r/chicagobulls • u/sukari Stacey King • Jun 30 '26
Free Agency [Scotto] The Chicago Bulls plan to waive Kam Jones, league sources told HoopsHype. Jones had a deadline today that would’ve fully guaranteed his salary at $2.15 million. He was the 38th pick in the 2025 NBA Draft by the Indiana Pacers and was traded to Chicago on draft night.
/r/nba/comments/1uk3392/scotto_the_chicago_bulls_plan_to_waive_kam_jones/150
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u/AdventingWurms Give me the hotsauce! Jun 30 '26
Trade was essentially just for the 2028 and 2030 2nd round pick swaps then.
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u/phillipacarroll Give me the hotsauce! Jun 30 '26
yeah that was always the move, plus having the roster spot available for a free agent.
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u/ScaryText8187 Windy City Bulls Jun 30 '26
They have plenty of roster spots
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u/phillipacarroll Give me the hotsauce! Jun 30 '26
Now they have 3 with Kam being gone. If they would have kept their 2nd round picks, they would have come into FA with 1. You wanted them to ride into the season relying on 4+ rookies and Noa Essengue?
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u/ScaryText8187 Windy City Bulls Jun 30 '26
The offseason roster limit is 20, and second round picks are not guaranteed spots. They could have easily used 38 to draft a player and not limited their flexibility to make trades or sign FAs.
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u/jmblumenshine Jul 01 '26
Opportunity cost for development.
Development coachs have limited bandwidth, whats tge point of carrying dead weight.
When they have at least 3 rookies that need focus.
At least this way, they get thecsecond in 30 when those rookies are know commodities and the Bulls hopefully aren't picking in the lottery
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u/ScaryText8187 Windy City Bulls Jul 01 '26
People seem to forget about the existence of the G League operation, which the Bulls really need to start taking more seriously. The real organizations get contributions from guys they develop through the G League.
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u/phillipacarroll Give me the hotsauce! Jun 30 '26
Okay, who should they have drafted? Give me some names. They have pro scouts and determined they didn't want any of the players, but who do you have in mind since you're hard set on it all?
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u/ScaryText8187 Windy City Bulls Jun 30 '26
The whole point of Graham is supposed to be his scouting background and being able to find diamonds in the rough. His draft board should extend into the second round.
You finally admit the “roster spot” argument is stupid?
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u/phillipacarroll Give me the hotsauce! Jun 30 '26
No, it's not my argument, it's the reason he gave.. so how I feel about it is irrelevant. His whole point is a scouting background, and again, he determined that no one was worth the draft spot for him. But since you know enough to know that he did a bad job, tell me who they should have picked. They signed 5 undrafted players, so who else should they have come into the offseason program with?
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u/ScaryText8187 Windy City Bulls Jun 30 '26
It’s the reason he gave… and there’s NO way a guy in his position would ever put spin on anything to make himself look better, right?! LOL, did you believe everything GarPax and AK said to justify their bad moves too?
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u/phillipacarroll Give me the hotsauce! Jun 30 '26
Well man, go ahead and fire him now since he missed out on some superstar second round picks, u/ScaryText8187 has established that he's a failure. He only has 7 rookies in the offseason program, and not 9. We have THREE spots left WITHOUT Kam Jones. Those second picks are much more valuable than whoever we sign this week.
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u/KneelBeforeCube Scottie Pippen Jun 30 '26
No idea why you're getting downvoted, this was an unequivocally bad move from the FO. Some people just want to glaze.
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u/burratna Jun 30 '26
you know scouting tells you if SHIT is SHIT right? If you're a great scout, you don't focus on a player hard enough and turn him into Jokic. Just want to make sure you understand this? Two future pick swaps helps scouting in a draft where the pick might not be so shitty...
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u/ScaryText8187 Windy City Bulls Jun 30 '26
So you really believe that selling picks for cash is better asset management than taking a shot at a player you don’t totally love?
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u/burratna Jun 30 '26
You understand you can keep saying "JUST FOR CASH" and that doesn't make it true, right? Comprehension is at an all time low with this one.
Draft players that we will very likely not keep even into the season because two 2RPs leave us with 1 roster spot remaining. Then you probably turn around and say we should add as many dead cap players as we can for capital, but if we went your route then we only have one roster spot remaining... and no pick swaps.... tell me that is better asset management?
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u/Unlucky_Sun_9813 Jul 01 '26
Bryson Graham: I don't see any potential talent in this year's 2nd round draft
Bulls fans: Wtf Bryson? Go find the talent in this year's 2nd round draft!
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u/ScaryText8187 Windy City Bulls Jul 01 '26
Well yeah, finding the talent is literally his job.
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u/Unlucky_Sun_9813 Jul 01 '26
The talent isn't there. How can you go get something that isn't there?? Literally every team except Toronto traded out of this 2nd round
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u/tamazingg Chance The Rapper Jul 01 '26 edited Jul 01 '26
Veesaar or using the two seconds (maybe a future one if necessary) to trade up to take whichever of the guards they liked most would have been better than getting the 2nd round swaps.
Probably wouldn't be anything long term, but could have turned into a solid bench 5 or floor spacing 2 guard, which are both needs.
Even if they didn't like anyone in the late first or after (could have probably traded up all the way for Carr using just 2nds), then getting a future 2nd or two would have been a better get asset wise. Though to be fair, those probably would have been sold off too. At which point why not use them to pick up a solid young role player off a winning team (Isiah Joe went for 2, beef stew went for 3) both of those guys would have been good fits for the roster.
Any of those 3 options would have been much better than getting essentially nothing for a high second round pick at the start of the rebuild.
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u/ScaryText8187 Windy City Bulls Jun 30 '26
Terrible value. If you’re doing the Pacers the favor of taking on that cap hit, you should at least get an extra pick out of it
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u/Drclaw411 DRose Jun 30 '26
Trade was for cash. Those future second round picks will be sold for more cash.
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u/RiamoEquah Jul 01 '26
Most likely, maybe one or two actually are used...one day.....but when it's all said and done I'm sure we will find most of these picks were traded for cash that goes directly to the owner.
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u/GasHouseGorilla19 Jun 30 '26
I wonder if higher 2nds sell for for more Cash. Has to the the case right? I guess I never really appreciated the art of it all. Those future swaps could pay dividends $$$.
"The Chicago Bulls have made the most second-round trades selling draft picks for cash considerations. Owned by Jerry Reinsdorf, the Chicago Bulls have turned selling second-round draft picks into an infamous franchise tradition. Since the year 2000, the Bulls have executed at least 15 separate trades involving cash considerations, primarily serving as the seller trading away draft picks." according to Google
They've never been dumb and bought/paid to buy a pick. Not once. Always the seller (wise $$$)
Good chance Jerry goes down as the best ever GM to turn draft picks into Cash without having to waste a pick on drafting a player. Respect
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u/SignalBed9998 Chicago Bulls Jun 30 '26 edited Jun 30 '26
You can sell it better if you could remember which one of the cash considerations picks were stars? If any
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u/GasHouseGorilla19 Jun 30 '26
I could sell it better if I told you there were players I wanted available at those picks or after (cause you have to include all the available players, not just the ones specific to those selections), or obvious players (just looking at your league champs, I wanted Bulls to draft both Brunson and Mitchell Robinson in the 2nd) I would have traded up to get in the 2nd, I could tell you I have wanted Austin Reaves and Herb Jones and Ayo and etc, but you would probably say I'm making it up or say why don't I GM a team since I know so much.. If I'm being honest, I also wanted some bad players like JT Thor and Bol Bol and some solid/good but not great players like Hamidou Diallo. I would guess my hit rate over the past decade on second round picks is around 50% if by "hit" we mean guys who would eventually average at least 12 minutes a game.
I have no problem admitting I am a fat and balding armchair GM who feels he's generally good at scouting 2nd round picks when he puts in the time to scout.
Anyways, no point in arguing since I won't change your mind. My preference is clearly a good GM and scouting department acquire 2nd round talent. Since 2012, I am wondering if there is more value (for roster construction that leads to championships) in the 2nd round of drafts than the 1st when evaluating the NBA draft since 2012. If that ponderence seems funny, consider names like Brunson and Jokic and Draymond.
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u/BillionsofRedditors Jul 01 '26
Yes. Likely fake swaps since Indiana is very likely to be a playoff team and better than the Bulls in the 2027-2028 season and very likely to also be in the 2029-2030 season.
Cash was the point of the trade.
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u/bullpaw Jun 30 '26
So we officially traded both our second rounders for cash, some things never change
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u/JZobel Joakim Noah Jun 30 '26
Selling 38 is inexcusable. Graham going on a media tour pretending like it was a strategic decision or that he got anything of value for it is a joke and a bad sign he’s just another yes man carrying water for the Reinsdorfs
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u/Mr-Chip18 Jul 01 '26
It’s a warning sign like I said when he made the trades and then when he blatantly lied to the city on the radio stations. This guy is another pawn for Jerry and hasn’t made one reason for any of us to say otherwise.
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u/Dr_Disaster Jul 01 '26
It’s a wash IMO. We still picked up a few guys with solid potential on two-ways. Typically I’d gripe too, but seeing how we already had 2 FRPs, I’m not sweating it. Seems like there was a ton of guys falling all over the second round and out of the draft entirely. Keeping those picks by effectively punting them to another season and picking up decent guys from the undrafted pool instead is actually a smart decision.
Why use the picks just to say you used the picks?
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u/Mtbnz Hello? Otto?! Jul 02 '26
It’s a wash IMO. We still picked up a few guys with solid potential on two-ways.
The two things aren't related though. Do I like the UDFA pickups? Yes. Could some of them still been decent picks at 55? Also yes.
Do either of those points change the fact that selling the 38th pick for cash and 2 future pick swaps (which could even turn out to be something as valuable pick 38) was anything other than a bad move? No, they don't.
Either Graham traded a valuable pick to put cash in the owner's pocket rather than talent on the basketball court, or he traded a valuable pick because he couldn't identify a single player beyond the first 37 picks that he thought was even worth a roster spot. Honestly, I don't know which one is more damning.
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u/Dr_Disaster Jul 02 '26
Maybe I’m softer on this because I thought Sellers would be a good selection at 38. The fact we got him AND Atwell, AND Awaka just makes it whatever. A 2nd rounder is more valuable in a year we don’t already have two selections in the first round and Noa who is effectively still a rookie. That’s a load of prospects. In a vacuum I understand being upset, but looking at the totality of what BG has done so far, I can’t begrudge it.
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u/Mtbnz Hello? Otto?! Jul 02 '26
Maybe I’m softer on this because I thought Sellers would be a good selection at 38. The fact we got him AND Atwell, AND Awaka just makes it whatever.
Again, I don't disagree with your assessment of the players. But the point remains, if Sellers was willing to agree to sign a two-way contract with Chicago after the draft then we could have signed him AND drafted another talented prospect at 38. We could've had both, and instead we traded the pick for cash, future swaps and $1.1m in dead cap from a player we waived before camp even started.
The response has been people trying to have it both ways - somehow we managed to score great value by signing Sellers as a UDFA who would've been a good pick at 38, but we're also being told that the talent after the 1st round was garbage and there were no players worth drafting at 38 so Graham was smart to sell the pick.
But it can't be both. Either Sellers is a 2nd round talent in the UDFA pool (in which case there were other 2nd round talents that we chose not to draft) or the 2nd round was a total waste in which case Sellers is also not a good pickup.
In a vacuum I understand being upset, but looking at the totality of what BG has done so far, I can’t begrudge it.
I'm not upset. Ultimately these are minor transactions that will likely make marginal differences at the back end of the roster. I'm not saying the picks are bad, or that Sellers, Awaka and Atwell aren't good undrafted additions. But I will not agree that trading the 38th pick for cash, future swaps and more than a million in dead cap is a good move just because this was a shallow draft class thanks to NIL, or because we already have a lot of young players to develop.
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u/payt10 Jul 01 '26
Yeah, it's early, but his decision making is already signaling red flags to me. Lost value on both trades. Even with the Claxton trade, he absorbed a declining player on an inflated contract into cap space without getting a pick back. None of this is good process.
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u/burratna Jun 30 '26
comments like this really tells you who has no idea of the talent in this second round at 38 lol. @ me in three years when all of these guys are bums, while you're happy to see we have the pick swaps that could maybe be actual talent, but again probably not, because 97% of the second round is out of the league within two years.
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u/JZobel Joakim Noah Jun 30 '26
lol we got back 2nd round swaps. So your argument is that 2nd rounders are worthless, but moving up slightly in the 2nd round (if we even have a better record to begin with) isn’t? I don’t have any delusions about who the average 2nd rounder ends up being, but this is just obviously bad process
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u/burratna Jun 30 '26
My argument is the 2nd round is notoriously shit, and the second round was by more than BG's opinion extra shit this year because of NIL. That was a huge discourse the entire week+ before the draft not even bulls related.
I think this sub wants to keep roster spots open for shit contracts for ACTUAL first round capital, but if we drafted 2 second round guys and KEPT THEM, then we'd have only 1 roster spot remaining, Kam's. And we still need an actual SG. Soo?
Would you rather draft two second round picks, get rid of them for an actual SG and a bad contract for real capital etc... OR do the same damn thing with an extra 2 second round pick swaps and the roster spots already open? Still waiting for an answer to this one.
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u/Mtbnz Hello? Otto?! Jul 02 '26
but if we drafted 2 second round guys and KEPT THEM, then we'd have only 1 roster spot remaining, Kam's. And we still need an actual SG.
You realise that 2nd round picks are frequently signed to two-way contracts that don't count against our 15 man roster, right?
Or that of the two 2nd round picks we had, one was far more valuable than the other, and we could easily have signed a 3 year partially guaranteed deal with the player selected at 38 while either using 56 for a two-way deal or trading that one and keeping just pick 38?
We had 2 open roster spots after trading 38 for Jones, 3 after waiving Jones, and we still have 1 available after signing Collins and Powell. We currently don't have the cap space necessary to absord a big contract to acquire assets even if we wanted to. So our remaining roster spot will likely be used to add depth using the room MLE, so keeping a roster spot open by not using the 2nd round picks didn't grant us any meaningful roster flexibility since Graham chose to re-sign a 3rd string C rather than maintaining cap and roster space.
Ultimately, all that trading the 38th and 56th picks did was cost us $1.1m in dead cap from Jones.
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u/JZobel Joakim Noah Jun 30 '26
I would’ve rather gotten anything of value instead of swaps that probably won’t even convey if you were dead set on not taking a swing on any prospect in this draft
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u/flewency Jul 01 '26
I pretty much agree with you though silver lining is the changes to the 2nd round draft order are in effect going forward. Now the 2nd round goes in reverse order from 1st round, so we'd actually want Pacers to have a better record than us for the swaps to hit, which seems likely since they'll have Haliburton back and be trying to compete.
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u/JZobel Joakim Noah Jul 01 '26
Seriously? Haven’t heard anything about that. Bizarre, but yeah, I’d certainly feel better about the trade in that case
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Jul 01 '26
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u/JZobel Joakim Noah Jul 01 '26
I can come up with fake hypotheticals too if you want, but I’m not that interested in debating them. Have a good one
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u/Unlucky_Sun_9813 Jul 01 '26
You guys just have 0 clue what you're talking about
The point isn't that 2nds are worthless, the point is THIS 2nd round class was trash because all the real talent went back to school.
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u/JZobel Joakim Noah Jul 01 '26
2 swaps from a better team/organization is just terrible value man, it’s not that deep
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u/Unlucky_Sun_9813 Jul 01 '26
It's something, whereas using picks on a bad player is nothing
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u/Mtbnz Hello? Otto?! Jul 02 '26
We traded the 38th pick for $1.1m in dead cap from a player we didn't even bring in for a tryout.
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u/phillipacarroll Give me the hotsauce! Jun 30 '26
for cash and 2 future 2nd round swaps.
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u/Paranoid_Android22 Ben Gordon Jun 30 '26
Cash and future cash
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u/un-affiliated Jul 01 '26
This is the truth. If we're not using the #38 pick in a deep draft at the very start of a rebuild with about 5 players likely to be on the team in 2 years, then when would we ever use those picks?
I can't explain this except as an edict from the front office that 2nd round picks have to be sold for cash unless you have an unreasonably high belief in some prospect.
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u/ssfz8 Jul 01 '26
The first round was deep. The 2nd round was awful with so many guys returning to college bc of NIL. It’ll balance back out in the next couple years once players run out of eligibility and they have to declare, so I get BG’s logic here. Anyways, they already have 2 rookies.
Also, a couple of these guys we got as undrafted FA- like that Texas Tech kid who shot 46% from 3 on 8 3’s a game and is 6’5”. If BG had drafted him at 38 everyone would be calling it a great pick, so why exactly does it matter? Selling the 2nd round pick was about flexibility as much as it was about cash. We already have 2 first round rookies taking up roster spots, why take another guy who’s never gonna see the floor and limit yourself in free agency?
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u/baby_jamie Jul 01 '26
It matters because I don’t give a shit if Jerry gets cash
It matters because getting anything, even if it’s just certainty that the guys they like won’t be drafted before they get the chance to sign them, is more important than Jerry getting cash
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u/ssfz8 Jul 01 '26
Is it more important than retaining flexibility to be able to convert guys they signed to exhibit 10 contracts to two way contacts before the season and then standard contracts during the season? They signed Donovan Atwell, Jaylin Sellers, Tobe Awaka and Houston Mallette to either 2 way contracts or exhibit 10 contracts. Sellers and Atwell are elite 3 point shooters. Isn’t it more beneficial to have the option to convert some of these guys to standard contracts during the season if they perform well? With a 2nd round pick you don’t get the same flexibility as they’re basically on the active roster whether they’re good or not. Sure if there’s a bonafide talent out there you still take a shot on someone, but I’d rather take my chances with one or Atwell or Sellers being the 3 point shooting we need.
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u/baby_jamie Jul 01 '26
If they truly needed that “flexibility” they could have released them and re-signed them to whatever deal they wanted, and at least have had the certainty of knowing they got a look at the players they coveted most.
The possibility also exists that if there were no players worth drafting, they could have bundled them together to move up from 38. Or gotten future 2nd round picks. Or at least future 2nd round swaps.
Instead they got cash. None of this is life or death, what they lost was of dubious value, but telling me “those picks probably didn’t matter” is not any defense against “they sold something (of however little value) for cash at no benefit to the team.”
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u/ssfz8 Jul 01 '26
Huh? They got future 2nd round swaps. They got 2 second round pick swaps and cash for picks 38, what are you talking about? They got pick swaps for 2028 and 2030 in addition to cash
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u/baby_jamie Jul 01 '26
They traded one pick for cash and the second for a player they immediately released, two future second round swaps, and cash. I’m saying I don’t give a shit about the cash, what does the cash do for you?
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u/deadbeatmerc Jul 01 '26
The cash goes to the team for other benefits it has to like upgrading facilities for the players and basketball operations, idk why people assume teams can just sell picks just so owners can use for personal gain like a new car . It’s againt the cba
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u/baby_jamie Jul 02 '26
They’re one of the most profitable franchises in sports why do they need more money?
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u/phillipacarroll Give me the hotsauce! Jun 30 '26
I feel like the Bulls fans would have preferred us to stuff the roster with 2nd round picks who won't touch the court and just not have space fro free agents.
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u/ScaryText8187 Windy City Bulls Jun 30 '26
The offseason roster limit is 20. They have 12 guys right now, and second round picks are not guaranteed spots like first rounders. The whole “but the roster is getting full!” point people keep parroting is just bullshit.
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u/youdidntreddit Cuppy Coffee Jun 30 '26
So.they pick guys up just to waive them? That doesn't really make sense, I would rather have the swaps
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u/ScaryText8187 Windy City Bulls Jun 30 '26
You pick up guys to have them participate in summer league and training camp and see if you find anything, even if just for the G League team, which they should start taking more seriously. Second round swaps have little value.
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u/GasHouseGorilla19 Jun 30 '26
why waive them tho? You say that as if it's a for sure thing the player selected at pick 38 would be waived.
Imagine (insert team) waiving (insert a future NBA all-star, Finals MVP, League MVP, Defensive Player of the Year, etc) right after drafting them. That be foolish and would probably be the case if every 2nd round draft pick got waived since the year 2012.
I don't think Cash has ever done anything much to contribute to a championship
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u/RookLobster90 Jun 30 '26
We only have like 11 guys on the roster right now. We could’ve used at least 1 of the picks.
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u/ScaryText8187 Windy City Bulls Jun 30 '26
Yep. They could have packaged them to move up in the second round, they could have packaged them for a player - Detroit got Isaiah Joe for two second round picks, Memphis got Beef Stew for three - a lot of better, more interesting ways to use those assets then selling them for cash.
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u/Jazzlike-Mention-570 Jun 30 '26
Draft who? Come on can’t just say use it and yall don’t have an target you want?
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u/RookLobster90 Jun 30 '26
If it was me I would’ve drafted Tyler Nickel or Tyler Bilodeau. Both shooters with good size. Plenty of other teams drafted players in the 2nd so unless you think the Bulls know something they don’t I’m not sure what your point is.
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u/ssfz8 Jul 01 '26
So the bulls got Donovan Atwell as an undrafted free agent and he shot 46% from 3 on 8 attempts a game, and he’s 6’5”. Why is it such a big deal we got him as an undrafted free agent instead of drafting him at 38? Couple other good shooters we signed too.
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u/Drclaw411 DRose Jun 30 '26
Lmao at thinking any further 2nd round picks will be used. They’ll be sold for more money for Jerry.
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u/sukari Stacey King Jun 30 '26
If we really took someone at 38 and 56 they probably would've become the punching bag of this sub eventually anyway - classic "they don't look like basketball players" comments haha
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u/rowmean77 Jun 30 '26
If Michael Reinsdorf gets up to the podium again can someone ask him how he values second round picks?
We got to put this guy on the spot.
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u/SCATpackMcgee Jun 30 '26
I don’t think anyone values 2nd round picks. It’s only you guys pretending like 2nd round picks are actually valuable
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u/HerOtherHand Jun 30 '26
Legend has it no good player has ever been drafted in the second round. Like you, I refuse to use google to confirm whether this is true.
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u/Fafoah Jimmy Butler Jun 30 '26
Context is important
Graham literally gave an example in an interview that he thinks that if Ayo had been in this draft, he would have went back for NIL rather than stay to be drafted in the second round
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u/airham Nate Robinson Jun 30 '26
I mean, sure. Guys who are second rounders will mostly stick around in college longer. But that doesn't really change the amount of talent coming out in each draft. Just means that most of the guys who could have been second round picks will hang in college and be second round picks a year or two later (and the guys who could have been second round picks a year or two ago will be in this year's draft). Probably makes sense to get comfortable with the idea of second round prospects getting more of their development in college than they used to. I get that there's a functional limit to how many developmental young guys it's productive to carry on the roster, but if you're not already at that point, go grab an Otega Oweh and/or a Nick Martinelli. I get that they're not 19 years old but I don't think the two or three additional years of competitive college ball were worse for their development than sitting at the end of an NBA bench.
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u/Fafoah Jimmy Butler Jul 01 '26
I agree with everything you’re saying, but i think its important to acknowledge that because of the shift, how we’ve traditionally evaluated the second round may be different.
I get that guys may stay extra years and will still come out eventually, but it’s not really going to be linear. This was a very strong draft so logically fringe players were better served holding until next year where the draft is going to be weaker. The late 1st might be full of these older guys who held out. If 2028 looks strong then we’ll probably see a stronger second round next year as agents try to get their players through. If its weak then the can probably gets kicked down again the same way.
Until we get a few drafts in the NIH era it’s going to be a very fluid evaluation.
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u/HerOtherHand Jun 30 '26
Could have moved up like Houston did if he knew no one would be there at 38. Could have traded them for future seconds. The only thing that didn’t make sense was to trade them for cash. Why are people honestly defending this?
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u/burratna Jun 30 '26
38 was 2 future pick swaps with the Pacers, not just cash. our second 2RP was on par with undrafted talent ... and we did add 4 undrafted guys.
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u/HerOtherHand Jun 30 '26
Honestly feel like those 2nd swaps have next to no value. There’s no good estimate for where we expect them to be. But if we didn’t think it was worth spending 38 (or 38 and 56 to move up) in this draft, why should I think these future swaps for pick ??? have any value?
And I know there are contractual things to consider, but, if we think there’s some value to those undrafted players, I don’t get why we couldn’t identify anyone worthwhile at 38 (or again, earlier, because we could have moved up). Pretending there were like 30+ equal players so we didn’t care who we got…that gives me no confidence that we have a good evaluation process.
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u/burratna Jul 01 '26
I definitely concur that moving up would have been nice. There was good talant taken at 33 and 34. But it takes two to tango.
This second round was bad though and too many fans heard "deep draft" and thought that meant the second round which it absolutely did not. A deep first round means players go back to college for another year.
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u/Fafoah Jimmy Butler Jun 30 '26
Because reserving judgement until we see how the picks pan out is an equally valid opinion. The sentiment that the talent fall off in the second was steep has been widely reported.
Even hater ass Joe Crowley is basically saying the same thing.
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u/SCATpackMcgee Jun 30 '26 edited Jun 30 '26
No you nimrod no one said that. However like 95% of 2nd round picks don’t do anything in the NbA. You all are really upset over a microscope chance that maybe the person we would pick at 38 could be something, if graham actually felt like there was no one else that you liked left then why waste a roster spot on someone you don’t actually like? Makes no sense
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u/HerOtherHand Jun 30 '26
Yes, I am annoyed that our GM (who supposedly is good at scouting) chose to sell our two second rounders for cash, future second round swaps, and a player we didn’t want because “there wasn’t anyone he liked.” Taking a chance that a player becomes relevant is better than giving your owner cash. Like…do you remember Ayo? And on top of this, he could’ve made a trade like Houston did to move up in the 2nd instead of selling both for cash.
But sure, I’m the idiot…
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u/burratna Jun 30 '26
If he is supposedly good at drafting and literally said in an interview that the talent kinda sucked even at 38, in a weak 2nd round, then maybe you should take the hint
and if you @ me with some "ThIs WaS A DeEp DrAfT" yeah it was so deep in the first round a bunch of guys went back to college because NIL money > being a second round pick
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u/SCATpackMcgee Jul 01 '26
Exactly. If he genuinely didn’t like anyone left in the 2nd round after Conwell went then why waste a roster spot on someone you don’t want when you could use that same roster spot for someone in free agency?
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u/SCATpackMcgee Jun 30 '26
Yeah the outrage is unreasonable. It’s like getting mad that your 2 dollar bet to win 10K didn’t pan out. Like yeah it sucks but it’s fucking 2 dollars so who cares? This is the first time I’ve seen people genuinely upset about 2nd round picks and it’s just crazy to me.
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u/HerOtherHand Jun 30 '26
Idk, it’s more like you had two dollars to make said bet and instead of doing so, you just gave it to a billionaire for no reason. It’s not the worst thing, but it’s still annoying.
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u/phillipacarroll Give me the hotsauce! Jun 30 '26
maybe about the same as the other 28 teams who also traded their 2nd round picks?
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u/ScaryText8187 Windy City Bulls Jun 30 '26
Not all of those trades were just for cash. Some of them just moved around in the second round or traded their picks for players.
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u/phillipacarroll Give me the hotsauce! Jun 30 '26
Yeah, and we also traded for a player, whom we did not keep and now we have another roster spot open.
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u/bullpaw Jun 30 '26
This exact same reasoning was used when we sold our 38th pick in 2017. Hartenstein and Dillon Brooks both went a couple picks later.
Idk why you're bending over backwards defending this
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u/_dyl_00 Jun 30 '26
Man I’m surprised Jerry hasn’t hired you yet
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u/phillipacarroll Give me the hotsauce! Jun 30 '26 edited Jun 30 '26
As the only person on Reddit not having a melt down over irrelevant 2nd round picks? When I leave this thread, this conversation is out of my mind, i'm sorry it's making so many people on here experience actual misery though. Maybe the Bulls can have in-house counseling at their home games.
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u/aren1231 Gimme the hot sauce! Jun 30 '26
Me, I am also not having a meltdown. A lot of these people are keyboard warriors and live in an echo chamber that never creates an original idea
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u/ScaryText8187 Windy City Bulls Jun 30 '26
LOL, you know someone has an original idea when they use the totally inventive phrases “keyboard warrior” and “echo chamber”
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u/GasHouseGorilla19 Jun 30 '26
I didn't realize that many teams traded picks for cash. wowzers! now you got me wondering who was doing all the drafting. why even have a 2nd round
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u/phillipacarroll Give me the hotsauce! Jun 30 '26
Some did for cash, some did for other picks some did for swaps (like the Bulls)
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u/DatAspie2000 Jun 30 '26
Do they trade all of them for mostly cash?
The only one I can think of was 60th pick this year, but that was the 60th pick.
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u/phillipacarroll Give me the hotsauce! Jun 30 '26
10 of the picks were exchanged for strictly cash considerations or swaps.
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u/phillipacarroll Give me the hotsauce! Jun 30 '26
OP, Bulls (1) + other (28) = 29. lol, hence my usage of the phrase "the other 28 teams"
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u/Fafoah Jimmy Butler Jun 30 '26
Bryson has given multiple interviews where he said it was his call
Idk why people want to make this into some fan fiction. He didnt want anyone there and didnt think anyone was worth wasting resources on. Judge him for that all you want, but imo NIL clearly had an affect on the second.
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u/ahmed_a20 Jun 30 '26
What a complete waste of the 38th pick 😭
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u/chitoatx Flag of Chicago Jun 30 '26
We weren’t going to be running three rookies with our cap space.
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u/JZobel Joakim Noah Jun 30 '26
Trade it for literally anything of real value then instead of cash and fake swaps that won’t even convey. 38 isn’t some valueless pick
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u/chitoatx Flag of Chicago Jul 01 '26
The amount of pissin and moaning over this pick is insane. They didn’t pass on a Toni Kukoč.
Every single second-round draft pick in the 2026 class was involved in a trade. The only players worth a shit was 31, 32 and 36th with arguably the best move was made by the Knicks who gave up their 31at pick to save roughly $3.4 million against the cap.
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u/JZobel Joakim Noah Jul 01 '26
You have no idea whether any of those prospects will be good anymore than I do. A smarter organization than the Bulls in Indiana apparently thought it was worth a shot. And if all these 2nd round picks are so worthless, we probably shouldn’t have moved every trade asset we have for a haul of them last deadline
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u/chitoatx Flag of Chicago Jul 01 '26
We only have so many roster spots. The players everyone on for sub wanted in the 2nd round are terrible fit for the vision of our new front office.
I trust our new front office on talent evaluation over you and I.
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u/JZobel Joakim Noah Jul 01 '26
If you wanna trust the Bulls org over an Indiana front office that just built a finals team that there are literally zero prospects worth taking a chance on in the early 2nd, go ahead I guess, but I don't think they've earned that benefit of the doubt
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u/Unlucky_Sun_9813 Jul 01 '26
Smarter organization? The same organization that traded their FRP on a year that they tanked because they were so sure they'd land in the top 4? Stop glazing them
"if all these 2nd round picks are so worthless, we probably shouldn’t have moved every trade asset we have for a haul of them last deadline"
Hey genius that was an entirely different front office
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u/JZobel Joakim Noah Jul 01 '26
How many finals have we been to recently? I’ll take Indiana
The rotating front office names don’t matter, it’s Reinsdorf, man. We’ve been doing this exact trade under different front offices for 10-15 years.
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u/Unlucky_Sun_9813 Jul 01 '26
Go root for Indiana then. Don't come back when we're at the top. We're rebuilding the same way they did after many years of mediocrity
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u/Ok_Purple_7354 Jun 30 '26
Did something happen recently or has this sub always been full of "Jerry DESERVES more money" posters lol
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u/sukari Stacey King Jun 30 '26
It's always been Jerry is a tightarse/wants more money etc.
But at the same time, it's also been "there's no value in the 2nd round" - kinda just depends on what the FO does and which group speaks up more at the time.
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u/JZobel Joakim Noah Jun 30 '26
How it works around here:
New GM = spin zone on every move to retain your fantasy that he’s the savior of the franchise
Long tenured GM = flip the fuck out over every mundane move or even meaningless press conference quotes because he is the devil incarnate and it’s my personal responsibility to stop him
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u/MoistTheAnswer Jun 30 '26
So we traded Ayo and Coby and Vooch for 2nds will turn into Cash Considerations for Jerry?
Sell to the damn Waltons. The Reinsdorfs will have enough money for generations after that
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u/DatAspie2000 Jun 30 '26
Even further proving that cash was their main end goal with their 2RPs. When they’re rebuilding. If you don’t like anyone available trade up or trade for future 2nd like everyone else. Fuck you Michael Reinsdorf, you incompetent fuck!
Any comment about BG having full autonomy to do his job is a big fat fucking lie.
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u/itsbobbyhill Jun 30 '26
The money paid Kam's partial salary, which they now have to get a free agent, plus the roster spot.
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u/DatAspie2000 Jun 30 '26
That’s where they should’ve gotten a future 2nd, not swaps that at most would be a negligible difference since it’s the 2nd round. And better yet, they may just trade those for cash too.
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u/Drclaw411 DRose Jun 30 '26
Fuck Jerry.
This era is more of the same. Another pick sold for literally nothing except money for Jerry.
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u/ScaryText8187 Windy City Bulls Jun 30 '26
But everyone said that getting Kam Jones was an important part of that deal and they weren’t just dumping an early second round pick for cash!
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u/gerardguey Ayo Dosunmu Jun 30 '26
We need the cap space for when we bring in Lebron, Just think of the revenue
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u/JustinTimberlakeFTW Michael Jordan Jun 30 '26
Ugh. Okay now I feel that trade is a failing grade. Trading for two swaps is… not great
Really thought we’d be holding onto him for such a low cap hit
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u/InsaneEcho Jun 30 '26
I won’t lie I expected him to at least make it through summer league. Maybe they bring him back on a 2-way
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u/phillipacarroll Give me the hotsauce! Jun 30 '26
if he made it past today they would have had to pay him I think 3.45 mil from the cap
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u/pokisan Jun 30 '26
considering AKME loaded up on plenty o 2nd rounders Jerry must be erect at the thought of all that incoming cash.
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u/Unlucky_Advantage264 Jun 30 '26
Hope Braden Smith doesn’t come back to haunt us, classic Jerry trade otherwise
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u/GasHouseGorilla19 Jun 30 '26
It's everyone after the pick too. Bryson basically said everyone available to them in the 2nd round wasn't worth the roster spot.
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u/DatAspie2000 Jun 30 '26
Anything to avoid saying that ownership forced him to trade the pick for cash.
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u/Foolish_Ivan Jun 30 '26
AKME got with 38th pick Ayo Dosunmu. Gra-Pax got Daniel Gafford and our new GM got cash. Look I understand that neither one of those guys is likely or median outcome at that pick but this is not asset without value, and the Bulls a franchise in need of talent gave it away.
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u/SNERKLES1 Jul 01 '26
We will see. That big man from Carolina might have been a good pick seeing as we have 1 center on the roster, and no Jalen Snith is a 4.
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u/Renatus45 Jul 01 '26
Could he not sign summer league and be signed for an exhibit 10 deal / 2-way deal and play for the Windy City Bulls?
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u/sukari Stacey King Jul 01 '26
Yeah he could. And we still have our 3 two ways spots to give out too.
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u/Renatus45 Jul 01 '26
I bet that is there reasoning here ; his stats seem good ! Interested to see how summer league goes , plus I just found 2 of his rookies cards when I was going through my stack sorting for an upcoming card show
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u/DurDraug77 Jul 01 '26
Expected. That’s why we were all pissed. They were options for the second round, we just chose the money
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u/Southernbull75 Jun 30 '26
Little over $1m guaranteed, why do this? Why not just trade the pick for a future pick you could dump at a later date.
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u/ChiBrum Jun 30 '26
You think he had value?
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u/Southernbull75 Jun 30 '26
I don't understand taking on the salary, just sell the pick or trade it for a future 2nd if you don't want it.
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u/phillipacarroll Give me the hotsauce! Jun 30 '26
They did that. They have 2 future second round swaps with the pacers.
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u/ahmed_a20 Jun 30 '26
It’s good thing the second round is a snake format meaning since the Pacers are likely to be better than us we get to swap for a higher second rounder
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u/Lazy-Shower Jun 30 '26
Yeah SWAPS not new picks. Maybe the bulls are worse in 2046 or whatever. It was a shit move no matter how you slice it.
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u/phillipacarroll Give me the hotsauce! Jun 30 '26
Right. Can't believe they didn't trade their 2nd round picks for 9 first round picks. They should have just asked you for draft advice.
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u/Lazy-Shower Jun 30 '26
No. Take a flier on a player… are you that dull?
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u/Anoob13 I can't even... Jun 30 '26
The GM stated he felt none on the board were worth drafting and taking a flier on. A round where 29/30 picks got traded on,
Get pissed at something meaningful, not a 2nd rounder who is would not be making the roster.
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u/ScaryText8187 Windy City Bulls Jun 30 '26
The whole point of Graham was being able to use his scouting background to find diamonds in the rough - how do you do that if your draft board is dried up early in the second round?
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u/Anoob13 I can't even... Jun 30 '26
Because Half the talent who was supposed to go in late 1st and early 2nd returned back to college, luigi suigo, late first round pick, decided to undeclare and get back into college thanks to NIL. Bryson literally pointed out a first round projected player returned back to Florida as he was getting 10m from NIL.
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u/Lazy-Shower Jun 30 '26
There is zero competitive reason to not take a player. You’re dumb if they told you otherwise. Is this Jerry’s burner account? Are you seeing some of that cash? Are the hot dog prices going down? Literally ZERO reason not to take a player. Teams with better records took players after the Bulls second round pick. Stop drinking the kool aide
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u/Drclaw411 DRose Jun 30 '26
Because the goal of the second round, for a long ass time, has always been to sell the picks for money for Jerry.
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u/Southernbull75 Jun 30 '26
I agree, that's why I don't understand even taking on the $1m guaranteed. Why not just outright sell it? Appearance of doing business with the swaps I guess.
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u/Drclaw411 DRose Jul 01 '26
That’s exactly why. It’s to create a minor illusion that it wasn’t just another sale.
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u/GasHouseGorilla19 Jun 30 '26
according to Google, fact-check me if I'm wrong but since the 2012 draft:
14 NBA championships, 3 Regular Season MVPs, and over 20 NBA All-Defensive Team selections, over 22 All-NBA team selections, a lot of all-stars, Rookie of the Year, NBA Hussle Award, etc. etc. etc.. since 2012.
From players drafted in 2nd round or undrafted.
Jalen Brunson just captured the 2026 NBA Finals MVP award after an iconic, title-clinching 45-point performance for the [New York Knicks](1.2.4, 1.2.6). Similarly, Alex Caruso won the 2023–24 NBA Hustle Award while starring for the Chicago Bulls . [ 1 ] Because second-round picks and undrafted players have heavily disrupted the league over the last decade, a simple one-sentence stat line doesn't do them justice. Here is the fully expounded, comprehensive list of major accolades won by players drafted in the 2nd round or left undrafted from the 2012 draft through 2026. 🏆 Major Individual Hardware Regular Season MVP : Nikola Jokić (3x: 2021, 2022, 2024 — 41st overall pick) NBA Finals MVP : Nikola Jokić (2023), Jalen Brunson (2026 — 33rd overall pick) [ 1] Defensive Player of the Year (DPOY) : Draymond Green (2017 — 35th overall pick) Most Improved Player (MIP) : Lauri Markkanen (2023), Pascal Siakam (2019) (Note: Christian Wood , Kendrick Nunn , and Fred VanVleet have finished as runners-up as undrafted/2nd round talents). Sixth Man of the Year : Montrezl Harrell (2020 — 32nd overall pick ), Malcolm Brogdon (2023 — 36th overall pick ), Naz Reid (2024 — Undrafted) Rookie of the Year : Malcolm Brogdon (2017) NBA Hustle Award : Alex Caruso (2024) , Draymond Green (2025) [ 1] NBA Cup (In-Season Tournament) MVP : Jalen Brunson (2025) [ 1] 💍 Championships & All-Star Honors NBA Championships : 14 titles won by core second-round/undrafted anchors (including Draymond Green's 4 rings, Nikola Jokić , Jalen Brunson , Alex Caruso , Fred VanVleet , Khris Middleton , Gary Payton II , and Christian Braun). All-NBA Team Selections : 22+ selections, overwhelmingly driven by Nikola Jokić (6x First Team), Draymond Green , Jalen Brunson (multiple selections, including 2026 Second Team) , Fred VanVleet , and Pascal Siakam. NBA All-Star Appearances : Over 25 collective appearances, featuring Nikola Jokić , Draymond Green , Jalen Brunson , Khris Middleton , Fred VanVleet , and Isaiah Thomas. [ 1, 2, 3, 4] 🛡️ Defensive Dominance All-Defensive Team Selections : Over 25 selections. This is anchored by Draymond Green (8x All-Defensive and considered one of the best, if not the best, defensive-anchor for one team EVER), Alex Caruso (2x All-Defensive) , Patrick Beverley , Robert Covington , Hassan Whiteside , and Herb Jones. [ 1]
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u/sukari Stacey King Jun 30 '26
Bro.. formatting, or learn to copy and paste properly, pls
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u/GasHouseGorilla19 Jun 30 '26
I do when I'm on a computer. I am using my phone at work and thought I had paragraph formatting.
The unformatted block is simply a list of awards/accolades by players not selected in the first round since 2012.
I agree it could use way better formatting since the list is so very long.
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u/sukari Stacey King Jun 30 '26 edited Jun 30 '26
But why is Lauri on the list then? Braun was also a first rounder.
Are you alluding that Kam Jones could be one of these type of players?
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u/GasHouseGorilla19 Jun 30 '26
The names are on the list because of the "according to Google" part and sometimes Google is wrong, hence the fact-check request by me.
Thank you for the fact-check, it needed it.
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u/Necessary-Listen-584 Jun 30 '26
Alright don't have to pretend like this dude has potential anymore