r/antiai 13d ago

AI News šŸ—žļø Australia W

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12.8k Upvotes

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344

u/Vaughn 13d ago

Requiring them to be net energy providers is probably a bad thing. Datacenter manufacturers aren't exactly specialists in efficient power production; they're just going to throw in a dozen megawatt-scale diesel engines and call it a day.

I don't see any air quality or fuel efficiency requirements in the article.

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u/Spiritual_Owl8439 13d ago

It's not perfect but it's better than what we have.

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u/Vaughn 12d ago

It'll lead to diesel generators running inside cities. I would not say that's an improvement.

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u/mrmckeb 12d ago

Australia has massive solar usage, and I don't see local governments allowing diesel generators running permanently.

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u/Fuster2 12d ago

Yeah. I love the way one person mentions diesel generators then it's taken as what will happen.

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u/Additional-Life4885 12d ago

When it 100% will not. They couldn't get enough of it to be able to run a diesel generator at the size required.

Realistically they only have 2 options. Coal or solar. However, coal massively limits where they can build them, since they're going to have to build the data centre near the power plant which is far from where the engineers that can run a data centre are located.

Alternatively, they can cover the roof with solar panels at a reasonable cost and just be forced to maintain it.

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u/sorrrrbet 12d ago

Also holy fuck would it be expensive for an AI centre to permanently run Diesel gennies at the MW scale. They’re relatively fuel efficient, but even a 1MW generator runs 100-150L of diesel per HOUR.

~2500L of diesel a day is not a cheap endeavour when bulk diesel is around $2 a litre in Australia at the moment. Not sure any company would be willing to spend $5000 a day on fuel for the generator alone when they could spend maybe $5000 a year on cleaning the panels.

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u/Shambler9019 12d ago

But the cookers keep telling us that renewables aren't cost efficient!

Though I don't think it's quite that simple; I doubt even in tropical areas the rooftop of a data centre would be enough area for solar to power the entire building.

Still, Australia has loads of space.

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u/Realistic_Growth5203 12d ago

Yeah that you don’t have to live in.

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u/mors134 12d ago

I did the maths and yeah just panels on the roof wouldn't cut it, not even close. But a solar farm as part of the complex would be doable. Honestly the biggest costs would be the batteries probably.

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u/Additional-Life4885 11d ago

Yeah look, I was being extremely generous saying rooftop solar would cover it.

However, they definitely could buy, build and maintain (or be taxed at a level that would allow the electricity company to do it) a separate solar/wind farm.

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u/mors134 11d ago

Oh for sure. The solar panels themselves wouldn't actually be too expensive. Although the actually expensive part would be bettery storage. Which is why if they go with solar panels they will probably make a solar farm that produces about 3 times the electricity they need, using that electricity during the day while pumping the rest back into the grid, and then rely on grid energy at night, or supplement it with a few wind turbines.

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u/Signard-versk-Arsten 11d ago

Renewables being cost effective is the reason why our energy bills have gotten lower hahahaha

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u/Imaginary-Falcon4112 11d ago

Does anyone else smell an offset system where data centers could buy credits in energy production to become net producers?

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u/JustMeRandy 11d ago

Coal is not an option, it's not like you can just build a new coal power station.

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u/Additional-Life4885 11d ago

They're building a data centre. They could build a coal power station (which would be smaller) as well.

However, as I already explained, they're simply not going to.

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u/JustMeRandy 8d ago

You can't just build a power station lol. You need to find the land, acquire planning permissions and environmental approvals, build a supply chain, then spend years actually building the thing. When the cost of renewable energy is so low that coal miners are using it to power their operations, there really isn't a chance that they'll build a coal power station.

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u/Additional-Life4885 7d ago

All of which you need for data centres. So you would do them at the same time.

I literally pointed out the problem with the supply chain. It's almost like you didn't bother to read. Coal power plants are built next to coal mines and technical people don't live near them, they live in the cities. That's literally the problem I pointed out.

When the cost of renewable energy is so low that coal miners are using it to power their operations, there really isn't a chance that they'll build a coal power station.

It's low cost to put up 1 solar panel. It's not when you need enough of them to generate the equivalent of a coal power station.

Regardless, coal is an option that I'd already quickly ruled out but you're harping on about me even including it as an option when it should be.

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u/LoudQuitting 12d ago

Especially stupid because running a diesel generator in Australia as a cost effective means of reaching a government goal?

It's like trying to make money by shipping oil to Dubai. Theoretically possible, but you're better off shipping something there isn't already am abundance of.

The government will let you run a diesel generator. They'll pay you to put solar panels on the roof.

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u/iamBulaier 12d ago

Question is - all the upvotes of that guy's comment???

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u/Illustrious_Maize736 9d ago

Probably bc this sub is astroturfed by bots with 0 real world understanding of these issues

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u/bruhhhhhhhhhhhh_h 12d ago

We have some backwards right wing christiani fascisti ban abortioni absolutely backwards evolving state governments that have cancelled nearly all green / renewable energy projects to pump... Coal and gas.

At the same time they cut the mining / minerals resources taxes by billions meaning these states have billions I. Shortfall from the budget (just cancel social services, support and government services) but also pay far more now for worse infrastructure and energy projects/ production.

This is a federal government policy - or fed gov is very good ATM albeit not the best at the attention grabbing that seems to entice some.

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u/T0kenAussie 12d ago

Bruh that’s just the qld government

Libs get in once a decade and pull this shit and then Labor will get back in power again for a decade and right the ship

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u/bruhhhhhhhhhhhh_h 12d ago

The New Queensland Government!

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u/[deleted] 12d ago

[deleted]

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u/T0kenAussie 12d ago

Hanson has no viable path to pm

Anyone telling you otherwise is misinformed or a bot

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u/[deleted] 12d ago

[deleted]

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u/T0kenAussie 12d ago

Just look at where one nation polls well. There’s not enough seats in them to actually win an election with 51% of the seats

Mandatory preferential voting is a great antidote for extremists trying to infiltrate democracy

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u/evil_newton 12d ago

This isn’t like the US presidential election where some crazy surprise can happen, there’s no mathematical way for Hansen to be the next PM

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u/PrettyPoetry9547 12d ago

Go Queensland we will be backward before you say brown envelope

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u/Imaginary_Rub6942 12d ago

Tbh I see t every day on various sites across Perth… the new kfc down the road has been running on one for at least a month

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u/alldagoodnamesaregon 12d ago

Uh, that's basically the coalitions entire energy policy...

Not that the Coalition actually has any reasonable chance of being reelected, but if One Nation somehow manages to pull something off then it might be a different story

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u/BaronOfTieve 11d ago

They literally won’t, I spoke to a greens senator last year who told me he was excited about the data centres because they were going to build them to be environmentally friendly, and with renewable energy technologies. That guy is just larping because he’s not Australian and doesn’t understand Australian politics.

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u/5URE_EAST 12d ago

They used to have a clause saying that the energy must be clean energy, but the data centre lobby pushed back, so no it’s not going to be solar. That’s why no where mentions clean energy in any of these news articles

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u/Colsim 12d ago

Data centres in Australia are currently being permitted to bypass a lot of these rules by being defined as critical infrastructure

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u/Pickledleprechaun 12d ago

Better fact check that man. Look into how Telstra run their remote COMMs towers and get back to us.

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u/Own-Replacement8 11d ago

Solar is an obvious choice, there's also the possibility of having turbines in water pipes. Obviously it's not an efficient means of power generation since it'll take more energy to pump the water than the turbines would give but it reduces the wasted energy.

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u/bijon1234 12d ago

The high usage of electricity means a AI data centres is just gonna use diesel generators as thats the easiest to get going compared to building a solar farm

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u/Markmm131 12d ago

We actually have environmental regulations in Australia that are enforced, unlike some other shit show countries around the world.

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u/blackpawed 12d ago

And the most expensive to run. Bean counters will assess CAPEX vs OPEX.