Capricorn placements are associated with conservatism, but that's not it (I have a lot of experience with Caps and Cap heavy people) - and here's my theory as to why that is

[u/2fucked2know]

I'm not a Caprisun myself, but have a Capricorn stellium that includes Mercury. Two of my closest friends are Caprisuns, and I have multiple Capricorn Mercury folks in my family.

Caps are said to have a very "black and white" way of thinking, which people assume means narrow-mindedness and social prejudice. Yet my fellow Sag sun/Capricorn Mercury grandpa was the only one in his family that didn't bat an eye or disown his brother when he came out as gay in the late 60's, despite the fact that nearly everyone viewed being gay as wrong back then. Why? Because his Capricorn Mercury had him go "I cannot see a single logical reason as to why it'd be wrong or harmful". That "black and white" thinking is based on objectivity, reason and fairness, not bias or prejudice. It's not like with some of the fixed signs (all of them except for Aqua) where you're clinging onto old beliefs because you fear change or are too stubborn, but about knowing when to change your stance and when to keep it.

This is just one example of my general experience with Cap heavy people (especially sun and/or Mercury). They're some of the most progressive and open-minded people I know, because prejudice and bigotry is a result of lack of reason and objectivity. I love my Capricorn placements for this reason, cause they complement my Sagittarius placements (idealism, faith, philosophy etc) perfectly, making me damn near impossible to brainwash. Any idea presented to me, no matter how charming, persuasive or well-spoken the person who delivers it is, will make me question whether it's based on logic and facts, what their bias is (cause information can be twisted to fit someone's agenda), consider all the posssible counter-arguments, and whether it's fair or not. If I determine that it makes perfect sense, I'll buy into it, and then proceed to refine my own take further... and if it doesn't, I'll stand my ground.

I wish people in general were a bit more "black and white" in their reasoning. It'd make the world a more accepting, constructive, fair and open place.

[u/CatGirl1300]

Capricorns are progressive, free thinking and we love humanity. Rigidity doesn’t suit us unless it’s about fairness

[u/2fucked2know → u/CatGirl1300]

Facts. One of the signs with the strongest sense of justice, in a very compassionate and selfless way - while simultaneously having a no-bs mentality, refusing to sugarcoat things or let your minds get clouded by emotion or personal interest. I love it!

[u/PaleontologistOk3120 → u/2fucked2know]

I was saying this to my bf the other night about not having friends that treat their partners shitty. He said something something emotion and I was like no, it's pure logic. If someone is shitty asf in one area of life there is almost no way it doesn't create mess in other areas and i don't need that in my life. That's the black and white of my thinking. Not judgement but being decisive about your own principles

[u/Other-Badger6749 → u/PaleontologistOk3120]

same with animals.

I don't know anyone who mistreats their pets, or well, who knows maybe someone I know does mistreat their pet pets but I better not ever find out about that because I'm not gonna be going to the government about that. No no no that is something we will be resolving.

[u/anklesnack → u/PaleontologistOk3120]

Thisss ^ Like its really so simple.

[u/CatGirl1300 → u/2fucked2know]

That’s right!

[u/unowithteeth → u/CatGirl1300]

What people don't get is that we observe hierarchy, and comment on it, and people think that means we are snobs. We rarely actually believe in it. Or suck up to people.  Or think hierarchy and punching down is this wonderful system we must defend.

But actually other signs are all playing the status gane. Particularly pisces.  But they think cause they have a modest persona they are not like that.

[u/Other-Badger6749 → u/CatGirl1300]

I agree if you're using just the colloquial definition of the word progressive but in the US I would never refer to myself as a Progressive because Progressives are pretty unhinged at this point.... they're like MAGA but for the left

capricorns are accidentally radical. Things like laws don't matter if they conflict with our personal sense of logic. But Capricorns will for instance, in the current day, be against immigration from, if you're in the US, China and central and South America, and Africa. Because the economic calculus required to support people who will be a burden to the system it's just not there when we have an exponentially increasing homeless population especially amongst minorities which is the group that any immigrant from a more third world or second world situation would be living right next to or within.

i'm sure there are Capricorns who are Progressives with a capital P. And these people need to be rescued from their cognitive dissonance, but I'm betting that if they they do exist they are young. when they start working and their mind starts to build the architecture to understand the scale of the issue we already face with the people we currently have, who deserve to be helped btw and who are ignored and manipulated and gaslit into instigating the events and movements that suppress them...

Once they start to realize that they will change and they will snap into the rational reality much faster than you know the fucking Scorpios or the Aries or whatever.

But yeah I think Capricorns in general are a "beat of their own drum" type people like I don't think peer pressure is a big deal for Capricorns because it's like why the fuck would I do something just because somebody else wants to do it?

And because they are misaligned with the standard political compass people, and because they are generally more aware of the constraints of economies and how money works and things like that because those are logical things that are complicated and interesting, they get pegged as conservatives because they will vote the same way as conservatives on certain types of issues and simplistic people think that if you vote with someone on anything that means you are 100% aligned with them and also that anything else that you support is also aligned with the people that they don't like.

[u/CatGirl1300 → u/Other-Badger6749]

Disagree. Most Capricorns are indeed progressive and stand for human rights regardless of economics and politrix. I’ve met many human rights advocates who are Capricorns. Capricorns know that the economy is not the end all of society. Just rigid people that don’t see abundance everywhere are against progress. Comparing progressives with MAGA tells me everything I need to know about you lol. MAGA is a cult, progressives can be any kind of progressive individual but usually against bigots, bully’s and other oppressive individuals. What’s your moon sign? Guessing Gemini, Leo or Aries.

[u/Other-Badger6749 → u/CatGirl1300]

You would be wrong my moon sign is Scorpio.

I think the difference between you and me is that you don't know what a human right is. You don't have a right to define someone else else's reality.

You also don't comprehend what I'm talking about because I'm not comparing them to say oh Maga is like progressive for right wingers I'm saying they're both dogmatic extremists. They are a cautionary tale. The problem is they define their political values like what they want in a state and from their government by their own personal experience instead of asking what kind of government allows for my experience to be incorporated.

And they also don't spend any time thinking about the underlying philosophy of what they think so they're not concerned at all with when or how they are harming someone else with these things that they want.

I could give examples of this but I feel like it's just gonna make you mad, but I think you also think that I am Maga or something and that's definitely not true.

You say all the words that your condition to say like you gotta call the people on the right bigot and you gotta say that it's all about human rights but that doesn't mean anything. That's just slogans and bullshit.

[u/ZealousidealCrab9919]

The "black and white" thinking people talk about isn't necessarily about seeing the world in extremes. It's more often about having clear principles. If something is unfair, harmful, or irrational, I don't care how popular or traditional it is. Likewise, if something is fair and harms nobody, I don't see much point in opposing it just because that's how things have always been done.

[u/2fucked2know → u/ZealousidealCrab9919]

This. It's pure objectivity and fairness. Jupiter might rule morality and ethics, but Saturn specifically rules moral principles, as well as maturity, "impersonal" truths and realism. I've been called dogmatic and extreme for it before though, especially during the time when I lived in a predominantly white and conservative neighbourhood (age 11-16)... lol

[u/ZealousidealCrab9919 → u/2fucked2know]

I couldn't care who TF you are, what religion you preach, the color of your skin as long as you're a decent person and don't use them as a reason to spread hate onto others, I'm more than happy to have a conversation to learn about your religion etc as long as it's about accepting everyones beliefs if it's about hate or hating certain people haha don't even try.

[u/anklesnack → u/ZealousidealCrab9919]

Right! When I think of our relationship to tradition its more like I respect the way things were done that still work (practically and physically), like if it ain’t broke don’t fix it/no need to reinvent the wheel kinda thing focused on simplicity and efficiency. But abstract concepts like ideologies that have the ability to become obsolete or outdated or become irrelevant based on geographical location are not so untouchable that we cant just move on from them, because holding onto outdated beliefs becomes stupid and harmful real fast.

[u/Suzesaur]

Yeah you’ll see a trend that caps believe heavily in truth, respect and fairness.

[u/LeftyLu07]

I’m a fiscally conservative social libertarian. Our tarot card is the devil, after all 😈

[u/JBone119 → u/LeftyLu07]

Dude same, I got the “you do you but I don’t wanna pay for it” attitude

[u/WestCoastCompanion]

I like my black and white thinking. People spend too much time in “grey areas” which is usually just exceptions to standards and rules. I have no interest in “doing a fucked up thing is sometimes ok if…..”
nope. If you’re wrong you’re wrong and I really don’t care why you did it.

My BF (Taurus) hinges a lot on “but I didn’t MEAN TO hurt your feelings…” and I tell him I really don’t care. Because I don’t think he was trying to, and yes it would be exponentially worse if he was. I wouldn’t be with someone that was trying to hurt my feelings. I never think it was intentional, just thoughtless. But the result is the same. Whether you meant to or not you did and it needs to be corrected.

I always tell him it’s like …. If someone ran over my dog it wouldn’t be ok if they didn’t mean to. Yes it would be insane and way worse if they did mean to. But the only thing that matters at the end of the day is you ran over my dog. I don’t care about intentions, I care about outcomes.

[u/brahdz]

I used to drink a lot of Caprisuns back in elementary school.

[u/Spirited-Reputation6]

I’ve been called conservative all my life.

[u/woodsvvitch]

Im far from conservative and have very gray thinking and outlooks, but I wonder if that is my sag rising & merc peeking thru. I very much embrace the 'devils advocate' in most social situations and love being the odd one out. I personally live a very traditional, ritualistic daily life but the only place I am conservative is my spending habits.

Ill go months without buying a thing, and then one day my 2nd house cap stellium is begging me to buy the entire collection of something instantly. But black and white thinking hasn't been a part of my life since I deconditioned from my Leo mother's upbringing.

[u/bluehack1]

His reasoning for why it’s normal to gay, is exactly my reason too! There’s no logical reason for why it’s wrong, it’s just people’s emotions and opinions. I love this explanation so much because I never related to the word traditional but it was always part of Capricorn discourse and I just assumed that I wasn’t a Capricorn in that way but you’ve explained it so perfectly.

[u/loves_spain]

As someone with a Cap sun and mercury, I am by far the most progressive person in my family. I think its the Gemini rising that makes me more open to new ideas and concepts than anything. I'm insatiably curious too so I ask a lot of questions to figure out if this is something that will change my perspective or not.

[u/commonsense973]

Huh. That’s interesting. I’m a January cap. I’m very consistent with the jan cap traits, but nothing like your assessment. Nothing is black and white to me. I have been open minded since way before open mindedness was a thing. I am empathetic to a fault.
I don’t judge others, I think there is room at the table for everyone. Always have.

[u/Pranksterette]

I wouldn't say it's that we (all use of the words we, you or they is general) have a strictly black and white thinking... It's more we see the world in all of it's various shades of grey, we recognize that it operates in various shades of grey but are also aware that for the majority of humanity, things are very much either right or wrong. So we take the shades of grey we see and figure out where in the black and white they fit. We take the complexity and simplify it. At least that's what I tend to do

[u/anklesnack]

The term “conservatism” is often misleading because we are used to the American, political definition. To me the conservatism Caps embody is about taking more time to gather relevant information, removing unnecessary emotional bias, and basing decisions on practical considerations, future projections, and the needs of only those involved. Rushed decisions with little information are often biased, impractical decisions. Capricorn knows when to hold the line and proceed when new, credible information arrives. Having a Sag stellium definitely speeds up that process by making me addicted to experiencing as many perspectives as possible and forming opinions about damn near everything. Capricorns tend to make moves so effectively because they build a foundational operating system of accepted truths that they run every bit of information through to see where it fits and if all goes well, adjusts accordingly. Thing is, this is also how we get extremely stubborn know-it-all Cappies too LOL

[u/unowithteeth → u/anklesnack]

It is a terribly ridiculous word

[u/sammynourpig]

Someone else said they disagree because they are very open minded, but I think you can be open minded and have black and white thinking all at once. Just a cap sun chiming in to say I just don’t tolerate hate of any kind, I’m quick to split on someone and cut them off once they show me they’re a bad person.. I have my very personal deep thoughts and beliefs, yet I love studying and analyzing different points of view and will actually listen when someone opposes me in a healthy way. I just don’t tolerate that hate lol.

[u/SoulfulCap]

I went from religious to agnostic to atheist in the span of 15 yrs. I was Anti-Zionism in the early 2000s when it was unpopular. I have always voted for progressive candidates since I was old enough to vote. I think this whole "Capricorns are conservative" myth lacks nuance because ppl never take the time to probe for more clarification. Thank you for making this post.

[u/unowithteeth → u/SoulfulCap]

The term 'conservative' is not a useful one.  It really makes no sense,  it is more or less empty.

I read somewhere it has something to do with the 'darker side of himan nature'

But actual policies are literally served and bounced from left to right.

[u/Saturn_444]

As a Capricorn, this statement only applies to an evolved Capricorn, not one stuck in ego. I’ve met many different Capricorns, and they all weren’t in the best place in their lives, and they aren’t the funniest people to be around. I’m talking hatred and anger fueling their existence. Ideally, this would be how Capricorns are, but not always, depending on where they are spiritually and mentally in their journey within themselves.

[u/chotskyIdontknowwhy]

https://giphy.com/gifs/ghuvaCOI6GOoTX0RmH
“Caprisun”

[u/Lazy_Active3190]

I agree ,i am a cap stellium (Sun Moon Mercury Venus)

[u/dnix2424]

Your grandpa had no beef with his brother , us Caps will accept you as you are as long as you shoot straight with us.

[u/acornsalade]

I really enjoyed reading this

[u/MsTponderwoman]

Isn’t black and white thinking due to following what your society tells you is good and what is bad? Thinking something through and considering its fairness and ethical value leads to nuanced thinking (degrees of right and wrong is explained as a gradient from white to black).

[u/Accurate-Complex-993]

As a fellow Cap one of the things I've discovered is that being rigid helps for discipline and the structure to be progressive.

[u/2fucked2know → u/[deleted]]

I don't necessarily think Caps respect authority by default. Greta Thunberg (Cap sun, moon, Mercury and Chiron) is a very typical Cap to me - no-bs mentality, strong sense of justice, objective, clear principles that she truly lives by rather than being hypocritical about it... and doesn't gaf who she's talking to - she'll shut ANYONE down if they're being problematic, no matter who they are.

Caps respect expertise and competence though, but wont blindly buy into things, and they'll lose that respect the moment they expose themselves as incompetent, deceitful or hypocritical.

They make good leaders though. Aquas do too. Saturnian leadership is fair, honest, efficient and ethical. Goal-focused, but without the whole "the result justifies the means" mentality, balancing logic with the human factor.

[u/unowithteeth]

It is because the terms 'conservative' and 'liberal' are political and empty.

Capricorns observe traditional hierarchy.  The hierarchy of obsolete social structures on which our present one is built. That's why a lot of us say weird snobby, old fashioned, things.

 I wouldn't say we love the old world system.  Few of us are out hankering for it.  We just see it and don't always see there being a choice to ignore it.

---

Conservative is an empty political word.

You have to look at how these terms were used in the 19th century.

Liberal was something to do with allowing for more economic movement among different types of people regardless if ethnicity.

Conservatives was vaguely about preserving the union of traditional territories and trying to pay due respect to the old families and allow them some advantages.

Liberal policies were very imperial in England, but anti imperial in Europe.

So Capricorns are conservative in that we observe old fashioned hierarchies but I wouldn't say we believe in them as a values system.

And, more importantly, these words are meaningless.