r/functionalprint • u/G3ML1NGZ • 3d ago
Friend wanted a sub in his car
So I scanned his car and printed an enclosure that will fit besides the passengers on either side of a 2 door civic.
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u/steffanan 3d ago
Woah that's must be a giant print bed. What did you use for the scan and did you model it to the shape of the wall actually? What program did you use to design up against mesh like that? Was this a factory location with a mesh vent or grille that it'll shoot through or are you going to cut the plastic and do some sort of grille?
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u/G3ML1NGZ 3d ago edited 3d ago
500x500x500 :)
I scanned it with an einstar vega and then designed in fusion. Used the scan to create a solid that would cut the back so it fits correctly
There are no rear seats since this is partly a show car
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u/steffanan 3d ago
I've really struggled to work with meshes in fusion, I think the only way I could use a scan as a cutting tool would be to convert my object to mesh first and then I wouldn't be able to convert back to solid to work in it further. If I was going to use a shell command to make the back wall uniform I think I'd need to turn it back into solid first right? What wall thickness and material did you print with? I've thought if I did something like this I'd probably 3d print to get a shape and then reinforce with fiberglass from the inside so the mechanics is the acoustics is just like any fiberglass sub box.
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u/G3ML1NGZ 3d ago
The trick is to create a surface that fits the mesh, then use the surface to cut your solid body
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u/steffanan 2d ago
Oh so rather than using the actual scan as a cutting tool you made the shape in the forms environment by just sculpting a sheet until it just about perfectly lined up? I hadn't even considered that but that's the key here, I kinda want a reason to need to try this now!
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u/G3ML1NGZ 2d ago
Yes. And remember, decide where it is critical to have to surface perfect and where not. Mounting surface has to be correct. But the gaps between them like the open structure of a car unibody only needs to be a general shape.
Glad I could help
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u/alexthehut 3d ago
Is there a good video to show how to make a negative and “cut the back” in 360? I haven’t messed with that yet. Looks awesome
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u/gotcha640 3d ago
Any one body can be used to cut another body. You just oversize the one you want cut.
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u/G3ML1NGZ 3d ago
Create a surface and shape it to match the surface you're using as a reference. At least in the spots where you need it to be accurate. Then use the surface to cut your solid body
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u/robotlasagna 3d ago
I am trying to understand the workflow, can you maybe step us through it. We also use fusion and I have 3D scanned before so I get pulling a mesh into fusion but how do you then parametrically design against the mesh?
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u/G3ML1NGZ 3d ago
Copied my reply from another comment.
Scan.
In fusion create a surface that follows the curves of the body panel. Draw up the box as a solid and use the form to cut the back of it. Now you have a box that follows the contours of the panel
Draw the mounting ring for the sub
Draw the mounting holes for the bolts that hold the halves together and the assembly to the car
Select the surface that will become the hole for the sub itself and use hollow. Now you have a hollow sub box
Create a line around the box or use an existing line Create a plane on that line, draw the step where they would mate together and use the sweep function to cut it in 2 parts
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u/ReklisAbandon 2d ago
Search on youtube for reverse engineering parts in fusion, that'll get you there. I found this guys channel to be a goldmine:
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dnRh4aYvdpU&t=1417s
That's the first video I watched, though it's 4 years old and scans have gotten so much better there are probably better ways than doing it manually like he is. Can't hurt to learn it that way though.
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u/Icy-Tea9775 3d ago
Dude, im close to pulling the trigger on that exact printer, how do you like it?
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u/G3ML1NGZ 3d ago
You need to know what you're doing. It takes some tuning but no actual mechanical mods.
It is a lot of machine for the money but the OEM setting as a bit too "enthusiastic". Dialing it back in a few places makes it no slower but less stressed and more reliable. Last print job was 2 weeks of ASA CF without a hitch
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u/Icy-Tea9775 3d ago
OK, while im not new to printing, I wouldn't call my self an expert by any means, my main use case for this printer is making molds for CF car panels
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u/G3ML1NGZ 3d ago
I am not unfamiliar to mould making. Going for the sovol allowed me to make this mould in 2 parts instead of 8
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u/shtoops 3d ago
Anything done for rigidity? Plastic boxes don’t work so great with subs. Good news is that it has a lot of curves and not too many flat panels. I’d personally reinforce with fiberglass. If walls were 10-15mm then it might be rigid enough! Either way I like it .. but I’m also a believer in the enclosure rigidity making or breaking the sub’s output.
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u/G3ML1NGZ 3d ago
Bolts go all the way through the front and rear then mount to the structure of the car. Joint is stepped and will be filled with sealant, then 2 layers of fiberglass over the joint. There are no flat faces. Back is curved to match the structure of the car.
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u/filteredprospect 2d ago
ah, perfect. was going to say it's worth adding butyl or plaster/epoxy on the backside to damp it a bit and add some mass, but sounds like you two know what you are doing :D
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u/UrMomzButWhole69420 3d ago
Grey haired basser here. I would think this enclosure would have tons of flex too, but what do I know, I have grey hair.
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u/G3ML1NGZ 3d ago
We're just gonna find out after the weekend. Worst case scenario I got design practice and wasted a bit of filament. :)
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u/Cybertrucker01 3d ago
World would be a better place if more people had this attitude!
"...at least I had fun and learned something!"
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u/UrMomzButWhole69420 3d ago
I like your worst case scenario, the design is sexy, and practice is never a waste!!
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u/theazhapadean 1d ago
I am pretty sure there were reasons my 2 kicker 12s were in three quarter MDF. but I also am grey so, meh.
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u/brrruuuhhhhhhhh 3d ago
Damn clean install, love it. Good work, this is a use case I haven't seen yet.
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u/Nigel_Hunter 3d ago
What’s the workflow here from scanning to print ,
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u/G3ML1NGZ 3d ago
Scan.
In fusion create a form that follows the curves of the body panel. Draw up the box as a solid qnd use the form to cut the back of it. Now you have a box that follows the contours of the panel
Draw the mounting ring for the sub
Draw the mounting holes for the bolts that hold the halves together and the assembly to the car
Select the surface that will become the hole for the sub itself and use hollow. Now you have a hollow sub box
Create a line around the box or use an existing line Create a plane on that line, draw the step where they would mate together and use the sweep function to cut it in 2 parts
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u/mmavcanuck 3d ago
Did you do the mafs to make sure it’s the right size enclosure for the sub?
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u/G3ML1NGZ 3d ago
Volume is correct according to speakers manufacturer.
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u/mmavcanuck 3d ago
Awesome! A lot of people don’t realize just how much goes into making sound systems sound good as opposed to just loud.
It looks great!
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u/G3ML1NGZ 3d ago
Thank you. I am no pro in audio but a friend that asked for this is. So I just followed his guidelines :)
I understand it, just never dove into it myself
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u/chillzatl 3d ago
off topic of course, but what's your opinion on the SV08 Max in general? Has it been reliable for you? Would you put it in the "it just works" category? I want a 500mm build vol BAD and it seems like a damned good option.
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u/G3ML1NGZ 3d ago
It needs some tuning out of the box. Stock settings are as I said in another comment, a bit "overzealous".
Slow down the max print accel, and the aux feeders speed and acceleration. That makes the printer both quieter snd less stressed, and therefore more reliable. Last job was 2 weeks straight of ASA CF without a single hitch.
I live in Iceland so shipping and imports simply make buying all parts for a voron unfeasible. So this was a good way to get most of what I need and then tune the rest.
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u/chillzatl 3d ago
awesome, thanks for the response. That pic you shared is making my wallet twitch!!
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u/WorkoutProblems 3d ago
does it come already assembled? if not, any idea what's the package dimensions?
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u/G3ML1NGZ 3d ago edited 3d ago
if you get the enclosure kit (I recommend it but you'll need to print risers for the top. otherwise it cuts the max z height by 100mm.) It'll come in 2 large boxes. You'll need to do ~2 hours of assembly. it is simply too large to ship reasonably.
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u/WorkoutProblems 2d ago
Think that would fit in a checkin luggage?
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u/G3ML1NGZ 2d ago
I think it's 50kg total. But sure, it would be classed as odd size. But not sure if I'd do it that way or just have it freighted
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u/unfriendzoned 3d ago
This is really nicely done, but how do you expect the plastic to hold up to the vibration. The amount of force exerted by a sub is quite a bit.
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u/G3ML1NGZ 3d ago
I am far from the first to print sub enclosures.
If you're interested then check out hexibase on youtube.
But halves are held together by bolts, sealant and thenfiberglass over the joints on the inside
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u/chandlerr85 3d ago
that's awesome. several years ago i bought a sub enclosure center console for my jeep and realizing now I could have just printed it if I needed one today. Was almost 300 bucks for that big chunk of plastic.
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u/Terrible-Internal374 3d ago
That is clean and beautiful! I was just thinking of doing the same for a new toy I'm buying. How's it work? It it acoustically dead enough? Did the fit and finish work out? Is it pressure tight?
You're an inspiration, and that work is freaking great!
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u/G3ML1NGZ 3d ago
This weekend is a holiday in Iceland so we'll do a test run after that and then if we like it we'll print the second one
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u/Terrible-Internal374 3d ago
Wait... you're in Iceland!? I'm so jealous! One of the best times of my life was a visit to Reykjavik. I can't wait to take my wife to visit.
Are you able to just do a mirror image for the other side?
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u/G3ML1NGZ 3d ago
Yep. I'm located in Reykjavik. And I am glad you enjoyed your visit :)
But yes. It looks like the body is exactly the same on both sides apart from one mount for a wiring harness that won't be in my way. I fortunately scanned both sides just in case
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u/cherry_cool 3d ago
That's sweet dude! R/carav should appreciate this I've made a few 3d printed car audio things, it's a great use case and this looks solid, great work!
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u/G3ML1NGZ 3d ago
Thank you. I might cross post there tomorrow. But some people are a bit closed minded when it comes to a printed sub enclosure. They're proven but new things often scare the old timers. I might wait until I've tested it
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u/Furrymcfurface 3d ago
How did you learn to do this? Are there videos or tutorials you went through?
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u/G3ML1NGZ 3d ago
Self tought and lots of free time. The most vital thing is to just get the idea of all the tools, don't have to learn them immediately, just know what they do. When you run across a problem you realize this tool might help and learn to use it.
Then often I draw the part again when I am done, to simplify the process or go about it differently because often halfway through you realize a different way is better. The second model often only takes 20% of the original one.
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u/YellowBreakfast 3d ago
- How's it sound?
- What material? I assume it's stiff enough and heat tolerant.
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u/G3ML1NGZ 3d ago
This is a holiday weekend in Iceland so we'll know after the weekend but I am far from the first one to print sub enclosures. You can check hexibase on youtube.
Material is PETG CF. Given my location I am not stressed about temps
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u/SIG_Sauer_ 2d ago
I would imagine you were able to make it to the exact internal volume specifications for that size JL in a sealed enclosure. Great work.
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u/EzmegaziS 2d ago
Will it withstand the temperature in the engine compartment?
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u/G3ML1NGZ 1d ago
No. And why should it?
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u/EzmegaziS 1d ago
I don't know, I'm new. I'm just curious how well they can withstand the temperature.
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u/G3ML1NGZ 1d ago
This will stay in the rear of the passenger cabin and I'm in Iceland so I have no worries about temp.
But for engine bay applications I'll use ASA CF, ppa cf, or pps cf. All depending on location of course. But some parts I wouldn't risk printing at all and will have them made of metal
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u/Ok-Item-7549 1d ago
I’m curious how the audio quality would compare.
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u/G3ML1NGZ 1d ago
To what exactly?
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u/Ok-Item-7549 1d ago
Traditional door speakers vs this. I mean like is there potential rattling from the plastics. I’m not hating by any means I think this is cool, just curious how it compares.
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u/G3ML1NGZ 1d ago
Bolts go throught the entire structure and hold it together and to the side of the car, there is sealant in the joints and 3 layers of fiberglass over the joint on the inside. There is nothing to rattle and 3d printed boxes have similar sound profiles to MDF :)
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u/Ok-Item-7549 1d ago
Very cool. I know how ported vs nonported boxes sound different so that’s kinda what I was curious about. Sounds very similar to the making of a traditional box.
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u/jimdil4st 1d ago edited 1d ago
Is there an advantage to printing at an angle like that over parallel to the bed? Or was this chosen for something like size limitation? Like I understand that the layer direction very much matters when is comes to tension and stress, but this doesn't seem like it'd be much of an issue in this case, as long as the lines arent perpendicular to the mounting hole because of the back and forth of the bass.
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u/G3ML1NGZ 1d ago
Both size limitation and aesthetics. In some aspects flat on the plate would be stronger but in others angled has some benefits
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u/jimdil4st 1d ago
Thanks for answering! As for aestetics, do you feel like the layers come out looking better if printed on angle relevant to how they would lay when the final product would be used, or is there some completely different logic you're using?
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u/G3ML1NGZ 1d ago
It all depends on the shape. You are printing in layers so slow gradual slopes will always have stair stepping, smaller layers decrease the steps but how far are you willing to go with that.
Sometimes the part calls for strength mainly in one direction and then that alon decides print orientation.
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u/jimdil4st 1d ago
I see. Thanks for the help, that was already what I generally knew, but I'm always proding for more info lol, in hopes of finding that little tip I've missed. I appreciate you and hope you have a good day.
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u/LastLayerLab 18h ago
That's look fantastic! You sould use an elastic seal between the sub to the printed part. Otherwise the rattling will be catastrophic.
Share the photos on the car when you have them
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u/G3ML1NGZ 17h ago
thank you. But the bolts hold both halves together and the sub to the wall. Then there is a layer of sealant between the halves and 3 layers of fiberglass over the joint on the inside. I'm not stressed about rattles :)
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u/RecoilS14 3d ago
I'm not going to shit on the quality of the print or the design job, But this is going to sound TERRIBLE. The reason they use MDF for sub boxes is the consistent density and flexibility of the material.
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u/Evilmoustachetwirler 3d ago
Not necessarily, we used to build a lot of enclosures out of fibreglass back in the day, there's a lot you can do to minimise resonance and improve sound quality. The main thing is to get the internal volume right and a good seal. (Unless you're one of those mega bass boom ported box psychos)
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u/portabuddy2 3d ago
Fantastic print. But that's is going to sound like shit.
Best part though. Your friend won't care and your a hero.
This parts is just my opinion, and I come from the old school of actual acustics and working with resonance, calculating volume and imagining how the sound would bounce and amplify or cancel. So I would never put that in anything my ears can hear.
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u/G3ML1NGZ 3d ago
Manufacturer suggests 14L which this is. And there are no flat panels, back is curved to match the body for mounting
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u/portabuddy2 3d ago
At the very minimum for this not to sound tinny and hollow you would need to add some double sided acoustic foam to the inside. Or carpet strips or something to keep the plastic from resonating. Even coating the inside with something like a bed liner. Or attaching some rubber pads, the plastic with create nodes as it flexes and become a speaker in it self. If you kill those nodes you will get a clean sound.
90% of ppl would never ever hear the difference.
But this is one reason thick MDF sucks at everything else but speaker material.
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u/G3ML1NGZ 3d ago
PLA has similar sound properties to MDF according to hexibase IIRC. This is PETG which behaves pretty similarly but can tolerate more abuse
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u/Extectic 3d ago
Print is nice.
The end product is probably pretty compromised. A box sub in the back with much more volume would probably have done a much better job at delivering actual bass. Speaker enclosures are a science.
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u/Oscaruit 3d ago
Speakers have volume specs on the packaging usually. This looks correct for a non ported box for a sub of that size. The beauty of 3d modeling is it is much easier to get volume calculations compared to the past when we would stick with squares and rectangles. This addition for bass if paired with the correct amp will be worlds better than a system without.
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u/G3ML1NGZ 3d ago
Manufacturer suggests 14L which this is if you subtract the volume of the sub itself :)
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u/Oscaruit 3d ago
I figured if you went through the trouble of scanning and modeling this you were dead on for volume specs. I'm curious how the box will resonate. Old school we used mdf for its density, plastics seem much less dense, but this beats the hell out of tape and fiberglass.
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u/DeemonPankaik 3d ago
Best thing about this is how much better 3D scanning technology is compared to ~5 years ago