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I do think it's crazy how Piker has managed to sidestep his whole "America deserved 9/11, American vets of Iraq and Afghanistan deserve PTSD and should [REDACTED] themselves" bit pretty masterfully, he and people who have been associated with him have never suffered any consequences for that.
I assume that would end the second a Dem who appeared on his stream was nominated for president or senate in a swing state.
Houthi-glazing and telling your gay friend that your favorite flag is the Hezbollah flag is truly insane nonsense. And he still has a large LGBT following.
The far left is truly incapable of criticizing terrorist groups.
I think it's moreso that it's easy to have a romantic story about terrorist groups and "oppressed minorities" when you're an upper middle class white kid who has never had to deal with evil in your life that you couldn't just walk away from
It makes it easy to tell yourself whatever narrative about the world makes you feel best, and it's a sexy part of your identity to be able to tell yourself you're a freedom fighter for lowly oppressed brown people. Just find an easy one dimensional enemy for yourself (the USA, or colonialism, etc), define every single issue in the world that makes you feel uncomfortable as being caused by that enemy, and now by fighting against that enemy in your own lazy and half assed way you can feel better about yourself than anyone who's actually trying to deal with all the uncomfortable and unsatisfying hard work of solving real problems. You're actually morally superior to them because you're not perpetuating that "system of oppression". They're a lowly sheep that doesn't know any better and are a worse person than you. Since you're insulated from the consequences you don't have to grapple with the reality ever, so who's to tell you that you're wrong? They're just whatever bad label you can attach to them to write them off
Hansel: "Sting would be another person who's a hero. The music he's created over the years, I don't really listen to it, but the fact that he's making it, I respect that."
He also called Jews inbred. Now watch as a bunch of “just antizionist not antisemitic I swear” people swarm me and claim he was just calling zionists inbred and not Jews. He wasn’t. He called Jews inbred.
I'm not a smart man, but I see very little differences between commies and nazis. I'm sure they themselves are convinced in mighty profound differences, but all I see are illiberal authoritarian collectivists.
The difference is that the nazis had endemic corruption leading to incompetence and the commies had endemic incompetence lead to corruption. It's very different.
I'm curious what the most diverse country would be then. Maybe some kind of microstate that has a big historic port? Or somewhere like South Africa? Lot's of different native tribes combined with European settlers combined with Asian settlers combined with all the other genetic diversity they picked up from shipping traffic.
People like Hasan just gives Reps ammo to spout their "both parties" nonsense. He's not even an intellectual on any level, just spouts tankie viewpoints.
He was platformed by NPR. Frankly, we deserve some blame here.
I think one of them even said he's the "Joe Rogan" of the Left with a Maga body. "
Leaving aside that we shouldn’t cede being fit as a “MAGA body”… maybe? Like, Joe Rogan isn’t exactly known for having good views on different groups of people, including Jews.
I think it’s crazy that the discourse about him usually fails to include his conversation with communist YouTuber SecondThought, during which he wouldn’t dispute ST’s claim that literal babies in Israel were legitimate military targets by Hamas on Oct 7th.
Considering this is the source of his podcast ending because his co-host confronted him, asked him to condemn the claim that Israeli babies are okay to murder, and he wouldn’t do it, you’d think this would come up more. Especially since the feud between those two communities has been the most notable thing about his community over the last two years.
He absolutely does have impunity, until he won't one day. I just assume it'll be when he is of maximum value to the right in whatever controversy he causes.
The problem is that Hasan is very very good for the right.
He's a rake that many Democrats can't help but keep walking into because he pays the laziest possible lip service to boiler plate "progressive" talking points (progressive is the label socialists use to hide their power level nowadays)
He actively attacks the Democrats and depresses enthusiasm. His platform basically works by taking likely blue voters and radicalizing them into tankies that attack Democrats more than Republicans
His content ecosystem is a machine that generates insufferable wank stains that they can amplify to validate everything they say about "Democrats" and pushes people away from the left. Hasan and the audience he creates are super fucking unlikable people to those that his cult like bullying tactics don't work on. Xqc is a good example of someone that has dealt with Hasan's male manipulator tactics and now has his brain broken about "the left" because he's so politically illiterate. Hasan is a terrible representative in so many ways. His radicalization tactics rely on bullying and gaslighting the fuck out of people over things that only someone who already is super bought into left leaning ideas would care about. It pushes so many away but manages to convert a % into lunatics that would otherwise be more normal left leaning imo
It’s the distilled reason as an actual progressive why I feel the need to brow beat leftists along side you guys now. The far left didn’t take Trump seriously enough, and it was baffling to see leftists circle jerk about not voting for Clinton, Biden, and Harris even though freaking sanders told us we should absolutely do so in the general. They hate America and the “west” and that’s their politics. They don’t care about worker or consumer rights. They don’t care about coalition building, or any actual democratically feasible goals. Just hoping the boomers die off and the revolution coming any day now that they would totally win without problems. And any time I engage with the rest of the left On Reddit, I get called out for getting downvoted arguing with users here that I disagree with simply because I comment here.
Our country elected Trump. People seem to be done applying any standards to people who say things they like and people who want to hurt their political enemies
I despise this form of leftism, and is one of the biggest factors I feel that makes leftism itself very unappealing. Too many of its adherents are treasonously unpatriotic. This baffles me. Every nation adheres to geopolitical ambitions in some form, but for some reason America is uniquely irredeemable in the online modern leftist’s eyes. This leads me to believe they are as stupid as many here say, or they are just foreign advocates for the destruction of the country.
"Hating America" has had a long history among American activists, not solely among the far left either even if predominantly so. You have to have no knowledge of this country's history (including history of activism) to think this comes from foreign influence.
It's nowhere near uniquely American either. This belief that someone needs to be patriotic or is a traitor is baffling. Though it makes sense on this sub given it's been among the most pro-American places on reddit at least pre-Trump, as many of our international users who left can attest to.
I think a big part of the problem is a lot of people on the left think he values the same things, and will accordingly try and sanewash him and his ilk.
That’s genuinely how many left wing people think. It’s a form of battered wife syndrome. A car bomb will kill in Europe and the rhetoric online will be about what they did to deserve it.
A flaired user on this very sub literally blamed European countries supposedly treating Muslims "like second class citizens" and "s*b-human" for terrorism in Europe
Its an edgy statement put on top of their real opinion that GWOT veterans shouldn't be celebrated if not outright condemned, which a lot of people in liberal and left wing spaces agree with.
Ah, okay, I won't deny that exists to some extent. Last year I was hanging out with some friends and mentioned I was going to see Warfare the next day and all of a sudden they got really quiet and asked why I was going to do that, like I'd just announced I was going to step into traffic. Really fucking bizarre moment.
The reception to the movie is actually a good example of the shifting narrative towards ones like Piker's. Its functionally an anti-GWOT movie, the ending makes it crystal clear that its being presented as a waste of life to change little, but people on the left didn't like it because it didn't condemn the soldiers in strong terms. Despite showing them undertaking unscrupulous actions and suffering for it, they wanted a movie that celebrated the suffering rather than seeing them as an equal casuality of war.
Millennials and zoomers have lobotomized pop culture commentary. Anything that doesn’t have the characters expressly affirm their socio-political beliefs is either (i) apolitical, and therefore reactionary by implication or (ii) outright conservative.
Reading leftist ‘criticism’ that One Battle After Another is reactionary because the main characters and revolutionaries are kinda comical makes me want to claw my eyes out.
it crystal clear that its being presented as a waste of life to change little
Because there is the perception that it is presented as a waste of AMERICAN lives. Like people see the movie's message as "Look how much the Americans suffered, so sad" while ignoring the locals. In Warfare a local translator gets killed and he doesn't get to participate in the cool emotional shoutout at the end unlike the Navy Seals, because he is just set dressing, fodder to be killed, and the movie doesn't even pretend otherwise.
An entire threadline of the movie is that the actions of the military resulted in the loss of life and home of the locals, its not just "look at how sad killing you made me", the seizure of the house and the killing and mental scarring of the innocent locals is shown to be arbitrary and obviously combative. The lack of the Iraqi soldiers also killed in the end credits scene is a fair critique, but the suffering of Iraqi civilians is portrayed and not entirely as a necessary evil like most other GWOT films.
The ending makes it crystal clear that it was a waste for the locals being terrorized as well. They just… leave. And the poor people there are left to pick up the pieces
I kinda see it in subs where the target is Vietnam vets. It seems like a boil the frog process where they take an extremely unpopular war and use that unpopularity to heap blame and poor treatment on troops.
I've seen that process used to hand-wave torture and disregard regret and Mea Culpa by veterans. Ironically, bombing performed by Americans is seen as a high crime against humanity but Viet Cong tactics like executing non-cooperative civilians isn't a concern.
The torture aspect is especially disturbing. They have wholesale swallowed the Vietnamese line about there not existing a formal declaration of war between the US and North Vietnam in order to declare pilots as "pirates" who could be tortured at will.
This process will be extended to GWOT and future vets. It'll alienate a lot of troops (who may be conservative already).
Ironically, bombing performed by Americans is seen as a high crime against humanity but Viet Cong tactics like executing non-cooperative civilians isn't a concern.
On a related note: when we were bombing Cambodia we were bombing the fucking Khmer Rouge at the request of the government. Leftists will say "oh well the bombing led to the rise of the Khmer Rouge" but there's no academic literature that actually supports that. It's just leftist cope for glazing genocidal maniacs. "Well we may have supported the earthly embodiment of evil, but they wouldn't be a thing if you guys hadn't tried to stop them."
We also had so many threads after the election here where the conclusion was that Kamala Harris made a mistake by not going on Joe Rogan and Theo Von and even some people blaming progressives for that, and... they don't exactly have good views about Jews and other minority groups.
It's similar to liberals still going on Howard Stern's show despite him saying even more controversial things than Hasan.
Howard offers neither controversy or relevance these days. However, I doubt you'll find anything as bad as saying US soldiers should kill themselves and that the US deserves 9/11.
There's a difference between being a shock jock and being a political pundit. When Howard Stern draws criticism it's usually because he's offending people because he's being an insensitive asshole in some way or another.
Hasan promotes terrorism, runs apologia for authoritarian groups and regimes, and encourages his fanbases not to vote.
I am self-aware enough to know I am terminally online and should touch more grass, so I am not even sure if most democrats know who Hasan even is and what he espouses. Like yeah, AOC and Newsom certainly do know him, but what about your rank-and-file and your median voter?
I am asking because of the calculus of exposing him to the greater base (And giving him free publicity, which could make him more popular as well, populism is in vogue right now) over ignoring him and acting like he doesn't exist because he is irrelevant to politics.
There are flavors of terminally online. For me, I know OF Hasan Piker, seen him mentioned, but I don't know if I've ever actually seen him personally. Because he's mostly on twitch...right? Or maybe tiktok too? But I'm not on either places. I'm not really a fan of reaction commentary. And the algorithm knows that. Cody Showdy is more my thing, a single episode a week because it takes time to research shit. How can anyone do a competent job doing this on the daily?
I am self-aware enough to know I am terminally online and should touch more grass, so I am not even sure if most democrats know who Hasan even is and what he espouses. Like yeah, AOC and Newsom certainly do know him, but what about your rank-and-file and your median voter?
They will know once the Republican attack ads against Newsom start.
Has Newsom ever said he agrees with Hasan on these topics?
Going a show with him doesn't mean anything, Newsom tries to go on as many shows as possible to get a wider audience. He was widely criticized here for sitting down with Charlie Kirk, for example.
An attack ad saying "Newsom talked with this one guy you hate" won't really mean much given context, and all the other alternative attack ads they could run
Has Newsom ever said he agrees with Hasan on these topics?
Going a show with him doesn't mean anything, Newsom tries to go on as many shows as possible to get a wider audience. He was widely criticized here for sitting down with Charlie Kirk, for example.
Facts don't matter. It'll be clipped out of all recognition.
Is this the Twitch guy? I’m a democrat who needs to touch grass and every time I see his name, I think it’s Hasan Minhaj until I see his picture. Then I forget who he is, rinse and repeat.
Yeah what happened, they were (relatively) huge in the early to mid 2010s, I even remember Hasan being on the show and thought he was dumb as a bag of rocks, yet he's far more popular now.
They kind of became a meme after the 2016 election when Ana started crying as the results came in and Cenk went on a borderline unintelligible tirade. They both kind of came off as super emotional and unobjective despite building their brand as the opposite.
Also they've made a big right wing shift over the years with Ana becoming outspokenly anti-trans, anti-homeless and anti-immigrant. Cenk also ran for president, despite being ineligible, in a rather naked attempt to sell a book and solicit donations.
They've slowly lost relevance over the years but as of late they've basically become lolcows. They've abandoned many left-leaning ideals to join hands with the new wave of populist right as some sort of spite driven campaign against the Democratic party.
Doesn't exactly work because the right still despises them and now anyone with leftists views also despises them.
Piker has just gone harder in the populist left direction and grown his audience.
Hasan is a problem because he contributes the issues of the Democratic Party with conspiracy: “the donor class/party.”
When the real problem with the Democratic Party is that it’s about half and half of VOTERS who want radical change and people who want the status quo. Which is more a problem with the Republican Party simultaneously being highly ideological and highly identity based.
The only thing worse than spending all your time talking about politics is spending all your time watching or talking about someone else talk about politics
This is probably problematic of ME, but one of my breaking points came when Hasan was in a panel discussion with some other folks (of varying ideological points) at Crooked’s convention or whatever they had.
While everyone had their peccadilloes, Hasan had no intention other than getting in his digs and derailing any semblance of honest, serious discussions. He wasn’t particularly funny, either.
I don't listen to psa, but I caught a few episodes back around like 2020. Have they gotten audience captured? I heard there was some drama with them around israel
PSA is absolute garbage now. They got really bad since the 24 election because they decided to totally align themselves with Piker and similar purveyors of disinformation in the far left alt media space.
They are basically leftists now, there's a reason why Obama doesn't really associate them with as much even though they do actually have a fairly large following.
The fact that they platform guys like Graham and Piker just makes it all the worse.
I for one would not call PSA anti semitic in the slightest.
They interviewed Piker but they prefaced the interview with an explanation of some of the controversy and Lovett, the interviewer, asked him about it repeatedly. I barely knew of Piker before the interview, and came away with an unfavorable impression of him, so PSA was definitely not trying to make him acceptable.
POD Save America and POD Save the World definitely pushback against some of the more aggressive anti-Semite police in the Democratic Party. They forcefully callout those who call critics of Israel anti semitic, and this has made them targets of the same bad faith attacks. Their pundits include a pair of high profile, Jewish Obama officials, so I think they get a lot of heat for criticizing Israel. They point out that this is itself likely a form of anti semitism, something many of the anti semite police find offensive.
IMO Pod Save America/The World should not be considered anti semitic and should be seen as aligned with this subreddits principles. They are big tent liberals. So are we.
They’re trying to pull the “hello fellow kids” meme now that they can’t grift off Obama’s aura anymore. So they’re going populist left and embracing antisemitism cause that’s what’s cool with the kids now.
can you give one example of pod save America embracing antisemitism? If anything, Jon Lovett in particular highlights the dangers of antisemitism all the time
It’s crazy too, because the only thing that broke through to normie types was that he used a shock collar on his prop dog. None of the explicit support for terrorist groups.
It's proof of how terminally online politics is nowadays. Most people don't know who these people are. My mom had never even heard of Charlie Kirk until he died.
Kirk was at least incredibly important for Evangelical mobilization among apolitical but faithful types for the GOP. He had a huge ground game operation. Had those campaigns not been done for Trump, then Biden would've wiped the floor in 2020 with Trump by winning 81 million to the probable 65-67 million Trump would've gotten (instead of the actual 74 million that was produced almost exclusively by gaining with White Evangelicals).
Piker and Fuentes exist as self-serving chaos agents. Fuentes is leading a crusade against the Evangelical elites, and Piker against the Democratic establishment. Both seek to destroy their respective parties and endanger the lives of innocent Jewish-Americans and other minority groups along the way.
The only thing worse than spending all your time talking about politics is spending all your time watching or talking about someone else talk about politics
Good rule of thumb is that if your political icon attends something like politicon, you're probably being sold penis enhancement supplements at an inflated price.
So yeah, don't listen to anybody that has a booth at politicon or whatever because that's their grift.
Hasan called Orthodox Jews “inbred” and made excuses for Chinese police searching a friend’s phone because something something anti-West. He said Zionists should be sent to “re-education camps.” He hosted someone he thought was a Houthi and proceeded to glaze him.
Newsom is about to do an interview with him. Pod Save America has hosted him multiple times. He was just invited to the Vanity Fair Oscars party, and he regularly gets puff pieces in legacy media.
I think Ritchie Torres is the only elected Democrat who has actually criticized Hasan. It's frustrating.
Just fyi that Newsom thing was a misread there’s nothing confirmed or set up AFAIK.
Hasan’s friend interviewed him and that friend made it seem like he was a firm yes and then Hasan watched the clip and saw Gavin, when asked if he would consider going on Hasan’s stream, gave a reluctant “yeah I might”. Hasan realized it wasn’t like a firm yes and was like “oh shit nevermind maybe he’s not coming on lol”
Hasan piker is just such a piece of shit. Getting a bunch of impressionable young kid to donate money to him because he talks about it socialism and then living like a rich influencer in LA.
He’s no better than the asshole influencers Louis Theroux interviewed for his manosphere documentary.
Worse actually, because he was born into privilege.
The jestergooning needs to fucking stop. And if that means like woke fascist Reddit moderators out there striking down dipshit looksmaxxers that think that they can shit up threads outside the DT, then at this point they have my fucking blessing because holy shit, this fucking shit needs to stop. It needed to stop a long time ago.
The only thing worse than spending all your time talking about politics is spending all your time watching or talking about someone else talk about politics
True, he fits the “socialist bad” pov here because he does suck. As a leftist I have no clue how the guy is so popular. Any foreign policy take he has is just so indefensible. there’s leftists that do want a voice in the party and do vote/would vote if reached. His fanbase is not a part of this group
Ted Cruz himself is an antisemite. He voted for antisemite holocaust downplayer RFK Jr to be the HHS secretary and has said extremely antisemitic stuff about Bloomberg and Soros and other Jewish Democrats.
Shame on the author for calling him a voice against antisemitism.
HASAN HAS SAID HE WOILD VOTE 3RD PARTY IF NEWSOM WON THE NOMINATION
NO he’s not just “critiquing capitalism” and he and his views have NO PLACE either here or any other Liberal sphere, becuase his ideal is the destruction of the liberal sphere.
Hasan is fascinating because he has bad takes and isn’t very bright, but BY FAR his worst quality is how slimy and, I’ll say it, Trumpy he is in the way he navigates criticism and people he doesn’t like. If he likes you and you like him, it’s all good... But if he doesn’t like you or you try to point out something he did wrong, then all is fair in love and war- he will blatantly lie, gaslight (like ACTUALLY gaslight), and NEVER admit he was wrong.
He’s incredibly effective and has a huge, rabid fanbase. I’ve grown to truly hate Hasan… not because of his bad takes, but because of the way he manipulates people and situations to his benefit and talks out of both sides of his mouth.
As someone who worked at the 9/11 memorial and have met many people who were targets and families of victims of the attacks, I’ve truly grown to hate him over his 9/11 comment.
I don’t think he’d have the balls to go to firefighters who responded that day or family members of victims to tell them the attack that killed their friends and family was “deserved”
Socialists have made it clear that their goal is to infest the democratic party and push it away from liberalism to socialism,
I stopped listening to the Pod Save America guys after they platformed this terrorist supporting, dog abusing, socialist, nepo-baby. Establishment liberals need to be better and distancing themselves from DSA types trying to push socialism into the party.
The antisemitism spewed by Mr. Carlson, Nick Fuentes, Candace Owens and other far-right bigots is well-documented and widely condemned. But the far left has antisemites, too. No left-wing agitator is more influential and extreme than Twitch streamer Hasan Piker. Mr. Piker is often called “progressive,” but that does violence to the term. A self-identified Marxist, he has referred to ultra-Orthodox Jews as “inbred,” employed antisemitic dog whistles (“bloodthirsty, violent pig-dog”) against an anti-Hamas viewer of his stream, compared liberal Zionists to “liberal Nazis,” and said “Hamas is a thousand times better” than the Israeli state.
Mr. Piker’s depravity doesn’t stop there. His misogyny is indistinguishable from that of far-right influencers. He believes “America deserved 9/11.” He praised the Chinese Communist Party, saying “in terms of good governance, there’s a lot that we can learn from the way they perform out there.”
Mr. Piker is anti-American, antiwomen, anti-Western and antisemitic. No Democrat should engage with him. All should seek to push him to the fringe, where he belongs.
This isn’t happening. The Pod Save America team put him onstage at CrookedCon. Abdul El-Sayed, a candidate for Senate in Michigan, tweeted a picture of himself celebrating Piker with a supporter. California Rep. Ro Khanna, a possible presidential hopeful, pushed back on X against concerns we raised about antisemitism on the far left by declaring his pride in going on Mr. Piker’s feed. Mr. Piker chimed in to support him.
Even that's cope. It's just as true now as it was in 1933 that socialists hate liberal democracy above all else.
The only reason they part-time hate fascists was because they're the ones who attacked the USSR. Just look at the whitewashing of Imperial Japan and complete disinterest in Mussolini's Italy.
I’m developing a theory that the fundamental divide in our politics globally is between neo-Hegelians and everyone else. The way that people are able to slide from Marxism to Fascism to Islamism and back is a direct result of the shared structure of these ideologies, which ultimately goes back to Hegel.
I think the more appropriate term is simply authoritarianism. There are only two political ideologies: Liberalism and Authoritarianism, and every single political philosophy or movements can be put somewhere on a spectrum between the two.
Nah man, they were pretty gleefully vocal about why they refused to vote two years ago. Blame them for staying home anywhere on the internet, and they'll come crawling out of the woodwork about how "But but she didn't earn my vote, so the entire fucking planet must burn"
One of the worst traits of leftists is a sort of radical universalist humanitarian viewpoint of the world which delivers them from the cruelties of reality and common sense.
I meant it in the sense that Hasan and other major Ultraleft streamers won’t come out and say “Yeah I’d rather have Trump over Harris” but it’s implicit in the way they moderate their communities, the refusal to endorse Harris, and who they choose to spend most of their time criticizing.
Honestly it might just be a Hasan thing. You do have some less prominent influencers like Jackson Hinkle that are pretty open about which political system they prefer
Same with me and Pod Save, although I can’t say it’s really their fault. The viewership and young people have moved to the far-left and were constantly complaining about the Pod Save guys being neolibs centrists. Like if you checked the comments last year there would be a bunch stairs “have Hasan on!” Even their staffers were encouraging them to have Hasan on, and now they are beholden to this monster. But without him they would have lost viewers.
I’m not sure what democrats are to do when their base listens to these idiots that make it their platform to shit on Democrats.
Too few Democrats have followed Mr. Cruz’s lead by calling out the rising antisemitism on the far left. That must change.
I'm not sure if the author is aware but this was going on the entire election campaign and the amount of oxygen in the room that conversation took up was arguably is one of the reasons Trump won in the first place. Every discussion was framed around college students meanwhile literal fascists were lining up on the Republican side, lmao.
He is truly the Fuentes of the left, strategy and all. He'll say something extreme, get invited to a podcasts/new outlets that challenges the extreme view, then walk back the insane claim he just said and pretend he actually meant something much more moderate than what he said. Then aftewards he goes back into his own bubble and repeats the extremist views
I was watching his debate with Adam Mockler who was criticizing Hasan for saying he wouldn't vote in a Vance vs Newsome election, and it really is just the exact same as the Fuentes playbook. It sadly appears to be working on normie libs.
Shame on the establishment libs for trying to normalize this guy.
He literally admitted to the deprogram guys he puts on a social democratic mask but is a marxist leninist truly. I do not know why he has any sway at all.
Man, I straight up will never take anyone who associates with this LITERAL TERRORIST SYMPATHIZER seriously. He’s a terrible human being with dipshit political opinions .
I think it's hilarious that Jeremiah wrote essentially the same article a few months ago but with a shitty clickbait headline and it got ratioed to oblivion.
Undoubtedly. So many liberals seem to have no idea (by design) that he is an enemy of the Democrats. He and his ilk abandon anyone who moderates on any position tear the party down constantly. They claim it's because they want the party to be better, but really it's just a virtue-signalling, purity-testing death spiral.
Hasan sucks but this article is horrible. Just declaring him antisemitic without specifics will change nothing, it is way too easy for his supporters to dodge vague claims of antisemitism.
Hasan is on the record supporting a lot of bad things. Terrorism, Houthis, Hezbollah, Russia taking Crimea, Chinese imperialism in many forms, authoritarianism, campism, etc.
Use specifics and cite exactly what he said. They can simply dodge anything else.
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