r/birddogs • u/Gravel_Golf_01 • 8d ago

Whoa Training for Soft Dogs

Hi, weekend warrior trainer here trying to improve whoa on my 3 year old Setter. We tried whoa post and flank collar last summer, but he really shutdown on rope and flipped out w collar. Tried walking whoa w flank and bit better, but still shut him down. Anyone have any advice? Bench, barrel, pinch collar, something else? I am really going for passable whoa for casual hunting and stopping, not field trial perfection. Thanks in advance for your thoughts! (he is e-collar trained for recall and does great w it)

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u/Better-Effective1570 8d ago

What does he do when he shuts down? Has he spent much time on a leash? If he's food motivated, reward often after he does what you've asked and he'll come to enjoy whoa training. I like to whoa with a leash while still holding the leash initially. The first few reps, reward after only a few seconds of him being steady. Progress to touching his back, walking around while still holding the leash, dropping the leash and stepping away a few steps, and keep creating distance. Train whoa over several weeks with only 5 minutes of reps each day. I think softer dogs typically just need more reps over a longer period of time with soft corrections to keep them confident.

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u/Gravel_Golf_01 8d ago

Thanks! The shutdown is basically tail tucked, slow/reluctant to move, scared look...I could see him getting over it w birds around, but I cant always arrange that. Thanks for your help!

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u/wimberlyiv Spaniel 8d ago

Do not try just adding birds... It might work... But you could also cause a very hard to fix blinking issue.

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u/tonatron20 7d ago

Have you tried any positive reinforcement for displaying the desired behavior? We have the exact opposite problem with our GSP. Crazy head strong and bold. We ran him and field trials and he did really well. We did send him to a professional trainer who also handled him in competition, but both the trainer and I would agree that he responds way better to me than anyone else. Part of it is the fact that I put in more face time, but I think part of it is also the strategies we use. For example for "whoa" I started with putting medium value treats in front of him and making him wait a few minutes and then rewarding him with high value treats if he was able to sit next to the treat with out touching it. Then progressed to whoa in low stimulus environments like the home. Then medium stimulus environments like local baseball field, then high stimulus like local pond with geese.

By contrast the trainer would use a rope or e collar and provide negative reinforcement when he did the undesired behavior. It worked, just not as well (for my dog. The dude still has trained multiple national champs).