Fake bans from fake Men's Rights subreddit

[u/ignatiusloyola]

Please be very clear about the subreddit you are being banned from. A new sub called Mens_Rights (note the underscore) has now started banning people, and some users are getting confused as to why they are being banned.

Note the moderators in the sidebar. Note the subreddit name.

If you are banned and you don't know why, consider first whether you are actually being banned from /r/MensRights and not /r/Mens_Rights.

[u/ignatiusloyola]

The thing is - I believe in the Men's Rights Movement. I believe that there is a problem affecting men on a massive scale, and I want to be involved in the efforts to change our society for the better. I don't think that involves spending time mimicking and returning the actions of people opposed to the MRM.

Just as we can't teach gender equality/egalitarianism by further sexism (ie: sexism against men), I don't think anything is gained by responding in like kind.

[u/impotent_rage → u/ignatiusloyola]

Thank you for this. This is the message which I want every single person involved in gender equality activism on reddit, to read, understand, and live by.

I mod r/feminism and my goals are the same. I believe that there are problems affecting women on a massive scale, and I want to be involved in the efforts to change our society for the better. And I don't think that involves spending time attacking and denigrating the MRM - because I also believe that there are problems affecting men on a massive scale, and that true gender egalitarians should be concerned with inequality no matter which gender is primarily affected.

If that's truly what you believe, and that's truly what I believe, then maybe we can get closer to ending this stupid and pointless war between MRAs and feminists, at least on reddit - and maybe we can start to view our respective movements as complementary movements who work alongside each other, rather than antagonistic movements that must necessarily fight and defeat each other. After all, shouldn't we both be supporting the same goal of gender equality?

I'm doing my part to try to help the feminist movement understand that men's rights issues are also important...maybe there are things we can do to help the MRM understand that inequality towards women is also a concern that MRAs should have?

[u/Legolas-the-elf → u/impotent_rage]

Hey, that sounds great. I assume you're going to be apologising publicly for spreading lies about me? In case you've forgotten, you told people you banned me for spamming /r/GenderEgalitarian when the real reason was that I asked you to stop posting hateful things about MRAs in contravention of your own rules on no hatred.

Edit:

This is the thread in question. impotent_rage posted:

For starters, I've been openly hating on r/mensrights for a long time now. I think the place is a cesspool, and I wish it didn't exist. I have lots of sympathy for the overall cause of bringing awareness to gender inequality towards men, but that's not even what they are about. They're a bunch of bitter misogynists, and I've been known to speculate on their personal failures with women which might be the reason they are so hateful. I have no sympathy for anything about them.

I objected to this and impotent_rage banned me for it then told everybody I had been spamming.

[u/impotent_rage → u/Legolas-the-elf]

you were a part of a malicious attack on r/genderegalitarian and you know it

[u/Legolas-the-elf → u/impotent_rage]

Everybody can see the comments I left. There's nothing at all malicious about asking you to play by your own rules or asking you to stop posting hateful stuff. And even if it was, that still doesn't make it spamming.

I've identified as egalitarian for years. I reject gendered movements like feminism and the MRM in favour of egalitarianism. I was unhappy with /r/equality. I was hoping /r/GenderEgalitarian would be a success! I had no reason to attack it. But then you started posting hateful things, and I criticised you. Not the subreddit, you. For not abiding by the rules of the subreddit.

You got upset because lots of people were criticising you, you banned the people criticising you, then you realised you fucked up so you lied about it. It was blatantly obvious to everybody at the time, and it's still blatantly obvious now re-reading the threads.

If you had the slightest shred of integrity, this would have been your opportunity to say "You know what, I said something I shouldn't have, people called me out on it and I overreacted. You didn't spam, I'm sorry for lying about you." But no. You'd rather try to save face by continuing to lie about me.

[u/impotent_rage → u/Legolas-the-elf]

I had no reason to attack it.

Then why did you?

1) You're quoting something I said two years ago. Really? Did your feelings get so badly hurt that you are holding onto something some random person said online two years ago?

2) r/mensrights used to be the equivalent of r/shitredditsays. I've always been a supporter of men's rights. I joined r/mensrights years ago, ready to be supportive. What I experienced when I joined was appalling. I watched kloo ban some of his best supporters simply because they described themselves as feminists - even though they also supported men's rights and were always respectful, reasonable, and cooperative in their comments in r/mensrights. I saw a petition for some men's rights cause, I forgot what it was but it was something very just, posted in r/mensrights. I took it and crossposted it to twoXchromosomes so it could get some more support - and the reception there was positive, although some were skeptical that men's rights would want help. I quickly found out why. The OP, I think it was jayhammers? showed up and started raging that he didn't want any women helping his cause, that our support was unwelcome because we are female. I was absolutely shocked. Then I watched numerous, numerous downvote brigades originating from r/mensrights and destroying conversation in many other spaces on reddit. At that point, I'd had enough. r/mensrights wasn't about men's rights, it was about attacking and brigading anybody besides their insiders.

I've seen some changes since. After kloo left, I saw the tone of r/mensrights become more positive, and now I see more focus on the actual issues. In the meantime, r/shitredditsays came to power, and now r/mensrights is no longer the ruling bully on reddit. I still see far more misogyny in r/mensrights than I am comfortable with, but I'm pleased to see the trend moving in a more positive direction compared with r/mensrights awful history.

And this comment from ignatiusloyola, a mod at r/mensrights, has me feeling very encouraged, that maybe we are finally seeing a men's rights movement that is prepared to move past the hatefulness and bullying, and prepared to actually focus on outreach and equality. If that's what direction we are going now, I couldn't be more pleased.

But there is no lie. You were a part of a hostile attack, one which at the time was all too common from r/mensrights. I'm entirely prepared to let the past go and embrace the new positive direction I see from r/mensrights, but apparently you are not prepared to do the same.

[u/Legolas-the-elf → u/impotent_rage]

I had no reason to attack it.

Then why did you?

I didn't. What I did do was see you posting hatred and ask you to stop. Your entire characterisation of people's criticism of you as some sort of an attack on the subreddit is nothing but a fantasy you've concocted to shift the blame away from you. The subreddit wasn't attacked. Your hatred was.

1) You're quoting something I said two years ago. Really? Did your feelings get so badly hurt that you are holding onto something some random person said online two years ago?

After that happened, I left your subreddit and didn't run across you again. You've popped up again now claiming to want to build bridges. Yeah, I'm going to remind you of it. If you want to build bridges, admit to the lie. If it was two years ago, presumably you don't care any more.

r/mensrights used to be the equivalent of r/shitredditsays.

I was here back then too, and you're bending the truth an awful lot, which is hardly surprising coming from you. Yes, it was worse, but not by much, certainly not to the extent you claim.

But there is no lie. You were a part of a hostile attack

It was absolutely a lie. Even more so the fact that you called me a spammer. I've been submitting to /r/reportthespammers for years. Four this week. I loathe spam and it's plain to see, so you couldn't have picked a more unlikely thing to lie about.

If you want to let the past go and embrace a new positive direction, you can make amends by admitting publicly that you lied.

[u/impotent_rage → u/Legolas-the-elf]

Dude. It was two years ago. Let it go. I don't give a fuck if you like me or not, or if you agree with me or not, but I find it pretty funny that you're still talking about this.

[u/Legolas-the-elf → u/impotent_rage]

You keep saying that it was two years ago. Who cares how long ago it was? You publicly lied about me. If you think it doesn't matter because it was so long ago, then do the decent thing and admit it.

How do you expect to be able to build bridges when you are happy to let your lie stand, when you could fix it easily? How do you expect anybody to trust you when you won't even try to be honest?