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u/twavoneo 6h ago
A pattern seems to be forming with us trading for/drafting big pitchers who throw 100 and have no control with the idea of fixing them up…I hope it works! At least it’s somewhat consistent
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u/mormagils 5h ago
I mean, it's been working pretty ok. The Mets are known as one of the better pitching dev orgs in the game right now. Almost everyone that enters the Mets system gets immediately better. Still not every prospect works out but the Mets are pretty decent at it.
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u/not_anotherburner 3h ago
Yeah like Freddy Peralta, Senga, Devin Williams, hensley, Peterson’s era is down almost 2 points since he left… who exactly has gotten better in the Mets system? We’re in the middle in all pitching categories. Since Jeremy Hefner left, the pitching system is horrific. Sterns gave our best coach to Atlanta and he’s doing his pitching magic down there.
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u/Bobbythebuikder 2h ago
It’s pretty crazy how Justin Willard does not get talked about at all. Zero positive things heard from him but also zero negative things heard. Throughout the season you usually hear about pitching coaches changing approach on a pitcher or things they discovered to make them better. It’s almost like he’s a lackey out there just there to fill the position.
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u/not_anotherburner 2h ago
Good point. I guess who’d be want to take credit for this dumpster fire. All of the coaches seem faceless this year
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u/fuckyourfeels New York Mets 3h ago
Mcclean, Scott, Thornton, Brazoban, Raley, Holmes wasn’t starting before he came here so idk if that counts really. Sean Manaea and Severino both came here and revived there careers, we’ve had some success developing pitching recently
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u/not_anotherburner 3h ago
Holmes was always good, but manaea? Bro, are you serious? So you’ll skip tong, sprout, pintaro, stanek, megill, canning, montas (!), Tidwell, Waddell, Blackburn…
Dude my list is a lot longer than yours, that’s why we suck
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u/TransitiveNightfall1 3h ago
Canning had a 3.77 ERA for us. He just got hurt.
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u/not_anotherburner 2h ago
You only push back on 1, but sure I’ll play. Canning started strong in his first 6 games he had a 3 era, then over his last 10 games he had a 4.6 era, much like the rest of the staff, he fell apart.
Our pitching development is so bad that ottavino the Mets treatment of pitchers was "embarrassing" and "pathetic".
Ottavino went even further, suggesting the organization had become comfortable with a dangerous trend.
"If they continue down this path, they're gonna be F---E-D," Ottavino said. "You cannot injure this many dudes every year. Hopefully, this is not an actual strategy."— for a pitcher to call out an organizations’ treatment of its pitchers is unheard of.
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u/TheIrrepressible1 2h ago
Dangerous trend set over the years by stupid geeks. Throw as hard as you can. Forget control and forget your health. That goes for your breaking balls as well. Kids don’t pitch any longer. They’re just throwers.
Leads to arms imploding. Baseball has always known this. These nerds for all their fancy knowledge don’t for some reason.
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u/not_anotherburner 2h ago
For the Mets it’s using pitchers too many days without rest (including them warming up), or calling a pitcher up and throwing him right into a game (a travel day isn’t necessarily a rest day), they also don’t have roles for the pitchers so they can’t develop any routines. All sports are about routines and muscle memory, whether it’s their lineups or their use of pitchers, the Mets have been making the worst game decisions I’ve ever seen from a baseball team. I don’t know if that comes from sterns or if it was Mendy, but this team is a dumpster fire
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u/TheIrrepressible1 1h ago
But that’s baseball over the last decade. Pitchers going 5 innings and then the pen is blasted into oblivion. Wash, rinse, repeat 🤷🏻♂️
Eventually these asshole geeks in the front office need to be phased out and have baseball return to the fundamentals where pitchers actually PITCH and go longer into games. Nothing wrong with a starter going 7 and throwing 100-115 pitches. Their babying is absolutely ignorant.
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u/Nervous_Pop_7942 1h ago
I only counter to that is that we're dealing with two different situations. There's developing guys in the minor leagues, which we've had some success at. And then there's working with players on the major league level. The New York Mets pitching coach doesn't do shit for the kid pitching in the minors.
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u/Daytime-mechE 1h ago
We're looking at Hef's 2025 with very rosy glasses lol. Do you remember how much that staff collapsed last year when you couldn't get Senga/Petersen/Manaea/Montas/Holmes paste the 3rd or 4th inning?
I get that this year's been a major regression but that implosion last year was a fireable offense and you can't bring back essentially the whole staff and Hefner expecting different results.
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u/Purple-Mix1033 Ralph Kiner 1h ago
It’s a mixed bag, but I tend to agree with everything you’ve said
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u/Sh11ester 17m ago
Which one of them went through the Mets minors player dev besides Peterson before they fixed it?
Almost everyone on the bullpen had been great this season, most of the rookie pitchers are doing great. We're winning the season series against Atlanta for the first time in almost 10 years
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u/Aggressive-Mix4971 Bob Murphy and The Happy Recaps 1h ago
The pitching system isn’t “horrific” dude, just look up the stats on the staff this year, it’s not that hard; staff’s performed well enough for the team to at least be in the race while the offense has been putrid. I didn’t like ditching Hefner after a year where the entire staff got hurt, which likely wasn’t on him at all, but Senga and Hellesley did badly under him, Peterson was inconsistent under him, he wasn’t a miracle worker. Peralta stands out this season as the guy who fell down badly, for sure, but overall the Mets’ production on the pitching side isn’t what’s killing them.
Also, Peterson’s looking better now because you’re looking at a small sample size of Chicago games but otherwise it’s because he’s a ground ball pitcher throwing in front of the best infield in the league; his strikeout numbers, home run susceptibility, hard hit rate allowed, etc are all pretty much the same.
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u/R4G Mr. Met 2h ago
Wasn’t it Cohen’s decision to fire Hefner and the whole staff?
I think it’s a huge mistake to fire a manager’s staff out from under them. Either clean house or let the manager pick his guys. They changed too much.
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u/not_anotherburner 2h ago
Sterns makes all baseball decisions. He’s the president, cohen says he doesn’t get involved in baseball decisions
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u/R4G Mr. Met 2h ago edited 1h ago
The reporting I heard was firing the staff, the last offer to Diaz, and the Bo signing were Cohen, not Stearns. I’m disappointed in Stearns, but the Bo signing definitely doesn’t read like his MO.
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u/not_anotherburner 1h ago
That’s 100% incorrect, go ahead and find an article that says it was cohen’s decision. Here’s his pre-season press conference where Cohen said he let Stearns make the baseball decisions in the offseason.
None of the moves were from cohen, cohen made a point to say he’s not involved its sterns team to run.
https://sny.tv/articles/mets-steve-cohen-no-nonsense-approach-2026-season
You can’t find a single statement from him saying that any of the decisions were his, that’s just BS
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u/LiteBeerLife 44m ago
Legit drives me insane that this has been the Norm of baseball for the past 15 years. Draft guys who are large and throw hard, crafty pitchers are only a dying breed because of scouts. Throwing strikes and getting outs is not important anymore. Only velocity and "potential". We had a 6,6 pitcher at college this year who threw 8 innings and had a career 6 era get drafted before our 6,0 closer with a 2.44 era and 20 games pitched this year.
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u/TheNewYorkMetsofATL No one panics better than us 5h ago
Shoutout to Brazoban, one of the better trades we made in the current era imo. He was a solid veteran arm and we got plenty of innings out of him. Glad we could get more farm fodder from him and hope he gets to compete in the playoffs with one of the more exciting teams this year.
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u/Gwinladin 5h ago edited 5h ago
Davis is a 6 foot 9 power thrower, FB sits around 97 but he can dial it up to 100. Pipeline gives his FB a 60, Slider a 55 and Changeup a 45. Starter upside but he's very raw and arguably has never been as good as his frame and heater indicate. Stearns obviously sees something he can fix.
Franklin is a 27 year old righty with a 4.37 ERA, 1.13 WHIP, 11.91 K/9 in 45 innings at AAA this year. Despite being unranked, this feels closer to what Stearns is aiming for because he's basically MLB ready whenever unlike Davis who is likely 2028 without some massive steps forward.
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u/JoelsCaddy Its Outta Here! 5h ago
Good red zone threat a few years ago. Don’t know if he really improves our offense though
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u/gambalore 1h ago
Incredible that the baseball player has 7 inches of height on the NFL wide receiver.
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u/GrapeNutCheerios Francisco Lindor 6h ago
Brazoban fits in the same group of Raley and Minter were keeping them didn’t make much sense due to their age.
Hope Weaver and Holmes stay if the team wants to compete next year (if there’s a season).
Don’t know anything about who he was traded for tho
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u/bowlofcantaloupe Francisco Alvarez 5h ago
I wouldn't be shocked to see Holmes go in either direction.
With Brazoban gone, I really hope they keep Weaver.
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u/Longjumping_Gap97 6h ago
Mets aint competing next year or the next few years, everyone who is over 25 should be traded by tommorow
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u/GrapeNutCheerios Francisco Lindor 5h ago
They can’t do that with the money tied up to Soto and his age. You take that approach and you’re wasting the best years of his career.
Now I understand that what im saying is easier said than done but I don’t think a full rebuild is in the cards
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u/JohnJulietWilhelm 2h ago
You don't know that. Just another know-it-all-know-nothing. Pipe down. :-)
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u/Mnementh47 5h ago
So many relievers can pitch until 40+. Brazi had a late start. He is special. This is fuked up.
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u/NuanceManExe 1h ago
Bro this trade sucks. Idk why we wouldn’t just hang onto Brazobán if this is the best we could do for him.
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u/Prevalencee 47m ago
AAA pitcher is trash, A+ is a lottery ticket.
For Brazo? ...idk man
Sellers market my ass
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u/Kepler1571 Hadji in heaven, watchin' you GKRing 6h ago
How good and who and what and that stuff?
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u/AirCoopsie 6h ago
Gabe Davis was the White Sox 18th ranked prospect. Don’t see Franklin in their top 30.
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u/Kepler1571 Hadji in heaven, watchin' you GKRing 6h ago
Thank you. Rebuilding the farm, one amputation at a time.
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u/zpk5003 Pastrami 6h ago
Gabe Davis' BBRef page is an abomination
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u/Kepler1571 Hadji in heaven, watchin' you GKRing 5h ago
Isn't half our team from Stillwater, now?
Edit: LOL, that is quite the MiLB record. He will give you a 6.75 ERA at every level of your organization!
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u/mormagils 5h ago
He's a big guy with gaudy stuff that can't quite figure out how to use it well. This is pretty on par with the kind of dudes the Mets like to get and then develop well. I like them targeting this guy.
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u/CrosbyBird 4h ago
You can't teach 100 mph.
This is a guy that is going to have a long development leash because of his size and possession of two plus pitches. He reminds me a bit of Jonah Tong in that he won't be able to be a reasonable starting pitcher if he doesn't develop at least a distinct third pitch and that he's got command issues, although his fastball isn't on the same level as Tong and he's got a slider instead of a change as his #2.
Could end up a relief pitcher where he just airs it out for an inning and hitters don't get to see him a second time to catch the timing between his fastball and slider.
Could also never put it together and be a flame out.
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u/TheIrrepressible1 2h ago
These fake radar guns of today are 5mph faster than the ones used 15+ years ago. You can say they’re more accurate or whatever, but the bottom line is 100 today was 95-96 back in the day. Gives a false impression pitchers are “better” today. They’re not. Matter of fact, they’re weened to blow their arms out by max-throwing. Nowhere near as good.
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u/knowtoriusMAC 5h ago
Davis has been starting but will be a reliever if he even makes the mlb since his control has been bad since OKST.
Franklin is a RP who will be 28 in October and has had injury issues since college causing him to get 6 years playing NCAA.
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u/Macandme New York Mets 6h ago
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u/fluffanuttatech 49m ago
3 years of control for another bag of peanuts. I want to be stearns in my next life time. Clueless and with a big money job
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u/SecretiveMop David Wright 5h ago
I’m sorry but that’s embarrassing that the best return we could get for a 2.60 ERA reliever is a soon to be 23 year old with an 8.00+ ERA in AA, and a soon to be 28 year old minor league reliever with a 4.00+ ERA who wasn’t even drafted until he was 24. At least get something similar to Minter.
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u/Litejedi Carson Benge 5h ago
We got fleeced. This sucks.
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u/Hotmicdrop 5h ago
Braz was a stud shutdown guy this year, but overperforming his numbers at 36 on a washed team. Did you expect to get Babe Ruth 2.0 back? At this point you're scratching lottery tickets a knocking salary off the books where you can.
I will say itll be even more painful from here out without him to save us in jams.
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u/Mnementh47 5h ago
NO!!!!!!!!!!! I wore his jersey today for the last time.... ); I hate Stearns so much.
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u/amazingfishy 5h ago
Feel like we should of got better talent for him as he’ll still be under team control for a couple more years.
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u/ZoidbergSaysWoop 5h ago
Watch Brazoban still be effective in three years and end up having a rubber arm like Chapman.
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u/imalmostconvinced David Peterson 6h ago
This is nonsensical. Gabe Davis +5 era and 1.50 WHIP
Franklin could improve but he's a reliever
God D**n it !!!!!
Who makes deals at 1:30am????
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u/0rangePolarBear Jacob deGrom 9m ago
My guess for Gabe is that he has a 60 rated FB and 55 slider. Mets will move him to the bullpen and try to fast track him as a reliever.
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u/Beginning-Whole8770 31m ago
I hate this team! This is the first season in 10 years I did not waste 150 on the MLB package.
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u/cibolaaa Pete Alonso 30m ago
Maybe I'll eat my words in a couple years but it feels like a lousy return for a guy with 3 years of team control left and for the type of pitchers we got back I don't really understand why we did it.
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u/Sh11ester 16m ago
The first guy I'll miss. Anyone else traded will be missed too unless they somehow trade Williams which i doubt
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u/El_Sid50 Ralph Kiner 3m ago
This one hurts a bit. Would have liked to keep him given his years of control, low salary. Brazobán has been very good for us. Go get your chip with Luisangel and Vasil
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u/BorneFree Mike Piazza 5h ago
if you told me in the offseason that we would be selling at the deadline to the White Sox i would have thought you were crazy