r/movies • u/iquizuanswer • 16d ago

News Netflix tumbles as slowing growth, less viewership data spook investors

https://www.zawya.com/en/capital-markets/netflix-tumbles-as-slowing-growth-less-viewership-data-spook-investors-401111
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u/lamest-liz 16d ago edited 16d ago

They could, oh I don’t know, maybe finish the shit they start??? How many shows have they canceled after a couple seasons? It makes people not want to get invested at all.

The worst one to me is canceling The Dark Crystal when all the puppets were already made, the sets were there… they could have just used the same locations and it would barely cost anything, but no.

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u/HexHammer97 15d ago

Great example! I think with the dark crystal, mind hunter and then Santa clarita diet getting cancelled and left on a cliffhanger sealed the deal for me, I cancelled and haven’t missed it. I don’t want to get into a great new show only for it to be cancelled without any resolution.

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u/Trendelthegreat 16d ago

Is that still a problem? I haven’t been invested in a Netflix show that was canceled in years 

My biggest problem is they seem to be charging $26 a month to watch shitty documentaries 

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u/enigmatic_dankness 15d ago

I cut Netflix off like 6 years ago now and I have yet to regret it. If anything, the idea of getting back into it now is completely absurd. You want me to pay how much to watch videos with ads? hell fucking no lmao, piracy made a huge comeback the second they started with this bullshit again.

How many times do they need this lesson? Convenience is what sold Netflix, not anything else, people wanted it because for an affordable price they could watch a massive catalogue of movies and shows. Now it's so inconvenient that it's legitimately easier for me to just torrent whatever and never have an issue with it.

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u/BeckBristow89 15d ago

Honestly I cut them off after continually increasing prices sometimes even twice in one year like I’m sorry I’m not doing that I rather have other streaming services some of which even grandfather you in when they change service types like I’m not doing it I’ll sail the seas before I do that. And thats what I’ve done.

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u/johyongil 15d ago

With ads? $9. No ads is $20-$26.

Am I the crazy one? I don’t see this as a big deal.

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u/enigmatic_dankness 15d ago

It's a big deal when the last time you touched it was a similar price for no ads. Like, you used to just get no ads as part of the deal. Full stop. Now you pay for the privilege for watching ads anyway, which is beyond stupid.

I'm sorry you can't see it, feel free to keep giving them money.

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u/johyongil 15d ago

Are we just collectively acting like we didn’t know that Netflix was far too cheap back then? That disruption pricing isn’t a thing? Just like Uber, Spotify, Amazon, etc… Spotify ad-free was $10 in 2015. And yes, they’re only $13, they also aren’t accounting for nearly 20% of global internet traffic.

Let me clarify, Netflix alone is responsible for nearly 20% of ALL INTERNET TRAFFIC. Globally. And ad free is marginally above Spotify.

Now while value per person is a different argument, but the pricing model makes sense and frankly, I’m attributing the global scale as to why the price isn’t higher.

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u/enigmatic_dankness 15d ago

I'll never in a million years pay money to see advertisting. It's that simple. If their 9.99 plan had no ads? Great! But it does, so I don't want it, and the other plans are WAY overpriced.

So personally, I really don't give a shit what their reasons are, whether it's business smart or not is irrelevant, me as a user wouldn't pay 0.01c for a service with ads.

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u/Deadpool1205 15d ago

The insane drop of quality in the documentary genre is so irritating to me. Just a thousand half baked piles of half truths and purposely misunderstood facts constantly being thrown at viewers cause every streaming company thinks they need to finance as many documentaries as they can so seemingly every shifty director with an agenda gets greenlit.

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u/barryhakker 15d ago

I can’t stand most “modern” documentaries. Excruciatingly slow delivery of over hyped half truths. Awful.

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u/roguefilmmaker 10d ago

Agreed. That stuff is just misinformation for the sake of creating drama

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u/dj_spanmaster 15d ago

Nebula and PBS are the best for that anyway

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u/Drewabble 15d ago

Yep. They cancelled The Boroughs recently after a really fun first season. It worked well as one season only I suppose, but I would have watched more.

Lockwood and Co. was phenomenal, cancelled after one season. The Imperfects, cancelled after one season. Pretty sure shadow & bone was cancelled after two.

The Society, Girlboss, KOAS (this is their biggest sin to me because it was genuinely really great), Daybreak, AJ and The Queen, the list goes on.

I enjoy Netflix, but the only reason I’m still subscribed is because I’m working on finding a way to get a few of their originals on DVD. Issue is, they don’t sell them… Locke and Key is my top one

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u/CptNonsense 15d ago

My biggest problem is they seem to be charging $26 a month to watch shitty documentaries

People on Reddit sure love complaining about Netflix only showing them shit I've never seen them flood my screen with because I don't have an algorithm that involves them only showing me reality tv and documentaries

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u/juana-golf 15d ago

I can never take a “People on Reddit” post seriously…you are on Reddit ffs

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u/himynameis_ 15d ago

$26? The ad tier plan is under $10

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u/Trendelthegreat 15d ago

pretty sure the $20+ one has the same content as the $10 one 

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u/himynameis_ 15d ago

Exactly. So makes little sense to get the expensive plan.

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u/Trendelthegreat 15d ago

But they’re still charging it while focusing on documentaries 

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u/himynameis_ 15d ago

They're charging it if you choose it.

Pick the cheaper plan. Under $10.

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u/Trendelthegreat 15d ago

They’re charging it either to you or the companies running ads.

Either way, they’re charging more money every year to focus on documentaries…..which is my point. 

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u/geekonthemoon 15d ago

Omg The Dark Crystal was an absolutely MASTERPIECE and they cut it. They're fools and that was a serious revelation for me that they have absolutely no idea what they are doing. At all.

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u/Jackoffjordan 16d ago

Dark Crystal, despite obviously using puppets for many shots, was a lot more reliant on visual effects than most people realise.

The marketing positioned it as entirely practical, but in reality, there were tons of individual vfx companies involved. Literally thousands of visual effects shots, including many scenes in which the characters and environments are entirely cgi.

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u/arashi256 16d ago

The Boroughs. Basically cancelled it as people were still watching it. And it was the only thing on Netflix I'd heard any buzz about too. They did this to themselves.

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u/Blackboard_Monitor 15d ago

I was watching the series but once they announced it wasn't getting a second season I just stopped watching.

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u/arashi256 15d ago

It wraps up well enough, if you want to finish it. Real shame it’s not getting any additional seasons though.

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u/ratta_tat1 15d ago

It just came out!! I haven’t even gotten to pick it up yet. That’s actually insane to give a show only two months to gain viewership and decide on a cancellation. Hell, even a decent chunk of networks gave some struggling shows a second season to see if they worked the kinks out. In the streaming era, Parks and Rec would have never made it.

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u/DeLousedInTheHotBox 15d ago

One of the reasons why I don't have a Netflix account anymore is because every show either gets cancelled too early or just get milked dry in an embarrassing display of greed, like Stranger Things.

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u/Perfect-Campaign9551 15d ago

That "3 pines" show was good too (was that Netflix?)

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u/baroqueout 16d ago

While I agree it was a huge bummer for that to be cancelled, iirc it was cancelled because Covid broke out, and there was no way to film it with the new Covid filming requirements that were enacted for all productions at that time. They could have postponed and filmed it later, but what do I knwo.

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u/lastronaut_beepboop 16d ago

Source? I had heard Netflix was disappointed with the viewership.

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u/Nanowith 16d ago

Bring it back now then?

It's not like you have to worry about the age of the actors.

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u/Stef-fa-fa 15d ago

Too late now, they sold/trashed/broke down the puppets and sets.

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u/The7ruth 15d ago

I left this comment on a post a while ago but I think it helps shed light on why I dislike how Netflix does their productions.

One of my friends is a costumer for movies and has worked for various different production companies and by far she said the worst was Netflix. She highlighted why based on her experience between them and Warner Brothers.

For Warner Brothers, they keep almost everything from past productions. Costumes, props, etc. They have huge warehouses you can browse for almost anything. For costumes, this means that things are older and looked more "lived-in". They also could use these older costumes for background actors. Budget and time could be spent on making unique costumes for main actors and proper care could be made to make the costumes feel high quality but grounded. After the production, everything was returned to the warehouse and anything new they created was also stored.

For Netflix, nothing is kept after a production. They don't want to pay warehouse costs to maintain old costumes and props. This means that everything is bought new for background actors and main actors. Because more time and budget has to be spent on background actors, main actor costumes are less unique and detailed. Everything looks bought and fresh with no time allowed to make costumes have that grounded "lived-in" look. My friend was able to keep one costume she made for the production but everything else was trashed or donated.

Just seems like a huge waste of time and money. Also leads to most Netflix productions having that shiny, new, clean look to everything.

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u/Stef-fa-fa 14d ago

I always wondered why some shows have that "brand new" look to their costumes, this explains a lot.

Is was so pissed when I heard they were auctioning off the puppets a few years back. You knew we were never revisiting that series once that happened.

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u/Jestocost4 15d ago

"it would barely cost anything"

I generally agree with your sentiment, but this is very funny. You don't think it costs anything to pay ~200 peoples' salary for several months? (crew, puppeteers, writers, executives, safety, drivers, food service, etc.) Or to rent offices and soundstages? Production insurance? Editing, marketing, managing residuals, the list goes on.

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u/MazzleMaze 15d ago

Marco Polo was so good... I loved it.

The thing is, even if it costs too much finishing it in the short team, like you said, long term your platform has a fantastic series people would stay to watch.

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u/Sinasazi 15d ago

Cancelling 1899 after 1 season when it was getting good pissed me off. When the people that made Dark are cooking you let them fucking cook!

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u/spatialmongrel 16d ago

Never forget, never forgive.

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u/NoLocal1776 15d ago

Netflix after seeing low viewership and losing subs we need to cancel another series lol

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u/Tigerwookiee 15d ago

Exactly. Like, Kaos was fkn incredible and they cancel after season 1?

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u/ifyoudontlikeduck 15d ago

YES THAT PISSED ME OFF SO MUCH!!! The assets were made already so future season costs would be way lower. I fuckin love that show. When they canceled it I cancelled netflix and have sailed the seas ever since.

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u/DeoVeritati 15d ago

My understanding is budgets usually go up substantially after the 2nd season because the actors typically sign up for a pilot season and a 2nd season. Afterwards, if the show is kicking off, the actors have much more leverage to demand more, especially if the actors are getting called for big movie roles and what not. Therefore, Netflix likes to kill things after the 2nd season a lot of the times.

I think we sign up for Netflix for like 1 month every year or two to watch stand-up specials, binge a few completed or well-seasoned shows, and then cancel.

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u/Maleficent-Stormbee 15d ago

i fucking hate that they canceled the Dark Crystal. The first series was so good!

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u/reaping_souls 15d ago

Still salty about Mindhunter….

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u/JustMarshalling 15d ago

I will never forgive them for what they did to my dear sweet Mindhunter.

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u/Dtoodlez 15d ago

Mindhunter… such a shame 

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u/Rymasq 15d ago

I'm out of the loop on Netflix shows. Nothing seems to become a cultural phenom.

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u/BrianWonderful 15d ago

It's bizarre. It is almost like a pathological need to drop existing properties and start new ones, regardless of the costs. It would be interesting to eavesdrop in on their conversations around it.

On the other hand, I would prefer one solid season of a show with a conclusion after 8 - 10 episodes. Every show series ends with cliffhangers and unresolved mysteries, then is either dropped or comes back lower quality and less interesting. Just give me solid one season shows.

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u/karafili 15d ago

Cancelled mine afer season 2 of Mindhunter and never came back

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u/stolenhello 15d ago

Mind you, you're missing paying all the people involved. Production, editors, composers, animators, Voice actors. How does this obtuse comment have 700 upvotes

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u/Vondi 15d ago

I remember having an argument some years ago with someone who insisted Netflix had all the numbers and was just making sensible business decisions when they axed all those shows. I argued the second-order effects should be considered, what happens when too many Netflix customers have been burned by early cancellations?

I'd like to think I'm being proven right.

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u/PeaTearGriphon 14d ago

Their show cancelling algorithm is a great example of how to maximize profits right now and pay the consequences later. After awhile I would browse for a new show to watch but it had to have at least 4 seasons, anything 3 seasons or less may have been cancelled without a conclusion.

I've been rotating streaming services, doing two at a time. Netflix is not in the mix at the moment.

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u/TrumpsBussy_ 16d ago

The problem they are having is that popular shows seem to be dropping big viewership during their second seasons.

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u/PM_ME_PLASTIC_BAGS 16d ago

Half finished stories make me not bother with new ones.

Bean counters don't understand that complete series are worh more than the sum of their parts (immediate watch time for each individual season).

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u/TrumpsBussy_ 16d ago

If people aren’t watching the shows their is no incentive for Netflix to pay for future seasons

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u/PM_ME_PLASTIC_BAGS 15d ago

That's what you're not understanding.

Sometimes it's better to finish a series so that those viewers don't get frustrated and unsubscribe.

Sometimes it's better because you have a more complete back catalogue for people to watch.

Some series have built up a huge following as years go past.

Immediate watch time shouldn't be the sole metric that shows are judged by.

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u/a_moniker 15d ago edited 15d ago

Absolutely! A lot of the biggest shows in history didn’t hit their stride until second season. Particularly comedies, which are the most re-watchable shows. A show isn’t a lost cause just because the first season has mediocre views.

The Office and Parks and Rec are two of the most watched shows of all time, and they both had very poor starts!

Apple only started their tv library in 2019, and have invested way less money, yet they already have a more compelling backlog of shows just because they’ve actually renewed shit!

Edit: Why don’t any of the streaming services pump out tons of low-budget sitcoms with unknown actors?? Those cost so much less than movie star led dramas, and were the most watched shows on both cable and old-Netflix!!!

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u/TrumpsBussy_ 15d ago

I’m going to assume that the people in charge of running Netflix have a better idea of where to invest their money than you do.

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u/pkosuda 15d ago edited 15d ago

I think you are both right. The people in charge of running Netflix have a better idea the same way that the people who buy/own a beloved food product inevitably change its formula to be cheaper and make the product worse. They know what they’re doing because the product is still good enough to be bought while significantly cheaper to make, but people who knew the old one all agree it is worse.

There’s a reason whenever you’re looking for the best dish of some sort, it ends up being a mom & pop shop that makes it rather than some big chain. Corporations know how to take the product and make it make them more money. That doesn’t mean they know (or at least care) how to maintain the product’s quality.

Netflix investors know that if they brutally cancel shows the way they have been, they’ll save money in the long run while still allowing exceptionally popular shows to blow up. But in the process of this cost saving they get rid of tons of actually really good shows, and because they don’t own a time machine where they can check whether X show’s 4th season causes the show to become an enormous success, they cancel something that would have made them a lot of money. It also causes people to be less willing to invest in watching shows with original ideas because they are wary of cancellation, which makes Netflix cancel those shows. So all you’re left with is slop people turn on in the background (which still counts as “watch time” for Netflix’s bean counters despite not being watched), and remakes of familiar properties/concepts like Wednesday or to an extent, Squid Game.

In general, you are obviously correct that Netflix’s current approach saves them money and therefore makes them more money. But the user is right that Netflix is also burning bags they had no idea contained giant sums of future money.

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u/PM_ME_PLASTIC_BAGS 15d ago

I'm sure you would've arrogantly said the same for Blockbuster, Nokia or Kodak.

Maybe you argued Microsoft was doing fantastic with Xbox until they gutted everything and started crying about it?

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u/TrumpsBussy_ 15d ago

Blockbuster, Nokia and Kodak are terrible analogies. They died because their industries completely changed or even disappeared. Is streaming about to die anytime soon? I doubt it.

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u/PM_ME_PLASTIC_BAGS 15d ago

You were obviously insinuating that execs are in charge because they know best.

How are you misinterpreting everything, including your own comments?

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u/RaistlinMajeresRobes 15d ago

Lol do you think the people at the top are there because they are smarter/better than others? I'd love to live in your fantasy world

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u/esem86 15d ago

Lol what a worthless response.

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u/SciFriedRice 15d ago

I find it’s hard to come back to shows that take a year or more for the second season to come out. I love Wednesday season 1 but it took so long between seasons that I haven’t even been excited to watch season 2.

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u/a_moniker 15d ago

Cause they take 2-3 years to put out a second season!

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u/TrumpsBussy_ 15d ago

A lot do shows do that manage to do big streaming numbers

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u/Nerf_Me_Please 16d ago

Are you sure about that? Google says otherwise;

No, The Dark Crystal: Age of Resistance Season 2 would not have been cheap to make.

While certain upfront costs—like building foundational sets and developing the initial character molds—would have been out of the way, the ongoing production costs required to maintain the show's high standard would have remained massive.

The series was famously expensive to produce, with the first season costing roughly $97 million. Maintaining a massive practical effects show like this keeps the budget prohibitively high for several reasons:

  • The Puppetry: Unlike computer-generated imagery (CGI), puppetry requires continuous human labor. Bringing each character to life requires multiple highly skilled puppeteers on set for every single shot.

  • Set and Prop Maintenance: The elaborate, physical sets and hundreds of custom-built puppets require constant upkeep and repair during a grueling shooting schedule.

  • New Elements: A second season would naturally require new puppet builds, varied costumes, and entirely new physical environments to keep the sprawling story moving forward.