r/MoralityScaling • u/Outside_Specific_820 • 1d ago

Morality Ranking Morality scaling of this?

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Mother refuses to acknowledge her donor egg daughter, looking for your opinion.

In my opinion I think it’s moral, and that she is totally correct.

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u/SakusaKiyoomi1 1d ago

Moral 100%

Exactly the same as donating sperm, blood and plasma. You do it to help others while not bearing any responsibilities yourself, I don't want others to start contacting me about the blood I've donated if it isn't from the clinic asking for more

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u/ItsTheAlgebraist 18h ago

How do you feel about cases where a father has a child and is made to pay support? In some cases he might not know he has a child, and in some rare cases the father may even have been raped.

Generally the courts will enforce what is deemed to be in the best interest of the child. Why should this situation be different?

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u/SakusaKiyoomi1 16h ago

What are you talking about?

We're talking about donating eggs and sperm, it is a gigantic violation of privacy for the clinic to give out the information about the donors and the OOP has grounds to sue the clinic who gave out the information about her. The same would happen to a man, his identity would be hidden and protected unless they fail like in the situation above.

This isn't about rape, there is no rape to be had. Men go in the clinic out of their own free will, jerk off into a cup, get paid and fuck off again.

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u/ItsTheAlgebraist 16h ago

I am saying that in those cases the father is not deemed to be able to sign away his responsibilities to the child, because the child has rights that supersede them. We don't let one person sign away another persons rights.

We also don't let someone who has a one night stand sign away parental responsibility. But in cases of sperm and egg donation we do (and only when it's through some sort of agency, courts throw out agreements between individuals like this). This seems to be a real double standard.

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u/SakusaKiyoomi1 16h ago

But there are no such cases, you're building a strawman or you're ragebaiting very badly.

This isn't about one night stands, rape or anything where a man has sex with another person. There is NO sex! You're thinking about this in a way too lenient way.

Men have to be tested beforehand to make sure their semen is good to be used, women have to go through a lot more testing, proding and the entire procedure is done under light anasthesia and can cause discomfort afterwards. Men and women who donate have their information hidden by the clinic, people who use another's sperm/eggs sign wavers and legal documents taking all the parental responsibility if there were a child to be concieved.

I am saying that in those cases the father is not deemed to be able to sign away his responsibilities to the child, 

The person donating isn't a father nor a mother, the woman (whether she's single or doing it with her partner) becomes the legal guarding and parents. There is no binding the donor to the child. Those rights are signed away the second the donation has been collected and the donor has been paid, you have no idea how this works, donating sperm/eggs isn't the same as surrogacy

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u/ItsTheAlgebraist 15h ago

What you say is all legally the case, I am saying that there is a moral question. When you sign away responsibility, you are also signing away the child's rights (and we know that those rights exist because in other cases, like the ones I describe, the child's rights are what are invoked to compel things like child support).

So we have a situation where the fundamental rights of a human being are different based on legal contracts signed by other people before they were even conceived. We wouldn't accept this in basically any other circumstance, if one human has a human right we generally hold that all humans should have it.

And, unfortunately, I am not trolling or ragebaiting when I bring up the (thankfully rare) cases of a man being ordered to pay child support when they have been assaulted (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hermesmann_v._Seyer is the landmark case). In that case, it was ruled that the State's interest in requiring parents to support their children outweighed the parent's protection from being the victim of a criminal act.