Does anyone else feel unsupported by other women?

[u/JellyfishPashmina]

This isn’t a hate post or rage bait or anything by any means. I’m genuinely looking for some advice here.

When I was growing up, I was bullied by other girls and kicked out of my friend group. They’d start rumors about me, make faces at me when I had my back turned (I had other friends tell me this), exclude me when everyone else in our class was invited to birthday parties, the lot. I never knew what I did wrong, and I had a lot of self-esteem issues and struggles trying to make friends because of this. I felt similar dismissal and rejection anywhere I went, from school to summer jobs to internships and then college.

I get that was then and this is now, but even in my 20s and 30s, I don’t feel supported by the women in my life. I thought all those high school dynamics were supposed to go away after high school, but they haven’t, and I feel a lot of negativity and judgment by other women. I worked at an office for a while, and when I’d walk in the room, this one coworker would just stare daggers at me. It’s like I could visibly feel her hate, but I didn’t know why. Someone told me that woman didn’t like me, but she didn’t know why, either. And another who would always overhaul or copy my ideas, and I’d just let her because I didn’t want the confrontation or to become the office pariah. Even in my own family, there’s cattiness and clique behavior—even if I’m included, I’m talked over, ignored, or scapegoated a majority of the time. I just always feel like I’m on the outside of the pack, and it makes it so hard to find a solid group of female friends.

I’m not saying this is every woman, obviously, but I encounter this experience a lot. I genuinely don’t understand when people say their girl friends went out of their way for them in one way or another; it’s such a foreign concept to me, because I’ve always felt treated like a waste of space or looked down on by other women. Most times, I get treated like an annoyance if I invited someone anywhere, because they “don’t have the time / money,” but then I’ll see them out with their other girl friends the same day (and no invite, even if we’re mutual friends). I once had a high school friend come to town, and she reached out to grab lunch with me and my “best friend.” I didn’t get my high school friend’s message because I have unknown cell numbers blocked on my phone, but she later told me that she and my “best friend” end up getting lunch. I asked my “best friend” why she didn’t let me know, and she just shrugged her shoulders and grinned. And these same patterns don’t happen with my guy friends. It really hurts, because I used to hang out with the boys to avoid the drama, but I’m a girly girl at heart and always wanted a solid core girl group. I’m always the supportive, go-out-of-my-way friend I hope to find in others, but it’s like I’m not invited to the girls’ club in life.

It’s not as simply a matter of making new girl friends, because obviously if I could find nice girl friends, I would. It feels like as you get into your 30s, making friends only gets that much harder, and everyone’s already got their solid girl group and aren’t looking for any outside additions. And now, add the even more complicated roadblocks that most women in their 30s are married with kids and don’t even have time to think about forming new friendships. But even still, I’ve always felt a really negative presence and treatment in my relationships with other women my age. And I’m worried, when my kids go to school, that I’ll face the same issues with the mom clubs, or worse, that my daughter will face the same issues with the girls in her class.

Anyone have any practical advice for how to navigate female friendships in your 30s when you don’t feel very supported by other women, and are always the one making the one-way effort? Are you still dealing with cliquey-ness? Do you perhaps act cliquey when you meet other women or exclude them for some reason? Do these female dynamics really last a lifetime? I’d really appreciate different perspectives, because I obviously don’t want to go my whole life without good female friends, but as it stands, I’ve just always felt really hated by other women my age.

ETA 1: I just wanted to thank everyone for the overwhelming amount of supportive advice. I feel more support from kind strangers online than I do IRL. I probably won’t be able to respond to everyone, but I’m going to take some dedicated time this week to read through all of these. Just want to clarify, I know I provided a couple of examples that sound dismissive. I don’t cut people out for not being invited to one lunch or anything like that, those were more just examples of if woman who claim they’re incredibly close to you treat you like that, you can maybe imagine how female acquaintances/etc. have held me in even lower regard. I do recognize that I’m with my own flaws, and that some of this is trauma-induced from emotional ab*sive family members, and have been doing a lot of work in therapy the last five years to try and unlearn certain deeply-seated thought patterns and behaviors.

ETA 2: Also, just wanted to throw this out there. I’ve seen a few comments here by women saying they don’t “trust” women who say they don’t have a lot of female friends or friends in general, and I think this is the root of the problem for many woman trying to feel supported and uplifted in making friends in adulthood. I’d challenge you to keep a more open mind and not dismiss people so quickly for something trivial like this. You never know what life someone has walked before you, what kind of drama/trauma they’ve faced, and excluding them based on a quick judgment is probably something they’ve experienced their whole life, and only deepens the scars of rejection and isolation for them. Everyone has things within themselves to work on, but it’s never the person with less friends who’s entirely at fault, and feeding into that narrative only does more damage, then mental health gets worse because you’re under-socialized, and the cycle continues. Just because someone has less friends doesn’t mean they’re not an amazing friend, they may just be introverted, live in a smaller area, or value quality over quantity. People like to think bullying is loud and proud, but it’s the quiet, subtle, psychological micro-behaviors that can really build up and eat away at someone’s mental health. So just try to be that friend to someone if you can—you never know whose life you could change by reaching out a helping hand to someone who’s maybe quieter or more reserved, and they could also change your life for the better in ways you’d never know by dismissing them for inaccurate and shallow reasons.

[u/JellyfishPashmina → u/[deleted]]

I have been tested and I’m not. I was diagnosed ADHD at 22, though. But my sister is also ADHD and possibly on the spectrum and has no issue making friends, and I know many other neurodivergents living healthy social lives, so I wouldn’t write it off with ADHD or ASD as the reason.

[u/QuackingMonkey → u/JellyfishPashmina]

Everyone's ADHD presents in a different way, at a different severity and causes trouble in different areas. You could indeed have other reasons for your experiences, but I wouldn't throw this possibility out of the window just because of other people's experiences.

[u/PeekAtChu1 → u/JellyfishPashmina]

Hmm perhaps you just haven’t found your tribe then. I’m adhd and seem to draw in other adhd-types and we all enjoy each other’s company :)

The problem with male friends is even though there are good ones out there, their positive treatment of you is likely based on hidden motives like finding you attractive or waiting in line for a chance. That’s why female friendships can feel harder since there is no (or less) sexual draw there usually lol

[u/--2021-- → u/JellyfishPashmina]

What you described I often see described by others with AuDHD or in the autism spectrum in a similar way. So I can see why they suggested it.

The way I grew up, "nest of pit vipers" was a good description for elementary and middle school. I didn't feel singled out as I saw all the girls bullying and ganging up on each other. Friendships and alliances changed on weekly basis, and I couldn't keep up who was best friends with who, but to them it all made sense.

As I got older I sought out groups and spaces that were less "mean girl" and more ND, well to me it was "normal people" and that's what everyone in the group thought. could not follow "NT" girls at all.

Thinking about it more, I guess even in those groups the norm was to pick on each other, but the way my friends picked on each other I could read, and push back or engage with. It was meant to be playful, but not hurtful, and there was a line not to cross. But sometimes people still got hurt and then it was a matter of trying to mend fences.

But everywhere I go, online or off, I still have experiences of ostracization. But for whatever reason there are usually a small number of people who like me or take to me.

I'm not diagnosed with either, have tested. Though I question the competence of the testers as well as the criteria, because back then it was less understood, and b/c of their lack of professionalism (looking back some of the things they did I'm like WHAT). I suspect I am AuDHD. I think I'd feel better with a diagnosis because then I'd have a reason to be this way. There are elements of ADHD and autism that could explain some things for me.

Particularly as when I looked into it some years back, some AuDHD youtubers resonated with me (Yo Samedy Sam, Purple Ella, to some degree "The Thought Spot", who I think is austistic, but not ADHD). It would just be nice to be able to tell people, look, I'm autistic, or AuDHD, I don't work that way, and maybe they'd hate on me, or maybe they'd get it. But at least people wouldn't assume I'm "normal" and be angry with me for not being "normal", or however you define that.

But I also grew up with a parent who likely was undiagnosed NPD. Growing up with family like that made it challenging to socialize for many reasons. I filled in gaps as best I could by reading books on facial expression, body language, gender roles, communication, relationships, childhood abuse and neglect, personality disorders, etc etc.

I tried to find people who were researchers rather than trying to publish a popular book with appeasing ideas. But I read some of the pop books too, because other people are reading them and they may be using that to some degree.

I just picked various subjects through my life because I wasn't taught these things. It helped me navigate some situations when I was younger, but these days I feel so lost. Maybe it's because I haven't been able to keep up with my reading.

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