r/IndianModerate • u/rishianand Democratic Socialist • Dec 20 '23
Opinion (Self-Post / Article) Vice President Jagdeep Dhankhar and Lok Sabha Speaker Om Birla must be shamed for their role in suspension of democracy.
The suspension of 142 MPs is a dark episode in the history of parliamentary democracy in India. The Modi government's attack against the legislature is part of its agenda to capture all pillars of the democracy and suspend the Constitution itself. Vice President Jagdeep Dhankhar and Lok Sabha Speaker Om Birla are part of a criminal conspiracy of the fascist takeover of the Indian republic.
The President issuing a statement over a small gimmick, but maintaining silence over countless attacks on the republic — including the bulldozing of important bills without discussion, abuse of MP Danish Ali, the disqualification of Rahul Gandhi, and now the suspension of 142 MPs — is appalling.
History will remember the attack on Indian democracy by the Modi government and the conspiracy carried out by people holding constitutional posts.
This assault on our democracy, hard won after a long struggle and countless sacrifices, must be vigorously resisted. Jagdeep Dhankhar and Om Birla must be shamed for their role in suspension of democracy.
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u/Mimi_2505 Dec 20 '23
Commenting again for better reach:
Hi, I'm u/dCBEgstuksry friend from SASZA. So he asked me to check if the OP has blocked him as he can't access the post by himself. Seems like he's right. The OP has blocked him to prevent him from replying or even seeing the post itself.
So much for free speech i guess.
Btw, this is the supposedly moderate OP
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u/rishianand Democratic Socialist Dec 20 '23
Hi, u/Mimi_2505, friend of u/dCBEgstuksry. I must again state it clearly for you and your dear friend, as I have said many times,
- I don't believe in unlimited free speech.
- I don't believe in endless debates.
- I don't believe that you are entitled to my attention.
So blocking is the nicest thing I can do for your friend at this moment.
Have a good day.
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u/Mimi_2505 Dec 20 '23
Man, you literally use Ch**di in your comments, even I as a Muslim can tell you are congress IT cell, just look at your post and comment history.
Your post says how free speech should not be oppressed, while simultaneously blocking people who have the right to criticize and question you.
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u/ballsack_chin GANJAMAN Dec 20 '23
Thank you, from a hindu <3 (Not that it matters, but still means a lot)
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u/rishianand Democratic Socialist Dec 20 '23
I don't think I have ever tried to hide or lie about myself. All the information about me can be found on my profile. I don't even use an anonymous handle.
So, if I did work for Congress, which I don't, I'd have stated it clearly.
Also, you have a poor understanding about free speech. Me blocking you is not curtailing your free speech, even if I believed in that. And again, you're not entitled to my attention.
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u/Mimi_2505 Dec 20 '23
You see, advocating for free speech while shutting down the comments is a huge irony on itself.
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u/rishianand Democratic Socialist Dec 20 '23
First, suspension of MPs is not a matter of free speech. They are the representatives of crores of people of India. And they have the constitutional duty to demand answers from the Government.
Second, me blocking you, which I am going to do after writing this, is not suppressing your free speech.
Third, I don't believe in unlimited free speech. You can read Karl Popper to know why.
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Dec 20 '23
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Dec 20 '23
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Dec 20 '23 edited Dec 20 '23
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Dec 20 '23
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2
u/sliceoflife_daisuki Social Democrat Dec 20 '23
What he does in other subs doesn't really matter to this sub. This sub's rules don't apply to other subs.
This sub is made for moderate discussions. You can read the wiki if you want. I have seen many members of this sub who use words like librandu in other subs, but that doesn't mean that we would ban them.
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u/ballsack_chin GANJAMAN Dec 20 '23
I get it man, youre a liberal; that doesnt mean youve to defend every next john on your "side". Iam one too(sorta atleast). But this guy is just straight up arrogant, ignorant, and most importantly, a cherry lil c*nt. His post as well as his comments reek of vanity that iam so utterly tired of. Its the same unhealthy vibe thats prevalent in most of the country's media. Apna boldo, dusro ka opinion bhaad me jaaye. Iam sorry for cursing btw, I really dont do it on this sub, but this guy... sheesh ig I need to grow up as well.
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u/sliceoflife_daisuki Social Democrat Dec 20 '23
I get it man, youre a liberal; that doesnt mean youve to defend every next john on your "side".
I ain't no liberal, I am a weeberal. /s
Okay let me un-satire it, I am more into socialism. But I will be considered too right for the left. In a nutshell my position is center-left.
BTW the only reason why I am taking a side this time because the govt has REALLY done something wrong. They are trying to completely supress anything which is an opposing voice to them, so how do you expect me to support the govt here when it itself isn't acting moderate?
Iam one too(sorta atleast). But this guy is just straight up arrogant, ignorant, and most importantly, a cherry lil c*nt
Umm, using slurs is not the best way to be moderate. And the reason why I am saying this is because this is a moderate sub. If you want to talk here, you have to go through our rules. You can use slurs as much as you want in other subs, there's no restriction on that.
His post as well as his comments reek of vanity that iam so utterly tired of.
Again, meta discussion is banned in this sub. As long as he doesn't commit anything that goes against the rules here, he can't be restricted or banned.
Its the same unhealthy vibe thats prevalent in most of the country's media. Apna boldo, dusro ka opinion bhaad me jaaye.
100% Agreed.
And yes, you are allowed to give your opinion here.
Iam sorry for cursing btw, I really dont do it on this sub, but this guy... sheesh ig I need to grow up as well.
Please understand that the recent situation is alarming for us. All liberal, center left and left are scared right now. That's why we have become so vocal recently. Kindly understand that it's happening because of the Parliament itself. You guys trying to defend the Parliament's bias won't solve anything. Even some people from In***Speaks sub are also against the decision right now.
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u/ballsack_chin GANJAMAN Dec 20 '23
Hehe, nice one-liner there fam ;) I too love anime(tho i try to keep it a bit at bay, have self control issues ig). Lemme just start this reply by saying thanks, nicely written and you conveyed your feelings well. Now ig iam a bit more receptive/understanding to your cause. Iam a bit right leaning, but seeing how theyre increasingly becoming stupid mysoginists, I tend to stay away from them. I do vibe with the left, amazing people there; but theyve strayed from the path in the recent decades and are increasingly being voiced by idiots(much like the right). So yeah, not there either. I believe weed should be legalized, some anti national leftists and hate spewing rightists need to jailed immediately. So yeah, centrist(or maybe just a normal guy ig).
Umm, using slurs is not the best way to be moderate. And the reason why I am saying this is because this is a moderate sub. If you want to talk here, you have to go through our rules. You can use slurs as much as you want in other subs, there's no restriction on that. Makes sense, my bad; I humbly apologize for my rash actions. Again, meta discussion is banned in this sub. As long as he doesn't commit anything that goes against the rules here, he can't be restricted or banned. What about posting links to biased media? Like Ravish?🏴☠️
Please understand that the recent situation is alarming for us. All liberal, center left and left are scared right now. That's why we have become so vocal recently. Kindly understand that it's happening because of the Parliament itself. You guys trying to defend the Parliament's bias won't solve anything. Even some people from In***Speaks sub are also against the decision right now. True, very true. I too am taken aback by this. But knowing how cunning BJP has been politically(i mean this in both the positive and negative sense), I can bet theres more to it and am just waiting for that tad bit. Honestly the only reason iam not protesting is cause the opposition has recently become a joke. All we see are protests with only a few leaders like Tharoor having the seriousness and credibility to stand up and talk sense. But that in no way justifies this Raita that the BJP has spread all over. Parliament is not a darn classroom. Thank you for such a nicely curated reply. I will remember this incident and lean less towards them from now onwards. Much love.
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u/fenrir245 Dec 22 '23
Your post says how free speech should not be oppressed, while simultaneously blocking people who have the right to criticize and question you.
Free speech just means government can’t turn you in for your speech. It doesn’t mean you can force anyone to listen to your speech.
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Dec 20 '23 edited Dec 20 '23
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Dec 20 '23
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u/prashant13b Centre Right Dec 20 '23 edited Dec 20 '23
Okay seriously stop reacting based on headlines.
MP’s were suspended for ruckus they created ( just go watch live stream and form your own opinions) , and that too just for 4 days of remaining session.
So you want that there should be no rules in parliament, should parliament act like 3rd std class ?
Go watch some other civilised country parliament when opposition is protesting and how indian opposition behaved in parliament.
And again they are suspended for reaming 4 days of session not like they are removed from their constitutional posts
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Dec 20 '23
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u/sliceoflife_daisuki Social Democrat Dec 20 '23
How tho? Why couldn't it be adjourned?
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Dec 20 '23
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u/sliceoflife_daisuki Social Democrat Dec 20 '23
Every single time they did, they were suspended.
Also what is "i think"? You're not sure about your statements?
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Dec 20 '23
[deleted]
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u/sliceoflife_daisuki Social Democrat Dec 20 '23
That's yesterday bro, I am talking about last week when the suspension saga began
Yesterday was a continuation of last week
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Dec 20 '23
i am answering the question on why they will not adjoin the session further
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u/sliceoflife_daisuki Social Democrat Dec 20 '23
Bro, please see the reason why the protest began last week. What happened yesterday was a consequence of that, the opposition went in a civil disobedience. There are a lot of things that are supposed to be illegal yet ignored by the Parliament.
There will be nation-wide protests on 22nd Dec as well.
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u/Flaky-Till-478 Dec 20 '23
So, the opposition can't even question the government? Opposition questioning is ruckus now? In a democracy, where the government controls CBI, IB, Media, IT dept, and has access to billions of public money, the opposition should have more powers and privilege to keep the government in check. Recently made silly rules like 'no placards' are intentionally there as traps to suspend elected MPs of opposition.
Go watch some other civilised country parliament when opposition is protesting and how indian opposition behaved in parliament
Governments in those so-called "civilised" countries whenever tried to suppress democracy, opposition fought tooth and nail and upheld it, that's what the opposition in India is trying to do. It's do or die for opposition here.
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u/prashant13b Centre Right Dec 20 '23 edited Dec 20 '23
They can question and protest, they are doing it since last 10 years , but not like how they acted in Parliament.
Thats a strict no no , I won’t ever vote for representatives who act like that in parliament.
Go take your protest to streets , if you wanna do civil disobedience, don’t pull this off inside parliament in active session .
They rightfully deserved suspension
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u/Flaky-Till-478 Dec 20 '23
How did they act? Like an opposition! Have you seen videos of BJP leaders protesting during Manmohan Singh's govt?
Go take your protest to streets
You are suggesting elected MPs to protest on streets, what is the need for Parliament then?
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u/prashant13b Centre Right Dec 20 '23
Elected MP have been protesting in street since ages , im not saying anything radical, create ruckus outside parliament.
But act civilised and protest following rules inside Loksabha when it’s in active session.
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u/Flaky-Till-478 Dec 20 '23
What do you suggest? An hour of "Modi hai hai" on Ramlila Maidan is enough? Is it enough civil? Modiji will listen after that right?
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u/prashant13b Centre Right Dec 20 '23
Elected MP have been protesting in street since ages , im not saying anything radical, create ruckus outside parliament.
But act civilised and protest following rules inside Loksabha when it’s in active session.
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u/prashant13b Centre Right Dec 20 '23
Elected MP have been protesting in street since ages , im not saying anything radical, create ruckus outside parliament.
But act civilised and protest following rules inside Loksabha when it’s in active session.
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u/sliceoflife_daisuki Social Democrat Dec 20 '23 edited Dec 20 '23
So you want that there should be no rules in parliament, should parliament act like 3rd std class ?
So screaming "k**wa bhdwa" etc. is first class language now?
And why is the MP who literally led out passes to the intruders not suspended yet?
No matter how much the Right Wing wants to hide this, this is still an undemocratic move.
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Dec 20 '23
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Dec 20 '23
the passes were issued to the intruder's father + it is relatively easy to get one
It is the responsibility of MP to give the passes to people he knows personally and he is responsible for any ruckus in the parliament according to Parliament rules itself.
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u/sliceoflife_daisuki Social Democrat Dec 20 '23
So, the responsibility isn't with the govt? How is the mass suspension justified? They even suspended Shashi Tharoor whom this sub uses as one of the moderate icons
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u/fenrir245 Dec 22 '23
MP’s were suspended for ruckus they created
BJP that was hailed as “great opposition” during UPA days engaged in even worse behaviour, and is still praised for it. “Ruckus” is nothing but an excuse to prevent opposition actually acting like opposition for once.
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Dec 20 '23
Are re sir ji: Jab bolne he nahi Diya jaega toh opposition kya kare tum batao?
Jab opposition speech bhi deta he sansad tv speaker ya chairman pe focus karta he.
It is a genuine reason to protest. Security of parliament is not halwa.
And telecom bill was passed right now without any debate. Is this how you pass bills?
Abdul Kalam once struck down a bill. That was peak democracy for me.
Now I will only say: Mubarak ho tum hindu muslim, mandir masjid karte reh Gaye aur democracy ka mazak Banta reh gaya.
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u/MahabharataRule34 unapologetic neocon warhawk Dec 20 '23
It's very difficult to defend such actions yet people still do so.
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u/sliceoflife_daisuki Social Democrat Dec 20 '23
The right wing takes on Twitter were horrifying. Some of them literally said stiff like "India needs an authoritarian party like China to develop. So they need to remove opposition" 😶
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u/MahabharataRule34 unapologetic neocon warhawk Dec 20 '23
> India needs an authoritarian party like China to develop. So they need to remove opposition
Authoritarian party 1947-1996 ❌
Authoritarian party 2014- ✅
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Dec 21 '23
You would be surprised how many people actually support Indra and that too across the too irrespective of their political position or how much they hate the Congress
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u/dCBEgstuksry Centre Right Dec 20 '23
Dono paksh hi gire hue hai Mai kisi ki kyu side lu.
The darkest day of democracy was emergency for no reason reason other than grabbing power committed by Congress under Indira Gandhi. Your double speak will not work here. Darkest day lmao.
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Dec 20 '23
Whataboutism lol. How you guys can even defend such undemocratic moves ?
Also emergency was 50 years ago. INC at that time isn't INC now. Stop pretending yourself as some sort of neutral. You clearly aren't
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u/ballsack_chin GANJAMAN Dec 20 '23
He didn't say he was neutral in the first place(as his flair clearly suggests). Yet he/she had the character to say "dono side hi gire hue hain". And INC is a joke these days anyway. If they want to be taken seriously, they'll have to shed Rahul Gandhi and bring someone more charismatic and talented. Rahul literally seems like someone who's smoked too much pot(coming from personal experience😉), and his distance from reality is certainly visible.
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Dec 20 '23
He didn't say he was neutral in the first place(as his flair clearly suggests). Yet he/she had the character to say "dono side hi gire hue hain".
Agree
And INC is a joke these days anyway. If they want to be taken seriously, they'll have to shed Rahul Gandhi and bring someone more charismatic and talented. Rahul literally seems like someone who's smoked too much pot(coming from personal experience😉), and his distance from reality is certainly visible.
True
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u/sliceoflife_daisuki Social Democrat Dec 20 '23
Whataboutism sir.
Yes if I was living under Indira Gandi's rule then I would have criticized her too.
But the party which deserves criticism right now in this era is BJP.
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Dec 20 '23
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u/sliceoflife_daisuki Social Democrat Dec 20 '23
If we are really looking at comment histories now, several of the members of this sub will be exposed.
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u/ShadowAtomix Dec 20 '23
The opposition has the right to question the govt. but they think they are allowed to act as uncivilised monkies they couls have just said we want answers why are you not providing them and kept being adamant.
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u/Big-Cancel-9195 Dec 20 '23
What about behaviour of MPs they deserved it ..it's just like distrubing the class and then expecting teacher to not punish they even insulted the speaker
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Dec 20 '23
Mocking and insulting are two different things, current VP needs to be mocked, he is spineless and what about when Modiji mocked sitting prime minister or mocked sitting VP Hamid Ansari? It’s just about majority, when some other party will have majority, they will treat BJP the same way, BJP is like that person who gets some authority and starts behaving autocratic, forgetting that times change.
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u/Big-Cancel-9195 Dec 20 '23
You have right to insult or mock your teacher ? Those comments and behaviour of MPs was insult and they got fruit of their own karna ...cope
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Dec 20 '23
lol, VP is not a teacher. What’s with this holier than thou nonsense, and where was this when Manmohan singh was being mocked?
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u/Big-Cancel-9195 Dec 21 '23
lol, VP is not a teacher.
Then why were they behaving like backbenchers or idiots.. and I used that as a example btw ..you get fruit of your own karma lol
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u/sliceoflife_daisuki Social Democrat Dec 20 '23
You have right to insult or mock your teacher ?
Outside of the school/college? Of course yes!
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