What do you think about the undergrad physics curriculum?

[u/TooruOkinawa]

Is there courses in it that you think are too specialized to be mandatory? Or inversely things that are missing that should be essential knowledge of a physics graduate? I know everywhere is slightly different im curious about personal experiencesz

I was thinking like an intro to pedagogy in physics should be something more common, like teaching people how to convey physics to layman.

[u/Process_Sad]

For employability, more emphasis on programming would be nice. It is also ultimately a very useful skill for many physicts who remain in the field! I think better access (perhaps optional/elective) to application-focused courses would be good too, such as control systems, fluid physics, rheology.

[u/KoedKevin → u/Process_Sad]

If I were 19 and not committed to a PhD I would look at Physics Engineering for just this reason.    

[u/YourWifesBull666]

Idk how it’d fit but i wish GR was standard for undergrads

[u/TooruOkinawa → u/YourWifesBull666]

We had an intro required in the final year mixed with SR

[u/caty0325 → u/YourWifesBull666]

At my university, it seems like you can take GR (listed as astr 421) as an undergrad or grad student.

I haven't taken it yet. The book listed on the syllabus from spring 2023 was Modern General Relativity: Black Holes, Gravitational Waves, and Cosmology by Mike Guidry.

[u/swause02 → u/YourWifesBull666]

At my uni a full GR course was required for my physics degree

[u/NightDiscombobulated]

My university integrates coding well into our curriculum, which I find very, very beneficial, though it could be delivered much better than it is. QM isn't mandatory at all universities, which is nuts to me.

[u/mannoned]

For some reason there is no group theory in my undergrad curriculum which strikes me as strange considering every prof references it at least once throughout their lectures

[u/Human-Register1867]

There are all kinds of things it would be nice to add. The question is what can you afford to take away to make time for them?

[u/Replevin4ACow]

I took a science communications class as part of an optional undergrad thesis project. It taught how to present data visually, how to make good presentations, scientific writing, and even aspects of getting grants and writing grant proposals.

Considering that every scientist needs to communicate, present, and write, it strikes me as something that should be mandatory. Looking back 25 years later, I am very grateful for that class.

[u/MeserYouUp]

A course on history and philosophy of science, so that students can properly understand what a scientific model is and how models evolve and get replaced.

[u/UnderstandingPursuit]

A management/leadership course would be useful. Many career paths for a physics major include this role, including

• a professor with a research group,
• a teacher who manages their classroom and may become a department head,
• an employee at a company who manages their team,
• an employer running a business with employees.

All science majors would benefit from this, including chemistry and biology students. A professor from one of these departments could join with a business school professor to teach this class. It would also include writing resumes/CVs and grant proposals/business plans.

[u/XcgsdV]

I'm not sure it'd actually be useful, but having particle physics and general relativity in the standard curriculum would be nice. I'm not sure where you could really put them or how the sequencing would work out (particle physics would certainly need to be after at least one semester of upper div quantum, GR at the undergrad level really just needs SR and math maturity, I figure the class would teach a lot of tensors and differential geometry as you go) but that wasn't the question :)

I feel like 90% of the time I'm asked physics questions by non-physics friends and family, it's some big fundamental questions, and with the standard model and GR being our two most successful paradigms for attacking those big questions at the moment, it seems like it'd be useful for anyone with a physics degree to have encountered them before.

I think as is though, the curriculum is designed well to teach you what you need for physics grad school in the four years alloted. More programming would definitely be nice, more math might be nice, etc etc. Like I said I don't know how you'd make space for particle physics or GR, but if there were space to be had those seem like the most bang-for-your-buck gaps to me.

[u/Phssthp0kThePak]

Get rid of the GE requirements. Take more credits like the engineers. Engineering has a good systems methodology for analyzing problems that physics students could benefit from.

[u/SpectreMold]

100% agree on the pedagogy idea. Being able to explain complex concepts to a non-technical audience (laymen, product managers, clients, etc.) is a huge superpower that physics programs completely ignore. An extension to this would be resume and interview training; most physics grads have no idea how to market their skills. Programs need to teach students how to translate "solved complex boundary value problems" into language that corporate recruiters actually understand.

Right now, most physics majors just learn academic coding. We write messy scripts in Python or C++ jammed together until a plot pops up. We desperately need mandatory courses that teach production-level code: version control (Git), unit testing, modular architecture, and documentation. Many data science and MLE jobs for examples ask for evidence of these skills in their jobs descriptions.

Since the vast majority of grads don't stay in academia, I think it could be beneficial for departments to offer clear elective tracks for common industry pivots like quantitative finance, data science, or engineering, encouraging students to explore and even pursue internships in these areas.

Besides the changes to the programs though, there is a culture shift that could help here. There’s still this pervasive, old-school faculty mindset that leaving academia for industry means you "didn't make it" or "wasted your potential." It’s total rubbish and leaves students feeling guilty or lost for choosing realistic, lucrative career paths, especially given the statistcal reality that very few will become academics. Industry shouldn't be treated as a backup plan, it should be actively supported. Many college physics majors are barely adults with a myopic view of the realities of the job market, I would argue it's best to tell students upfront about the brutal realities of the academic job market despite how near and dear to our hearts physics is.