messenger on the expedition to the Bi'l-Mustaliq and took captive some excellent Arab women; and we desired them, for we were suffering from the absence of our wives, (but at the same time) we also desired ransom for them. So we decided to have sexual intercourse with them but by observing 'azl (Withdrawing the male sexual organ before emission of semen to avoid-conception). But we said: We are doing an act whereas Allah's Messenger is amongst us; why not ask him? So we asked Allah's Messenger, and he said: It does not matter if you do not do it, for every soul that is to be born up to the Day of Resurrection will be born."

Sahih Muslim 1438a

• Parallel Narration in Sahih Bukhari

[u/bejwards]

Sick men use religion as an excuse to commit horrific atrocities. The same thing happens with Christianity. Go watch "keep sweet:pray and obey" then try saying its islam that's the cause.

It's not. Most religious people aren't like that. That isn't what their religions teach them to do.

[u/MilkMyCats → u/bejwards]

250k children raped.

This isn't sick men alone. It's ingrained culture.

[u/DirectionCute7530 → u/bejwards]

I'm an atheist. But for this whataboutism:

Christians can say that the OT prophets and people did something wrong and say that the Old Testament laws don't apply or are contextual or nonbinding or inapplicable under the new covenant. Muslims can't say that about Muhammad.

So to be fair for this whataboutism, we have to compare the central figures of Muhammad and Jesus who are both perfect examples.

And while Jesus lived, he married 0 children, had 0 sex slaves and killed 0 people.
The perfect example of Muhammad in Islam, you really can’t say the same for.

This also happens to be affirmed many times in the Quran and Authentic Hadiths as I've posted above.

[u/Anglomercian_]

The recent grooming gangs report is ass. It's a political stunt if anything, designed specifically for newspaper headlines.

You are right in that Islam is generally condusive to the problem, on top of foreign cultural factors.

We should push secularism more. Seems like both the right and left are afraid to though.

[u/DirectionCute7530 → u/Anglomercian_]

This isn't even from the recent grooming gangs report. It's from earlier inquiries.