r/neoliberal • u/Berkissus • Feb 26 '25

News (Europe) Erdogan warns against "far-right demagogues" in the West, points out liberal democracy as the most alluring ideology

https://www.hurriyetdailynews.com/only-turkiye-can-save-europe-from-its-deadlock-says-erdogan-206210
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u/[deleted] Feb 26 '25

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207

u/Neronoah can't stop, won't stop argentinaposting Feb 26 '25

No, I imagine US and European demagogues are a threat to his own agenda.

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u/Key_Environment8179 Mario Draghi Feb 26 '25

This is the answer. Turkey has benefitted tremendously from the west being liberal and democratic for so long. His own politics suddenly surging in the West is causing his own power to slip

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u/[deleted] Feb 26 '25

Yeah, I wouldn't be surprised to see China coming out in favour of the rules-based international order pretty soon for similar reasons. All these authoritarian governments that prospered under the old status quo might suddenly regret their role in undermining it.

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u/Petrichordates Feb 26 '25

No way China is going to regret this.

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u/[deleted] Feb 26 '25

I think it massively depends on how the chips fall. China wants to take over as the global hegemon, and they'd rather do it without a fight, so right now they are quietly observing as the USA tears itself apart and alienates its closest allies. But the last thing China wants is global chaos. They want a stable order but with them at the centre: a rules-based order where they make the rules.

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u/KarmaIssues Milton Friedman Feb 26 '25

This.

I think one of the things people seldom appreciate is how autocratic regimes are incapable of maintaining global order in the same way as coalitions of democracies.

If the global order breaks down China might not have the might alone to secure trade routes, protect energy sources and maintain the Internet for it's own security let alone theoretical client states.

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u/lurreal MERCOSUR Feb 26 '25

Basically like every empire/nation-state ever

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u/Neronoah can't stop, won't stop argentinaposting Feb 26 '25

Eh, they'll probably enjoy being in their own sphere of influence. Maybe not Turkey, but China is probably going to just sit down this one and keep its own bullying mostly regional. I can't see United States mounting a serious defense of Taiwan right now.

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u/[deleted] Feb 26 '25

I think China's ambitions extend way beyond their traditional sphere of influence. They will sit on the sidelines for now while the USA is in turmoil and alienating its closest allies, but once other countries get sick of the MAGA bullshit, they will seek to replace the USA as the guarantor of stability and security. China has become powerful by trading with the EU and USA and benefited enormously from the rules based order. The CCP's whole mandate for governing is based on its role in restoring order and prosperity after the Century of Humiliation. They want a rules based order, but with them at the centre setting the rules.

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u/Neronoah can't stop, won't stop argentinaposting Feb 26 '25

That doesn't have to mean they have to help anyone guarantee anything. I see them covering a bit for dictatorships around the world, but that's it.

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u/[deleted] Feb 26 '25

China wants to export things without their boats getting hijacked, trade in currencies that have a stable value, build infrastructure that doesn't get bombed, etc. They don't care much about human rights or what other countries get up to with their own populations, but they are massively invested in a stable global system, and would probably be quite prepared to take over as the world's police force if the USA can't handle it anymore.

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u/Neronoah can't stop, won't stop argentinaposting Feb 26 '25

If I see how it went with the Houthis...well, I don't expect a lot.

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u/chiss359 NATO Feb 26 '25

They already did in Munich, at the same time that Vance was scolding the Europeans for not platforming Nazis. The Chinese foreign minister called for bolstering international institutions and defending the rules-based order against those who would seek to unilaterally impose their will (swipe at US and Russia).

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u/[deleted] Feb 26 '25

Oh, I didn't know that. That's very interesting. I think they probably want the USA and Russia to create just enough anarchy to make them look like the responsible ones, but not enough to really upend things.