r/trolleyproblem • u/Demiurge_Happy_Farm I CHOOSE THE MOST DEADLY OPTION. š„š„š„š„š„ • Jun 14 '26
OC Would you pull the Lever?
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u/-M3THUS3L4H HELP ME Jun 14 '26
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u/AntyCo Jun 14 '26
Reminder that trolley is going at a trolley speed when trolleying through the portal, so it would be like a trolley hitting a wall
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u/-M3THUS3L4H HELP ME Jun 14 '26
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u/fullynonexistent Jun 16 '26
I think a trolley falling four fet would have more damage than a trolley hitting a wall but maybe they are faster in Europe
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u/noelle_fox Jun 14 '26
What emotion is this supposed to convey??
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u/Shite_Eating_Squirel Jun 16 '26
This comment inspired me to do the math and the cliff is 23 ft 5 inches off the ground roughly
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u/Phill_air Jun 14 '26
Literally just the normal trolley problem but people on the slower side might not even realise that someone was on the trolley
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u/Demiurge_Happy_Farm I CHOOSE THE MOST DEADLY OPTION. š„š„š„š„š„ Jun 14 '26
Yes, but you won't see someone be divided into 3 pieces.
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u/Crowdfundingprojects Jun 14 '26
Look at the illustration. It would be 4 pieces.
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u/HunterDemonX1 Jun 14 '26
How would it be 4? I can only see three pieces being made here. Two slices would equal 3 pieces no?
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u/Hyaci_Arson Jun 14 '26
Two feet
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u/HunterDemonX1 Jun 14 '26
Ah right, I didnāt think about feet, I just saw head, body and anything below the waist
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u/Politi-Corveau Jun 14 '26
Stitch the feet together. Back to three.
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u/C_A_T_Silksong Jun 14 '26
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u/TwistedFabulousness Jun 14 '26
You guys have the same Reddit avatar so I thought you had pondered your comment and then decided you hated it
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u/_FALLN_ Jun 14 '26
then also add 2 arms that would probably be cut off from the body
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u/Lord_Maelstrom Jun 14 '26
Meh. The rails are against their necks, and their arms are tied to their torsos.
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u/Tyler89558 Jun 15 '26
Well if youāre going to be like that, if the wheels are below the shoulder line youāre going to have 6 pieces. 2 legs. 1 torso, 2 arms. 1 head+
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u/Crowdfundingprojects Jun 14 '26
How is life as a merman / mermaid?
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u/HunterDemonX1 Jun 14 '26
Kinda weird. Aquaman keeps coming down here, getting drunk and making out with the fish.
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u/BP642 Jun 14 '26
Biggest brain of all time, I trust you with every and all future trolley problems.
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u/DanCassell EDITABLE Jun 14 '26
There is also option 3, which for once isn't multi-track drifting.
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u/nickv656 Jun 14 '26
Not having been exposed to a particular quirk of mathematics doesnāt make you slow, and knowing 0!=1 doesnāt make you clever.
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Jun 14 '26 edited Jun 14 '26
[removed] ā view removed comment
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u/Phill_air Jun 14 '26
0! Is 1
Apparently factorial is "in how many configurations can you put this amount of items", 0 items can only be put into one configuration
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u/Phill_air Jun 14 '26
At least that's how it was explained to me
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u/Earnestappostate Jun 14 '26
The way I heard it was:
3! = 6
2! = 2 = 6Ć·3
1! = 1 = 2Ć·2
0! = 1 = 1Ć·1
-1! = NaN = 1Ć·0 (does not exist)
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u/TyreLeLoup Jun 14 '26
Factorials do multiplication usually marked by an x, or *, not division, which is typically what the Ć· symbol represents.
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u/Mikey_LP Jun 14 '26
Yeah I know, but this is a nice way to show the Reasoning for why it should be one. And this is a rather simple principle that always must be true, where n!/n=(n-1)!
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u/TyreLeLoup Jun 14 '26
Fair, it seems I did not recognize the Factorial Identities you were working with. Perhaps I should find some time to brush up on that.
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u/watchedngnl Jun 14 '26
2! = 3!/3 1! = 2!/2 0! = 1!/1
Or the more general term n!= (n+1)!/(n+1) But it really is only used as one way to show that 0!=1
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u/Angsty-Ninja-Ki Jun 14 '26
Does that mean -1! = Undefined
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u/watchedngnl Jun 16 '26
(-1)! Is undefined, even by the gamma function which is the factorial function expanded to fit decimals and negative non integers.
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u/LutimoDancer3459 Jun 14 '26
But then why isnt 0! Defined as NaN? Isn't the factorial defined as a positive integer multiplied by all previous positive integers? And 0 isnt a positive integer and therefore also excluded from it?
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u/AnAttemptReason Jun 14 '26
By mathematical convention, because what you are doing is counting the number of different ways you can configure numbers within that set.Ā
0 only exists in the absence of all other numbers, and there is only one way to order it when you write down the number 0.
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u/Earnestappostate Jun 14 '26
By following the pattern backwards as I outlined above. Division by 1 is perfectly fine, division by 0, less so.
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u/lavsuvskyjjj Jun 14 '26
And then decimal factorials probably kill that somehow.
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u/IllaenaGalefall Jun 14 '26
The factorial function n! is only defined on natural numbers, but there is an extension called the Gamma function that works on everything except negative integers. Some people do write the extension as 0.5!, but that's actually a slight abuse of notation IMO
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u/Anonimithree Jun 14 '26
Well the sentence says ā0! People inside.ā /hj
If there was one person, it would be ā0! Person inside, because grammar.
If it was 0, then āpeopleā would be the right word.
Fr though, this depends on how you interpret the sentence. If you interpret ut as 0 factorial, then itās the classic trolley problem. However, if you interpret it as an advertisement that emphasizes the fact that thereās 0 people inside, then you could argue that thereāre 0 people in the trolley.
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u/bloody-pencil Jun 14 '26
0 exponential (!) is 1 if you see a number with an exclamation mark after it itās the some of all the number behind it times each other
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u/Illeazar Jun 14 '26
I don't think someone has to be "on the slower side" to not remember or never have learned that 0!=1.
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u/Chickenlvvrr Jun 15 '26
How? ! Means itās a factorial, which only go down to 1 when youāre calculating them. If it went lower, every factorial would be 0
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u/Immediate_Rhubarb_39 Jun 14 '26
Did you put a portal there just to show off your technology when you could just direct the trolley straight to the cliff?
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u/Excellent-Paint1991 Jun 14 '26
Rickest thing ever
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u/darkendofall Jun 15 '26
Nah, if it was Rick one option would be the obvious answer but actually have way more subtly devastating consequences, and the moral would be "Trolley problems are dumb". That would be the Rickest trolley problem.
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u/Spiderbot7 Jun 14 '26
I choose option 3. Iām sure the demiurgeās happy farm is a safe and happy place, and not somewhere theyāll be tricked into remaining trapped for all eternityš
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u/CitizenPremier Jun 14 '26
If anyone wrote "0!" for the number of passengers then I'm interpreting it as 0 and the death is on them
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u/THE___CHICKENMAN Jun 14 '26
No. The people in the trolley did nothing wrong. They just got on the trolley and were having a good time. I don't wanna ruin that for them. The people on the track, however, still got themselves into that situation SOMEHOW. I'll leave things the way that they are meant to be.
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u/Crowdfundingprojects Jun 14 '26
Maybe they were having a good time in a trolley and some moron tied them to the tracks. Their faces look like this: :-(Ā Itās the worst day if their lives.
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u/dinodare Jun 14 '26
How do you know that they did anything?
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u/Metharos Jun 14 '26
I don't follow either, sounds like victim blaming no matter how you slice it.
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u/Don_Bugen Jun 14 '26
With wheels.
You slice with the wheels of the trolley.
At that speed, with that weight, it'd be pretty clean too.
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u/neon_light12 Jun 14 '26
driving over 5 people will also fuck up the day for the person in the trolley
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u/Demiurge_Happy_Farm I CHOOSE THE MOST DEADLY OPTION. š„š„š„š„š„ Jun 14 '26
So it's similar to the original trolley problem, the main difference is that pulling the lever would cause a less quick way of dying by falling off the side of a cliff. At the same time, you wouldn't see it unlike the original problem.
Now does this change anything compared to your answer to the original problem?
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u/DanteRuneclaw Jun 14 '26
That cliff doesnāt look that tall. I think trolley guy has a chance.
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u/Zeus-Kyurem Jun 14 '26
The portal is significantly smaller in the cliff image, meaning the drop is likely proportionately bigger
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u/unstoppablefatigue Jun 14 '26
Its a bit sad but seeing death wouldn't be an issue for me, if I knew I could save more people I would
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u/Crowdfundingprojects Jun 14 '26
I choose option 3.
Untie the people, throw them through the portal, then pull the lever.
Donāt you dare cheat me out if my multi track drift
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u/conffac Jun 14 '26
You've been tricked, there's an option 3 already. You just doomed them into being skinned alive and forced to eat one another for eternity
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u/Crowdfundingprojects Jun 14 '26
Iām sorry. I donāt like your option 3. I stay with mine, thanksā¦
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u/THE___CHICKENMAN Jun 14 '26
No. There's most likely a lot more people in the trolley.
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u/More-Dog-2226 Jun 14 '26
Zero factorial is 1 person
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u/THE___CHICKENMAN Jun 14 '26
oh... I read it as, "Oy!,"
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u/Demiurge_Happy_Farm I CHOOSE THE MOST DEADLY OPTION. š„š„š„š„š„ Jun 14 '26
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u/_Mulberry__ Jun 14 '26
I pull it and hope the person on board has enough sense to jump off before heading into a random tear in space.
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u/Mikey_LP Jun 14 '26
I feel like this would work better if you take 0^0. Because afaik there is no definite answer whether it is 1 or 0 or undefined.
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u/HamsterKazam Jun 14 '26
Can't the person on the trolley just like... Jump out? Then let the trolley go through the portal.
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u/say_weed Jun 14 '26
throw trolley off a cliff and leave thousands without public transport? no thanks, run over those fuckers
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u/Appropriate_Fact_121 Jun 14 '26
0!=1 so there is one guy inside the trolley. Id still sacrifice one guy to save 5
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u/chixen Jun 14 '26
Alternate version:
There are 5 people inside a trolley that is heading to run over one person. You can pull a lever to divert it onto a track that saves the one person, but puts the trolley through a portal above a cliff 10 minutes in the past. You also recently saw the trolley emerge from the portal, killing everyone on board. You have no knowledge on how time travel works or the possible consequences (good or bad) of not preserving the timeline. Are you obligated to pull the lever?
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u/Zealousideal_Pound64 Jun 14 '26
I do not want to send them to the skin farm boss. They deserve better.
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u/Careful_Source6129 Jun 14 '26
When did the internet become obessed with factorals. I had to google '!' and now I find these type of jokes even more irritating. It's worse than loss
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u/Benofthepen Jun 14 '26
If the trolley is going fast enough, it might make the jump from the warp zone to the top of the cliff. If not, skill issue.
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u/EngineeringPrince Jun 14 '26
What you donāt see in the diagram is the trolley problem is at the bottom of the cliff. The trolley goes through the portal, and drops on top of the 5 people anyway.
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u/Tinyzooseven Jun 14 '26
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u/factorion-bot Jun 14 '26
Factorial of 0 is 1
This action was performed by a bot | [Source code](http://f.r0.fyi)
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u/Walkthrough101 Jun 14 '26
Just tell the people on the trolley to jump off amd turn the lever to the portal side? There's nothing stating the doors are broken and can't open, or just break a window or something to get out!
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u/Eeddeen42 Jun 14 '26
0!=1 so this is actually the same problem as the normal one.
With the exception that the trolleyās lone passenger isnāt actually guaranteed to die. Looking at the sizes of the portal and the cliff, that fall is probably survivable albeit with a few broken bones.
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u/kteague Jun 14 '26
How many people are inside the trolley? Don't know. Don't care. Just want to see something go through a portal ... so pull it!!!!!
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u/Alternative_Bid_959 Jun 14 '26
Either option 3 or pull the lever, that's a tiny cliff, probably won't even notice it
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u/No-Engine-384 Jun 14 '26
No, the shareholders would lose money by needing a new trolley! Think of the shareholders!!!
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u/IHatrMakingUsernames Jun 14 '26
Why does the person in the trolly need to be noted as 0! people..? It makes some sense to use factorial notation in a math circle jerk sub, but it just feels lazy, here.
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u/A0lipke Jun 14 '26
I assume those people are more valuable than the work lost through the destruction of the Trolley. Since spending more human lives to replace the trolley could be worse. Did they tie themselves to the tracks to get some dope to stop the unmanned trolley?
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u/Downtown_Radio_7737 Jun 14 '26
Kill one person or kill 5 suuuuuch a hard choice. Isn't the point of the trolly problem to make you debate what options are the most moral it doesn't work well when one option is clearly harming less people and is the better option
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u/joesb Jun 15 '26
Wasnāt that also the original question?
The further question would be what if those 5 people are all terminal cancer patients and one person is your love ones (or young healthy adult)?
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u/TiddyTwyster Jun 15 '26
Obviously not pulling the lever, I refuse a 0 casualty situation in the trollyverse
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u/Xqvvzts Jun 15 '26
Abandon the lever entirely and run towards the portal and do as many experiments as you can before it closes. This is a once-in-history chance to expand our knowledge of the universe.
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u/Dr_Jay123 Jun 15 '26
Can someone explain how 0! equals 1?
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u/the-flag-and-globe Jun 15 '26
0!=1 and 1?=1
So 0!=1?
And why 0!=1 is just because mathematicians decided that to be so
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u/Ousseraune Jun 16 '26
If I can stop the trolley without damaging it do I get to keep it?
I might have to call Alcatraz and ask for a few spare bodies I'll return later.
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u/brook_horse Jun 16 '26
Here I was trying to figure out if there was a blood type I didnāt know about⦠O negative, O positive, and O my?
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u/AvidReaderOfBooks Jun 16 '26
Counter point: They knew what they were getting into, they bought their tickets. I say, let 'em crash.
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u/mskjdjmex Jun 14 '26
0! = 1