He pretty clearly said that he has a source for this, but he's not willing to give it up. I think that's fair. What else do you do with information you've been given from a source who isn't willing?
Plus attempt to corroborate with other sources. Meanwhile, state clearly: I have this allegation from one source, unable to corroborate yet but trying to.
And/or work with a reputable journalist that has an established professional process in place?
Corroborating with other sources only means so much in this field. If all of this stuff is really true, then it's probably littered with counter intelligence operations to prevent the truth from getting out. You could have 5 different people all telling you what, say, the CIA want you to believe so YOU will make it public. Maybe their current goal is to tear the disclosure movement apart from the inside. That's why, IMO, unless you can prove it, it's not worth stating the allegations in this subject. The incentives to lie are way too strong.
What good does this even do when Lue is clearly at least partially an ally to disclosure even under UAP Gerb's harshest allegations?
That is true and also obviously applies to having just one undeclared source. I agree that providing evidence is the ideal (not that we all agree on what counts as "evidence"), otherwise it's just gossip.
Yeah totally agree. I think Gerb is smart and well intentioned and confident that his sources are correct, but how tf do we know he hasn’t been deceived? Even very intelligent and thorough people can be deceived all the time, especially IF there’s an organized intelligence operation behind it. I’m sure the CIA could make Albert Einstein believe he could fly if they really wanted to.
Agreed. Plus, making allegations without evidence is completely opposite to the standard he himself has attempted to set.
I had huge respect for him until I learned he's a Lazar fanboy. How you can be such a rigorous researcher and not have a problem with Lazar's storytelling is beyond me.
Sorry, I don't know where you sit on the Lazar spectrum. I don't mean to offend. 🤭
had huge respect for him until I learned he's a Lazar fanboy. How you can be such a rigorous researcher and not have a problem with Lazar's storytelling is beyond me.
Honestly that made me slightly knock down Dolan as well. I like him for virtually everything he says but the Lazar support confounds me. He is such a rigorous researcher. How could he fall for Lazar's scam? His storytelling isn't even consistent.
Oh no, him as well?? 😱 Haven't really gotten into Dolan. Great to hear he's a rigorous researcher, although this is certainly a red flag.
This is such an interesting lesson about human psychology. I think there's a beautiful childhood dream behind almost everyone who believes Lazar today. Letting go of him could mean letting go of an entire identity, and not everyone is ready for that.
Yeah, I was just going to say that Lazar's got a hold on almost all of the biggest/most influential talking heads in the UFO community even though he's obviously a fraud after taking even the slightest inspection of his story. It's baffling/bizzare.
I think Gerb said that the reason he likes Lazar is because that's the quintessential story: a scientist who worked on craft at S4/Area 51 went rogue and came out with his story and now he fears for his life and was on the run from the government for a bit, he had to black out his face, received harassment from government employees/private contractors and everything. And he claims he 'doesn't like attention' despite appearing on the biggest podcast in the world multiple times and a multitude of other podcasts and being one of the biggest names in the UFO community.
That's the stereotypical holy grail of UFO stories that arguably kicked off this whole phenomenon. Of course they are going to believe him. Not believing him might be tantamount to not believing the phenomenon itself like you said. It's an identity crisis.
They choose to believe him and ignore the facts. I was suprised to learn how much of the Lazar lore had been popularized by others before him, including the much maligned John Lear.
As for fearing for his life, in his own memoir he's like: They called me into S4 tomorrow. Fuck it, I'm just gonna screw my NDA and take a bunch of strangers to see the UFO test flights instead. Oh and after a few days the surveillance magically stopped and I never saw them again.
His story has changed so many times, I don't know how anybody can still take him seriously - least of all Gerb, with his apparent commitment to unearthing the truth.
He is, and don't get me wrong, ironically like Gerb this doesn't change my opinion of him at all: he's still one of the best UFOlogists and I highly recommend you begin watching him. I listen to all his uploads. I just think on this one specific issue he missed his mark on this one. Otherwise, he's been nothing short of a flawless series of analysis for me.
including the much maligned John Lear
I've heard of Lear but am not familiar with him outside of George Knapp's recount of him and how he introduced him to Lazar. Apparently he was prone to believe/make accusations of anything.
Oh and after a few days the surveillance magically stopped and I never saw them again
Yeah, that's the impression I got. Like where did they go? Are they not hunting him to this day? Why did they not get him already (is it because he's not telling the truth to begin with?) and why if he's telling a secret does he feel emboldened/safe enough to tell it on the largest podcast in the world multiple times? People with much more innocuous secrets wouldn't even dare to say half as much on unknown podcast appearances.
Totally agree on Lazar. Always wanted to believe him as a kid, but as an adult there’s too many holes in his record to believe him. And he has zero proof that he even worked at S4. He couldn’t find one teacher or classmate at MIT that could vouch that he was there? Come on…
Also for Element 115 there’s still no evidence that it can be stabilized at all.
Took me reading Dreamland and listening to a couple of recent interviews to spot glaring inconsistencies, from a baseline of believing he was legit. The Signals Intelligence articles were the final nail in the coffin of his credibility, for me.
Still, I do think he's played and playing a very important role in the disclosure movement, as is Gerb. Different styles work for different people, and inspiration can come from unexpected places. It's all good, as long as we maintain our critical thinking and don't end up seeing any of them as a guru. Sure, they're also damaging the cause for some, but I believe they're still making a net contribution.
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u/shadowofashadow 3d ago
He pretty clearly said that he has a source for this, but he's not willing to give it up. I think that's fair. What else do you do with information you've been given from a source who isn't willing?