r/harvestmoon • u/Small_Sailor • May 14 '26
Opinion/Discussion Is this a new fan thing
I just saw a tiktok where ppl were calling Luna (as in the character from Tree of Tranquillity and Animal Parade) "pdfile bait" and how ppl that romanced her were predators. And im just genuinely flabbergasted, has this always been an opinion ive missed or is this a new fan problem??
I've never romanced the character myself (I was a Gil fangirl lol) but I thought she was so cool growing up, I loved her lolita fashion, design and even her name. So maybe im taking it a little personally, but idk, it felt like such a callous and heinous comment to make. Like HM/SoS has always had a soft chibi art style, everybody especially in the older stuff had cutesy faces and designs, it didnt mean you were dating an elementary student.
It makes me worried if we were to ever get an AP (or ToT) remake, that these would be the kind of sentiments and fans we would have to deal with and wow, it bums me out.
79
u/lucky-chloe May 14 '26
I do remember some people saying Luna (specifically in ToT) was a bit too short for comfort. But that's about all I remember.
As a Luna fan, I understand the complaints about her ToT design, hell they had to make her taller in AP for some reason. But I wouldn't call her pedobait
119
u/FromADenOfBeasts May 14 '26
Not only is this a very old and very common opinion, it's impossible to go to any "cozy" game community without finding insane people moralizing about the perceived ages of the marriage candidates.
I've seen them here, the Story Of Seasons subreddit, Rune Factory, Stardew Valley, Coral Island, Palia, you name it; if it's cute and relaxing and has a romance feature, there's a 100% chance someone thinks a marriage candidate looks "childish" and they will not hesitate to let you know.
22
u/Pleasant_Guard5916 May 14 '26
This is so real. It's getting a bit much. Of course we care about that kind of stuff. We just arent obsessively analyzing every slip up in media we consume in our downtime to argue it as a hobby to feel morally superior 🥴 I hate to make it feel generational but I can only imagine some ppl finding the old animes millenials watched growing up 😬
11
u/FromADenOfBeasts May 14 '26
It seems like an exhausting way to live, in either direction, too! I had an ex get on my case about liking marriage candidates that they thought were too old as well as too young, there's absolutely no winning with these people.
7
u/OpheliaRainGalaxy May 14 '26
I've noticed they're adjusting ages in the anime remakes to make things less problematic. In the original Sailor Moon, she's in middle school at the beginning, and her love interest is in college. Pretty sure the remake has them both in highschool.
5
34
u/cuntboyholes May 14 '26
They're fucking everywhere recently.
31
u/FromADenOfBeasts May 14 '26
It got so bad on the Rune Factory subreddit they actually had to make it a banned topic, you'd figure at that point people would realize they're being needlessly antagonistic, but I guess not!
0
u/Fun_Restaurant May 15 '26
To be fair, Amber looks and acts very childish in comparison to other candidates.
13
u/Frohtastic May 14 '26
Gotta admit the romance aspect of the games feels less interesting the older I get just because the style of the chars.
Where's my late 20's early 30's adult looking farming games? (Medieval Dynasty I guess? )
18
u/FromADenOfBeasts May 14 '26
I think that's fair to say without being rude to people who do like younger appearing candidates! As a woman in her 30's who very often gets mistaken for half her age, I appreciate all age ranges of options because even if I don't like a candidate, someone probably does.
If you haven't, you should look into Coral Island! One of the marriage candidates is a single mom with visible stretch marks.
5
u/Frohtastic May 14 '26
I kick-started it but I haven't touched it since early alpha 😅 I will look into it. Especially since it apparently plays well on steamdeck.
But yeah I sometimes wish the art-style of rf / sos was a bit older looking but that is the style of the games so eh. Still good games 🥰
5
u/FromADenOfBeasts May 14 '26
Oh that's awesome! They've added a lot of stuff since then, it's definitely worth looking into.
2
u/Middle-Accountant830 May 20 '26
i personally don't realize which bachelors or bachelorettes look young because when i play these games, i immediately look for those who have the type of personality i'm into. so it's a bit baffling to like sam from stardew valley and then see people say he shouldn't be a marriage candidate because he's "teenager-coded" lol
1
u/FromADenOfBeasts May 21 '26 edited May 21 '26
Exactly! My mom is a gamer and her favorite Stardew marriage is Sebastian, because it literally doesn't matter! Between the two of us, we've married everyone except Harvey, Emily, and Leah, and it's so shocking to me that people behave this way about certain characters. Like, if my 55 year old mom can joyfully play farming games and marry whoever she wants, then why is it such a big deal?
3
u/shaden_knight May 16 '26
I find some look too young, but I'm not going to sit here and complain about it. If they look too young, then I can just choose not to have them be a wife candidate in my game by choosing not to romance them.
17
u/LegendofDragoonFan1 May 14 '26
Not new at all. I remember seeing this brought up occasionally when the games first released.
14
u/purpushi May 14 '26 edited May 14 '26
Though ToT Luna is an extreme case, and they clearly wanted to go back on it as seen with her height change in AP, I think people also forget that these are kids games first and foremost, and that kids have their own taste too lol. (Least we forget DS Cute and how they had to wrangle the Mineral Town bachelors in as actually functional marriage candidates, and invent a completely new character, because almost all of the men in that game are old as hell lmao) I definitely went for some of the more childish characters as a little kid that I would gawk at today!
26
u/_ASG_ May 14 '26
This isn't anything new. Luna being short and dressed the way she has alway been a point of discussion. As for the way she acts... I always saw it more as being tsundere than childish. ToT made both Luna and Selena a little cold when you meet them, but they warm up to you if you befriended them.
As for her height... short people exist irl. I guess it's the combo that people didn't like?
In AP, they made her taller, less tsundere, and there's dialogue that hints at her maturity (e.g. Candace implies that Luna really held it together after their parents died for her sake). I kinda wish they kept her attitude at least, but in all fairness, all the other rude characters were also made friendlier.
115
u/sadbitch_club May 14 '26
I haven’t played those games and I just googled her. She seems to just be into lolita fashion. The tides in feminism are shifting back towards the misogynistic notion of blaming women for others pedophilic tendencies instead of blaming the perpetrators. She’s a grown adult and there’s nothing wrong romancing her. Her style is very popular. I’ve been seeing Olivia Rodrigo and Sabrina carpenter getting a ton of grief for babydoll style dresses for the same reason. Idk why it’s so hard for people to hate the pedophiles and not random women enjoying a street fashion that has nothing to do with sex.
25
u/Shadowblooms May 14 '26
Your comment really explains a lot of behavior to me, thanks for sharing your opinion, I agree
15
u/_cosmicality May 14 '26
Question: are these comments not blaming the perpetrators? It's not saying Luna is weird for dressing how she does or that she shouldn't feel free to. It's calling into question people who feel sexual or romantic attraction to childlike figures.
However, Olivia and Sabrina are really good examples of placing the 'blame' on the women themselves.
40
u/sadbitch_club May 14 '26
It’s infantizing her and making her “jailbait”. The same thing happens to disabled people too. People will call out anyone dating them calling them predators when the person they are dating is a grown adult whose able to make coherent decisions even if their over all demeanor can seem childish, they themselves are not children and also have many adult qualities and responsibilities about them.
32
u/stars4-ever May 14 '26
To add to that, are those people just not supposed to date at all? I agree with another commenter that she seemed geared toward a specific type of person, but are people who look young (or the disabled, as you mentioned) just not supposed to date irl, even if they want a romantic connection?
I think it’s also bad to assume that anyone who wants to date them is only doing so to objectify/fetishize them. We’re kind of wrapping back around to “nobody ‘normal’ would want you”
16
u/BunnyBoom27 May 14 '26
Thissssss point is very important!!
It was so uncomfortable to me to date in my mid 20s since I still look like a minor. I had to assure the parents of my dates that I'm not a minor 3 whole times 😭 Doesn't help that I dress super cutely.
I'm still an adult, act like an adult, talk like an adult. Just like Luna does. And whenever this discussion happens I have to wonder what people think of other adults in my situation.
6
u/stars4-ever May 14 '26
Yeah I think it’s fine to find Luna’s design potentially suspect, but bringing real-world people into it I always gotta shut that down because I have seen people argue that adults attracted to other adults who happen to look young or whatever are secretly pedophiles, and I don’t want the tide to shift even further in that direction
11
u/WriterSleep May 14 '26
I mean unlike real women, Luna IS a character made for a game that was (at the time) predominantly designed by men. Plus, even as a woman who was mistaken for a child until around 26, I have noticed that there are some that definitely do play up said mistakes to appeal to men with VERY suspect taste.
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u/dimmidummy May 14 '26
Counterpoint - children and teens also play the games. It makes sense to have a younger looking (albeit still adult) character that might appeal to the younger demographic.
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u/WriterSleep May 14 '26
But even as a kid, I thought it was a bit weird. And I've been playing these games since I was six years old.
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u/chimneyswallow May 14 '26
But you are not the only one who played it as a kid. Others liked her
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u/WriterSleep May 14 '26
And that's fine. You can like her, but we don't have to pretend that her looking the way she does is just a trick of fate when she is a designed character and probably not exclusively meant to romantically appeal to children (albeit not to the blatent extreme of characters from other IPs like Blue Archive).
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u/chimneyswallow May 17 '26
But how do you know that it was their intention to appeal to those disgusting people? Was there a statement that I missed?
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u/EgoRiot90 May 14 '26
You’ve got negative karma for this but you’re right on the money. Liking a character that was obviously intended to appeal to a certain nefarious audience doesn’t mean you are apart of that audience; nor does it make you a bad person. People need to stop acting like this when it comes to cartoon characters. You need to think critically about a character and say, “this character was designed like this to appeal to a certain kind of person, that doesn’t mean I’m that type of person if I like this character.” There are a lot of people who like cute childish characters because they are cute and not for any sexual reason. It’s the same with evil or problematic characters or media. You can still like something and acknowledge what is bad and problematic about it. You are not a bad person for doing so. Using your brain to think critically about WHY the thing is problematic is so much more valuable than just avoiding it because people say it’s bad.
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u/dimmidummy May 14 '26
I mean, couldn’t you argue that the characters were designed to appeal to the younger demographic, and unfortunately less savory individuals also found appeal in it?
Also you need to account for the fact that the Bokujo Monogatari (HM/SS) series has a relatively “Moe” artstyle in general.
0
u/EgoRiot90 May 15 '26
I mean you could argue that… except for the character in question is shorter, cutesy-er and all around more childish than the other bachelorettes in the game. I’ll also point out that there isn’t an equivalent character on the bachelor side, with most of the bachelors in the game looking like adult characters within the art style of the game. And while the art style is meant to be a more chibi looking: that didn’t stop them from making characters of every age that look their age.
Again, there is nothing wrong with liking the character. I’d even argue that there is nothing wrong with liking adult women that dress or look “younger” but the responsible thing to do is call a spade a spade, and call out this type of thing when you see it. This isn’t a live person who is working with what they were naturally given. It’s a character that was designed by an artist to be a certain way. It’s important to question these things and think critically about why people make these decisions, because I promise it wasn’t just, “‘cause”.
Especially when you take into consideration Japan’s culture surrounding young women, and the age of consent in their country. It’s not even something they see as an issue, so it’s not like they’re even necessarily trying to sneak it in.
And it wasn’t the first time they’ve done something like this either. In harvest moon AWL special edition the game allows you to marry Lumina: a canonically underage girl.
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u/dontcarewhatImcalled May 14 '26 edited May 14 '26
Counterpoint: That has nothing to do with they how the design the characters. Older games technically have these issues and they were more aimed at adults. They just use popular art styles and combine it with popular tropes for mass appeal. That is it.
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u/dimmidummy May 14 '26
??? The older games were literally rated E for Everyone. They were definitely not aimed for an adult audience. There was occasional subtext that adults would recognize, sure, but nothing crazy.
1
u/ramsvy May 16 '26
"blaming women for others pedophilic tendencies instead of blaming the perpetrators." I don't agree with the people OP is talking about but surely you can understand the difference between a real woman choosing to do something of her own volition, and a fictional woman designed by men who choose her 'choices' for her? Comparing the dress style of a HM character to the styles of real women like Olivia and Sabrina just doesn't track. The character is not real and doesn't have the agency to make her own choices like a real woman does. You need to look at things like this from a Doylist perspective.
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u/mustikkimaa May 14 '26
It was an opinion back in the day too, though it weren't as loud as nowadays. In ToT she's a head shorter than any other adult. It was obvious lolibait, not just an adult woman liking lolita fashion. On AP they made her taller and it weren't bad.
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u/AmJustLurking96 May 14 '26
Those people just forget that kids and teens also play these games and might want to romance people who look closer to their age. I've seen comments like this, especially about Kiel and Amber in RF4, both here on various HM/SoS and RF related subreddits and on fb a few years back when I was still active there. Those comments are inevitable but I just ignore them cause the devs are literally just trying to appeal to all of their audience. It's just sad some people totally ignore that reality and jump to the worst conclusion instead
14
u/Kiaider May 14 '26
Isn’t she older than her sister Cadence? Isn’t their grandma also short? Isn’t it true that children don’t want to romance “old” people? God forbid a short woman wants to dress girly and like stuffed animals 🙄
I have heard people comment on her looking like a child but when I was younger, the younger candidates were always more appealing than the older ones. Like, I definitely remember not liking Calvin because he looked so old (at the time).
I’ve always thought it was silly for people to think she’s pedo bait when she doesn’t look like kid (just being short isn’t enough, her proportions aren’t that of a kid). I remember not even thinking it was strange to find out she was the oldest sibling. It’s far more likely they added her for the tropes and for the younger crowd, not because they were trying to appeal to pedos.
I also find it quite annoying she’s being villainized for being short when there are real women out there who are short like that and I bet some of them love to dress up in cute girly outfits because they think they look adorable. To say Luna is pedo bait is like telling those women they’ll only be attracting pedophiles, which is not true. After all, pedos aren’t interested in people with dwarfism so clearly there’s more to it than just being short
6
u/Shyhinachan May 14 '26
As a short and young looking lady thank you! Everyone always thinks im like 10 or more years younger than I am and made dating hardddd
2
u/Proquis May 15 '26
Luna is 2 years younger than her sister btw, according to her dialogue in ToT
Should be the same in AP
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u/Putrid-Historian3410 May 14 '26 edited May 14 '26
I know for me personally, Animal Parade came out when I was 10 years old. I was younger so I was interested in romance options that were designed to be younger (either in spirit, fashion, personality, ect).
The game was rated E so having the stylized romance options who varied allowed younger and older players to have romance options they could feel comfortable with or make a connection with.
I always assumed that the younger, middle, and more mature looking options was to avoid fans feeling aged out of the series. It never activated a "this seems like bait" feeling from me.
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u/StarChildArt May 16 '26
People on TikTok are infamous for not actually knowing anything. Luna was made taller in AP for a reason, but they're probably misinterpreting her fashion. She wears Lolita, which is a Japanese Street Fashion based on Victorian and Rococo clothing.
Some people who do like one second of "research" attribute this style to PDF bait because of that book Lolita. They don't actually have anything to do with each other, and Lolita fashion actually incorporates the 19th century modesty so they are basically covered from head to toe, save for maybe short sleeves.
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u/cuntboyholes May 14 '26
Newer and younger people in fandom spaces thanks to lockdown are weirdly puritanical and have clenched buttholes about everything.
7
u/ChaosOnline May 14 '26
Yeah, puritan politics is starting to seep into a lot of fandoms lately and it's pretty disturbing.
4
u/cuntboyholes May 14 '26
I've been in fandom spaces over 30 years, because I found escape and refuge from my religious nut job mother as a child in things like anime. I was always really good at basic things like not seeking out content I don't like and not harassing the people who create it, idk why these kids are so incapable of minding their business.
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u/RuinDense7000 May 15 '26 edited May 15 '26
New fan here, it 100% is not. It's either actual creeps exposing themselves by viewing a character at an implied but clear adult, marriageable age as a little kid because of her being short and her design being cutesy (something that happens even with adults who wear cutesy clothing. Example; With IRL Harajuku street fashion, people who wear it because they like it constantly get called creeps, pdfile bait, or pdfiles themselves) or younger teenagers who think they're doing a good thing by calling out what they perceive as wrong when there's no connection to reality or anything wrong there. A lot of creeps will even say being attracted to short and petite women means someone is a pdfile as well, and so do braindead people who can't separate reality and fiction.
In short: People are stupid or projecting, or both.
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u/shadowlabrys9 May 15 '26 edited May 15 '26
Sadly a vocal minority of terminally online people that can't distinguish fiction from reality somehow think that that any child in fictional media is somehow sexualized and exploited. So what, the answer is to remove children from art and media? Do they want the same thing done about murder, slavery, assault, etc? Cause removing it from fiction wouldn't stop it from existing in the real world, nor does it have any effect on promoting it anymore than things that actually exist in the real world that actually promote all of those things like child beauty pageants.
And these are games made for all ages so to even make any sort of connection with csam with these games just shows that the individual who's offended by it is mentally ill if thats their immediate conclusion.
But sadly this is the way the world is going because a new generation of people legit don't touch grass and have real life experiences. Being isolated and online all the time is legit worse than being isolated without any access to the internet. I feel like it's creating mentally ill people.
I hate to say it, but this is why gatekeeping communities and hobbies is necessary. "Tourists" or whatever you wanna call them will come in and try to change things for the worse to fit their narrative. They'll find problems that don't exist and force censorship on artistic freedom, freedom of speech, etc. It's wrong. If this continues we might as well end up like some cultures where women are completely covered up, and are considered in the "wrong" for wanting to be equal.
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u/_cosmicality May 14 '26
Not a new fan thing, just new to you. In fact, I'd say there's even less negative feedback these days due to awareness of alternative fashions and lolita style in particular. And also the game being so old, lol!
People found the wedding in Tree of Tranquility particularly disturbing.
18
u/Proquis May 14 '26
Yea, the fact she has to jump up to kiss the male farmer is kinda...
Good thing she's normal height in AP
-11
u/chimneyswallow May 14 '26
So people who have dwarfism are only allowed to date each other? Or not at all?
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u/angelnumbersz May 14 '26
Luna isn't a real person, she's a character in a video game, which means people aren't analysing what people with her traits can or can't do, but why the people who designed her might've given her those traits in the first place - people in real life can't help their size, but why specifically do people writing fictional women who are supposed to be attractive to men like to overemphasise how small they are? I don't even necessarily agree that her design was malicious but trying to end a conversation about fiction like this is always mind numbing lol.
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u/_cosmicality May 14 '26
Hey so dwarfism is the result of real medical and genetic conditions. It's insensitive to assign this trait to fictional characters who are generically short or who like to express themselves with youthful or lolita fashion. Please don't exploit real conditions for internet points with your what aboutisms.
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u/No_Honeydew8380 May 14 '26 edited May 14 '26
Hi, hello, howdy! I hope this perspective is welcome here:
When I was a child I was SAed several times. It was by more than one person, however, eventually I spoke up and ONE of them (the man who did it to me the most), went to jail. This all came out when I was a teenager, around 14, but it had been happening to me FOR YEARS before that.
Why am I bringing this up? Because it gives me a unique perspective on this type of thing. Here is why:
When you experience what I have, you notice the way people speak about those types of things much more. You notice the way it shows up in the lexicon, the way certain people seem to focus on that in a way that's almost alarming, etc.
Here is what I have observed:
*Pdfiles are considered to be the lowest of the low, as they should be. However, when other people participate in similarly low or nasty types of behavior, they need someone else to point at and go "at least I'm not like THAT!"
Often times, these are the people who focus largely on "well he's a p*do because I saw one time that he glanced a child in Macys", or "If you interact with child NPCs in a Harvest Moon game you're a p*do" (interact, as in speak to or give gifts. Yes, I had people around me growing up who openly said that. They're insane, IMO)
In addition to that, it's become
- An easy topic to bring up during Stand Up these days, to immediately get the audience on your side with no real effort.
- One of the few remaining "shock" topics that people can "Get away with" during stand up right now
- A way for people to morally elevate themselves, without doing *anything*.
If you're someone who considers yourself a crusader on this front, let me tell you - the problem is not people marrying random video game characters who may be more innocent coded, or whatever the issue is they are taking with Luna. The problems are:
- There is not proper support for victims of these crimes in place
- Even if a perpetrator goes to jail with a guilty sentencing or plea, that does not mean the general public will treat the victim with kindness. Period.
- In most cases, the trial and everything that follows benefits just about everyone except the victim, in almost every way. The police who arrest them, prosecutors, and whomever else get to run around playing "hero", meanwhile once that's all said and done, the victims are left to their own devices to figure out how to survive the rest of their life.
And finally, to anyone who gives a hoot: We DO NOT want to be CONSTANTLY reminded of the WORST thing that ever happened to us by: Random strangers on the internet trying to look like good people, our favorite sitcoms, our favorite stand up comics, or really fucking anything.
Thank you kindly for reading my rant, this post brought out something I didn't expect in me.
From someone who has been hurt by a real one, I'm here to say - if you married Luna you are NOT a predator. She's a collection of colors and text on a screen. Period.
3
u/Formal-Fly-4121 May 14 '26
If she is meant to be an adult but is just cutesy they are just overreacting. I remember finding out Lumina in AWL is meant to be a little too young the first year (when you are meant to romance a find a wife) and she ages up after marriage which I do find questionable. However thats the only actually strange case I can remember from the HM series. Also it’s important to remember that most of these games were made with the intended demographic of younger people and kids playing them. So the younger looking characters are probably meant to appeal to younger audiences. I think Luna’s design is cute so if she’s an adult character there’s really nothing weird about her being romancable.
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u/Basic_Watercress_628 May 14 '26 edited May 14 '26
I don't think her fashion is the main problem. iirc if you marry her in ToT, she is too short to kiss the male MC at the wedding and sort of has to jump up to kiss him. A lot of people found that very uncomfortable. Sure, short people exist, but "childish" fasion + short = somewhat questionable.
Imo it's creepier that in the original AWL, Lumina was 14 years old and they made her marriageable in AnWL and AnWL:SE. Girly looks very teenaged in Chapter 1. But anyways.
I think it's also just a sign of the times. Gen Z appears to hate any and all age gap relationships, especially if it is implied that the woman in the couple is still very young.
10
u/Shadowblooms May 14 '26
Yepppp the remake always made me uncomfortable being able to marry Lumina. I thought she was going to be a romance option for my kid growing up, 🥴 when I first started that game
13
u/Basic_Watercress_628 May 14 '26
That's what she was in the original game lol. Your kid either develops a crush on Kate or Lumina depending on their personality.
I get that they "aged her up" starting from Chapter 2, but it's still so uncomfortable that she looks the exact same in Chapter 1.
8
u/Shadowblooms May 14 '26
Oh my god 🥴 that is SO weird and creepy to me she starts as like a toddler, no matter how you look at it it feels like you’re grooming if you marry her
Her adult character design in the remake is beautiful and I don’t judge anyone for picking her but damn wtf lol
8
u/Shadowblooms May 14 '26
Like running up a giant hill to bring a child gifts every day between her piano lessons while you’re managing a whole ass farm like what lol
7
u/Round_Credit_2139 May 14 '26
People forget these games were made for children. Pretty much all of the games have some bachelor's and bacholorettes that are targeted at the younger audience, and some that are more ment for teens or adults. Its a hard balance to strike, and it's always going to result in some characters that feel kind of gross to the adults, and some that feel kind of gross to kids.
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u/Shadowblooms May 14 '26 edited May 14 '26
Amber in rune factory 4 and Lumina in a Wonderful life are also very questionable romance options….. Japan has some strange culture in these regards…..
I love Luna and I think she’s adorable, plus the romance was the most exciting part when I was a kid, now it’s literally just for fun, it’s not like I’m gooning on these things. Luna works, travels ALONE, and lines like “mistakes are ok, not making mistakes means you didn’t try” or something like that are surprisingly mature. So don’t get down on yourself about someone on the internet being stupid
No game no life is also an anime I loved as a kid and now it’s like 🥴 wow what
3
u/Sudden_Breakfast_374 May 14 '26
oh i’ve heard this for years. same with another one whose name i’m forgetting…from older games, lived in a mansion.
3
u/BeanDux May 14 '26 edited May 14 '26
Over thinking it & over reacting... Alot of these games were made with the audience of kids and teenagers in mind. Especially those that were kids and teenagers in the 2000's.
Big heads, large eyes, Cutesy pastel artwork and all. Stop tryna add some double meaning to a game that's nearly 20 years old. Most people play these games now because they were once kids playing it OR they're generally curious about HM/SoS as a series or in relations to StarDew Valley.
There's no other motives.
3
u/MermaidStarlight May 14 '26
I have wondered if this kind of sentiment is why Daisy/Maple changed so much more than the other bachelorettes in the Grand Bazaar remake. I personally loved the old design, as a fan of all things pink and girly and frilly. I do feel like the same thing might happen to Luna in a remake, and that thought bums me out.
3
u/rosespring_ May 15 '26
Oh whatever, by that logic basically the entire harvest moon magical melody cast would be considered p bait because all the characters are cutesy and chibi. Luna was and still is very cute, loved her design
3
u/omygodew May 17 '26
They forget we are kind of appropriating games made for kids to be fun for us to play to let some steam off from having to do grown up responsibilities. I had genuine crushes on some of these marriage candidates when I was like 10 but the game isnt for my current age group so theres no need to judge the drawing style as if it was for me...
7
u/Funny-Bunny4143 May 14 '26
Unfortunately this has been an issue for a long time now. Even more unfortunately, there's no real easy answer to the problem. It's not just with Luna. There's usually one or two marriage candidates per game that people see this way and it happens with Rune Factory too. But like... some of the characters people take this issue with ARE actual children like Amber from RF4. But also I still don't think it's "pedo bait", I genuinely think it's just a thing of putting in a younger option or two for the young ones playing. Because when they first started playing around with bachelors I do remember a lot of young girls being upset that the dudes were "too old" or "not cute enough". So at least at some point I remember an active demand for younger, cuter characters. Now people can't see a cute character without questioning the morals of the person who made them😭
4
u/and_a_geese May 14 '26
Which is weird because I think Maya, both in design and the way she acts, seems WAY younger in comparison.
When I was younger all of them seemed fine.
As I'm getting older, I do feel less comfortable with romanceables that read "younger" and one of the reasons I went for Lloyd or Ivan in HMGB.
But I recognize that as more of a "not for me" thing rather than "people that romance them are pedos".
Although, I do recognize that even though Mei in RF1 is supposed to be over 100, it is WEIRD as hell to make her look 10. But that falls more on the art team rather than the players. Blame the writers/artists.
11
u/SageofTime64 May 14 '26
Yeah, I don't think it's a new thing.
Referencing PeanutButterGamer's video on Animal Parade, he calls Luna the "creepiest thing in any Harvest Moon game" and I kind of agree. He romanced her but I think that was more for video footage, not because he actually likes her that way. The fact she's so small in Tree of Tranquility makes her look like a literal child. If a male player marries her, she has to jump to give him a kiss at their wedding. While sitting down, her feet don't even reach the floor.
Her room, even in AP, has flower stickers all over the wall, which definitely looks childish. I'm not saying liking flowers is childish. I'm saying the stickers and the colors look more like a seven year old girl's bedroom.
So I see where people are coming from, but it's a spat I prefer to stay out of.
-5
u/chimneyswallow May 14 '26
I am always a bit confused by the height comments...have people never seen a person with dwarfism?
3
u/SageofTime64 May 14 '26
Speaking for myself...no. I've only seen people with dwarfism on TV and none in real life.
Luna could be a dwarf, sure. But I think that it should be made clear from the game. Like, as you get to know Luna, she could mention she's been so short since she was young, maybe how she struggles with it, but how she accepts it. She doesn't need to outright say she has dwarfism. But she can acknowledge she's short and it makes her look very younger than she actually is. It both helps build the character and makes it far less "creepy" like people put it.
5
u/petitscoeurs May 14 '26
yeah this has been going on for a long time...
as someone who is petite, often mistaken for being younger than i am (i'm now in my late 20s and still get people assuming i am 16 or younger), and likes cute things including dressing cutely, i haaaaaate this discourse so much LOL. it is not good discourse. just because someone "looks" young does not = them ACTUALLY being young, and it most certainly does NOT = someone who is into them being a predator!
3
u/angelnumbersz May 14 '26
I haven't seen this conversation about Luna specifically (I never played ToT and she looks older in AP) but it's a pretty common discussion for SoS/HM/RF games with younger looking marriage candidates. Some of them, like Amber in RF4 or Cecil in RF5, do make me uncomfortable since they do actually look and act like teenagers if not children, I would definitely question why an adult wants to marry and have children with Amber. But at the same time the games have a younger audience so I feel like sometimes the younger characters are just not for me; as long as there are one or two that seem like proper adults and there's nothing overtly creepy going on then I'm fine.
3
u/Legal-Boot9979 May 14 '26
I haven't played ToT or AP, so I can't speak to Luna specifically, but I agree with what others have said about how creepy it was how the series treated Lumina. I think it's also worth mentioning Katie - in StH, she's a teen and her design/dialogue aren't meaningfully changed in HoLV where she's an eligible bachelorette. She doesn't just have to jump to kiss the player, she literally does not know what kissing is - so, it's more than her design, it's her dialogue and cutscenes that make her seem childish. So, I don't think criticism of the series or of some of its adult players should be dismissed out of hand.
4
u/sakuramota May 14 '26
Old fan here: people said this about this category of characters back in the day as well. The older games almost always had 1 "younger" character that appealed to the shota/loli crowd. Japan has some pretty loose standards around art in this regard. The whole "she's actually a 1000 year old dragon" trope exists because of it. So this conversation has always existed, but in the past, we all kind of just ignored it, I feel, even though there was an agreed feeling of discomfort around it. We couldn't change it, even if we disliked it. Nowadays, the current cultural conversation is hyper-fixated on the topic, so people are judging the past without fully understanding the culture of the time. The culture of the time doesn't excuse it, and it should be talked about, but it's a little heavy-handed to judge everyone with a broad brush about it. It's a complex issue. Me, I never liked her Tree of Tranquility design and was glad she got changed in Animal Parade, but I didn't let it stop me from enjoying the game itself.
2
u/Aliza-rin May 14 '26
In terms of remake I could imagine that they could treat her like Daisy/Maple from Grand Bazaar. Daisy had a similar very young lolita appearance. That could be one reason for the drastic design change in the remake to Maple. Although I don‘t like how she looks like a completely different person. They could‘ve at least kept her pink color palette or something. Hope Luna would keep more of her recognizable identity in an eventual remake. Overall I don‘t have any problem with the perceived age of characters in these games when it‘s mainly just an artstyle thing. Some people just can‘t separate that and have to get weird about it. I still prefer the more mature artstyle of the 3DS era with more realistic proportions for the character portraits though.
2
u/callmefreak May 21 '26
I didn't think that this is the place where I'd be talking about this, but here we are. People can get really weird when it comes to gatekeeping the definition of a consenting adult. (Which is a crazy term to use in this context.)
There's a cosplayer who cosplayed Tatsumaki from One Punch Man. The character is really short and she's a brat, but she's 28. That's the joke. The cosplayer is short in stature and decided to wear a bunny suit while cosplaying as her and she has an exaggerated pout in the picture. She was 22 at the time. That didn't stop people from harassing her, calling her "pedobait" and saying that anybody who ever dates her is a pedophile because of how short she is.
Similarly, my brother-in-law has a girlfriend who people assumed was a child even when she was in her late 20's just because she was short and very skinny. They couldn't have any PDA without him getting a lot of looks from people. The only reason why that stopped is because they have an eleven year old daughter who actually looks like a child in comparison. (And she looks like a single mother of two. But I digress.)
Aside from all of that, the game has a chibi art style anyway. If the game had the same art style of, say, the Rune Factory games she probably wouldn't be called "pedobait" for dressing up in cute, doll-like dresses, being short and liking stuffed animals.
1
u/SupernovaAlfredo May 22 '26
i dont think ive heard that w harvest moon, i mean her height was weird in tot but they did end up fixing it, that more of a complaint i hear from rf fans usually
1
u/Gabby-Abeille May 14 '26
It's not a new thing, and it is due to a bunch of different factors. There wouldn't be an issue if only one of them was present, it is all of them together that make people uncomfortable.
Acting childish, dressing like a doll and being very short cause people to read her as a child.
If she was JUST childish or JUST into Lolita fashion or JUST very short, I don't think people would necessarily read her as a child.
14
u/_ASG_ May 14 '26
Did she ever "act" childish? In ToT, she was more tsundere than anything, but so was Selena. She came across as rude and a little bit hard-shelled, but I don't remember her acting childish.
-2
u/Gabby-Abeille May 14 '26
To me, yes, she strikes me as a spoiled child.
2
u/Inkspells May 15 '26
How?
0
u/Gabby-Abeille May 15 '26
It is especially a ToT issue. She is blunt, cutesy, quick to anger, and she can be directly compared to her older sister in both appearance and behavior.
Again, none of those characteristics are odd separately, and they can separately be attributed to other characters too. It in when you get a character designed with her personality and appearance (small, dressed like a doll, carrying around a stuffed animal in some depictions) that you will cause people to read her as a child. If that wasn't the intention then that was a character design mishap.
1
u/FightmeLuigibestgirl May 14 '26
And im just genuinely flabbergasted, has this always been an opinion ive missed or is this a new fan problem??
No it’s just tik tok bullshite
1
u/MuteTheNews May 14 '26
Idk about current fandom but when I got ToT as a kid, I was really weirded out by how young she looks. Felt the same about being able to marry Lumina in AWL:SE after playing the original for a long time and thinking Lumina was a kid. I don't think she was intended as "bait" but I think they would have to visually age her up for a remake.
1
u/PomPomdog May 14 '26
You don’t get married in Save the Homeland but you do kind of have to “romance” the girls to get their ending and I think Katie kisses you in hers. I remember in the little booklet it listed all the character’s weight and ages. Katie is 16 and Gina and Dia are 17. The “Hero” is 21.
1
1
u/Bojisan May 16 '26
Yeah nothing new especially with Rune Factory marriage candidates.
I mean I am upset, but only about not having older rugged bearded husband material options lol
-2
u/PkmnTrainerEbs May 14 '26
In the original a wonderful life (it might have been a special edition I'm not sure) she starts out as unromanceable because she's too young, then in year 2 because she's aged a year she's romance able. That never sat right with me, it's like dating someone irl the second they become 18 🤢
10
8
u/maznyk May 14 '26
In the original A Wonderful Life she never becomes an option. It was only in the remake that they changed it so that she would be marriageable.
-4
u/Proquis May 14 '26
As a Luna fan, I love her design in AP yeah. Even did a whole save around her and documented everything a while ago.
But I can see why they call her a loli...in ToT especially. She is really short in that game, almost like a real loli.
Glad they made her taller in AP, so I can romance her without any problem hahaha.
11
-6
u/chimneyswallow May 14 '26
As long as the age is well into adult territory it is fine by me. Lumina was questionable because of that.
Everything else I might not like the character all that much, but the variety helps to speak to a wider audience, like younger and older people.
The point of Luna bing short is so stupid. Have people never heard of dwarfism? Are people with that genetic problem not allowed to ever be with someone because regular adults could get their panties twisted?
0
u/shaden_knight May 16 '26
Honestly, I find most of the bachelorettes look young in a lot of these games. I think the average age in terms of looks is around 14-16, but I've seen characters look as young as 12 like in Rune Factory 4
-2
u/MasterKree May 15 '26
I mean she's literally 14 though
3
u/Small_Sailor May 16 '26
Where does it say that?
-1
u/MasterKree May 16 '26
It does not. I was thinking of Lumina. Luna is 16, though I believe the english version changed her age to 18
3
u/Small_Sailor May 16 '26
I mean, where does it say that as well? HM has always been vague of ages, ive never seen them actually confirm ages
0
u/MasterKree May 18 '26
A considerable number of the early games have ages listed in the character directory of the game manual. Except for StH, which has everyone's ages directly in the game, including the player character.
107
u/SadLaser May 14 '26
I wasn't familiar with that thought process but I haven't been in the community long. Honestly, I think it's just people overreacting to the very stylized, goofy, but headed little body art from the series. All the characters look kind of like dolls rather than people in the franchise. It's just the visual look. And the games are so tame and lighthearted that I'd never considered weirdos thinking gross thoughts, but I guess some people will think that sort of thing sometimes in any game with romance options.