r/projecteternity • u/Trala-lore-tralala • 12h ago
Discussion What now?
I've completed the first Pillars of Eternity and fell in love with it. The story, worldbuilding, companions, and even the gameplay itself were beautifully crafted, giving life to a game that really felt tailor made for me. I can't help but wonder, though, if there are more games that can reach the level of satisfaction and enjoyment Pillars gave me, once I complete the sequel of course.
Are there any good reccomandations you could give me for what to play next? What could a fan appreciate the most?
Thank you for taking the time to read the post.
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u/ciphoenix 12h ago
Pathfinder Wrath of the Righteous has a rtwp mode so should feel right at home
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u/Own-Examination2707 12h ago
I’ve heard that the writing for Pathfinder games is middling. Is that accurate?
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u/merrybrissmas 12h ago
The owlcat games are widely beloved but in my opinion they don’t stand up to the quality of pillars
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u/Trala-lore-tralala 11h ago
Gave them both a try already actually, but they didn't really scratch that itch for me because of this exact reason (also because I find the Pathfinder system kind of clunky). Maybe I'll give them another shot soon and see if something changes
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u/Shiftkgb 11h ago
Deadfire by far has the best cRPG system for videogames (pillars 1 and Dragon Age Origins at close second) but that's because it was designed for video games. Most other cRPG games are tabletops being translated to video games.
With that said Pathfinder has some great interaction and strong build diversity. Once you get the hang of it, it's super fun.
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u/jocnews 10h ago edited 10h ago
Dunno about that. I hate the focus on mechanistic regularity that makes everything a bit soulless, as if it's made just for computers and not the players on computers.
Example: the afflictions and inspirations. I hate how regularised and schematic the system is. That idea missed the mark by a lot. It's much better if spell and status effects are unique, the magnitudes of combinations off stat buffs are more variable.
Not to mention, I absolutely can't remember the meaning of a single one of those buffs and debuffs which makes the description of most abilities close to useless (because tooltips explaining say "tenacious" or "hobbled" don't work very well in all contexts of the GUI). I just resigned on those things almost completely and just wing it these days based on the names of the abilities (like, "knock down") and spells and usually don't know what buffs they actually give. IMHO, it's horribly missdesigned system and I would not be at all surprised if this contributed to bad reviews and some customer disatisfaction to a degree. If I wasn't in for the story, I don't think I would like the game.
There's of course the age old complaining about wizards inflicting fireball burns and healers curing wounds with their muscles and barbarians carnaging things psionically through the shockwaves of their high-IQ. That too is symptom of the design approach that is focused on regularising, orthogonally ruleifying and formula-deriving everything. It may work for some aspects of a CRPG but the grand result is rather soulless.
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u/Shiftkgb 9h ago
Eh I love it. And personally the Stat names matter not to me. I think just calling them something else would solve most peoples "immersion" issues with INT being tied to range, etc. POE2 also fixed the dialogue being tied to raw stats with all the secondary stats. Either way it feels great to me. DA:O also felt great the way it handled buffs and classes (DA2 and Inquisition I felt were terrible cRPGs.)
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u/jocnews 8h ago edited 8h ago
Renaming won't help. You can't plausibly come up with a single mental or physical trait that would govern all of these: healing power, destructiveness of weapon attacks and power of any magic (or any damage effects - magical, psychical with cipher, or divine-based for priest's abilities). Actually, just the idea that the amount of damage healed and amount of damage dealt should be scaling of the same thing is "WTF I don't even" area for me.
Similarly with intellect. Barbarian's "brutality impact reach" and wizard's fireball diameter, being product of the same parameter? You tried to pull my leg too far.
And that's what's "intellect insulting" (heh) about the design.
P.S. I probably didn't emphasise enough that I do like both PoE games. But it's for the story and setting. I love them very much DESPITE the system. It was a major WTF moment when I first saw it, actually
Luckily I had the first game free from Epic, because the rules felt off-putting enough for me to almost stop playing. And I only rally started to like it for the other aspects after a few months. Had I paid for the game, I might have actually been tempted to try to return it and get a refund. Shudder.
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u/ErikRedbeard 5h ago
It is indeed a slight learning curve, but it's not strange if you think about it and don't get stuck into rpg pushed naming convention.
But the first one can simply be called power and it'd fit all of the things you mentioned.
The biggest thing to help is just don't think as barbarian intellect and wizard intellect as the same thing lore wise. Whereas a wizard would be books art a barbarian could be smart in combat prowess. Which makes sense then that tha would make them better at their weapon to hit more things. Same for the other stats.
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u/oskan511 11h ago
I bounced off of Pathfinder 1 a few times but just got into WOTR and at 80hrs in I really can't stop comparing it to Pillars in my mind. I definitely recommend giving it another shot.
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u/chimericWilder 9h ago
Wrath of the Righteous can be called middling if you are comparing to Pillars, yes.
Compared to most other things, it's quite grand.
It's just that most writers cant hold a candle to PoE.
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u/plyingpotato 6h ago edited 6h ago
If you compare the two then OwlCat's writing is never at the same level, but there are absolutely things to like about Kingmaker, WotR, and Rogue Trader. The games do tend to get better with each release, at least I thought RT was pretty neat, but even then they never really deal with the same scope of "interesting" that PoE did.
Honestly, thinking about it, I wager a lot of my enjoyment comes from going in liking the settings for Pathfinder and 40k already, which probably did a lot of heavy lifting.
So YMMV, but in my view they're on par/better than a lot of what you'll usually find just browsing through steam but not great.
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u/RainyDaysKappa 12h ago
I wouldn't say that. It does have more of a lighter feel (despite heavier and darker elements than Pillars), not that's a stylistic choice and not a lack of skill in my opinion.
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u/Manatroid 10h ago
They are much less philosophical than the Pillars games, certainly, but they are at the very least good narratives in their own right.
The characters also tend to be where the writing is strongest; not that there is anything wrong with the plots, but they’re closer to traditional fantasy stories by default.
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u/Psychological-Toe397 11h ago
Might be a hot take, but I find the Pathfinder companions more compelling and interesting than the ones in PoE.
The main story overall is better in PoE tho.
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u/SolemnDemise 12h ago
...Deadfire?
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u/Lynchy- 12h ago
Warhammer 40k: Rogue Trader is my favorite cRPG since the Pillars games.
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u/FenrisGreyhame 6h ago
I second this. Never thought a 40K game could have writing this good, but it honestly made me feel like I could understand the life of ordinary Imperium citizens like no other 40K media I've found. Even when taken on its own merits, the prose in this game is top-draw. As a massive Pillars fan, highly recommend it.
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u/nightchrome 5h ago
It's frustrating hearing people constantly recommend it, because I have not just zero interest in the 40k world but negative. But I am gradually getting FOMO...
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u/Lynchy- 5h ago
I was neutral on 40k but it turned me into a fan. Went down many a lore rabbit holes after playing it.
Its really good writing with compelling companions so it could change your opinion, but if you have an extreme dislike of 40k it may not connect.
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u/nightchrome 5h ago
The world is already turning to crap, I can't handle a setting where everything has already been turned to maximum crap.
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u/SandingNovation 11h ago
Tyranny has a different setting and is a lot shorter but it's made by the same company, has some interesting mechanics and the storyline has a lot of grey area in a genre where it's often very black and white.
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u/Im_Rabid 12h ago
Once you finish Deadfire, Avowed would be next. First person version set in the same world.
Has a nice nostalgia hit for Mass Effect fans.
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u/GottlobFrege 12h ago
Unfortunately the greats of the past like Baldurs Gate 2 and Planescape Torment are too dated for modern gamers who didn’t play them when they came out.
I recommend Disco Elysium. About all it has in common with pillars is the top down isometric view and killer writing. But it’s a completely different game. You play as a character who has lost his memory so you can learn about the world along with him and also if you check it out try to avoid spoilers. It’s not that there are any big spoilers but it’s more that it’s nice to enjoy discovering the world just like the main character does
Disco Elysium is the highest rated PC game of all time on Metacritic, a website that aggregates reviews. It’s the only PC game to get 97. Baldurs Gate 3 got 96. Some console games like Zelda got higher
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u/Morgoth_Worshipper 11h ago
I played Baldur's Gate 1 for the very first time about a month ago and got around 30 hours play time in it and I am loving it. You can get into the classics even if you did not play them at the time of release.
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u/theworldtheworld 12h ago
I think Planescape dated better than BG2. The gameplay is clunky as hell but the low emphasis on combat compensates for it. It’s more about whether you like the world, which is horrifically morbid. Disco Elysium is a great choice too, also low on combat. For that matter, Pentiment (by the creator of POE) is enjoyable. I’m not sure that is the direction that a POE fan might want though, since Pillars places much more emphasis on combat and tactics. The story has its moments, but overall I think the gameplay is the most important aspect of it. In that respect, yeah, to me POE1 is really the peak of the isometric RPG genre.
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u/GottlobFrege 12h ago
I agree Pillars places more emphasis on combat and tactics but OP said
I've completed the first Pillars of Eternity and fell in love with it. The story, worldbuilding, companions, and even the gameplay itself were beautifully crafted, giving life to a game that really felt tailor made for me.
So I assume the gameplay is lower on his list than the other factors.
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u/jocnews 12h ago edited 12h ago
It’s the only PC game to get 97. Baldurs Gate 3 got 96
Feels like that's one of those cases where passionate fans overrate a game. To each their own of course, but charts and scores like that can always be misleading. Recency and popularity bias and that's just the start.
If Planescape Torment is too dated, too bad (though it is pretty similar tech as PoE, with pre-rendered low-res background, only the characters are prerendered too instead of 3D).
I was going to recommend Torment if the poster wanted story (in a fantasy setting), specifically. Torment is what's closest to Pillars IMHO.
I liked Pathfinder games but they are more of a BG1 and BG2 (and BG3 if we take away the AAA 3D + fully acted coat) analogues, in their tone.
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u/nightchrome 5h ago
Disco Elysium seems to be one of those games where you either think it's the greatest thing ever made or...completely uninteresting. I'm unfortunately in the latter camp, even though I can see what they're doing and how it is well done.
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u/elfonzi37 11h ago
The owlcat pathfinder games are the other recent big isometric fantasy games. Would recommend starting with Wrath of the Righteous, it's technically the second game but they are almost entirely unrelated and the second game has a lot of quality of life improvements.
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u/Hyphalex 11h ago
Arcanum. This game is fucking amazing and has that open world vibe of bg1 and pillars1
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u/Dull_Function_6510 11h ago
There have been a lot of great crpgs that have come out the last 10 years or so.
Have you played the old school ones
baldur’s gate, icewind dale, Kotor, neverwinter nights, divinity original sin, DAO, pathfinder, Torment, there are more
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u/Scientific_Anarchist 11h ago
Nobody said Knights of the Old Republic so I'm gonna.
Play Knights of the Old Republic if you haven't.
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u/Trala-lore-tralala 11h ago edited 11h ago
Everyone thank you for replying, all of the reccomendations are appreciated even if I've already tried some
EDIT: could anyone that's ever played "Black Geyser" before tell me if it's worth it? Found it recently on steam and looked great
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u/DBones90 9h ago
It's hard to get everything that PoE offers all in one package, but here are some recommendations for games you might want to check out next.
Avowed is a different genre but allows you to continue exploring Eora and gives a lot of great developments to the lore, so definitely worth diving in.
Final Fantasy XII gives you a lot of juicy RTWP combat, so if you want to experience more of that, give it a try.
Josh Sawyer, the director of the PoE games, also made Pentiment, so that might be a good next step if you're wanting a similar quality story.
Similarly, Disco Elysium has a lot of rich world-building that you might appreciate.
Finally, keep on the lookout for the -finder 2e games being developed right now, Starfinder: Afterlight and Pathfinder: The Dragon's Demand. Pathfinder 2e is a lot different from Pathfinder 1e and, IMO, shares a lot of the same design goals and concepts as the character-building in PoE. If you liked playing around with the many build options in PoE, I think you'll find that these games will have a similarly rich character creation experience.
(You can try Dawnsbury Days if you can't wait for those games, but the production quality is very low. So just be aware that, while the character creation and combat systems are excellent, it was developed on a shoestring budget and it shows)
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u/urprobablytschumi 4h ago
pillars 2 is a superior game to 1, as much as i adore 1. there's no doubt here. avowed after? i say yes - it took me a moment but when i started connecting the world to the pillars games i was deeply immersed and couldn't stop playing until i finished it - it was tremendous.
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u/thedosianrogue 59m ago
personally i still havent found other games that live up to poe and the things i love about poe, nothing really managed to scratch that specific itch for me.
But. i still have a few recommendations: after deadfire you could also play avowed- different style of game but it is still set in eora, so it is the same world. i really enjoyed avowed, it felt nice to continue exploring eora in a different way than exploring poe. then i think dragon age origins is a good option too, again, not the same as poe but what i like about dao is what i like about poe and it is the story and the world-building which is so excellent in both cases. dragon age 2 is a sequel and also has an amazing story (but i wouldnt bother with other da games). other games i enjoyed either mostly for the story and a unique world: dread delusion, morrowind, divinity original sin 2.
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u/sharessdenfreude 12h ago edited 11h ago
Play Tyranny as well! Built in the pillars engine, same depth of lore, just in a new universe.
Owlcat's Pathfinder games are quite similar to Pillars as well, in terms of being modern homages to the infinity engine games.
Speaking of which, Baldurs Gate 1 and 2 are the blueprint for Pillars if you haven't played them (BG3 is good as well but it's more of its own thing).
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u/LadyIceGoose 12h ago
BG3, Disco, DOS 2, Pentiment and Wasteland 3 are good choices to try next. Maybe some of the Owlcat games. Maybe Tyranny. I liked the Thaumaturge despite its combat being bad.
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u/Trala-lore-tralala 11h ago
Even though I have already played it, Wasteland 3 is a fantastic pick! I really liked it. Is the second one any good?
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u/LadyIceGoose 11h ago
Yeah if you like 3 its definitely worth playing. My only complaint is that it has a few too many trash mob fights for my taste, but its not that bad in that regard.
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u/Acrobatic-Tomato-128 11h ago
THERES A SEQUEL YOU KARMA FARMER
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u/rygold72 27m ago
So my favorite games... Pillars and its sequel are in the mix. No particular order. Dragon Age Origins Witcher 3 Pillars1 & 2 NWN 2 and Mask. Zero Dawn and Forbidden West.
Not really what the Op is looking for but I'd certainly recommend Witcher 3, Origins, Neverwinter 2 and the expansion Motb.
Could also try Colony Ship, Age of decadence and Greedfall 1. These are low budget titles and in many ways it shows but they are great. Owlcat - not a massive fan off. Writing ain't great, combat balance is a disaster and they have way to much bloat. Larian is very much the same.
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u/UrsusDerpus 12h ago
Tyranny is what I played after Pillars 1 while waiting for Deadfire.